300TDI into 6cyl SIII 109

[LRT]

Is anyone familiar with the modifications that are needed to install a 300Tdi engine with either a stumpy R380 or a standard SIII gearbox into a SIII engine bay originally fitted with a Rover 6cyl petrol engine?

LRT

[wrinklearthur]

Can be done, you will need to change the bell housing to the one with the one hole in the housing at centre top and watch out for the layshaft bearing size as the later boxes had a stronger layshaft.

The mounting points for the side of the engine need to be looked at, cut the ones from the donor's chassis and weld them in place after taking careful measurement for their placement.

Look at the clearances between things like the side of the 300TDi engine, injector pump, turbo and the footwell, steering box and steering relay.

You will need to modify the top of your fuel tank for a return for the diesel spill line and fit diesel filters into the pickup line.

With the clutch the 300 TDi uses the same throwout bearing as a series three, it's best to stay with the stronger 300TDi clutch, so to get around that maybe look at using a bell housing and clutch mechanism from a four cylinder S3, otherwise use a S2A diesel clutch.
The later S2A and S3 bell housings do interchange.
With the gearbox input shaft to crankshaft bush, the bush has remained the same from the 80" right through to the TD5, with the exception of the V8 .
.

[gromit]

There's a lot of info on the InterWeb but you'd have to read through it to see what applies to your situation. I've never done one so I can't provide first hand info.
I did find somewhere the exact details of the mounting to a Series gearbox but cannot find it at the moment.

300Di Conversion (http://tukojack.com/300di_conversion.htm)
200tdi 300tdi 300 200 tdi land rover defender conversion engines (http://www.landroverimport.com/products.html)
300TDi Conversion. Apologies in advance (http://www.series2club.co.uk/forum/forum/index.php'topic=59175.0)
Land Rover Owner • View topic - Series lll 300TDI engine conversion.. (http://forum.lro.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=81268)
The 300Tdi Engine | Land Rover Expedition (http://www.landroverexpedition.com/engines/300tdi/)



Colin

[LRT]

Hi wrinklearthur,

Thank you for your prompt and informative response.

LRT

[LRT]

Hi Colin,

Thank you for the links.

I look foreword to reading them.

I am sure they will be interesting and helpful.

LRT

[Shepp]

Hi LRT just wondering if you are doing this conversion still?
I am currently in the process and have found the 6 cylinder is a different fit to the 4 cylinder as the gearbox is mounted further back to allow the original 6 cylinder to fit.
The problem is the 300 TDI sits further back closer to the fire wall and their is not enough room for the turbo.
Wondering if you or anyone else has any pics of a 300 TDI fitted to a 6 cylinder and how they got around this problem. I have some ideas but want to put the feelers out there first.

[Tim Jones]

Hi I`ve got a daihatsu 2.8 in a six chassis and the engine is squeezed right bak I had to cut the firewall a bit for the exhaust manifold and move the heater across a bit for the intake manifold but its still tight and it has no turbo. My idea is that a longer lt77 or lt95 gearbox would push the engine forward a bit as in a stage 1 V8 though an adaptor plate would be needed for the V8 bellhousing( I don`t know the 300tdi bell housing length) With hindsight I would have preferred this option as series gearboxes are at their limit especially if towing. My next project might be something down these lines perhaps....Anyone got a daihatsu to V8 adaptor?

[Shepp]

I had to cut firewall a little but once that was done it fit beautifully .

[kreecha]

Hi,
Nice to see that someone has started a thread instead of me regarding this process!

I am preparing to sell my roadworthy series 1 disco so that I can use my unregistered series 1 disco as a donor for exactly what you are proposing here.

I understand that it is best to use the 4 cylinder petrol series 3 because the bell housing will bolt to the 300tdi. This also saves the other mentioned issues such as the firewall shunt of the repositioning of gearbox mounts.

The issue I am facing is that 4-cylinder petrol series 3's are in limited supply in the NT. Let alone ones for a respectable price.

I have subscribed and look forward to your progress. I have been given a max 2yr time limit to complete the job. I want stage one done relatively quickly though. Stages two and three can be a work in progress.

Are you going to use the 300tdi alternator?
Are you going to retain the 300tdi power steering pump?
Are you going to retain the 300tdi a/c?
What will you do for the drivers side engine mount?

Cheers, Adam.

[Shepp]

Ok just to clarify. I had 6 cylinder series 3 matched it to the original gearbox using 200 TDI bell housing. Didn't move gearbox mounts but did fit new engine mounts. Slight trim of firewall to accommodate turbo.
Very neat fit and heaps of room up front I fit electric thermo fan.
Thread on GCLRO under Rambover in members rides if you want a look. Happy to post up more pics if something specific you need to see.

[jerryd]

Ok just to clarify. I had 6 cylinder series 3 matched it to the original gearbox using 200 TDI bell housing. Didn't move gearbox mounts but did fit new engine mounts. Slight trim of firewall to accommodate turbo.
Very neat fit and heaps of room up front I fit electric thermo fan.
Thread on GCLRO under Rambover in members rides if you want a look. Happy to post up more pics if something specific you need to see.

Hopefully about to start my 300tdi conversion quite soon, although it's to a four cylinder model. I'm using a defender 300tdi onto the original gearbox.
I've probably got heaps of unanswered questions so you might get a few messages come your way ;)
I'd like to see your vehicle in the flesh sometime if that's possible.

[kreecha]

Hopefully about to start my 300tdi conversion quite soon, although it's to a four cylinder model. I'm using a defender 300tdi onto the original gearbox.
I've probably got heaps of unanswered questions so you might get a few messages come your way ;)
I'd like to see your vehicle in the flesh sometime if that's possible.

How are you mating the 300tdi to the gearbox? (All I have read states a 200tdi flywheel cover is required).

Do you intend to keep the turbo? If so what intercooler are you attempting to use and what radiator? I will try the standard radiator and engine driven fan and initially lower the boost and use no intercooler then as time and $$ permit add a WTA intercooler.

[kreecha]

Ok just to clarify. I had 6 cylinder series 3 matched it to the original gearbox using 200 TDI bell housing. Didn't move gearbox mounts but did fit new engine mounts. Slight trim of firewall to accommodate turbo.
Very neat fit and heaps of room up front I fit electric thermo fan.
Thread on GCLRO under Rambover in members rides if you want a look. Happy to post up more pics if something specific you need to see.

How do you find the gearing?
What size tyres are you running?
Did you fix the overheating with the shiny radiator?

Cheers, Adam.

[Shepp]

Used late model 109 v8 diffs currently running original tyres and rims but will change soon. Overheating prob fixed with shiny radiator.

[Shepp]

I can bring vehicle to next club meeting for those who want to view it.

[jerryd]

How are you mating the 300tdi to the gearbox? (All I have read states a 200tdi flywheel cover is required).

Do you intend to keep the turbo? If so what intercooler are you attempting to use and what radiator? I will try the standard radiator and engine driven fan and initially lower the boost and use no intercooler then as time and $$ permit add a WTA intercooler.


I've altered the Series gearbox bell housing to mate up to the 300tdi flywheel, basically welded on some extra material at the bottom and had to drill some new holes to line up with the bottom flywheel holes. I've had to cut off a fixing point on the flywheel so it clears the front drive shaft.
I'm certainly keeping the turbo :) I'm hoping to install a P38 power steering set up (steering box on the outside of chassis rail) which will enable me to use the defender radiator and intercooler side by side, I'm going to try and keep it looking like a factory fitment if possible.

I've overhauled the gearbox and will drive with care so hopefully the gearbox won't explode :angel:

Here's a pic of the engine / gearbox trial fit.

[jerryd]

I can bring vehicle to next club meeting for those who want to view it.

Is this a monthly meet on the Gold Coast ?? Evenings or weekends ?? I'd certainly like to see your handy work and have a chat :)

[Shepp]

First Thursday of every month. Really great bunch of people and heaps of knowledge I couldn't have done this project without picking a few peoples brains.

[Shepp]

Oops forgot to mention it is at Parkwood Tavern opposite new Hospital 7pm.

[kreecha]

I've altered the Series gearbox bell housing to mate up to the 300tdi flywheel, basically welded on some extra material at the bottom and had to drill some new holes to line up with the bottom flywheel holes. I've had to cut off a fixing point on the flywheel so it clears the front drive shaft.


Thanks for the pic.

Where did you get the gearbox rebuild kit? I agree with and like the drive with care policy.

I too intend to fit power steering.

When you keep referring to the flywheel, do you mean flywheel cover? (The plate/housing between block and bellhousing)

Cheers, Adam.

[jerryd]

Hi Adam, I sourced bearings and roller bearings from a local specialist and purchased an overhaul kit from a place down south, it included all the gaskets ,springs etc in with it. afraid I can't remember who it was though :confused:

This was a spare gearbox that I played with but it turned out okay, so I'm going to use this as an experimental one until I can get the original gearbox / overdrive rebuilt.

I've also fitted stage one axles front and rear with the 3.54 diffs, the front brakes are also larger and make quite a difference in stopping power :)

Yes I was referring to the flywheel housing, the defender item also bolts to the engine mount plates. Here's a pic showing the difference between a 200 and 300 tdi flywheel housing. You can see where the bolt holes are at the bottom of the housing. It's part of this area I have removed.
I tried to source a 200tdi item but they are hard to find, I would also have to change the rear main seal to suit the 200tdi item.

[kreecha]

Hmmmm I believe I have seen that picture somewhere before :-)

[kreecha]

Hi Adam, I sourced bearings and roller bearings from a local specialist and purchased an overhaul kit from a place down south, it included all the gaskets ,springs etc in with it. afraid I can't remember who it was though :confused:

This was a spare gearbox that I played with but it turned out okay, so I'm going to use this as an experimental one until I can get the original gearbox / overdrive rebuilt.

I've also fitted stage one axles front and rear with the 3.54 diffs, the front brakes are also larger and make quite a difference in stopping power :)

Thanks for the heads up on the 300 vs 200 flywheel cover. I'm leaning towards the 200 because of the rear main seals, no welding, less cutting and fab work I can likely undertake.

Also thanks for the info about the rebuild kit. It's good to know the bearings are available off the shelf at SKF/Timken etc.

Also are the stage one diffs from the pre-county defender? The series three with the defender grill? If you get my drift....😳

I like the idea of the ashcroft HRTC gears so not to affect low range. Did you find the 3.54s affected low range much?

Cheers, Adam.

[jerryd]

I would have preferred a 200tdi motor also but they are hard to find, the 300tdi motor I have belonged to a friend who's vehicle was written off so that's why it's sitting in my garage with lots of extra bits :angel:

Yes you're right about the axles ;) My dormobile has a 186 motor fitted at present, so fitting the 3.54 diffs was a huge improvement bringing the revs down quite a bit. I find low range is still okay and haven't had any problems, although I don't tend to do too much rough stuff in it .

[Shepp]

Yes the stage 1 diffs in mine made a big difference too. I really think the 300 tdi is a better conversion than the 200 as parts are so much more readily available. At the moment I am running mine without an inter cooler on the turbo and it's fine. Inter cooler adds more power and then likely to break something.

[kreecha]

At the moment I am running mine without an inter cooler on the turbo and it's fine.

Would you possibly have a photo of this setup?
Cheers, Adam.

[Shepp]

Might be some on my thread on GCLRO members rides Rambover.

[chazza]

I really think the 300 tdi is a better conversion than the 200 as parts are so much more readily available.

I agree; however; many of the hard to get parts of the 200tdi are interchangeable with the 300tdi e.g. exhaust manifold; cylinder head.

So if you have a 200tdi - fear not, they are repairable with later parts,

Cheers Charlie

[Samtownsend]

93585
Here's a picture of a 200 tdi I fitted into a 6 cylinder lwb series 3, just had it's first run today, I have some more recent pictures somewhere, once I get them I will post them up here