What would you tow 4500kg boat with?

[ramblingboy42]

A friend has had a boat project reaching completion. He purchased a defender 110 300tdi wagon to initially do the job as his tow vehicle. As the boat/trailer combo has now exceeded 4500kg he has had to rethink his tow vehicle. He is prepared to build a 6x6 version of his defender, which we have discussed or contemplate another vehicle which he doesn't really want to do....mainly due to costs.....he believes he can do the 6x6 conversion for around $9,000. What are your ideas? I have looked at 6x6 conversions here but don't seem to be able to find a tutorial. Looking for guidelines.

[Homestar]

How far does he Plan to tow it? I would get a smaller boat or a larger truck...:D

[pop058]

Have a look at the Isuzu lights trucks. I drove one a couple of weeks ago helping shift some furniture and it was brilliant.

[ramblingboy42]

read the thread.....that's not what he wants to do.....

[ramblingboy42]

another $60,000 is not what he wants

[bob10]

A friend has had a boat project reaching completion. He purchased a defender 110 300tdi wagon to initially do the job as his tow vehicle. As the boat/trailer combo has now exceeded 4500kg he has had to rethink his tow vehicle. He is prepared to build a 6x6 version of his defender, which we have discussed or contemplate another vehicle which he doesn't really want to do....mainly due to costs.....he believes he can do the 6x6 conversion for around $9,000. What are your ideas? I have looked at 6x6 conversions here but don't seem to be able to find a tutorial. Looking for guidelines.
How far is he intending to tow the 4,500 t. boat? If it is to the coast to moor it , best to hire an appropriate truck to do the job. Not sure if towing a boat that size permanently on Qld roads is a good idea. Apart from that, a Yank tank, F250, or such like. Good luck paying for the fuel, Bob

[UncleHo]

Why doesn't he look at a Mitsubishi Cantor 4x4 drop side or dual cab ex- govt. or council.

cheers

[LandyAndy]

Perentie 6x6 at the current Army auctions???
A Canter wouldnt pull the skin off a rice pudding;););););) We just got rid of one.We have a brand new Isuzu equivelent,it has the same motor/gearbox as the DMax.Nice enough unit,doubt its up to the task.
Andrew

[justinc]

The 6x6 conversion is well worth the thought and the $$ IMO. Cheaper than pulling the pin on a Defender and spending a further 60K for a truck as a daily when not towing the boat.


Did you see the 6x6 for wrecking in the markets???


JC

[MR LR]

So basically he wants a 300tdi to lug at least 7 tonnes around!! HAHAHAHA

Does he intend getting out of first low?

Maybe sell it and buy a Perentie 6x6 if he's so twisted he NEEDS a Landy. Maybe do an engine conversion at the same time as 6x6? And make the trailer a gooseneck with a fifth wheel hitch right between the two back axles on the giant Deefer.

If he just wants to pull it in and out at a boat ramp up the road, put the deefer in low range and tow it.

Cheers
Will

ADIT: He also needs the whole, thing engineered to have a GCM of what he needs, this may be difficult.

[ramblingboy42]

he intends to tow it up and down the coast to and from his favourite fishing spots, does not want to leave it in the water but launch and retrieve himself from boatramps and beaches where possible. the 6x6 convo is his cheapest alternative.

[AnD3rew]

he intends to tow it up and down the coast to and from his favourite fishing spots, does not want to leave it in the water but launch and retrieve himself from boatramps and beaches where possible. the 6x6 convo is his cheapest alternative.

I'm sorry but that truly sounds insane, that's just too Big a boat for a regular trailer able, and taking it on a beach for a beach launch sounds like a recipe for disaster on so many fronts.

[bob10]

The 6x6 conversion is well worth the thought and the $$ IMO. Cheaper than pulling the pin on a Defender and spending a further 60K for a truck as a daily when not towing the bo


JC

Just out of interest, what is the 6x6 rated to tow? Bob

[Series3 GT]

How about a 6x6 Defender with a 6.6L Duramax V8 turbo diesel, that engine has the ability to pull any stump you want out of the ground with 1000NM (claimed) at really low revs and you get better economy and reliability than a 6.5 chev diesel. Or if thats not good enough get a yank tank like the Ford F-250, F-350, Chev Silverado or a Dodge Ram V10.

[FeatherWeightDriver]

he believes he can do the 6x6 conversion for around $9,000. What are your ideas? I have looked at 6x6 conversions here but don't seem to be able to find a tutorial. Looking for guidelines.

This thread seems to have some interesting info and contacts on these forums: http://www.aulro.com/afvb/general-chat/149180-6wd-chassis-drawings.html

Hope this helps...

[Chucaro]

I would go for the Ford F series
2013 Ford Super Duty | View Towing Specifications | Ford.com (http://www.ford.com/trucks/superduty/specifications/towing/)
or and old one with a good diesel engine on it.

[redrovertdi]

just buy an old 70s F250 as a dedicated hack for towing, leave the 110 alone

[roverrescue]

Regularly enough I tow a triple axle boat and trailer that we choose not to weigh - 4.5ish.

The 130 eats it for breakfast in low range
BUT and the BIG BUT is I only tow it a few kays.

My 130 is rated to 4.5T tow weight in the book and on the tow bar but geez if the rig needed to go to Cairns or Townsville, I would run the boat by sea and hook the trailer up to the commo and shoot it down the highway empty. No chance I would enjoy towing that thing any more than 20 kays no matter what vehicle I was in - even if a full size twuck!

Its a boat - It weighs over 3.5 tonnes
Dont not matter what the weather is
Dunk it and steam the coast

S
My 95

[isuzurover]

read the thread.....that's not what he wants to do.....

sometimes people need to be told that what they "want" to do isn't sensible...

I agree with roverrescue

[laney]

How far and offten is he towing this 4500kg boat big ask for any 4x4 I think main roads would have issues if he intends to tow it every where as in over size and over with load best check with thm before forking out to many dollars.

[29dinosaur]

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

[justinc]

http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/j/g/jgg5037/images/Tanks.jpg

:D:D:D

They look like kids steering that thing! Are we recruiting from day care centres now??:D


JC

[justinc]

Last year I went through this with a customer who was towing his tri axle trailer with a 4.2T 'Glass boat to Tassie east coast and back behind his P38a....after warning him many times about the implications of this legally and safety wise he relented and bought a Isuzu 4x4 truck. The truck he loves, BUT it is a work truck for him, too. It serves 2 purposes boat towing and work. He has a car for everything else as he doesn't go 4x4íng anyway.

Point is, the 6x6 conversion IMO will easily and legally tow the 4.5T boat, NOT at speed, and will find hills a struggle still, but at least it would be legal and safer. I agree a truck would be the best solution or as Steve suggested dunk it if travelling the coast:o, but the OP has no desire to spend 60K+ and thereby leaving his Defender redundant.

JC

[william mcallan]

Hi I posted recently towing a caravan extreme distances, the van is close to three tonne, all up vehicle loaded has a total GVM of 5.85t, the 2.4 does this quite well, however for more than this I would consider a Iveco Daily, these will do it with ease and ensure the tow is legal. I am also aware the post is discussing Def, I don't think it will do it for too long.

[roverrescue]

As the boat/trailer combo has now exceeded 4500kg

I just re-read what you wrote:
Even if the BMT rig did only weigh 4.5T, I can only imagine it carries 800-1000L of fuel and 200L of water. Then you will pack 300kg plus of ice and food and gear.
GTM is gonna be approaching 6T - better not actually weigh it!

And with regards to beach launching, even with a tractor for the launching duties a 5T plus rig on a triple axle is going to be hell - it will sink into the sand faster than a 200series lowers itself into the mud of teatree country!

And besides when it all boils down to it - I wanna see pics of this beastie!

this thread is useless... ;)

Steve

[Dougal]

I would go for the Ford F series
2013 Ford Super Duty | View Towing Specifications | Ford.com (http://www.ford.com/trucks/superduty/specifications/towing/)
or and old one with a good diesel engine on it.

Ford don't appear to have any good diesels, especially not the old ones.

I also suspect that US tow ratings may not be legally achievable elsewhere in the world.

[ramblingboy42]

most everyone is making assumptions here....everything has been considered , the 4500kg is all up on trailer victaulled, everything is/will be engineered accordingly, thank you for those who have made meaningful suggestions and comments.

[ramblingboy42]

does the tank have an approved tow hitch?

[Dizza]

does the tank have an approved tow hitch?

I can't see any on the Hayman Reese website :angel: :p

[disco2_dan]

A friend just bought a silverado because it had 9T towning capacity not sure of engine size or year model but its only 2wd I believe

[roverrescue]

rambling,
sorry if I came across as brash and "unmeaningful"... It is just that I have actually towed a 4.5T plus boat trailer with a 300tdi.

It wont matter if you throw another axle in - it will still be pretty ugly method of travel for highway distances. A 4.5T triple pulls you backward not twice as much as 2.5T double (the other boat I tow with no issues) but it seems more like the thing is 6 times as heavy! It really is that slow. The 15 or so degree incline going up Green St in town is 3rd gear low range full noise 50km/h. Obviosuly no momentum but even still on the highway with a 300tdi I wouldnt be surprised if you end up playing with the little lever.

Best of luck to your buddy - make sure the cooling system is A1 and that he plonks in a new gear bag and HD clutch while doing the chassis stretch.

Photos would still be awesome!

S

[FeatherWeightDriver]

A friend just bought a silverado because it had 9T towning capacity not sure of engine size or year model but its only 2wd I believe

Wow - that's some serious hauling: 9.8T towing and 3T carry.

Chevrolet Silverado fit for towing - caravancampingsales.com.au - caravancampingsales.com.au (http://www.caravancampingsales.com.au/news/2011/chevrolet-silverado-fit-for-towing-27791)

Then again it comes with a serious price tag to at around $100k, and a trip to the RTA to upgrade your license to rigid class (at least in NSW) :eek:

[Mick_Marsh]

I'd use a Ford F650.
In fact, I'd use any excuse to get a Ford F650. A six door would be nice.

[Red90]

Are you really legally allowed to pull trailers that weigh more than the tow vehicle in Australia without a fifth wheel? That is crazy.

[MR LR]

Are you really legally allowed to pull trailers that weigh more than the tow vehicle in Australia without a fifth wheel? That is crazy.
You'll get three different answers to that, and all will be able to be found on the RTA website, no one really knows, it's a very grey area. Some say that the 3.5t ratin on a D2 is for the tow bar and the car can only tow it's GVW (2750kg).

[Homestar]

Are you really legally allowed to pull trailers that weigh more than the tow vehicle in Australia without a fifth wheel? That is crazy.

Yes, up to the maximum rated towing capacity of the vehicle. There are a few exceptions - if there is no factory towing rating, then you are not to exceed the weight of the vehicle. But that leaves 3.5 tonne for most modern LR's and 4 tonne I think for my old RRC and some others - way more than e vehicle weight.

With a fifth wheel it is completely different. My mates F250 can legally tow over 7 tonnes with a fifth wheel and the right braking system (air brakes). Although not legal, I have seen him move an empty semi trailer down the street with it...

The crazy thing is that ANYONE with a full licence can tow these trailers, and there are a lot out there that don't understand how to do this safely and properly. There are a lot of BIG caravans getting about being towed by people that have no idea at all...

In England, and I'm sure other countries you need a trailer licence to tow anything that has a gross weight that exceeds 750kg. While I'm not for over regulation, I don't see that law as a bad thing...

[spudboy]

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/288.jpg

I had to look up Ford F650 - never heard of one before!

After towing my Disco behind my L322 Rangie, I reckon you'll have to be looking at a whole bigger tow car than any land rover - 6x6 or not.

[Mick_Marsh]

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/288.jpg

I had to look up Ford F650 - never heard of one before!

After towing my Disco behind my L322 Rangie, I reckon you'll have to be looking at a whole bigger tow car than any land rover - 6x6 or not.
I parked next to one which was towing a fifth wheel horse float. A rather large horse float. Like a mini semi trailer. Then and there I decided I wanted one.
There's one advertised in the latest "Unique Cars" for $195.000.
A good shopping run vehicle.

[sheerluck]

......A good shopping run vehicle.

Unlikely that you'd be able to leave it running whilst filling it up...."Turn it off, it's gaining on me!" :D

[Dougal]

Only the yanks could produce a vehicle so large that can carry so little.

[Homestar]

I parked next to one which was towing a fifth wheel horse float. A rather large horse float. Like a mini semi trailer. Then and there I decided I wanted one.
There's one advertised in the latest "Unique Cars" for $195.000.
A good shopping run vehicle.

I think it would be more economical to buy a small prime mover...

[Davo]

Yes, up to the maximum rated towing capacity of the vehicle. There are a few exceptions - if there is no factory towing rating, then you are not to exceed the weight of the vehicle. But that leaves 3.5 tonne for most modern LR's and 4 tonne I think for my old RRC and some others - way more than e vehicle weight.

With a fifth wheel it is completely different. My mates F250 can legally tow over 7 tonnes with a fifth wheel and the right braking system (air brakes). Although not legal, I have seen him move an empty semi trailer down the street with it...

The crazy thing is that ANYONE with a full licence can tow these trailers, and there are a lot out there that don't understand how to do this safely and properly. There are a lot of BIG caravans getting about being towed by people that have no idea at all...

In England, and I'm sure other countries you need a trailer licence to tow anything that has a gross weight that exceeds 750kg. While I'm not for over regulation, I don't see that law as a bad thing...

Yes, oh my dear God, the stupid things I've seen caravanners do up here in tourist season, young or old, it doesn't matter. As soon as I see a caravan these days I stay a long way away. I'd love to see a course, a test, and a licence for it all, and I'll happily admit that I'd need it as well. Towing a rig above a certain GVM should be treated like a truck licence.

[Mick_Marsh]

I think it would be more economical to buy a small prime mover...
Well, I do have my eye on one of those ex-ADF Macks.

[Mick_Marsh]

Only the yanks could produce a vehicle so large that can carry so little.
And I like that thinking.
You go down to the local Coles car park. It's all about haw many car park spaces ypu take up. With one of those, I reckon I could take up four, maybe six.

Besides, I reckon it could tow 4.5t easily.

Also in UC there is a Hummer H1 advertised. I reckon that would tow 4.5t.

Just offering up suggestions.

[BreakingBad]

And I like that thinking.
You go down to the local Coles car park. It's all about haw many car park spaces ypu take up. With one of those, I reckon I could take up four, maybe six.


If you park on a bit of an angle you could take up even more spaces. :D

At least it would make the trip to buy a litre of milk fun.

[AnD3rew]

You need to check this out

Ford F650 Truck - Caterpillar Diesel Engine - Truckin' Magazine (http://www.truckinweb.com/features/1003tr_ford_f650_truck/)

[justinc]

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/05/288.jpg

.

i'd say the guy in the above pic is 'compensating for something'....:eek:

jc

[FeatherWeightDriver]

i'd say the guy in the above pic is 'compensating for something'....:eek:

jc

Unless that's a pistol holster on his right hip, in which case he can do most whatever he wants... :eek::eek:

[Disco Muppet]

i'd say the guy in the above pic is 'compensating for something'....:eek:

jc

Or lack thereof :wasntme:
If the question is "How do you tow 4.5t with a 300tdi" then the answer is "bloody slowly" :p
I'll be interested to see how it pans out though :)