Intermittant loss of throttle response Puma 2.4

[Brid]

Last week, my 2.4 Puma suddenly lost throttle response in peak hour traffic...

It was driving well, going through the gears from traffic lights. 1st & 2nd as normal, then 3rd gear and backed off with the traffic flow. Reapplying the accelerator and ZERO response. Tickled it several times, and power again. This was the same pattern until I reached my destination. Which ever gear I eased up in, and reapplied the throttle it would go dead.

There was no engine malfunction light, and when I restarted the engine to head home again after 15 minute stop, all was well. Back to normal again. I had thought it might be the potentiometer (?) thing connected to the accelerator pedal. Definitely not the fuel filter, or tank breather.

Anyone else had this happen to throw any light on things?

[jx2mad]

Happened a few times in my wife's Astra. Suspected accelerator pot. Problem disappeared and hasn't come back. Jim

[ATH]

I had a similiar prob with the throttle potentiometer on a Td5 and it left us stranded in Newman some years ago.
Vehicle would tick over all day but putting power on made it do some things like bunny hops or the engine would cut out.
Then it took nearly 3 weeks for it to get trucked back to Perth as the truckies didn't want to unload just to get our vehicle and camper on to their truck.
Best get it checked out as you could be left stranded as even in a town as big as Newman absolutely no one could or would even look at a Landie.
AlanH

[Brid]

I booked it in to MR Automotive a few weeks ago (before all this happened) to get a thorough check over, and I actually dropped it in there this morning, so it's in good hands.

The problem is that they'll need it to play up on them to identify where the problem is. Otherwise, there's likely to be an element of guesswork. The problem happened once again this morning, but only on one occasion. It'd be a bit of good luck if it happened when MR test drove it.

[Beckford]

Best get it checked out as you could be left stranded as even in a town as big as Newman absolutely no one could or would even look at a Landie.

Is there a Ford Dealer in Newman?

Same engine as the Ford Ranger and Ford Transit van?

[the_preacher1973]

Is there a Ford Dealer in Newman?

Same engine as the Ford Ranger and Ford Transit van?

The vehicle stranded in Newman was a TD5.

[The Cone of Silence]

I've had the throttle ignore me in two different situations in my PUMA. The conditions aren't quite the same as yours but it might be worth thinking about:

1.) Throttle response went to about 75% one day. turned out to be a FILTHY air filter. That said, the throttle still worked, power was simply reduced very consistently across the range.

2.) Radiator got blocked up with mud and so occasionally when it would overheat, especially when accelerating in traffic or on the freeway up a hill, the engine would simply ignore any right foot input. Once it had cooled down (a few seconds only), it'd be back to normal. have you been through nay mud? Carrying a heavy load?

Keen to hear what your issue is and whether it's related or not.

Bobby

[Ewen]

i've been having this problem for ages actually. and same thing happened to me this morning.. thankfully i was a street away from my office and managed to limp in..

went for a drive again 3 hours later and alls well. same as last time..

haven't tried anything yet.. ain't too keen on changing fuel filter myself, priming it again seems awfully troublesome.. might check the air filter later.. everything else i'll have to bring it into a workshop..

do let us know if you find anything..

[The Cone of Silence]

Ewen

According to this videao, "Priming the filter (which seems to be just filling it with diesel) prevents you having to bleed air from the fuel line."

Fuel filter change begins at 7m21s
NEW Land Rover Defender 90 2.4 TDCI Puma Oil and Filter Service - YouTube

Bobby

[BilboBoggles]

Would the PUMa store codes for overheating, and perhaps throttle pot failure? I would have thought the dealer could locate those codes?

[Brid]

Not sure. The engine malfunction light didn't come on, so I would think not (could be wrong of course). I didn't think to check the scan gauge, but so far it has only identified a fault code when the malfunction light comes on.

Will advise if & when it is sorted.

[Naks]

Not sure. The engine malfunction light didn't come on, so I would think not (could be wrong of course). I didn't think to check the scan gauge, but so far it has only identified a fault code when the malfunction light comes on.
Will advise if & when it is sorted.


Not all fault codes trigger the MIL, so check with the scanguage and you can look up the code(s) here: Diesel performance tuning and economy remap chip tuning for Landrover Defender Discovery TD5 Puma TDV6 TDV8 (http://bellautoservices.co.uk/) or in the manual.

It could be the throttle position sensor?

[Ewen]

watching this thread closely... thanks for the video link.. have actually seen it but alas got bit by the procastination bug :p

[labrado]

Would the PUMa store codes for overheating, and perhaps throttle pot failure? I would have thought the dealer could locate those codes?

my 2.4 puma experienced this problem twice last month after finishing a dusty track:(. Got it checked by an independent LR specialist back in melbourne, no DTC found.

Drove thru a bog hole full of water and mud on last Sunday and it played up once just now.:(

Will check the radiator tmr.

[Naks]

Check intercooler & turbo hoses

[Lorryman100]

The MIL lamp only illuminates with tested DTC's to do with the Emissions control of the engine. The dealers only check the modules for tested DTC's using SDD and not untested or pending DTC's. If the EMS went into limp mode due to overheating then a Tested DTC would be logged in the EMS.
If you have a diagnostic tool check that the accelerator is sending valid position values back to the EMS.

Nanocom:
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/318.jpg

MSV2
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/319.jpg

It may be a good idea to remove the accelerator plug and coat the contacts on both the plug and the pedal contacts with electrical contact cleaner. If the pedal readings are constant when you lose power again then you will have discounted the pedal as being at fault and then you can move onto tracing the loom back to the EMS looking for chaffing, shorts etc.

HTH Brian.

[labrado]

Hi Lorryman100,
what if it was a momentary loss? Actually I don't have to stop the vehicle and turn off the engine to get it back to normal. I just depressed the pedal a couple of times and all of a sudden the power came back.

any suggestion to diagnose this issue?



The MIL lamp only illuminates with tested DTC's to do with the Emissions control of the engine. The dealers only check the modules for tested DTC's using SDD and not untested or pending DTC's. If the EMS went into limp mode due to overheating then a Tested DTC would be logged in the EMS.
If you have a diagnostic tool check that the accelerator is sending valid position values back to the EMS.

Nanocom:
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/318.jpg

MSV2
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/319.jpg

It may be a good idea to remove the accelerator plug and coat the contacts on both the plug and the pedal contacts with electrical contact cleaner. If the pedal readings are constant when you lose power again then you will have discounted the pedal as being at fault and then you can move onto tracing the loom back to the EMS looking for chaffing, shorts etc.

HTH Brian.

[Lorryman100]

First thing I would do is disconnect the accelerator pedal plug and check the pins for contamination then clean it with an electrical contact cleaner. Then a live data check on the EMS sensors along with the pedal position sensor with a diagnostic tool to see if the values corresponded with my foot on the pedal, if it happened again after cleaning the terminals. Also I would be able to check the other parameters as well, MAP, MAF, Fuel rail pressure, CHT and Turbo boost. Once I had the live data then I would be in a better position to say if the pedal was at fault or if it was something else causing the lack of throttle response.

HTH Brian

[MD5]

Is there a way to check the "Pedal Sensor" using the ScanGauge2 ?

[n plus one]

Is there a way to check the "Pedal Sensor" using the ScanGauge2 ?

Pretty sure the Scan Guage shows TPS? So you could check be looking for inconsistencies between perceived TPS (ie the angle if your foot) and displayed TPS?

Crude, but possibly sufficient to diagnose an issue?

[MD5]

Thanks, I will take a look at the ScanGauge TPS gauge.

[Iain_B]

Any idea what a TPS costs? Thinking about getting one for the the toolbox if it can die and leave you stranded.

[Lorryman100]

They come in at about £100 in the UK for the genuine LR ones.

Accelerator Pedal Assembly (Puma) - SLC500050PMA | Land Rover and Range Rover parts (http://landrover.shukersparts.co.uk/potentiometer-pedal-assembly-2-4l-duratorq-tdci-hpcr-140ps-slc500050pma.html)

Brian.

[pushrod]

the scangauge 2 has got as display field for TPS , but on mine its blank
has anyone activated it with a programmable Xgauge code yet ?

cheers



Pretty sure the Scan Guage shows TPS? So you could check be looking for inconsistencies between perceived TPS (ie the angle if your foot) and displayed TPS?

Crude, but possibly sufficient to diagnose an issue?

[FLINTSTONE]

Check the green and white wires in the back of the plug that connects to the turbo, may be broken and contacting intermittently, was my problem.

[Ewen]

same thing happened to me again today.. no power on 4th gear.. back down to 3rd and its fine. after a couple of minutes, no power at all.. and it comes back again..

talk about stress driving down the fwy. went like this for about half hour then engine suddenly stalled / died while I was still moving at about 40kph+ in 3rd gear.. thankfully wasn't on the fwy. restarted the engine and it was fine again. :(

going to bring it into the workshop tmr.

[Brid]

Thanks for the comments. I'm just back from my 2000km trip, and it hasn't played up again since the first 2 occasions, just before my trip.

I did check electrical connections to the throttle position sensor before I left, as well as relays under the drivers seat as suggested. I guess that doesn't throw much light on it really. My gut thought TPS, but my gut isn't always right either!

[alan48]

Hi all,
similar to others I too have a fuel issue on a 2010 puma 2.4 ltr 90-it looses throttle response completely but then sometimes seems to clear itself and be fine--now doing it again and this time eventually stops and will not even start any more. Have previously had one sensor replaced with upgraded version but now again home on a flat top-- maybe a pressure wash has been the culprit but really a LR should be able to take some washing. Any ideas wil be helpful and glad not in the middle of the Simpson! Doubt I will ever touch LR again though.:(