This might be expensive

[Ean Austral]

Gday All,

The daughter and her boyfriend were travelling home in front of us and we passed them on the side of the road with a friends car next to them, not getting a call we assumed that all was fine. not long after we got home our daughter comes home to get her car and go back to the friends place to pick up their gear, The boyfriends Ford Ranger 3.0 ltr turbo deisel had a suspected broken timing belt.

We went over later in the arvo and sure enough it has. I havent worked on a overhead cam engine before, and this being twin overhead cam it will be interesting to see how it pulls up.

We are getting it flatbedded over to my shed and will strip it down over the next few days and see how bad it is. Lucky he's a 2nd year diesel fitter with CAT, so will be a bit more trainning and he should save a bit of coin on labour.

We have been told its the same engine that is in the newish defenders... not sure about that but with 130,000ks and the belt was supposed to be done at 110,000ks but maybe it was just a sales pitch when he baught it.

Its going to be interesting in comparing it to the 300tdi when its belt broke... think the pushrod engine may come out better.

Cheers Ean

[roverrescue]

DOHC diesel eh... You would have to guess them purdy valves would be laying over at just the right angle that when they got introduced to mr piston there was not a happy ending ;)

As you say though - a good spanner twirling experience!

You know we will need photos of the carnage !!!

Steve

[Roverlord off road spares]

EAN ,don't forget the pictures,
Cheers, Mario

[goingbush]

yes they have the same engine as a Ranger, except the Ranger if its the 3.2 is the 5 cylinder version that you cant buy in a Defender, but same timing belt setup

In the last few months travelling we have seen both Ranger and BT50 (same engine) with similar problems, waiting for parts from overseas

this is one of the reasons I wont be buying a new Defender,

[clubagreenie]

Just depends on whether it's an interference or non interference design.

[Ean Austral]

yes they have the same engine as a Ranger, except the Ranger if its the 3.2 is the 5 cylinder version that you cant buy in a Defender, but same timing belt setup

In the last few months travelling we have seen both Ranger and BT50 (same engine) with similar problems, waiting for parts from overseas

this is one of the reasons I wont be buying a new Defender,

Its a 3.0 4cyl but am told the defender has a smaller stroke, but is same engine.

Will be interested to see what the damage is.

Cheers Ean

[justinc]

They are Not the same engine as the defender , the Puma engine has chain driven camshafts for a start. The Puma 2.4 will be a bit more reliable in that department I reckon...I have just finished rebuilding one and they are quite a simple engine. Nice cylinder head and valve gear design, good looking porting etc and a very simple engine to time and reassemble. A fair bit of stuff hanging off them though, took nearly as long to get it ready for final install as it did to reassemble the long engine:o

JC

[goingbush]

Just depends on whether it's an interference or non interference design.

I thought all diesels are interference fit, otherwise not enough compression for the bang.

The next car I'm seriously contemplating buying happens to have dohc 3 liter diesel, via camchain (not belt) with rockers designed to break in the event of a timing failure, so no bent valves or holed pistons.

I had a timing failure on a Toyota 1HDT which resulted in bent valves AND holed pistons, which is why the topic intrests me.

[DieselDan]

Hi Ean,

JC is right, the 3.0 litre in the previous generation Ranger is a Mazda unit and not related at all to the 2.2/2.4/3.2 Puma engines in the Defender and current model Rangers.
I'll see if there's any workshop manual stuff for these engines knocking around at work if that'll be any use to you?

Dan

[Roverlord off road spares]

They are Not the same engine as the defender , the Puma engine has chain driven camshafts for a start. The Puma 2.4 will be a bit more reliable in that department I reckon...I have just finished rebuilding one and they are quite a simple engine. Nice cylinder head and valve gear design, good looking porting etc and a very simple engine to time and reassemble. A fair bit of stuff hanging off them though, took nearly as long to get it ready for final install as it did to reassemble the long engine:o

JC
:o Justin, rebuild, how many ks on it?
cheers Mario

[Ean Austral]

Hi Ean,

JC is right, the 3.0 litre in the previous generation Ranger is a Mazda unit and not related at all to the 2.2/2.4/3.2 Puma engines in the Defender and current model Rangers.
I'll see if there's any workshop manual stuff for these engines knocking around at work if that'll be any use to you?

Dan

Thanks Dan,

We will start stripping it tonight, so should know more tomorrow.

Thanks for the offer,

Cheers Ean

[justinc]

:o Justin, rebuild, how many ks on it?
cheers Mario

136K. Failed piston oil squirter, took the thrust side off number 1 piston skirt and deposited it on the cylinder wall....:mad:. I researched and researched and although I found several instances in this VIN range (MY2008) with the same fault, ALL were in the first 10,000km or less of lifespan. I even approached LR but they basically said err, no. So I fitted the upgraded bore squirters that were of COMPLETELY different design and standard fit to all MY2009 manufactured vehicles. Me thinks they redesigned them for a VERY good reason :(

Owner is very disappointed, he NEVER misses a service, strictly 10,000km and 6 month intervals, had landies and RR's all his life, this is the first that has actually let him down. His 1988 V8 110 has 470,000km up, apart from a 3.9 short engine and an R380 transplant at 350K, it is still going fine.

I must say I was a bit annoyed, too:( Shouldn't happen


JC

[Ean Austral]

Well rocker cover off, timing belt still on but nearly half the teeth on the belt missing :eek:. Valve rocker gear on 1 & 4 is smashed to bits.

pulled the cams and no noticeable damage so may be lucky there.

Pull the head tomorrow and see if any valve or piston damage.

Feel sorry for him as he asked if the belt had been done and was told YES, but there is no way that belt has been replaced. Car yard now shut down :mad: paints an even worse picture of used car salesman.

Post up some pics tomorrow.

Cheers Ean

[goingbush]

heres my 1HDT fail, belt and tensioner were only 20k old
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/08/1324.jpg

[ramblingboy42]

Ean....I didn't know there WAS a way to paint a worse picture of used car salesmen....Den

[Ean Austral]

Not sure about posting pics with photobucket but here goes
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/08/1314.jpg

Look at the left hand side of the belt...all the teeth on the belt are missing

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/08/1315.jpg

This is some of the carnage from 1&4 rocker gear.

I would have felt that a 20,000km belt would atleast still have the writting and numbers on it , the belt on this engine the imprint was nearly impossible to see, plus it was still stamped with the FORD logo when we found it, most people would use an after market gates or similar belt kit.

Cheers Ean

[UncleHo]

Looks like the belt it left the Ford factory with!

[roverrescue]

Ean,
does the valve train look square in the head or is it angled?
You would have to assume if 1&4 rocker gear has detonated that much of the load was absorbed.
If the valves hit square to the face of the piston could you get lucky like a 300 break and just be up for some rocker gear ???? A kissed piston aint gonna be a huge drama in the grand scheme of things?

S

[goingbush]

agreed, looks like an original belt.

if the rockers snapped like that they are probably designed to do so, may be no reason to pull the head, worth inspecting pistons with a borescope thru plug holes, then rotate engine with pistons down hit the valve tops with a hammer to test if any are bent.

[Ean Austral]

Borescope says piston crowns look ok so head has stayed on.

Parts ordered today, so hopefully re-assembly on Friday.

A big thanks to Diesel Dan for supplying us with some of the technical data and assembly pages for the engine..:BigThumb:

Cheers Ean

[Ean Austral]

Just an update,

Got parts on friday, and engine was re-assembled, but wont start.

the only thing we can think of is the ECU needs to be re-booted (maybe wrong choice of word) to read the sensers.

Jack's friend has a ford ECU reader so will see what it says when it gets plugged in.

Cheers Ean

[Blknight.aus]

do the short easy stuff first..

compression and leakdown test.