Looking to build a camper

[Dizza]

I have always been a big fan of camping out of a four wheel drive. I love the prospect of pulling up to a camp sight, rolling out a swag and cooking over a fire.
There are a few disadvantages to this though....

1. You cant really do it all that comfortably in the winter
2. It means that you need to fit all of your equipment in the car (an interesting challenge in a Disco 1) :p
3. The girlfriend is never as keen on it as I am (she has been caravanning with her family her whole life) :D

So i began thinking about alternatives. And came up with a couple ideas.

1. Pick up a second hand camper
2. Get a cheap caravan (had one available at the time)
3. Build something

Now naturally neither option 1 or 2 are really feasible for taking off road however option 3 got me thinking. After a quick bit of research i found an interesting concept. A teardrop camper.

A teardrop camper is like a very compact caravan (you sleep indoors - Happy girlfriend :p ) with an outdoor cooking space.
Building it myself means i can build it as big as i want, with whatever features i want and match it to my Disco in width, clearance and height.

The most attractive advantage of a teardrop camper is probably the weight. If built carefully they usually come in at well below 500kg (usually closer to 350) Which means its a little more likely to follow my disco to those great little camp sites off the beaten track. :)

So i relearned bits of sketchup for the 10th time :p and threw this together. Just looking for any advice or suggestions. Obviously it isn't finished but having some more eyes give it a once over will be helpful.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/439.jpg (http://s1333.photobucket.com/user/Dillan_Stock/media/Trailer1_zpsd6107f84.png.html)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/440.jpg (http://s1333.photobucket.com/user/Dillan_Stock/media/Trailer2_zpsb3972aa4.png.html)

[richard4u2]

looks good, solid insulated walls and roof , air con , heater , should be happy girl friend happy camping :D

[steveG]

Looks good.
Make sure you consider ventilation - or it will get unbearably stuffy inside.

Steve

[POD]

The teardrop style campers look great, I think they are a good lightweight option but the little awning over the cooking area leaves a bit to be desired. Great if rain only ever fell vertically and you don't mind eating on your bed. Sooner or later you will want a bigger covered area with side protection. There are some great portable awnings on the market which would make a practical addition.
If you do any outback touring, you will need to do something about the box on the drawbar to prevent stones bouncing off it straight back at the car. Many a back window has been broken in this way and that is why some form of stone deflector is standard on an off-road trailer.

[Dizza]

Looks good.
Make sure you consider ventilation - or it will get unbearably stuffy inside.

Steve

Yep, electric roof fan and opening windows on both side will be in the final design.


The teardrop style campers look great, I think they are a good lightweight option but the little awning over the cooking area leaves a bit to be desired. Great if rain only ever fell vertically and you don't mind eating on your bed. Sooner or later you will want a bigger covered area with side protection. There are some great portable awnings on the market which would make a practical addition.
If you do any outback touring, you will need to do something about the box on the drawbar to prevent stones bouncing off it straight back at the car. Many a back window has been broken in this way and that is why some form of stone deflector is standard on an off-road trailer.

The plan is to have a canvas awning made up to go with it and have it clip on to the back and sides. Kinda like a C shape with the camper in the middle and the canvas covering a metre or so to the rear and sides. Not sure how it would be pulled off but that's the plan :p
And i hadn't thought of a stone guard, thanks heaps, will add that for sure. :)

[Ranga]

Reminds me of the Tvan.

Tvan : Track Trailer (http://tracktrailer.com.au/tvan/)

[Dizza]

Reminds me of the Tvan.

Tvan : Track Trailer (http://tracktrailer.com.au/tvan/)

Its a similar concept, The Tvan includes living space off the rear in the form of a tent as I understand it too.
And they are worth an absolute fortune :eek: :p

edit: and after a quick bit of research it appears that their lightest model weighs 890kg. Im hoping for 400kg :p

[Tank]

Try to make your eating and cooking areas bug-proof, there is nothing worse than flys all over your food and face while eating, and the missus wouldn't complain.
Would also suggest you make the drawbar shorter, I see a lot of long draw bar C/T's tearing into the tops of eco-drains and getting hung up, which usually results in chopping up the track with spinning the wheels to get the trailer over. NPWS have started issuing "Not Suitable for Trailers" notices on many tracks because of this damage, these notices usually precede total ban.
Your back door set-up will require very good sealing from dust, the rear seems to attract more than it's fair share of dust.
May I also suggest to build 2 long shallow sliding draws between chassis and body for heavy items, like recovery gear and tools, either pull out the back or sides, good luck, Regards Frank.

[Dizza]

Try to make you eating and cooking areas bug-proof, there is nothing worse than flys all over your food and face while eating.
Would also suggest you make the drawbar shorter, i see a lot of long bar C/T's tearing into the tops of eco-drains and getting hung, which usually results in chopping up the track. NPWS have started issuing "Not Suitable for Trailers" notices on many tracks because of this damage, these notices usually precede total ban.
Your back door set-up will require very good sealing from dust, the rear seems to attract more than it's fair share of dust.
May I also suggest to build 2 long shallow sliding draws between chassis and body for heavy items, like recovery gear and tools, either pull out the back or sides, good luck, Regards Frank.

The draw bar will definitely be shorter than it is in those images, im having the local trailer manufacturer fab the chassis so i plan on leaving things like draw bar length up to them (they know better than me)
The rear hatch sits inside the outer walls against proper rubber seals when closed. It should be sufficient for keeping the dust out though i could be wrong :p

I had considered that and included a pair of long draws in the original design however i omitted them from this design in the interest of reducing the trailer's profile a little. I plan on storing most of the '4x4' related equipment in the Disco and the camping stuff (clothes, food etc.) in the trailer. Is there any major disadvantage to this?

[Chops]

I love the look of the little teardrop campers, have seen a couple of new ones for sale, very nicely done they were compared to the originals.
Suspension of course would need to be raised and beefed up, and I'm not sure of the best way to deal with the canopy/fly mesh.
For just the two of you, you shouldn't really need much space in the way of storage for clothes etc. So you could make a small cupboard off the back of the pantry box for clothes and shoes that would be accessed from inside.
Just need room for a fridge, battery and gas bottle, although you might want to keep the fridge in the car, it'll come in handy when your doing your day trips etc.

[Dizza]

Im going to run leaf springs with shocks for the sake of simplicity and cost. There is probably a bit too much storage in that design, i have now removed some and increased the interior space a bit.
The box on the front will fit a deep cycle battery and the fridge (60l Waeco) and probably a gas bottle on top of the guards which i am yet to add.

[Flipper]

[QUOTE=Dizza;1914890]I have always been a big fan of camping out of a four wheel drive. I love the prospect of pulling up to a camp sight, rolling out a swag and cooking over a fire.
There are a few disadvantages to this though....

1. You cant really do it all that comfortably in the winter
2. It means that you need to fit all of your equipment in the car (an interesting challenge in a Disco 1) :p
3. The girlfriend is never as keen on it as I am (she has been caravanning with her family her whole life) :D

So i began thinking about alternatives. And came up with a couple ideas.

1. Pick up a second hand camper
2. Get a cheap caravan (had one available at the time)
3. Build something

Now naturally neither option 1 or 2 are really feasible for taking off road however option 3 got me thinking. After a quick bit of research i found an interesting concept. A teardrop camper.

A teardrop camper is like a very compact caravan (you sleep indoors - Happy girlfriend :p ) with an outdoor cooking space.
Building it myself means i can build it as big as i want, with whatever features i want and match it to my Disco in width, clearance and height.

The most attractive advantage of a teardrop camper is probably the weight. If built carefully they usually come in at well below 500kg (usually closer to 350) Which means its a little more likely to follow my disco to those great little camp sites off the beaten track. :)

So i relearned bits of sketchup for the 10th time :p and threw this together. Just looking for any advice or suggestions. Obviously it isn't finished but having some more eyes give it a once over will be helpful.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/439.jpg (http://s1333.photobucket.com/user/Dillan_Stock/media/Trailer1_zpsd6107f84.png.html)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/440.jpg (http://s1333.photobucket.com/user/Dillan_Stock/media/Trailer2_zpsb3972aa4.png.html)
Love your spirit Dizza, and keeping the girlfriend comfortable is the most important also. If you get stuck with the lady for a few more years unfortunately you will have to update to something more prestige.
It costs money and lots of it as they get older. :D

[Roverlord off road spares]

Have a gander on this Aussie camper site, lots of home built campers and lots of different suspension setups.
My Camper Trailer Build (http://www.myswag.org/index.php?PHPSESSID=ujk20hqe77o4kic6cm78cpcge2&board=28.0)

mighty helpful with ideas, some rippers ones built.
cheers, Mario

[roverrescue]

Depending on how heavy duty you want to make it you will need to work some serious mojo to keep it under 400kg if it has fridges, battery, kitchen, gas and sleeping area.

If it is simply dirt road capable you could lighten the chassis and suspension up to shed kilos.
300kg is seriously light for a full offroad chassis/ box before you even put one item in it?

But the fun thing is trying! Best of luck.

S

[digger]

Spare tyre?

Small window somewhere, eg light/ventilation, or even porthole in door?

battery with trickle charge via trailer plug, LED lighting in and out

water tank and tap? maybe even small sink?

rear bumper set back at least 4" from rear door in case of bumps etc, so door can still open etc...

very interested to see how it comes out..

[Dizza]

Depending on how heavy duty you want to make it you will need to work some serious mojo to keep it under 400kg if it has fridges, battery, kitchen, gas and sleeping area.

If it is simply dirt road capable you could lighten the chassis and suspension up to shed kilos.
300kg is seriously light for a full offroad chassis/ box before you even put one item in it?

But the fun thing is trying! Best of luck.

S

It definitely wont come in that light loaded but the aim is to get it at least below 500 unloaded :)
The construction of the actual shell is all really lightweight, it's primarily sandwiched ply, foam insulation and fiberglass.

Thanks for the feedback :)


Spare tyre?

Small window somewhere, eg light/ventilation, or even porthole in door?

battery with trickle charge via trailer plug, LED lighting in and out

water tank and tap? maybe even small sink?

rear bumper set back at least 4" from rear door in case of bumps etc, so door can still open etc...

very interested to see how it comes out..

There will be wind out windows on each door and a long narrow one at the draw bar end.
It'll be running a 100AH deep cycle in the trailer with an anderson to hook it up to the Disco, led lights inside and out and a water tank mounted underneath above the axle with a simple hand pump (less to go wrong) mounted in the kitchen are.
I'm probably going to put the spare on the draw bar. If there's room ;) if not on the roof or maybe on a swing out carrier.

Thanks for the feedback, keep it coming :p
Dillan

[Sitec]

Hi. If you are getting a trailer mob to make it, get them to use a square rear axle, and fit it up with stud pattern to match your Disco. Most of them use AlCo for axles, springs etc. Make sure they take the drawbar 'A' frame right back to the front spring hangers if using leaf springs. I noticed you are keeping your body inside the wheels... This then makes the arches a good place to carry a spare wheel and a Jerry Can... Good luck with the build.:)

[Dizza]

Hi. If you are getting a trailer mob to make it, get them to use a square rear axle, and fit it up with stud pattern to match your Disco. Most of them use AlCo for axles, springs etc. Make sure they take the drawbar 'A' frame right back to the front spring hangers if using leaf springs. I noticed you are keeping your body inside the wheels... This then makes the arches a good place to carry a spare wheel and a Jerry Can... Good luck with the build.:)

Thats the plan, same width and stud pattern as the old girl :) (anyone have 3 spare Disco 1 alloys going cheap? :p ) I hope to be able to tow (drag) it anywhere i can take the truck (within reason) so a matched trailer is a must.

I assume the A frame back to the spring hangers is a strength thing?

Yeah that's the plan for a couple of jerry cans, though I hadn't considered the spare wheel. Thanks! :D

I am definitely set on building it. Just gotta come to some agreement with the old man about using his shed :angel: :p

[Tank]

You will want the drawbar long enough so you can fully open the rear door of the Disco and possibly long enough to jack-knife without hitting the drawbar/camper. Ask the trailer builder to keep the angle between the 2 drawbar rails as close together as possible, a good example is the drawbars on "Lifestyle Campers", or even a single pipe bar as in the army trailers and a means of recovery from the rear.
You need to consider, when taking a trailer off road is how you are going to get "it' out of a bog or off a very steep ascent/descent and how well it tracks behind on bends, Regards Frank.

[Dizza]

You will want the drawbar long enough so you can fully open the rear door of the Disco and possibly long enough to jack-knife without hitting the drawbar/camper. Ask the trailer builder to keep the angle between the 2 drawbar rails as close together as possible, a good example is the drawbars on "Lifestyle Campers", or even a single pipe bar as in the army trailers and a means of recovery from the rear.
You need to consider, when taking a trailer off road is how you are going to get "it' out of a bog or off a very steep ascent/descent and how well it tracks behind on bends, Regards Frank.

That's an excellent point, I hadn't considered that. Thanks.
I have seen a number of trailers with a single piece of box section along the length of the trailer. (mainly on the military types) Is that what you mean? I may have a chat with the trailer bloke about doing that. Ill include a Hayman Reese style hitch at the back, properly braced of course. To use as a recovery point.

Anything i should consider to help it track well?

Any other important points to consider?

[Dizza]

Here are a couple of updated photos.

I have changed how much of the rear hatch opens to simplify construction a little.
I have also added the cupboard doors for inside and a 15" DVD player :p

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/413.jpg (http://s1333.photobucket.com/user/Dillan_Stock/media/Trailerv34_zpsf166d47c.png.html)

I also threw on the doors.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/414.jpg (http://s1333.photobucket.com/user/Dillan_Stock/media/Trailerv33_zps3fc37d96.png.html)

Does anyone know the width hub to hub of a Discovery 1 axle? i have done a quick search but couldn't find a definite answer. My model is about right but not exact, bit hard to measure the width while the vehicle is still attached :p

Im going to get a quote from a couple trailer mobs tomorrow in between painting my bull bar and mounting it.

Would it be best to source the water tank and things myself or leave that to the trailer mob?
And not knowing a great deal about metal work would a galvanized chassis be best? I understand it has greater resistance to rust? (also greater impact on the hip pocket right? :( :p )

[roverrescue]

There is nothing wrong with a solidly constructed centre bar for the hitch as opposed to an a-frame.
Not just light weight army trailers... have a look at a 2.5T rated boat trailer sometime ;)

50mm Hitch Receiver at the rear is also good for a bike rack...

But if you have a compliant builder I would incorporate solid recover points to each rear corner of the rig.

Often when trailers are all messed up - you will be disconnecting and then cornerpulling for the win.



Steve

[Chops]

Although light enough not to warrant it on the road, electric brakes will help you in sticky spots.
I had a tradesmans trailer set out as a camper, I had provision for brakes but couldn't afford it at the time of purchase. Did a fair bit of treckling into the high country with it and had a few scary moments where the trailer tried to overtake me on downhill runs :eek:

And as a point of interest, why the TV? Do you want to enjoy the bush/beach wherever, or watch the box? ;)

[Dizza]

There is nothing wrong with a solidly constructed centre bar for the hitch as opposed to an a-frame.
Not just light weight army trailers... have a look at a 2.5T rated boat trailer sometime ;)

50mm Hitch Receiver at the rear is also good for a bike rack...

But if you have a compliant builder I would incorporate solid recover points to each rear corner of the rig.

Often when trailers are all messed up - you will be disconnecting and then cornerpulling for the win.



Steve

Haha so its a pretty solid method of trailer construction? :p

Thats one of the main reasons i'm having the hitch put on the back. The girlfriend and I both enjoy our mountain biking (used to race before I blew out my knee)

Recovery points for sure, have had more than enough experience dragging stuck trailers out to understand the how necessary they are :D


Although light enough not to warrant it on the road, electric brakes will help you in sticky spots.
I had a tradesmans trailer set out as a camper, I had provision for brakes but couldn't afford it at the time of purchase. Did a fair bit of treckling into the high country with it and had a few scary moments where the trailer tried to overtake me on downhill runs :eek:

And as a point of interest, why the TV? Do you want to enjoy the bush/beach wherever, or watch the box? ;)

Yeah absolutely. Electric brakes are definitely on the cards. I will definitely include provisions for them down the track if i don't put them in to begin with. :)

Due to the uni student budget it will be a sort of rolling project for a bit i imagine :p

Haha again, to keep the girlfriend happy primarily.
I am trying to involve her in the design process (and some of the building) because its a bit of a joint venture. She saw the space between the cupboards and showed me a picture of a tear-drop trailer with a TV in it saying it 'looked nice'. I took the hint... :p

[Tank]

That's an excellent point, I hadn't considered that. Thanks.
I have seen a number of trailers with a single piece of box section along the length of the trailer. (mainly on the military types) Is that what you mean? I may have a chat with the trailer bloke about doing that. Ill include a Hayman Reese style hitch at the back, properly braced of course. To use as a recovery point.

Anything i should consider to help it track well?

Any other important points to consider?
Have a look at an ex-army trailer, they have LR stud pattern, rear tow point, proper springs with shocks, easy to extend single round drawbar, I'm extending mine 18" to give me some room for spare on drawbar. Heavy though at around 300kgs for bare chassis (no body), but will never break, am considering setting up chains from front corners of trailer to Disco so as I can back it without trailer turning off straight back, so as it will not jack knife while backing down a slope, still on the drawing board with that one, show you a pic of my bare trailer, if I can find it, Regards Frank.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/388.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/389.jpg

[Tank]

Might be for sale if I get a trailer I'm after, Regards Frank.

[Dizza]

Have a look at an ex-army trailer, they have LR stud pattern, rear tow point, proper springs with shocks, easy to extend single round drawbar, I'm extending mine 18" to give me some room for spare on drawbar. Heavy though at around 300kgs for bare chassis (no body), but will never break, am considering setting up chains from front corners of trailer to Disco so as I can back it without trailer turning off straight back, so as it will not jack knife while backing down a slope, still on the drawing board with that one, show you a pic of my bare trailer, if I can find it, Regards Frank.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/388.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/389.jpg

I had considered one of the military type trailers, would probably require significant modification of my plans and ideas so far. What does the top measure?


Might be for sale if I get a trailer I'm after, Regards Frank.

Ill keep that in mind.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/390.jpg (http://s1333.photobucket.com/user/Dillan_Stock/media/Untitled_zpsb40c2530.png.html)

I have thrown this together, Is this the sort of thing i should be asking the trailer mob for? in this quick draft it has a 50x75 centre section and the rest is 50x50 box section.

I jacked up the truck and took off the back wheels to get a proper measurement of the rear axle's length and found with the offset of the standard rims it is quite a lot narrower than i had thought :eek:

It looks like i will have to shift around the design a bit so that the wheels are a little inboard and the mattress sits higher. It does mean i can add some storage under the bed though. It is a PITA though because it complicates things quite a lot.
The alternative is some new rims for the truck and trailer to gain some more space ;) :p

[DiscoMick]

Storage under the bed sounds like a good idea. Its important in our Aussieswag camper because it means we don't have to load as much stuff in the Disco and can leave the camper setup and ready to go at short notice.
Electric brakes would be a must, I reckon, for towing down slopes and pulling up suddenly from highway speeds.
You will have to think carefully about weight distribution to get the trailer balanced with a towball weight of about 100kg or so.
Dust/water sealing will need a lot of thought - it's a big failing with some campers I have seen (including my own).
Could you design it to add a standard awning or even a wrapround awning like a Foxwing, as a simple way to cover the outside?
Incidentally, have you researched registration/engineering requirements with your state transport department? And does your insurer have requirements for you to be able to insure the trailer? Your trailer manufacturer should be able to advise on this.
Its an interesting project - good on you for having a go.

[Dizza]

Storage under the bed sounds like a good idea. Its important in our Aussieswag camper because it means we don't have to load as much stuff in the Disco and can leave the camper setup and ready to go at short notice.
Electric brakes would be a must, I reckon, for towing down slopes and pulling up suddenly from highway speeds.
You will have to think carefully about weight distribution to get the trailer balanced with a towball weight of about 100kg or so.
Dust/water sealing will need a lot of thought - it's a big failing with some campers I have seen (including my own).
Could you design it to add a standard awning or even a wrapround awning like a Foxwing, as a simple way to cover the outside?
Incidentally, have you researched registration/engineering requirements with your state transport department? And does your insurer have requirements for you to be able to insure the trailer? Your trailer manufacturer should be able to advise on this.
Its an interesting project - good on you for having a go.


As i am having the chassis built rego is pretty easy to do.
The plan is to include a spot on the side for an awning. I am going to talk to some people about having a linking section made up to cover the back and link into a side awning.

Thanks, im looking forward to getting started.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/332.jpg (http://s1333.photobucket.com/user/Dillan_Stock/media/TrailerwithDisco_zps0288440e.png.html)

I have updated things to suit the new chassis and i threw in a Discovery 2 model to get an idea of how it will look. I think it looks good :)

I also got the quote back for the chassis with an off road hitch, electric brakes, a rear Hayman Reese style reciever and the correct hubs. I was quoted $3100. They also said they can fit Al-ko independent suspension at the same price.

Still waiting for a couple more quotes but i think that's pretty good. Opinions? Sound like a decent price?

[austastar]

Hi,
If you can jack knife the trailer to near 90 degrees, it makes it easier to get in the back of the vehicle for short stops like a lunch break.
cheers

[steveG]

Are you planning on making the shell from pre-laminated panels, or are you going to laminate it up yourself with the curves in?

With the flat sides, and curved top it would be perfect to do from pre-laminated panels. Curves would be easily made by making multiple cuts in the inside of the radius and bending.

Steve

[Dizza]

Are you planning on making the shell from pre-laminated panels, or are you going to laminate it up yourself with the curves in?

With the flat sides, and curved top it would be perfect to do from pre-laminated panels. Curves would be easily made by making multiple cuts in the inside of the radius and bending.

Steve

The plan is to make the side panels myself by sandwiching some plywood between fibre glass panels and an internal layer of thin, decorative ply. The roof will have a number of cross pieces which some reasonably thin ply will be bent over and then some fiberglass over that as well.
The outside edges will be finished with a J mould extrusion.
The main reason for this is that it is the method that the majority of home builders use for building these. That means that there are plenty of resources around on the best way to curve ply etc.

Dillan

[Chops]

Just over 3K seems a lot for just a chassis. I had my whole trailer built for under 1500, I know it was a few years ago, but I wouldn't have thought prices had gone up that much (??).

[Dizza]

Just over 3K seems a lot for just a chassis. I had my whole trailer built for under 1500, I know it was a few years ago, but I wouldn't have thought prices had gone up that much (??).

I don't want to sound as if i am defending the trailer manufacturer im speaking to but it does include electric brakes, an off road hitch and proper off road suspension.
I am waiting on a couple more quotes so we will see what sort of figures they give.

[Chops]

I don't want to sound as if i am defending the trailer manufacturer im speaking to but it does include electric brakes, an off road hitch and proper off road suspension.
I am waiting on a couple more quotes so we will see what sort of figures they give.

Naa, all good then, that makes sense :) Mine was only leaf sprung with no brakes, but it did have the brackets for them and Toyo Hubs/rims (:angel:).

[Chops]

Hey Dizza, what's the drawing program your using? If you could post me a link to it I would appreciate it thanks. I've been trying to get hold of one, but not having much success without having to spend coin,,
I like the way you got the Disco onto it :D

[Dizza]

Hey Dizza, what's the drawing program your using? If you could post me a link to it I would appreciate it thanks. I've been trying to get hold of one, but not having much success without having to spend coin,,
I like the way you got the Disco onto it :D

Its just Google sketchup, Im using the paid version but there is a free one which is good for most things.
Its pretty easy to use with a bit of googling to figure out bits and pieces.

I cheated and downloaded someone else's accurately sized Disco model :D There is no way I could do that :p

[Sitec]

Hello again. That's still tall money for a chassis. We have a mob here in Adelaide called SA Trailer & Chassis Equipment. Used to use them all the time when I worked for one of the trailer mobs in Gawler.. Price up the bits you need then see how much the chassis is really worth. Also worth looking up composite panels... We used to be able to buy a sheet 3m x 1.5m composite panel that had .8 alli, 4mm hard plastic, .8 alli. It was light, less than $150 a sheet and came with paint ready white or silver sides. We were also able to buy corner and end cappings to suit the same stuff... Will try and find the make and supplier! :)

[DiscoMick]

Independent suspension for the same price sounds like a very good idea.:cool:
Are you getting them to do any electrics?

[Dizza]

ill see if they can do it any cheaper.
Im doing a little more research into the composites, looks like a good idea. especially the insulated caravan wall type stuff


Independent suspension for the same price sounds like a very good idea.:cool:
Are you getting them to do any electrics?

Thats what i thought :p

Nope. Electrics is the one thing i am very confident about so i figured ill save some money and do it myself :)

[Sitec]

Hi Dizza. As promised, here is the composite panel manufacturer. It's a product by Ullrich Alluminium. Rigid as hell and light as too. You can also countersink it, but practise on a little bit and get your drill sharpened with minimal taper behind the cutting edge or blink and you'll have a hole the size of your countersunk rivet!! I used 5mm CSK blind rivets from Wurth on my camp body. Here's a pic which has the phone no on the removable wrapper!!

[Sitec]

And here's a pic of the protective film pealed back revealing the silver side which has a good 'keyed' finish for paint. The other side is a bright white which is as good a finish as a car, truck etc. Sorry they're a bit 'grainy', iPads don't seem to take good pictures in unnatural workshop light!!

[steveG]

Whats the core material in that Sitec? And thickness?
Did you have any problems with the core crushing when you riveted it up?

One technique if you are going to be bolting/attaching through composite panels is to drill your hole through, then use something to dig out the core for about 10mm around the hole.
A small cut-off allen key in your cordless drill does a good job ;)
Fill with epoxy filler and then redrill the hole when set. Sort of like a crush tube for composite panels!

Steve

[Chops]

Couldn't you just use a small piece of tube as crush tube? Same effect but not the messing around.

[Sitec]

SteveG, no need. The black plasticky material that is in the center is best described as just like the material used to make high pressure mains water pipe. I used 5 mm countersunk rivets and it didn't crush at all. Just measured it now and it is 4mm overall thickness. Just like a piece of water pipe, a drill bit will go thru it like a knife thru butter. When building horse floats, using 25x50 and 25x25 rhs I buffed the rear side to give Sikaflex the 'key' required, pressed each panel into place and taped into position using masking tape. The following day I marked and drilled my 5mm holes, and then sharpened a 9mm drill to suit the CSK rivet head angle. Sharpen it so it does not bite and use it on a cordless on the slowest speed and you can get a very neat countersunk flush finish with no crushing or denting.....

[Sitec]

Here's a pic of the capping material. I've had to draw a cross section pic of the corner capping as having just spent 10 min in the workshop looking for the off cut has given me the s***s!!! If I find it over the course of the weekend I'll pit a pic up!! :)

[Dizza]

Thanks Sitec for the info on those panels.
I think i will be building it out of foam/fiberglass composite. (a sheet of foam sandwiched between 2 sheets of fiberglass) 20mm wide.
From the research i have done it will not require any additional support and should be plenty strong enough to hold itself together. (it is a material often used in caravan construction)
It also has excellent insulating properties (it is often used in the construction of freezer truck bodies)

Seems as though it is perfect for my application


Dizza

[steveG]

Couldn't you just use a small piece of tube as crush tube? Same effect but not the messing around.

You could, but by the time you get the correct size tube, and cut it perfectly to length it still takes a bit of time to do - particularly if there are a few holes to do. A quick spin to clean out the core then mix and squeeze in some filler doesn't take long. If the core material doesn't like water you also need to make sure its sealed so that would be an extra step with if using a tube.

Crushing the core isn't a problem with the material that Sitec has used as its only thin, and by the sound of it has a solid core. The 20mm stuff that Dizza is looking at will need some thought put into structural fixings such as door hinges etc

When we were building the foam cored dinghies, we would cut out areas of foam and insert marine ply where there were going to be fixings for rigging etc. Since we were laminating our own panels we'd set it up before it was laminated. Not so easy when working with pre-made panels

Dizza, that 20mm sheet sounds like it would be great for what you are planning to do. Working with foam or honeycomb cored panels is great and they are amazingly strong. Do you have a link to the particular material?
There's probably a particular resin that works well with that panel so find out about that.

Glue for joining panels is usually made from resin with added filler material such as micro-balloons.

If you are planning to put glass tape/cloth around corners to strengthen the joins you will save yourself a lot of work if you get some peel ply. We used one that was like a fine polyester cloth, and you applied it over the joint after the resin and glass cloth was in place, and rubbed any air bubbles out using a rubber/plastic squeegee. Once it was cured, the peel ply could be pulled off giving you a nice smooth surface without the usual weave pattern or fibres poking out that you get if you just apply cloth/resin.

Steve

[Dizza]

The manufacturer is vanglass.
(vanglass.com.au i think)
They make panels for the caravan industry and for home builders. They use sikaflex of some kind for joining panels and things like hinges can be attached to the skins using alloy rivets.

I plan on gluing the panels using a sort of lap joint (will post a cross section explaining it better tomorrow)
I will be attaching a length of aluminium angle to the top edge on the outside using rivets and sikaflex to finish the joint edge.
And if needed i will use a fiberglass strip on the inside as well however i dont think it will be needed.

Dizza