Expert Advice Needed - 19" D4 rims to fit Campertrailer possible?

[Heavyduty]

Hi All,

I read the forum all the time but rarely post, so please be gentle.

I have a Camprite Campertrailer that has hubs to match a Nissan Patrol (my last vehicle). I chased up some matching 19" D4 rims with the aim of swapping the hubs to fit, giving me 2 matching spares for either the car or trailer when we go away.

Unfortunately all my investigations so far with the trailer companies in Perth is that it can't be done due to:
1. The spacing of the wheel studs being fairly narrow
2. The internal bore size of the rim centre (where the land rover cap sits) and
3. The offset of the rims.

The trailer has a AGTM of 1300kg, with independent trailing suspension (see attached photo's)

I am looking for any info or advice as to if it is possible, if so, any leads on who could carry out the work.

Any help would be really appreciated.

Thanks
Dave

[MR LR]

Seeings you're in Perth I can't offer much help, but my Father has done quite a few for Range Rover sports and Disco 2's, I'll tell you this, it can and has been done with those hubs (they have the big outer bearing), the "outer bearing housing" (for want of a better word) that comes out from the hub flange has to be turned down to the size of the spigot that the alloy wheel locates on, it needs a wheel spacer of ~16mm IIRC (use longer studs) and then it will possibly need a different centre cap.
Then it all fits, it's not cheap though!!
And you need to buy blank hubs and have them drilled to suit.
I don't know what the legalities of spacers on trailers is, but with longer studs there is still many different components that would fail first!!

Cheers
Will

[Graeme]

I fitted HD 10" electric brake hubs to my van to take BMW X5 or LR rims. The LR rims will need a spacer but load-wise its not an issue because they're needed only because of the extra positive offset than the rims normally used with these hubs.
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/trailers-vans-campers/167864-coromal-suspension-conversion.html#post1853860

[Heavyduty]

Thanks Graeme and Will,

Really appreciate the knowledge that you and the other members have and your willingness to share it.

A few more questions after reading your posts and links:

1. Just would like to clarify that there is enough "meat" left around the bearing housing after it is machined, to handle the load of my trailer?

2. Am I right in my understanding that you saying that I can use the existing axles, get a suitable new hub machined and then only require a 16mm spacer to maintain the same "track" width of the trailer?

3. Does this extra spacer, effectively increasing the axle length, place too much leverage on the existing axle?

4. Is there an achievable solution to purchasing a suitable grease cap?

Sorry if I'm asking too many questions, but you guys have given me a glimmer of hope. The trailer spares "experts" I have consulted have all pointed out issues in relation to the above questions as to why it is not going to be achievable.

Thanks again
Dave

[Graeme]

1. The machinist who did mine thought there should be plenty but that's just one opinion.

2. How does the offset of the existing rims compare with 53-16 (37) mm for LR rims with 16mm spacers? If not too much more, do the tyres on LR rims buldge as much as the existing rims to sufficiently increase the chassis to tyre gap? My van tyres have only 10-12mm but with wide springs and a wide axle the tyres can't move sideways enough to touch.

3. Increased rim mounting face offset offsets extra leverage caused by spacers. Whether there's more or less leverage depends on the difference in offsets and spacer width.

4. Whilst a standard hubcap fits over the axle nut, I doubt it will provide clearance for the split-pin. Hence the normal HD cap will need to be fitted, which I suspect (but not tried) requires more than a 10mm spacer. I can check LR rims on mine in the next day or so to determine the minimum spacer although I would chamfer the edge of the hubs so that less spacer is required.

[Heavyduty]

Thanks Graeme,

I will try and take some measurements tomorrow of the existing offset.

Does anyone know if this work could be carried out in Perth?

Thanks
Dave.

[Heavyduty]

Just out of interest, have the GOE rims got a larger centre bore, or is it the same as the standard 19" land rover rims?

Thanks
Dave

[Graeme]

I only know that the GOE rims take the standard LR hub cap but nothing about their internal dimensions apart from having the same register diameter. The GOE rims may have a different offset to LR and may have a different centre hole depth. The original version of those rims (Compomotive) had a 43mm offset rather than 53 when used on earlier RRSs.

Edit: Comparing pictures of a LR rim and a design image for the GOE rim I suspect the GOE rim's centre hole is shallower than LR, thus requiring an even thicker spacer to clear the bearing cap. Unfortunately for trailer use the large centre hole of the Compomotive rim was not retained for the GOE rim, favouring original LR cap fitment. Note that the picture on the GOE web-site is the original Compomotive rim which has the large centre cap hole.

[MR LR]

Thanks Graeme and Will,

Really appreciate the knowledge that you and the other members have and your willingness to share it.

A few more questions after reading your posts and links:

1. Just would like to clarify that there is enough "meat" left around the bearing housing after it is machined, to handle the load of my trailer?

2. Am I right in my understanding that you saying that I can use the existing axles, get a suitable new hub machined and then only require a 16mm spacer to maintain the same "track" width of the trailer?

3. Does this extra spacer, effectively increasing the axle length, place too much leverage on the existing axle?

4. Is there an achievable solution to purchasing a suitable grease cap?

Sorry if I'm asking too many questions, but you guys have given me a glimmer of hope. The trailer spares "experts" I have consulted have all pointed out issues in relation to the above questions as to why it is not going to be achievable.

Thanks again
Dave
1. Yes there was very little machines off at all, on some of the hubs it was only even cleaning up the casting to square!!

2. Depends on the offset of your original wheels, I think the minimum spacer we've used is 12mm

3. No (not going into engineering calculations here though!)

4. Only the 12mm spaced wheels needed the grease cap modifying, it was just cut down about 10mm in height I believe

As for it being done in Perth, all you need is a good fitter and turner to do the job, someone that does one-off jobs and gets paid in beer is the best ;)

[chuck]

It might be worth following up holden hubs.

I have a tandem trailer with holden hubs that are fitted with dynamic 17" steel rims for a D3.

The studs might will to be replaced with landrover studs which are the next size up - it should be relatively easy to machine these out & knock the larger studs in.

Just a thought.

[Graeme]

Judging by the size of the existing bearing cap the stub axles are for either 1500 kg or 1600 kg parallel bearing HD hubs so standard trailer hubs wont fit.

[MR LR]

Judging by the size of the existing bearing cap the stub axles are for either 1500 kg or 1600 kg parallel bearing HD hubs so standard trailer hubs wont fit.
They drill the parallel Hubs in HQ patter (slightly off 120pcd though), we use them as they don't drill them in commodore which is 120.

They work

[Graeme]

My hubs were drilled to 120mm pcd and fitted with 14mm studs at my request. I much prefer to use the correct spacing especially for alloy rims.

[PhilipA]

One way may be to have hubs drilled 5x165 ( old LR pattern), then buy adaptors from the UK to convert to the smaller PCD.

There are ones available to convert RRC and D1 to D3 and D4 wheels.
I may be doing this to convert my RRC trailer hubs to suit D2 wheels soon.

They want $400+ for a full set , and I have not asked whether they will supply 2 but maybe we could combine an order for 4 with 2xD3/D4 and 2x D2.
My problem is that D2 wheels are 8inch and RRC mags are 7 inch and the wheels will not have clearance to the inside guards without spacers.
Regards Philip A

[Heavyduty]

Hi Phillip,

Have you got a part number or description for these? I have not heard of this type of arrangement before. May be worth investigating as you say.

Thanks
Dave

[discotwinturbo]

Just out of interest, have the GOE rims got a larger centre bore, or is it the same as the standard 19" land rover rims?

Thanks
Dave

Dave,

You can try one of my GOE rims. I can swing by after school one day, as its on the back of the D4 at the moment.

Brett....

[Heavyduty]

Thanks Brett,

Might try and catch up. Can you please pm me your contact number some time and I'll give you a call.

Thanks
Dave.

[PhilipA]

Have you got a part number or description for these? I have not heard of this type of arrangement before. May be worth investigating as you say.


Land Rover Wheel Adaptor allows Range Rover Disco 3 & 4 Range Sports L322 rims | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Land-Rover-Wheel-Adaptor-allows-Range-Rover-Disco-3-4-Range-Sports-L322-rims-/121029348231?pt=UK_Cars_Parts_Vehicles_Wheels_tyre _Trims_Trims_ET&hash=item1c2de94b87)

There they are.

[MR LR]

I don't know what the legality issues are with spacers/adapters on trailers, we use spaces but it is on the same studs, personally I'm not keen on the spacers/adapters that have different studs, but each to their own

And PhillpA the adapters should probably space them out enough I would have thought, just hope you don't kill a bus load of Nuns using them as you'll probably lose insurance...

[djambalawa]

You don't want to put 19" rims on an offroad camper do you? Their bad enough on the wonderfully suspensioned D4 :)

Your eggs might arrive scrambled!

[Graeme]

As those adapters are for fitting later rims to earlier LR vehicles, they may not fit over the boss on HD trailer hubs even if they were legal and a cheaper solution.

[Heavyduty]

I think I'll stick to finding an alternative solution to the adaptors.

Thanks anyway for the suggestion.

Thanks
Dave

[TerryO]

This topic was been moved from the D3/4/RRs section because it is no longer being discussed there and may be of some interest to readers in this section.