wheel spacers

[rangietragic]

Does anyone know if i can legally fit wheel spacers to my 130 in qld?I want to reduce my turning circle from a road train down to say a semi:p.You can fit them to landcruisers but i suppose they are special.

[VM_Motori]

You can but don't get caught..... Or have an accident and try to claim.


WHEEL STUDS AND NUTS, LOCK RINGS
Reasons for rejection:
• Wheels/rims are not fitted with the correct number and type of nuts and studs.
• Studs/nuts are not securely fitted, are damaged and not engaged for at least the same thread
length as provided originally by the vehicle manufacturer.
• Spacer plates are used between hub and wheels (except where fitted by the vehicle
manufacturer).

TMR WEB SITE (http://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/~/media/Safety/Vehicle%20standards%20and%20modifications/Vehicle%20modifications/Industry%20codes%20of%20practice/vehiclestandardscodeofpracticesection2feb2004.pdf)

[FeatherWeightDriver]

You can but don't get caught..... Or have an accident and try to claim.

So if you can fit them but can't get caught that sounds like it isn't actually legal... :angel::wasntme:

[MR LR]

Are they actually legal for cruisers?

I reckon they'd be safer as you could make the rear track identical to the front, but I doubt it would be legal...

[Vern]

All illegal

[JDNSW]

Just to state it plainly, wheel spacers are illegal to use on the road in all Australian states and territories. (except where fitted by manufacturers).

You can argue whether this ought to be the case, but it does not alter the current status. As with most blanket rulings about equipment, it probably is the result of a very few cases where serious accidents have resulted from poorly engineered or implemented spacers.

John

[VM_Motori]

So if you can fit them but can't get caught that sounds like it isn't actually legal... :angel::wasntme:

Mate 60% of anything on a supercheap or repco shelf can get you booked still they sell and still people do

I am stating that the OP has the choice I provided the TMR rules anything after that is his choice.

I am not on this forum to "TELL" people what to do like other's on here.

Regard
VM

[KarlB]

Mate 60% of anything on a supercheap or repco shelf can get you booked still they sell and still people do

I am stating that the OP has the choice I provided the TMR rules anything after that is his choice.

I am not on this forum to "TELL" people what to do like other's on here.

Regard
VM
It is not about telling, it is about encouraging people to do the lawful thing and to not act fraudulently, or risk the physical wellbeing and welfare of others, by so doing.

Cheers
KarlB
:)

[uninformed]

Someone correct me If I am wrong. I believe you can increase wheel track by a maxium allowable 2 inches total (1 inch each side) in Qld. If so, get some rims with some more offset/backspacing to get them outboard a little. Not wider rims, just different offset/backspacing to what you have now.

I would need John to step in here, but I would think that 1 inch more offset be the same increase in forces as 1 inch wheel spacer and normal rim????

[JDNSW]

.....
I would need John to step in here, but I would think that 1 inch more offset be the same increase in forces as 1 inch wheel spacer and normal rim????

Overall, yes, but there is the additional problem is with the spacers themselves. There are two types of spacer - ones that are like a simple washer between the wheel and the hub - with this, the load on the stud itself is considerably increased in a way not anticipated when designed. The second type has the spacer attached by nuts as the wheel would be, but the spacer is fitted with a second set of studs half a stud spacing round from the studs in the hub. In this case the stress on the material of the spacer is quite high, and it would be difficult to establish that there is sufficient strength to give an adequate safety factor, and further to give sufficient rigidity. An additional problem that may arise is ensuring the nuts securing the spacer cannot loosen. It is clear that the authorities have decided, probably based on experience, that it is too difficult to ensure these factors.

John

[BigJon]

Does anyone know if i can legally fit wheel spacers to my 130 in qld?I want to reduce my turning circle from a road train down to say a semi:p.You can fit them to landcruisers but i suppose they are special.

As noted by others, you can't legally fit wheel spacers to any road going vehicle in Australia unless they were factory fitted (some Porsche, for example).

You say that you can fit them to Landcruisers, but that is incorrect if you are talking legalities.

[frantic]

Overall, yes, but there is the additional problem is with the spacers themselves. There are two types of spacer - ones that are like a simple washer between the wheel and the hub - with this, the load on the stud itself is considerably increased in a way not anticipated when designed. The second type has the spacer attached by nuts as the wheel would be, but the spacer is fitted with a second set of studs half a stud spacing round from the studs in the hub. In this case the stress on the material of the spacer is quite high, and it would be difficult to establish that there is sufficient strength to give an adequate safety factor, and further to give sufficient rigidity. An additional problem that may arise is ensuring the nuts securing the spacer cannot loosen. It is clear that the authorities have decided, probably based on experience, that it is too difficult to ensure these factors.

John

Unfortunately John it's just the govt being lazy using a blanket ban rather than approving appropriate products. What's heavier and places more stress On the axle? A alloy or wheel with a aluminum billet spacer as sold and used legally in UK and Germany ( where they go a fair bit faster) or an equally offset steel wheel ,both with same tire?

[frantic]

Overall, yes, but there is the additional problem is with the spacers themselves. There are two types of spacer - ones that are like a simple washer between the wheel and the hub - with this, the load on the stud itself is considerably increased in a way not anticipated when designed. The second type has the spacer attached by nuts as the wheel would be, but the spacer is fitted with a second set of studs half a stud spacing round from the studs in the hub. In this case the stress on the material of the spacer is quite high, and it would be difficult to establish that there is sufficient strength to give an adequate safety factor, and further to give sufficient rigidity. An additional problem that may arise is ensuring the nuts securing the spacer cannot loosen. It is clear that the authorities have decided, probably based on experience, that it is too difficult to ensure these factors.

John

Unfortunately John it's just the govt being lazy using a blanket ban rather than approving appropriate products. What's heavier and places more stress On the axle? A alloy or wheel with a aluminum billet spacer as sold and used legally in UK and Germany ( where they go a fair bit faster) or an equally offset steel wheel ,both with same tire?

[JDNSW]

Unfortunately John it's just the govt being lazy using a blanket ban rather than approving appropriate products.

Can't disagree!

What's heavier and places more stress On the axle? A alloy or wheel with a aluminum billet spacer as sold and used legally in UK and Germany ( where they go a fair bit faster) or an equally offset steel wheel ,both with same tire?

With the same offset, probably little to choose - but the spacer introduces another part, as I commented. And although they drive a fair bit faster there than here, Australians have a well earned reputation for driving at high speed on very rough roads for very long distances, something that is not really possible in Europe, and parts that function in Europe do not necessarily do so here.

John

[Bigbjorn]

I'm with JD on this. Spacers were fitted to small earthmoving equipment to allow sand tyres or accessory tracks. My experience was that they continually worked loose on machines that couldn't exceed 10 mph. Machine manufacturer's comment? "We don't supply them and won't".

Much plant & trucks that were highly regarded in Europe particularly didn't do well here without a deal of local engineering input. They had to learn the hard way about dust, heat, distance, and corrugations. "We sell these in Africa and the Middle East where they work in appalling conditions". 'Yes, but they are not in the hands of owner-operators who have to drive them fast, hard, and long to make a living. Your dusky skinned operators stop for prayers and sing-sings, chase an antelope, and to sleep at night. Our operators put in 20 hour days or they don't make a living".

[uninformed]

Unfortunately John it's just the govt being lazy using a blanket ban rather than approving appropriate products. What's heavier and places more stress On the axle? A alloy or wheel with a aluminum billet spacer as sold and used legally in UK and Germany ( where they go a fair bit faster) or an equally offset steel wheel ,both with same tire?

IMO I would say poor argument. The weight difference between an aluminium wheel spacer + rim Vs a Steel rim is not much nore the issue, its the offset that is and forces from driving/steering bumps load etc. Its placing stress on the studs, bearings, stub axle and its connection to the axle housing.

If you really want to do the best thing and increase wheel track, get someone to custom widen your housing so all factory parts and rims are used. keep original tyre size and scrub etc. ;)

[bushrover]

They can be difficult to centre and balance wheels. I used spacers for bush work, but not on the road. One or two studs in the spacers were always loose when I removed them. They are soooo good I have a set to give away if anyone wants to pay the postage............one owner, look like new and only used on Sunday's. No wheel nuts though, I am keeping them for spares.

Rick

[rangietragic]

Thanks for all that info and opinions.My reference to cruisers is based on stories about the v8 utes with the wider front track.I know of a local firm here that fitted spacers to the rear to fix bad handling especially in sand.My wheels are roh alloys,i havn't checked offset.I could get a set of steels with a wider offset but i like my alloys.Guess i'll just have to keep on wearing out my steering every time i park:(

[BigJon]

My reference to cruisers is based on stories about the v8 utes with the wider front track.I know of a local firm here that fitted spacers to the rear to fix bad handling especially in sand.

I have heard of that too. I have also heard of many rear wheel bearing failures due to the increased load.

[frantic]

As far as I can see 95% of LR drivers as well as the Japanese drivers go for offsetting their rims when they fit larger tyres. In a defender the rear touches with 255/85 On standard alloy +33 alloys so you need either offset rims to zero or spacers. If you want a 12.5 wide tyre (33+) you need -25mm or you can forget steering:D. The cost is around $350(5 ,15/8 in rims -25 offset-) up depending upon how flashy you want the wheels compared to widening your track, axles, custom shafts etc OUCH the cost of that sort of custom fabrication would pay for bearings for decades!

[rangietragic]

I'm running 265/75s and they rub on the front on full lock.My 02 rangie will turn inside the defender with metres to spare.Come to think of it ,it makes my d2 look bad too:p