The P38 Rear Bar Tyre Carrier SNAFU

[TheTree]

Hi

As a new P38, with LPG, owner I am struggling with where to carry my spare wheel.

It seems that P38 rear tyre carriers are very rare, so I am looking for ideas.

I noted that recently someone had a D2 front bar fitted with little modification, so I am wondering about a D2 rear bar.

The other alternative i guess is to get something fabricated.

I am in the Central Coast, NSW area, so any pointers to shops in this area would be a great help.

Thanks
Steve

[ytt105]

When you discover the holy grail, let us all know!!

[bee utey]

I believe it is wrong for a LPG fitter to not provide a safe new location for a spare wheel. I make a mount for the wheel underneath the hatch, so you lay the wheel down on the hatch and put a bolt through it. This is a minimum IMHO and of course a swing away carrier would be better. Best of luck having someone make you one.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachments/lpg/18409d1251970729-more-lpg-conversion-pics-p38-diesel-p38-boot.jpg

The bracket I made is in the front right corner of the wheel well.

[TheTree]

When you discover the holy grail, let us all know!!

It may turn out more like Monty Python and the Holy Grail :eek:

[TheTree]

I believe it is wrong for a LPG fitter to not provide a safe new location for a spare wheel.

They have provided a safe location, but it takes up a heap of the available load space in the back !

[TheTree]

These guys have a bar for the Disco 3/4

4x4 Design and Engineering - Landrover Discovery 3 and 4 (http://www.4x4de.com.au/landrover-discovery-3-and-4#one)

A similar design may be able to be implemented on the P38, I have a mate who has an engineering workshop, i will have a word with him and see what he thinks

RidgyDidg have a kit with most of the necessary bits which could be a good start.

I will let the forum know if i make any progress!

[PaulP38a]

These guys have a bar for the Disco 3/4

4x4 Design and Engineering - Landrover Discovery 3 and 4 (http://www.4x4de.com.au/landrover-discovery-3-and-4#one)



looks like a rebranding of the old 4x4 Intelligence site, who arranged the group buy for P38 rear bars in 2008 when I got mine.
Worth asking them about anther run.

Cheers, Paul.

[bobslandies]

Not so long ago there was a special deal on Wheel Carriers for the P38 -Ron (P38arover) one of the Moderators of the forum was involved.

The company in Melbourne you referred to (I think it was 4x4 design & Engineering) like to make them in batches so you should get in touch with them or PM Ron for more info. There is a thread about the deal.

A friend at Hornsby bought one and has recently had it fitted (at home - helping the fitter as well ). If you want to have a look at it he is happy to let you drop by. PM me and I will give you his contact details.

Someone may be able to find the thread.

Bob

[PaulP38a]

Bob - I don't think has been another group buy of P38 rear bars from 4x4 Intelligence since the one I was involved in in 2008, as mentioned in my previous post... I could be wrong.
Cheers, Paul.

[benji]

Michael Samootin is his name. Myself and a few others bought rear bars off him in I think September last year.

If you take a look back at the old thread there's a flyer and prices.

A great bar, well finished, and extremely solid.

I doubt a D2 bar could be modified, as there is about 200mm difference in the chassis width.

When I got mine I had the same conundrum. I made up a frame from 25X3 SHS that bolts into the two floor bosses on the drivers side in the boot, braced up to the tire. I'll post a few photos up. It wouldn't hold in a severe accident though.

[bobslandies]

Michael Samootin is his name. Myself and a few others bought rear bars off him in I think September last year.

If you take a look back at the old thread there's a flyer and prices.

A great bar, well finished, and extremely solid.

I doubt a D2 bar could be modified, as there is about 200mm difference in the chassis width.

When I got mine I had the same conundrum. I made up a frame from 25X3 SHS that bolts into the two floor bosses on the drivers side in the boot, braced up to the tire. I'll post a few photos up. It wouldn't hold in a severe accident though.

Thanks benji for the clue how long ago it was. My friend got one and I know it has been sitting around a while as he could not do the fitting himself (bad back) and was waiting for Peter Davis to fit it for him. Looks great too! He's added an upright for a reversing light and backing camera.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/p38a-range-rover/81573-bull-bars-rear-bars-2.html
Flyer at p2 post #12 - benji.

Bob

[Keithy P38]

As mentioned in that post, you end up paying over $3k for a dual wheel carrier equipped rear bar... Could get one made up for half that...

[bobslandies]

As I said there was a special offer last year and my friend bought a rear bar / single wheel carrier, fitted with extra stub and clamp on P/S for future use. It cost under $2700 delivered to Sydney.

Apparently the Kaymar unit is no longer available and Ron got one of these ones also as he was more impressed with its design and quality (having had a Kaymar).

Bob

[Vern]

Look at Gippslander on here, he made his own, looks neat.

[TheTree]

Looks like the gippslander idea is the go, 3k for a rear bar is a bit rich for me :o

[Keithy P38]

Yeah, I rekon even an "expensive" metal fab joint would charge less...

Ill be getting a quote in August from my guys!

[PaulP38a]

I transferred my 4.5yo 4x4 intelligence rear bar from my (now sold) Hard Rangie to my black P38 a couple of weeks ago, and was impressed how well it still looked overall. A couple of minor irritations with the wheel carrier open/close strut mount, but nothing to make me regret paying around $2.3-2.5k for it a few years back.

[TheTree]

Hey Paul,

I hear you regarding the quality and longevity of this bar, but for me it's just a bit OTT for a wheel carrier!

[Robsrod 58]

I'm in the process of getting a quote for a custom one using "Rigidig" parts from a guy in Taren Point, Sydney. I'll post quote when received.

[p38arover]

I have a swingaway rear wheel carrier on a rear bar but I must admit I like this idea: RPi Engineering - Specialized Rover Engines - faqs (http://www.v8engines.com/faq-lpg-Gems-twin-tanks.htm#Spare)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/03/644.jpg

[TheTree]

Very nice idea !

[Robsrod 58]

I'm in the process of getting a quote for a custom one using "Rigidig" parts from a guy in Taren Point, Sydney. I'll post quote when received.
OK, Bar only, $1800 and he guarantees it won't be under engineered then ++++$ for wheel carrier and any other extras. Mmmmm, I'm still thinking is this an over capitalisation :confused:

Rob

[TheTree]

Hi Rob,

Thanks for that, it is still a little lighter than 3K for that other bar!

Thanks
Steve

[TheTree]

Just got an email from Shaun @ GSE Rig Gear (http://gse4x4.com.au/) about a rear bar.

we can make one to suit your requirements but would need access to the vehicle for design purposes.

Usual pricing is $1250 for the main bar,$450 per swingaway wheel carrier and $400 per swing away jerry can carrier.

Unfortunately, they are in Melbourne.

So if anyone in Melbourne is looking for a rear bar, maybe they could take their P38 over for him to look at ;)

[Robsrod 58]

Just got an email from Shaun @ GSE Rig Gear (http://gse4x4.com.au/) about a rear bar.

we can make one to suit your requirements but would need access to the vehicle for design purposes.

Usual pricing is $1250 for the main bar,$450 per swingaway wheel carrier and $400 per swing away jerry can carrier.

Unfortunately, they are in Melbourne.

So if anyone in Melbourne is looking for a rear bar, maybe they could take their P38 over for him to look at ;)

Maybe some generous soul in Melbourne who needs one could offer up their P38 as a template for us poor buggers in other states who just seem to get ripped off every time they ask a fabricator to do some work:Wouldn't that be nice:)

[TheTree]

Maybe some generous soul in Melbourne who needs one could offer up their P38 as a template for us poor buggers in other states who just seem to get ripped off every time they ask a fabricator to do some work:Wouldn't that be nice:)

Mate you read my mind :eek:

[p38arover]

If I was nearby, he could use mine which has a Kaymar bar and wheel carrier fitted.

[BusinessConnected]

If someone in another state is seriously keen... I'll drop my Spare P38 Rangie down to this guy in Melbourn which has a Kaymar Bar Fitted and he can have a look if you want....

[davidsonsm]

I made a swing away rear carrier last year using a landcruiser 80 kit supplied by rijidij near geelong. I can post some photos of the fabrication and finished product if you like. Willing to show it melbourne area if anybody is interested. Managed to keep original rear bumper so only stub axle shows carrier is removed when pottering about (dont carry spare - use gel in tyres).

[Keithy P38]

Yes! Pictures please!

[TheTree]

+1 for pictures please !

[Robsrod 58]

I designed a bracket over easter that bolts onto the right side chassis rail and uses the existing bumper bar to cover it. It requires that a Haymen Reece type tow bar be fitted to improve torsional rigidity and is designed to accept a Rijidij axel assembly. Made out of 5-6mm steel I think it may have some merit. I welcome any comment that may be able to improve it prior to getting one made. I've included measurements, please feel free to edit to improve

PS I'm no engineer, so my drawing is possibly a bit rough but I think you will get the general idea.

Rob

[TheTree]

If someone in another state is seriously keen... I'll drop my Spare P38 Rangie down to this guy in Melbourn which has a Kaymar Bar Fitted and he can have a look if you want....
Hi,

Thanks for the offer, I may come back to you on that.

I kind of like the idea of keeping the original bumper is possible, but may need to go to a replacement rear bar if the bracket idea turns out to be lacking in strength.

Regards
Steve

[TheTree]

Hi Rod,

Looks interesting, would we also need to cut a hole in the bumper to take the lock on the swing arm?

Regards
Steve

[Robsrod 58]

No, you need a slot so it can slide over it.

[TheTree]

Rob,

I will follow your progress with great interest. My beast has a Hayman Resse towbar fitted, and I like this idea very much :D

Regards
Steve

[TheTree]

Rob,

Looking at the drawing, the only thing i can think of is you could attach a plate to the rear horizontal face to give it even more strength

I am not sure it needs it, an engineering shop may have other suggestions

Regards
Steve

[Robsrod 58]

Rob,

Looking at the drawing, the only thing i can think of is you could attach a plate to the rear horizontal face to give it even more strength

I am not sure it needs it, an engineering shop may have other suggestions

Regards
Steve

Yeh Steve,
It doesn't show in the drawing very well but the piece you're referring to is "C" section which the backing you refer to is part of. As I said I'm not an engineer or for that matter a draughtsman:)

[TheTree]

Looks like it will do the job in style Rob :D

[davidsonsm]

Ok. Will dig out the pictures of the carrier fitted to my p38. Probably tomorrow now. Will post them. Cheers.

[davidsonsm]

Got plenty more piccies. Happy to answer any queries or show off my handywork. Cheers sean

[davidsonsm]

I added a gas strut for ease of opening. Plus the led work light, brake light & number plate. Carrier is lockable and will hold jerry can. Can show picture of carrier removed if wanted. Plan to get the carrier powder coated for better finish.

[Keithy P38]

That looks great! Will have a crack at it I rekon!

[mtb_gary]

Looks GOOD! Well done ;)

[ytt105]

So, who's going to make a few?

[PaulP38a]

Nice work there Sean, looks very stock :thumbsup:

[Keithy P38]

If I make one and its easy enough I will think about doing more up. Shame about my location though.

[ytt105]

Nothing wrong with your location Keith. It just becomes an excuse for a road trip.

[davidsonsm]

Lots of hours in it im afraid. Next jobs on list are discrete winch tray mount and cobbling together a snorkel (using 2x gu & 1x hilux) ldpe snorkels - so learning how to plastic weld. Hoping itll end up not like dogs dinner. Thanks for feedback guys.

[TheTree]

Great stuff, looks perfect ;-)

[TheTree]

Next jobs on list are discrete winch tray mount

Have you seen the winch tray the French guy (i can't remember his name right now) did at rr-evolution.com ?

It looks like a good place to start ;)

Pity it would cost so much to get one shipped to OZ

[davidsonsm]

Yeah seen it. Devon4x4 also sell one out of Germany. Cost is about GBP450 plus P&P. Hence why ill have a go at fabricating one. I've bought a t-max tray and will try to make it as close to the german one as possible - I have the installation instructions that give me a pretty good idea how it should look. Want to get the assembly as high & tucked away as possible.

[Keithy P38]

I rekon I might even do it the slack way, looks a bit much for my capabilities on a welder. Ill take it in to the shop and leave my Rangie with them for as long as they need to see if they can make one up for either side and maybe ask them to hang onto the design so if needs be we could have a few made up and just ship them out for anyone interested. Initial one will probably cost a bit but each one after would be cheaper and easier to make up.

I won't look into it until the tax man gets generous again but ill let you know.

[TheTree]

Hi Sean,

Is your bracket similar to the the one Rob has come up with?

I am thinking if we settle on a final design, I can ask my mate about engineering shops up my way and see if we can get a few made up and save some cost over individual fabrication

Regards
Steve

[olbod]

Anyone using or seen one of these ?
I like it as it can be removed when not travelling and spare inside when just running about. If you leave the spare onboard in the dish, this carrier could be used to carry a couple of jerries and jack etc..

[TheTree]

I have seen them on US websites, but never in OZ. Maybe they are not legal down under?

Steve

[Keithy P38]

I'm not a fan of having an increased departure angle with that unit pictured.

Probably why a lot of 4wders don't have one on the back of their rigs. For a tame tourer it might be ok, wonder how much it would rattle and vibrate over corrugations?

[olbod]

I dont know if that Tyregate unit would be any good or not but here is a link to their website. I think it might be suitable for a lot of applications.
Not all use of a P38 involves playing around and rock climbing where departure angles are important. Also it could be further braced to the tow bar as a semi permanent fixture if it rattles.
I dont know, I havent seen one but someone here might be near to supplier and could check it out, if curious. I know I am. I havent seen my Sister who lives down near Bermagui, since 1990. I would like to go down for a visit and being able to hang a couple of jerries and a jack out the back would be good oh.
And I could easily remove it when I want to go to Sarina and do me shopping.

New Products | Parts | Tire Gate Spare Wheel Carrier (Hitch Gate Series) | 4WD WORLD- A World of 4x4 Accessories (http://www.4wdworld.com.au/Tire-Gate-Spare-Wheel-Carrier-Hitch-Gate-Series.html)

[olbod]

I have forgotten to mention that this P38 has a dual gas conversion ( which is not working at the moment as it needs a service ). Grrr. This means that the big spare lives on the floor behind the back seat. Grrr.
If I had me druthers, I would druther throw all this gas crap in the skip but it cost him six grand.
If I go down to Sisters it would be via Longreach, Charlieville, Bourke, Cobar and SE to Bermaguie. Thats as close as I ever want be to brisbane and sydney.
Also while down there I would take a bit of a run in the High country which I havent seen since the sixties.
So I need and like the idea of a removable swingaway carrier for jerries etc:.
Think I am talking myself into checking it out further. Drat.

[Keithy P38]

It's always the way! The more you look at something that you don't have, the more you want it!

[olbod]

It's always the way! The more you look at something that you don't have, the more you want it!


To right. Have you seen The Dr's new Chum ? Cripes she's a cutie.

[mtb_gary]

I had a look at getting one of the Tire Gate carriers a few months back but could not justify the $2k price tag once you get the carrier with a couple of options for carrying Jerry cans and number plate mount with light!
Gary

[davidsonsm]

Steve. The bracket I made used 100m x 50mm box section welded to a plate which fixes with bolts to the side of the chasis rails. Two bolts (front of car) were into large rivnuts. The two rear ones picked up bolts on the end of the towbar cross member. I also welded plates top and bottom to pick up more existing tow bar bolts. The other end if the bix section was drilled at 40mm dia to accept the stub axle - which I reduced in length. Ill try to find some more pictures to show it. I'd never welded before this job so it was a great project to learn on. The MIGs make it relatively easy. The ugliness of my beads being tidied with a grinding flap. When driving the lock plate obviously takes a lot of the weight. It all seems pretty solid.

I also made an extra jerry can holder that sits on the rhs of the vehicle using the hitch. I used a hitch pin wedge to stop vibration. I believe the hitch wheel carrier discussed in this thread also has a wedge designed hitch bar which is tightened to stop vibration. There's fella in melbourne selling them - avenger 4x4 from memory.

[davidsonsm]

Steve. The bracket I made used 100m x 50mm box section welded to a plate which fixes with bolts to the side of the chasis rails. Two bolts (front of car) were into large rivnuts. The two rear ones picked up bolts on the end of the towbar cross member. I also welded plates top and bottom to pick up more existing tow bar bolts. The other end if the bix section was drilled at 40mm dia to accept the stub axle - which I reduced in length. Ill try to find some more pictures to show it. I'd never welded before this job so it was a great project to learn on. The MIGs make it relatively easy. The ugliness of my beads being tidied with a grinding flap. When driving the lock plate obviously takes a lot of the weight. It all seems pretty solid.

I also made an extra jerry can holder that sits on the rhs of the vehicle using the hitch. I used a hitch pin wedge to stop vibration. I believe the hitch wheel carrier discussed in this thread also has a wedge designed hitch bar which is tightened to stop vibration. There's fella in melbourne selling them - avenger 4x4 from memory.

Hitchgate by wilco is what I was refering to as the product. Looks pretty ingenuous.

[davidsonsm]

A couple more photos to illustrate what I was trying to describe.

[mtb_gary]

Davidsonsm

Can you post a couple more pics please including how the stub axle comes through the rear bumper bar. I'm also looking at the rijidij swing away kit but still undecided how to mount it to the car. I currently have the rear bumper off and am toying with a piece of 12mm steel that I have in the shed bolted ( or welded) on top of the tow bar frame under the top of the bumper bar. I believe from preliminary measurements this should be able to sit out of sight inside the standard bumper bar. I would then have to weld the stub axle directly onto the plate and of course drill through the bumper to allow the stub axle to protrude.

Gary

[davidsonsm]

Had to slot the bumper in line with the stub axle so the bumper would slide back on. I then glued a split piece of rubber around the stub axle to hide the slot in the bumper. Will take some close ups & post.

[davidsonsm]

Hope this shows ok.

[davidsonsm]

And another. To see it in daylight with axle cover removed, it'll be the weekend.

[mtb_gary]

Thanks for pics. I'll have a look at the mounting options again on mine when I'm back in Perth. I'm in Melbourne for a trade show this week......where the temperature is somewhat cooler than I'm used to.

Gary

[TheTree]

I have the rijidig kit sitting in my garage and I think I may have found a metal fabrication shop who can make the bracket for me.

Thanks to all for lots of great ideas!

Steve

[rijidij]

I got some pics from a customer today who built a carrier for his P38 Rangie using our components, so I thought I'd share them here.
No pics of the chassis bracket under the bumper, but he said he used a piece of 100 x 50 x 6 RHS and cut it to the shape required.
As you can see he also welded a tab onto the latch plate to mount a gas strut.
I think he's done a great job considering he said, "all I have is a welder and angle grinder".

Cheers, Murray

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/06/1157.jpg (http://s204.photobucket.com/user/rijidij/media/Wheel%20Carriers/Range%20Rover/P38/P38_5_zps1c3ed1b8.jpg.html)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/06/1158.jpg (http://s204.photobucket.com/user/rijidij/media/Wheel%20Carriers/Range%20Rover/P38/P38_4_zps65b1e916.jpg.html)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/06/1159.jpg (http://s204.photobucket.com/user/rijidij/media/Wheel%20Carriers/Range%20Rover/P38/P38_3_zps22158421.jpg.html)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/06/1160.jpg (http://s204.photobucket.com/user/rijidij/media/Wheel%20Carriers/Range%20Rover/P38/P38_2_zps290de89a.jpg.html)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/06/1161.jpg (http://s204.photobucket.com/user/rijidij/media/Wheel%20Carriers/Range%20Rover/P38/P38_1_zpscebf5b04.jpg.html)

[TheTree]

Murray

Thanks for those pics it looks great !

My rear bar project is on hold temporarily while I deal with some ABS and EAS issues :(

Steve

[Robsrod 58]

Thanks Murray,
You were too quick for me to post these pics!!.

SteveFarmer if you use the dimensions of the bracket I posted it will be too long and it also be too close to the inner face of the bumper, a lot of mucking around to get it right as you can't see whats going on under the bumper. One thing for sure its strong.

Rob

[mtb_gary]

Rob

If you get a chance at some stage see what has been done behind the bumper. That from the outside is one of the cleanest installations I've ever seen. Well done, something to be proud of!

Gary

Thanks Murray,
You were too quick for me to post these pics!!.

SteveFarmer if you use the dimensions of the bracket I posted it will be too long and it also be too close to the inner face of the bumper, a lot of mucking around to get it right as you can't see whats going on under the bumper. One thing for sure its strong.

Rob

[davidsonsm]

Yeah looks great. Did you get it powder coated? What made you decide RHS vs. LHS? Also the led's. I didn't bother except for outboard of the spare wheel. We're they required? What are you doing about the number plate?

[Robsrod 58]

Yeah looks great. Did you get it powder coated? What made you decide RHS vs. LHS? Also the led's. I didn't bother except for outboard of the spare wheel. We're they required? What are you doing about the number plate?

Next time I take the rear bar off I'll take a couple of pics, but believe me I'm not in any hurry to do it as it has been on and off so many times I've just about worn the bolts out!!:censored:

6mm x 50 x 100 RHS is what I had lying around and over a length of approx 150mm it is quite strong. If you look at the diagram I posted at the beginning of this thread everything is the same except the gusseted "C" section. No its not powder coated as yet in case of more mods.

The LED's straight off fleebay - the best looking I could find. If you look at the bumper adjacent to the LH light assy you will see 2 number plate leds with 2 rivnuts located between them for holding the Nplate when spare is fitted. I think I've covered all the legalities.:wasntme:

Rob

[rijidij]

.................Also the led's. I didn't bother except for outboard of the spare wheel. We're they required? ...........

The basic rule to keep in mind, in Vic anyway, is the rear lights need to be visible from an angle of 45*, so unless your spare wheel is positioned right in the middle it's most likely you will need to fit extra lights.

Cheers, Murray

[DT-P38]

I would love to have one like the RobsRod DIY but with the wheel centered and number plate holder located in the centre of the wheel.

Rijidij, assuming no IP issues with RobsRod would you arrange production of a small batch?

What sort of pricing?

[Robsrod 58]

I would love to have one like the RobsRod DIY but with the wheel centered and number plate holder located in the centre of the wheel.

Rijidij, assuming no IP issues with RobsRod would you arrange production of a small batch?

What sort of pricing?

If Murray wants to to do a run, go for it!

But if you centre the wheel you will massively increase the moment on the bracket and will definitely require a lot of extra work under the bumper to prevent flexing, as it is you can't do this without a Haymen Reece type tow bar, which spreads the load and stiffens the chassis rails .
As it is mine is secured by 5 bolts and there is minor flexing if I hang off the carrier....Just something to be aware of.

I pondered the idea of N plate on wheel but getting it on there with these type of lug nuts makes it awkward as the wheel is heavy enough without trying to hang another bracket as well!

Rob

[davidsonsm]

If Murray wants to to do a run, go for it!

But if you centre the wheel you will massively increase the moment on the bracket and will definitely require a lot of extra work under the bumper to prevent flexing, as it is you can't do this without a Haymen Reece type tow bar, which spreads the load and stiffens the chassis rails .
As it is mine is secured by 5 bolts and there is minor flexing if I hang off the carrier....Just something to be aware of.

I pondered the idea of N plate on wheel but getting it on there with these type of lug nuts makes it awkward as the wheel is heavy enough without trying to hang another bracket as well!

Rob

I second that. I've put a bike rack number plate and tail/brake light unit outboard of the wheel on my set up. I've also made it so it can carry a Jerry can as well if needed - but without finite element analysis - worry it's on the heavy side!

[rijidij]

I would love to have one like the RobsRod DIY but with the wheel centered and number plate holder located in the centre of the wheel.

Rijidij, assuming no IP issues with RobsRod would you arrange production of a small batch?

What sort of pricing?


If Murray wants to to do a run, go for it!

But if you centre the wheel you will massively increase the moment on the bracket and will definitely require a lot of extra work under the bumper to prevent flexing, as it is you can't do this without a Haymen Reece type tow bar, which spreads the load and stiffens the chassis rails .
As it is mine is secured by 5 bolts and there is minor flexing if I hang off the carrier....Just something to be aware of.

I pondered the idea of N plate on wheel but getting it on there with these type of lug nuts makes it awkward as the wheel is heavy enough without trying to hang another bracket as well!

Rob


A common problem I face in situations like this is, I would love to do a batch of P38 carriers, but I struggle to find the time for extra projects over what I've already got on the go.
Having said that, one way this could work is, if someone like Rob is willing to share his design and it is suitable for converting the parts/drawings to laser cut drawing format, then most of the time consuming work is done. R&D and design is what takes the time with new products, not the cutting, fabrication etc.
Even if just the chassis mounting bracket was produced, this is the most difficult part of building a DIY carrier, then the main arm is fairly straight forward. I already produce wheel mounts, latches etc See here (http://rijidijoffroad.bounce.com.au/#/kit-page/4551195113) so as long as the chassis mount was made, it probably wouldn't be too hard to sort out all that's needed for a DIY kit for the whole carrier.
Rob, did you happen to draw the dimensions of how you made your chassis mount from the RHS ? Also, what did you do under the bumper to mount the latch plate too ?

I'm only suggesting a DIY carrier beacuse I don't want to say "yeah, I can make these" and then not be able to deliver.

I agree with Rob regarding building a longer arm to center the wheel to the car..........be aware of flexing etc. I think the wheel could be centered, but you would have to make sure the weight of the wheel and carrier were very well supported when in the closed position. It might require a strong bracket fixed to the tow bar for example, to share the load of the wheel and carrier between the tow bar and chassis mounting bracket.
The down side to centering the wheel is, you will need to raise the wheel to allow clearance for tow hitches etc, which in turn restricts your rear vision.

Regarding mounting a number plate in the middle of the wheel, the same type of mount as I use on my Defender carriers could be made with the appropriate stud pattern. These are pretty light weight and have provision for a light. See pic below


Just my thoughts anyway............keep the ideas coming.

Cheers, Murray


https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/06/429.jpg (http://s204.photobucket.com/user/rijidij/media/Wheel%20Carriers/Defender%20dual%20rear%20bar/Defender%20Dual%20Rear%20Carrier/Number-Plate-Bracket_zpsfc7320c4.jpg.html)

[Robsrod 58]

Wow, I'm feeling the pressure!!!

The way the bracket could be done would be based on my original design, posted previously, made up of 8 separate laser cut pieces of 6mm plate and welded together. That would achieve the same result especially with your expert welding Murray! Also I think each bracket would need to be drilled to suit each situation as the tolerances are quite tight behind the bar to achieve maximum bracket size and strength. I'll see what I can do about getting some measurements in the next couple of weeks as at the moment I'm quite busy, please be patient.

The latch plate nuts, that was another issue, after chewing the fat I decided to take a punt and mig the nuts directly to the bumper. I thought about reinforcing plates behind but that would distort the bumper. there are also spacers between the latch plate and the steel part of the bumper so as to not place pressure on the plastic bumper covering I feel the load is quite well spread, time will tell. As I said before I can put all my weight on the carrier with only a minute amount of movement and I'm not convinced its the bracket flexing.

Murray, as for your N plate bracket, because I run standard alloys they are domed in the centre therefore your bracket would not sit flat against the wheel. The only way it would work would be to weld the approx 25mm x 25mm tube directly to the wheel mount and then slide the wheel on and the holder over that, if you get my gist...

Rob

[rijidij]

Wow, I'm feeling the pressure!!!

The way it could be done would be based on my original design, posted previously, made up of 8 separate laser cut pieces of 6mm plate and welded together. That would achieve the same result especially with your expert welding Murray! I'll see what I can do about getting some measurements in the next couple of weeks as at the moment I'm quite busy, please be patient.

Murray, as for your N plate bracket, because I run standard alloys they are domed in the centre therefore your bracket would not sit flat against the wheel. The only way it would work would be to weld the approx 25mm x 25mm tube directly to the wheel mount and then slide the wheel on and the holder over that, if you get my gist...

Rob

Sorry Rob, I don't mean to put pressure on you or make you feel obligated to supply measurements. I just suggested you as an example of someone who has been through the process. It would be great if anyone could supply measurements of a chassis bracket that they've made up.

Regarding the number plate mount, the previous picture might not explain well enough, but the part of the bracket with the three holes in it goes on behind the wheel and sticks through the center hole of the wheel, then it's just one small bolt to attach the outer part that the No. plate attaches to.
Exactly the same bracket is fitted to this 90, I hope that makes it clearer how it fits on. If we were to make these to fit the Rangie I would need to check the dimensions of the wheels to make sure they fitted as neat and close to the wheel as possible. They need to stick out just enough to be able to get to the small bolt to remove it.

Cheers, Murray

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/10/904.jpg (http://s204.photobucket.com/user/rijidij/media/Wheel%20Carriers/Defender%20dual%20rear%20bar/Defender%20Dual%20Rear%20Carrier/Defender-90-wheel-carrier_zps5cf0f00f.jpg.html)

[Robsrod 58]

No Murray, I'm only kidding, but you are right about R&D, it's the most time consuming and frustrating part of building any thing. I must admit though I do enjoy the challenge and satisfaction of saying " I did that" while sucking on a beer, then another, then another!!!

If I had of known of that N bracket I would gone that way for sure. Drats!

Rob

[davidsonsm]

My solution to fixing the latch plate was to weld 4 x long high tensile bolts to the tow bar cross member. I added a plate behind the bumper to stiffen it up. 4 clearance were drilled through the bumper so no weight was on it. The latch plate was then fixed between 2 nuts (dome on outside) x 4 sets. Seems to work ok.

[Robsrod 58]

My solution to fixing the latch plate was to weld 4 x long high tensile bolts to the tow bar cross member. I added a plate behind the bumper to stiffen it up. 4 clearance were drilled through the bumper so no weight was on it. The latch plate was then fixed between 2 nuts (dome on outside) x 4 sets. Seems to work ok.
Wow, that would take some time to get the right position to drill the bumper or very big clearance holes!!

I'm banking on having little weight on the latch assy therefor avoiding extra engineering.

Rob

[TheTree]

Wow, I'm feeling the pressure!!!
Rob

Rob,

I for one am very thankful for all your effort and am very happy to wait until you have a little time to get together with Murray:cool:

Steve

[davidsonsm]

Old school. Over engineer it. That's got to be the solution. When you're clearly under qualified - as I am. Give it a go guys. As with 'll things P38 - there's rarely an out of the box solution. Isn't that why we love them? And hate them.

[davidsonsm]

Next time I take the rear bar off I'll take a couple of pics, but believe me I'm not in any hurry to do it as it has been on and off so many times I've just about worn the bolts out!!:censored:

6mm x 50 x 100 RHS is what I had lying around and over a length of approx 150mm it is quite strong. If you look at the diagram I posted at the beginning of this thread everything is the same except the gusseted "C" section. No its not powder coated as yet in case of more mods.

The LED's straight off fleebay - the best looking I could find. If you look at the bumper adjacent to the LH light assy you will see 2 number plate leds with 2 rivnuts located between them for holding the Nplate when spare is fitted. I think I've covered all the legalities.:wasntme:

Rob

Complete and utter empathy.