Random Moderation

[AnD3rew]

There is some pretty random moderation decisions around here. My D3 specific question about Traxide dual battery systems with solar on a trailer got moved to electrical and there are at least 4 other threads on this page alone relating to electrical and diagnostic systems etc.

If I'd wanted it in electrical and comms, I would have put it there :nazilock:

[p38arover]

It wasn't random at all. It wasn't a D3-specific question. Had I seen other threads in here that should be elsewhere, I'd have moved them, too.

When questions like this appear in vehicle-specific areas, one can usually assume that the poster (especially in the D3/D4 area :p ) doesn't know there are other areas in AULRO. We see it all too often that some members post everything in the area that applies to their vehicle.

[AnD3rew]

Sorry I seems pretty random to me, there is bucket loads that is no more or less specific than mine in here. And sometimes you post it where you know there are people hanging out who you know can answer your question.

[vnx205]

Andrew, I read your original post before you started this thread.

I have only an academic interest in multiple battery systems and charging problems since my camper has a three way fridge and I have converted the lights to LEDs.

Your thread title and the content of the post gave me the impression that it was a series of questions about battery charging. Even re-reading the post later didn't convince me that it was a D3/D4 question.

However that is just the opinion of someone who doesn't own a D3 or D4, has no need for multiple batteries and controllers and who is not involved in any way in moderation on this forum or any other.

I will confess, however, that I am someone who gets mildly irritated by people who post in the general forum when their question clearly belongs somewhere else. Some of them even make the excuse that they posted there because they thought more people would see their post in the general forum than in the place where they knew it belonged.

I hasten to add that I didn't even notice where you had posted and read it because of its title.

I have the impression that the moderators generally have a good reason for the things that they do and that most of the inconsistencies that you mention are probably just because they are human and they occasionally miss something.

I would have thought that Drivesafe or anyone else who was interested in electronics would spend a bit of time in the electrical forum. I am mildly puzzled that you didn't make the same assumption.

I don't think it is worth getting stressed about. Although that might be because the moderators haven't yet done anything to me to get my blood pressure up. :p

[p38arover]

Sorry I seems pretty random to me, there is bucket loads that is no more or less specific than mine in here.

I'm not the Mod for that area and those vehicles aren't of particular interest to me so I don't look in there. However, when I scan the new posts at each logon I look for posts that may be incorrectly placed. if I see any, I move them. Generally, I'll leave an expiring redirect.


And sometimes you post it where you know there are people hanging out who you know can answer your question.

And that's exactly the problem with some of you. The forum wouldn't be set up the way it is if we wanted to follow your method of posting.

Typical of what I have moved this week:

A thread about Anzac Day in the D2 area, ( to General Chat)
A general question about awnings in the D3/D4/RRS area (to Camping)
General questions about Nanocom that were in the D2 and D3/D4 areas (to Electronic Diagnostics)

To be honest, the worst offenders are the D3/D4 owners. Note that I have left RRS off that - they don't seem to be a problem.

[CaverD3]

The D3/4 RRS are different vehicles in may respects especially the elecrical system.
Help with D3 issues are more likely to be given by members who are regularly in the specific section.
If an administrator doesn't even visit the section he moved the post to who else is going to see it and help?
Aulro is too large and general to be searching all the time.

[AnD3rew]

I apologise if I seem argumentative I spend most of my online time n another forum where everyone flames everyone all the time and there is a constant war between the denizens and the moderators and their moderation is very very light touch so maybe I just have picked up some bad feuding habits. But as much as maybe it annoys some of you if the posting doesn't fit your view of where it should be, it annoys me when I put a post somewhere because I want a specific response from a specific group of people and someone decides they know better.

It is also annoying when it looks to me as though this is applied inconsistently my question was about a specific dual battery system designed for a D3 and installed in a D3 and as Caver says D3 and 4's are very electrically "unique"
There are clearly several other threads current which are no more D3-4 specific than mine.

That said I'll shut up now, this is a great forum with brilliant and generous people and I have no wish to be seen as the trouble maker, just my bad forum training from elsewhere showing through.

[Redback]

If it makes you feel better, I would have moved it if I saw it before Ron, I probably would have moved it to the Camper section, but the Electrical section might be a better place for it.

Baz.

[p38arover]

Aulro is too large and general to be searching all the time.

I agree there are too many sub-sections in AULRO. But you don't need to search, use the New Posts menu item to see what's new.

I read your comment as "I only want to look in the D3/D4/RRS area and nowhere else on AULRO".


If an administrator doesn't even visit the section he moved the post to who else is going to see it and help?

No, I moved it from a section I don't visit.

[CaverD3]

New posts: 765 new posts! :o

I check for new posts in RRS section but since I don't check the whole forum I would miss other posts.
Does anyone else do the same?
In fact if this thread was elsewhere I would have missed it.

[p38arover]

There're only that many because you don't use the feature enough.

I usually get no more than a page of them.

[101RRS]

New posts: 765 new posts! :o

I check for new posts in RRS section but since I don't check the whole forum I would miss other posts.
Does anyone else do the same?
In fact if this thread was elsewhere I would have missed it.

Not having a go - just highlighting - yes but that is your choice - the post was not related to D3 etc. If this a e specific D3 related topic then it would be fair to put it in D3 section but it was electrical or maybe trailer related.

If you only check the D3 section then you will be missing a lot of threads than may be relevant to you but in a more general sense.

I check into AULRO a couple of times a day and generally only have about 60 new posts. If I have been away and get a lot of posts listed I just skim for the ones that stand out and mark the rest as read and most threads are ongoing and will pop up next search - not always successful but not too bad.

Cheers

Garry

[vnx205]

I apologise if I seem argumentative

I don't see you as argumentative and I trust that I am not being seen as sufficiently argumentative to annoy people, or at least not annoy them all the time.

I am quite happy to read your reasons for wanting your post in a particular spot. I happen to believe that I can think of a better reason for posting it elsewhere.

I seriously considered offering my earlier comments as a PM. The reason I didn't is related to a reason I have for believing that your original post belongs in the electrics section.

The way I see it is that if all you wanted was some specific information from Tim or anyone else, you could have corresponded via PMs. By posting it in a forum instead, there is the possibility that you may have helped some other AULRO member who has a similar problem. There are, after all a tiny minority of members whose first reaction when they have a problem or a question is to do a search. They might use the search function or they might do a quick skim in the place where they think the issue might have been discussed previously.

I have already said that I saw your original post (rightly or wrongly) as a series of questions about Traxide, batteries and charging. I would have expected to find a discussion about those topics in the electrics section.

So when you are posting a question or some information, you should not only consider where you would like to put it, but also where others might expect to find it if they happen to subscribe to the quaint notion that you should start by searching to see if your problem has already been solved in the past.

On that basis, I would suggest that your post would be more help to other AULRO members in the electrics.

I will concede that my Defender doesn't have some of those electrical devices that D3 and D4 drivers apparently can't live without, like electric windows, heated seats and musical cup holders. I know that the D3 and D4 have some electrical peculiarities, but they also have some similarities to fair dinkum Land Rovers.

My earlier comments about annoyance or irritation were fairly heavily qualified and certainly not directed at you. They were intended more just as throwaway lines.

The fact that I disagree with your reasons for wanting your post in a particular place don't prevent me from reading your explanation.

There seems to me to be something mildly amusing about the fact that I seem to be posting in the D3/D4 forum on a subject that to my mind really has nothing to do with D3s or D4s. :)

[alpick]

Dear Moderators,

how come this thread hasn't been moved to the complaints section?

:)

[Homestar]

New posts: 765 new posts! :o

I check for new posts in RRS section but since I don't check the whole forum I would miss other posts.
Does anyone else do the same?
In fact if this thread was elsewhere I would have missed it.

As Ron said, you need to check it a bit more often:). It doesn't take long to search though a few pages to find something of interest.

I must visit too often, as I rarely get more than a page of new posts each time I visit...:angel:

Also, if you think that 765 new posts is a lot - it is - think of the Mods here as well, as they all give a lot of time to keeping this place in as good a condition as it is with that sort of volume coming through. Must be a pretty thankless job sometime I would think, and they don't get the credit they deserve. They are a very helpful bunch if you ever need anything, and always quick to respond - unlike some other sites I frequent.

[incisor]

Dear Moderators,

how come this thread hasn't been moved to the complaints section?

:)

do we have one?

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

[alpick]

seems like you need one:p

[Homestar]

Try here...
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=59730&d=1367200696

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Aulro is too large and general to be searching all the time.

I agree there are too many sub-sections in AULRO. But you don't need to search, use the New Posts menu item to see what's new.

I read your comment as "I only want to look in the D3/D4/RRS area and nowhere else on AULRO".


If an administrator doesn't even visit the section he moved the post to who else is going to see it and help?

No, I moved it from a section I don't visit.Just to add weight to the topic, I am a D4 owner who visits the D3/D4/RRS forum frequently and like redback and p38rover I would have moved it too.

Diana

[incisor]

seems like you need one:p

current system has been working okay till now... most of the time i thought

and anyone can send me a pm and i will usually listen..

to be frank there is always an ongoing battle to moderate the place in a sustainable manner.

it isnt easy to balance sometimes

the overriding thing is the place has to be viable and manageable from a management point of view and usefull friendly and welcoming from a users point of view.

that means the place needs to keep people engaged and happy to be here and getting something back for their input, be it info wise or subscription wise or time spent moderating etc etc.

that said, to keep it manageable, the moderators have to do things that some people might dislike sometimes and people then start treating moderators like police and not perceiving them as other members who give their time to help them.

fine balance

i have purposely picked widely differing people and personalities as moderators so i can get some sort of consensus that represents a wider median view.

it doesnt always work well and there can be some pretty intense debate behind the scenes as there is at present about the way certain topics and discussions are moderated.

not to mention some people don't cope with change...

i certainly don't believe anyone on the moderating team goes out of their way to make things difficult for people.

[weeds]

i reckon this thread should be moved to genderal chat area........nothing D3/4 specific

[Disco Muppet]

Complaints section moderated by Akelly and Nugget? :angel:

[sheerluck]

i reckon this thread should be moved to genderal chat area........nothing D3/4 specific

But I don't visit that forum, how would I know where it is? :Rolling:

[incisor]

i reckon this thread should be moved to genderal chat area........nothing D3/4 specific

and when the conversation subsides you can...

;)

[grumpa]

I don't have a problem with threads being moved by moderators as I would hope the move would be to a more relevant section and thus receive more appropriate responses. Just my thoughts...

[TerryO]

Just to add weight to the topic, I am a D4 owner who visits the D3/D4/RRS forum frequently and like redback and p38rover I would have moved it too.

Diana

Ok Diana but why the need to move posts straight away? Why not leave it in the section where it was raised and let it be discussed until the thread runs out of puff and falls off the radar and then move it to the correct section?

I have been doing this for several weeks here and it has allowed a number of topics to be discussed in full then moved as reference Threads into the correct section, where sometimes a new group of members picks up on it and other discussions happen. *Note anything I mark with a 'lighbulb' like at the top of this page is a topic to me moved at a later date.

Does this harm the forum in anyway? Or does it possibly keep members more engaged and interested in various topics that they may otherwise not be?

Can someone please show me a downside to doing it this way?

Right now there is a thread in here on Camper Trialers that I have marked to be moved once it is stopped being discussed here and falls off the front page.

Will leaving this here for a few days turn the world upside down or might it just provide a situation where people who wouldn't usually read or discuss anything about campers an opportunity to learn something or grow an interest?

Same thing goes for all the other other topics that have been whisked away in the last few days, often when the thread was many posts old and people were discussing various points. Can someone please explain how doing that has made this section or the forum as a whole a better place?

I know change can be challenging for some people, espcially those who tend to see things only in black or white. But change and experimentation is what allows things an opportunity to grow, staying the same and never looking outside the square means stagnation and in the end often a slow demise.

[VladTepes]

Terry - quite often when a mod moves a thread they will leave an "expiring re-direct" (for say a week). This leaves the thread title in the original forum and when clicked on takes them to the actual topic which is now in the 'correct' forum. In my example this would disappear after a week as its pretty safe to assume anyone following the thread will have read / looked at it / realised its been moved by then.


To all - Inc's post summed it up very well. Moderating is a fine art and a LOT of work by the mods on here (not so much me, but the rest of them certainly!) We all do the best we can to make AULRO a satisfying place where good discussions and technical help can be had, and where it's as easy as possible for anyone to find threads on topics they may be looking for.

Do we get it right all the time? Well YES. Oh OK, no we don't. But we get it right most of the time. :)

[TerryO]

Hi Vlad,

yes I undertand about redirects, but that doesn't alwasy help the moved thread either. Have a look at a thread that was in the General Section and was moved to the Recovery section about tow balls or something like that.

In the fist two days in the General sesction it got 25 posts on the topic, it was moved and redirect was left and over the next three days it received 3 posts and then died.

This kind of thing usually happens when a topic is moved prematurely.

I have proven moving the thread after it is no longer active works here in the D3/4/RRs section, and over the years reading many posts on here the only time people ask questions or complain is when the thread is moved while it is still active.

I know and understand the present accepted norm on posts but again can someone please tell me what is wrong about not waiting until a thread has run out of puff before moving it?

Why not look outside the square and give it a go?

[sheerluck]

The point is that this remains a happy, good natured and easy place to frequent because of the way it is moderated, not in spite of.

I personally have no issues whatsoever with the way the place is moderated. If a thread is moved from one forum to another, based on another person's opinion (and that person being one which the owner of the site trusts to deal with such matters fairly) of that forum being a better fit for the subject, then so what. There's more important things in life to get hung up on.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Hi Terry

I hear your argument! :)

Diana

[clubagreenie]

I run a co-owned forum with about the same number of forum subjects. But rather than being brand or even model specific it's all about one model of engine. This makes the subjects very specific (Ignition, exhaust, injection etc) so it's a very easily self moderated place. To the extent that since I'm not developing anything in the field anymore I visit once a month to delete the dodgy spam users (if anyone knows a better system to stop spam bots let me know, stopping the posts was easy)

The guys here do a great job on whats a larger, worldwide (topic/based) forum with a wide spread of potential topics, each one of which could apply equally o every model or be specific to only one.

This makes it either an easy or big call to move something. If it's a elec issue, but for a 48-49 S1 should it be in Pinnacles S1 or elec stuff? (for me it'd be S1) Likewise a question about Tims headlight kits that suits every model is certainly electrical. But an ignition question thats RRC/D1 & maybe county is a elec specific rather than model specific question. I say that on the basis that RRC & D1 users may not browse each others areas, but a question about ignition issues in elec maybe seen by anyone.

I have often related issues raised on other models back to similar issues I've had on other models or even other makes. At the end of the day it's all about the sharing of information and having it in the most appropriate area for both random viewing as well as topic specific listing searches.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Hi c-A-g

It is frequently a difficult call, the electrics/brakes/transmission in a S1 are often the same or similar to the electrics/brakes/transmission in an SIII and I frequently move them to the root Series forum. This sometimes upsets the SIII owner who created the thread and who only looks at the SIII sub-forum on the flip-side the same action is welcomed by the SII or S1 owners. Without trying to be a little logical about it, we find that the same problem appears in each of the series sub-forums will get similar discussion but the important trick may only appear in one. Then only those who look in the correct forum will find the shortcut but not the others.

When talking about the camper trailer interface to a D3 Trakside system, yes the D3/D4 are different electrical systems to those in the Defender, but the trailer interface and function is essentially the same irrespective of vehicle system.

What I see is the mods trying to save duplication of threads and make them easily available to the greatest number of AULRO members. If I had a problem with dual battery systems in a trailer, I would likely search in the camper/trailer, the electrical technical forum and the specific model forum.

What will not help anyone is if we make the site too confused or so complex the mods give up all together.

[vnx205]

.... .. ... . ... ..
In the fist two days in the General sesction it got 25 posts on the topic, it was moved and redirect was left and over the next three days it received 3 posts and then died.
Maybe it had just run out of puff. It is hard to know for sure that it was the move that reduced the number of posts. I wonder if the number of views was maintained for a while in the new location.


.. ... .... ...
I know and understand the present accepted norm on posts but again can someone please tell me what is wrong about not waiting until a thread has run out of puff before moving it?
.. ..... ......


A couple of times recently I have seen a couple of threads started on the same topic a few days apart. I didn't take any notice of the location of the posts, but it is possible that someone noticed that there didn't seem to be a post on the topic in the logical place, so they started one, duplicating one that already existed in the wrong forum.

Moving the thread immediately and leaving an expiring redirect would reduce that possibility.

Of course my speculation about the duplicate threads is based on the rather dubious assumption that people look or do a search before they post. :p:p:p

[TerryO]

Hi Allen (vnx205)

re multiple similar threads, that is a constant and will never change. For instance how many threads are there in this section re Tyres? ...I'd guess hundreds.

How many threads are in the D2 section on V8's v TD5's ...there would be dozens. The list of popular threads that keep popping up in nearly every section would be very high.

The thing is a 'Search' feature works good in most cases but not all and if everyone just used the Search feature rather than asking questions, then consider this, if everyone did exactly that then the forum would not be anywhere near as busy. There would be lots of reading but not much discussion or building of community.

The whole secret to any forums success is to have people engaged in the forum and enjoying their discussions while meeting other like minded souls and hopefully making new friends and finding out important and interesting related facts.

In the end as long as each thread ends up in the correct section that is all that matters and from that point of view nothing has changed. ...;)

[gghaggis]

When talking about the camper trailer interface to a D3 Trakside system, yes the D3/D4 are different electrical systems to those in the Defender, but the trailer interface and function is essentially the same irrespective of vehicle system.


Um, no actually, it's still pretty specific.

Cheers,

Gordon

[CaverD3]

Just checked 'new posts' again 800 this time. :angel:

[TerryO]

Just checked 'new posts' again 800 this time. :angel:


Hi Caver,

Ron was just putting forward how he finds it easier to keep up to date with what people are posting on the forum.

People can use the 'New Posts' section to keep up to speed like Ron does if they wish, or just visit their usual favourite areas like the D3/4/RRS area to read the posts they are mainly interested in, nothing has changed on that front he was just pointing out there is an alternate way of reading the forum. ...;)

[CaverD3]

I think Aulro is large and diverse. Both it's strength an weakness.
for this reason I usually stay within the D3/4 RRS section unless I am looking for something off topic or another vehicle.
Unless someone has clearly posted in the wrong section in error they are expecting an answer from those who know the vehicle and it's systems.
There is no way I would have seen his question had I been able to help if it was moved.

[101RRS]

Ban anyone from AULRO for 6 months if they have a moderator issue.:banban::banban::wasntme:

[Plane Fixer]

I have found the moderation on this great forum to be very light handed. There are other forums where the moderators allow very little leeway and have no hesitation to lock and move posts.
The forumites here are also very relaxed and have no hesitation giving advice and help, nor do they force their views, the notable exception was the poster on soapbox who cut pasted, and in my humble opinion simply spammed his view on the world.
For me I generally only quickly view mainly the D3/4 forum, but also others when I am looking for something specific.
As such I would like to sincerely thank the mods who give us so much of their time, for free, to keep this place a civil and very informative site. WELL DONE!!!

[AnD3rew]

I like TerryO's approach, that seems like a very reasonable compromise.