Fitting Shock Absorbers...

[Sitec]

Just used the search to see if anyone had a thread running on this but I didn't find one... Ok, on the first drive, of the 101 there was quite a bit of rattling from under the drivers seat. Upon investigation I found the shocker bushes to be more than a little worn.. I've removed the front shocks, wire brushed and reprinted them and now it comes to the refit with the new blue bushes sourced from AJ.. (Must add here that he was very organised and very quick to post out the bits I needed so a thumbs up there!!). Inner bushes pushed on, then the shocker followed by the second bush and that's as far as I got as I need new split pins.... but..... How do people push the washer far enough on to allow the re fitment of the split pin?? Just thought I'd ask before I started making special pressing tools.... Thanks in advance!! Oh, and if anyone finds a thread lee lathing to this, Mods please feel free to delete this one!!

[101 Ron]

Check out my disc brake thread its in there.
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/101-forward-controls-variations/174377-disc-brakes-4.html

[101 Ron]

I have done a few other shock bushes now and had to use different metric threads and bolts top to bottom as the holes are different sizes.

[Sitec]

Knew I'd seen it somewhere!!!! Just couldn't remember where! I'd thought about doing that, but putting a bolt all the way thru.. (like the Series vehicles). How did you do the bottom bush on the front? If the lower pin was longer, I'd run a dye down it and fit a large nyloc nut to it! Also learnt that the rear lower shocker bushes are the same part as the fuel tank rear bush too! Good old Land Rover saving costs there!! :)

[lardy]

Invalid thread Id is 4 apparently??
Maybe your link has expired

[chazza]

For my S3, I turned a cylindrical sleeve on the lathe, which is a clearance fit over the lower mounting pin. I made the sleeve too long so that I could then drill a hole - at right angles to the axis - through the sleeve completely. This hole was big enough so that a pair of long nose pliers could insert the split-pin through it. When the hole was drilled, I cut the waste off the bottom of the sleeve and filed the bottom of the holes, so that they now looked like two arches.

When the damper bushes and washer are installed, the sleeve is put on top, taking care to align the arches with the split-pin hole and the bush is compressed with a large F-clamp, which works on the far side of the leaf spring pack. The split-pin can then be installed - if anyone would like a photo posted let me know,

Cheers Charlie

[Sitec]

Thanks Charlie. That was along the lines of what I was going to make. Thought I'd ask before I got into special tool mfr!! :)

[stuee]

What shocks are people fitting to their 101's? I'm not going to pay the going rate for the re-produced ones the UK club has organised when those same dollars could get high end shocks out of the US.

[Sitec]

At the moment mine are ok... but would be keen to know the answer too!! :)

[isuzurover]

What shocks are people fitting to their 101's? I'm not going to pay the going rate for the re-produced ones the UK club has organised when those same dollars could get high end shocks out of the US.

In general terms, the single leaf springs (correct name for them) fitted to 101s behave like coils, so any shock that would be fine for a coil sprung vehicle of the same weight would be fine for a 101. E.g. a coily nissan patrol shock - assuming they are the corrrect length and eye type (unlikely).

[101RRS]

The problem with 101 shocks is the size of the pins that they fit to - much larger than "normal" 4wds and smaller than truck shocks. There are some shocks low end Rancho shocks that will fit but require modifcations. Likewise on the rear apparently Defender 130 shocks can go on but the lower mount has to be modified.

This is some old information - have a look at 3.12 Land Rover FAQ - Repair & Maintenance - 101 Forward Control (http://www.fourfold.org/LR_FAQ/FC/FAQ.FC.101.html) The101 club forum has stacks of threads on shockies.

To be honest I suspect a 101 will drive pretty much the same with or without shockies :o.

Garry

[DasLandRoverMan]

A wee bit bouncier without...

I've seen some big ass TerraFirma 110 rears fitted to the back of a 101, fine at the bottom, although the steel insert in the top bush had been knocked out and replaced with a piece of 22mm (I think) copper pipe.

Did the job.

[101RRS]

A wee bit bouncier without...


With a softer spring rate maybe but not with standard springs and relatively unloaded.

[spongie]

On my GS I'm planning to use either Rancho shocks from the US all round or terrafirma big bore extended defender 110 rears on the back and Rancho fronts.

Part numbers can be found on the other place. But as I mostly ever use the net on my phone I can't find them and copy and paste.

[stuee]

Wasn't sleeping so started looking at shocks. Looked at the club forum for rancho part numbers etc but the Aussie importers want silly money compared to what they retail for in the US.

I started sifting through the Monroe catalogue putting it into excel filtering etc then I found this page on the Aussie website:
Monroe - Catalogue Search (http://www.monroe.com.au/trade-corner/catalogue/catalogue-search.html)

Put in the specs from the Club forum as follows:
Front 385/595 eye-eye (ferule-ferule for website)
Rear 345/520 pin-eye (ferule-stud for website)

And you get these results:
Front: 16-0588+, 160589+ - Both from the Landcruiser 7x series,0588 is the 78 series Troop carrier rear, 0589 the 79series ute rear - Gas magnum TDT - both 382/616

It took a little playing around but I found a reasonable one for the rear.
Rear: 16-189+ - Discovery Series 1 and Rangie Classic Rear - Gas Magnum TDT - 337/548

I'm going to ring around today to see what these cost but also now that I have the vehicle makes I'm going to see what else is about.

edit* Forgot to mention that these all have 19mm bushes (according to the website), so the closest we can probably get to the 21mm mounts on the 101. This would make it easy to ream them out or change the sleeves to get the 21 mm. Also you can see that the website only spits out parts that wont restrict movement over the old shocks so these shouldn't act as bump stops or restrict wheels dropping.

[spongie]

Ta chap! Ranchos stupid money here too, have the terrafirma options over here for rear. Not sure on front yet

[stuee]

The only other thing I'll be doing before ordering is confirming the closed and extended lengths on my old shocks to check the figures on the club forum are correct.

[101 Ron]

Defender 130 rear shocks should fit rear of 101 landrover.
That was my answer for the rear.......I have not chased it.
Using defender shocks the steel pipe eye in the centre of the top rubber bush must be removed so the rubber bush will fit the 101s pin.
I was thinking adjustable Koni.........which worked well on the rear of a 130 defender I had, but the cost was though the roof.

[stuee]

Just updated my post. I probably shouldn't post when I cant sleep, I mixed up the front and rear lengths. Put in some new searches and got some different but still usable results.

This post on the club forum is quite useful. It shows the Disco shock is slightly better suited than the defender shock for the rear.

101 club • View topic - Front shock dimensions (http://www.101club.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=7726&hilit=shocks&sid=dffdf77cd6cb871473fb46662b866ad0#p72394)

[stuee]

My bonus from work has come through so I bit the bullet and ordered some foam cell shocks from 4wd1 and a steering damper. When they get delivered I'll put up a post and let everyone know if they fit or not! Fingers crossed :eek:

[stuee]

I picked these up from the post office this morning:
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/04/822.jpg

The rears:
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/04/823.jpg

The fronts:
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/04/824.jpg

I've fitted one rear shock so far. The rear shock compared to the original ones is below - make sure you keep the factory rubbers from the lower mount or organise some replacements as they can be used on the standard 4wd shocks (Ironman in my case). They will work a lot better than the rubbers that come with the new shocks. The new ones are almost small enough that they'll simply pull through the mount unless some wide washers were used on each side of the mount.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/04/825.jpg

I first cut a 14x2 thread as per Ron's post linked earlier in the thread. Since I had the chassis galvanised, one of the shock mount tubes on the rear filled with zinc and I had to drill about 40mm out so I could get the required thread depth (its why thers not much thread depth for the first few threads as due to air pockets the drill had a tendency to jump around. Thankfully all the others are clear.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/04/826.jpg


Next I tried one of the ironman upper rubbers. A bit of dish washing liquid on the shaft and it popped on quite easily. The ironman bushes look like they are made for a 19mm shaft where as the 101 shaft is 23mm. I re-lubed the shaft with dish washing liquid, placed the shock over the first rubber and the second one slipped on just as easily. You'll note that I wire brushed the shafts first to get the paint off (still a galvanised finish) and to help smooth the shaft so the rubbers slide on easily.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/04/827.jpg
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/04/828.jpg

Next it was a case of putting in some washers to get it seated nicely on the rubbers. I've used two of the original bush retainers and 4 24x2mm washers. I'm not very happy with how it looks at the moment although it does work. I will see if my mate can help me out by making up some bushing for me or I might hunt some tube down with the correct ID and use it in place of the washers. Ultimately the washers work though, I just don't think it looks very nice.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/04/829.jpg

The bottom mounts came up nicely and don't need any other work.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/04/830.jpg
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/04/831.jpg

I'm confident the fronts will fit as the eyes are the same and the mounts are the same as the rear top mount. The only issue is I may need to drop the lower mounting plate off the front axle in order to tap the thread but I will give it a crack first and see how I go.

I'm not sure how long the rubbers will last stretched over the 23mm shafts. There is also much less rubber than a factory shock but its by no means difficult to change the rubbers if need be and I doubt they are very expensive. These sort of shocks may not be the greatest alternative but they are relatively cheap compared to the re-manufactured shocks and do not require any serious modifications to the chassis.

I was having a think the other night about what options I may have if the rubbers didn't stretch over the mounts. One idea I came up with is to cut the shafts off flush with the chassis mount, tap the remainder of the shaft with the 14x2mm thread and get some new 19mm solid round bar mounts made with and 14x2mm thread cut on one end to simply screw into the chassis mounts with some thread locker. Another thread on the other end plus a washer and nut and your're sorted. But with how easy it was to fit the ironmans I'll probably just replace the rubbers when needed and when the these shocks flog out I'll be more inclined to spend a bit more on bilsteins or koni's. The advantage of these would be getting them valved to suite as well.

Unfortunately I cant tell you how it rides with these shocks as I'm still a bit of getting the 101 on the road but hopefully this shows that the shocks fit and will help others choose a replacement option.

[101RRS]

Thanks for that Stuee - what are the shock model numbers.

I have not had any issue getting the split pin through the shock mounts so not sure why you needed to drill the shock mounts.

When I last replaced my shock rubbers I was surprised at their cost so went to a local truck parts supplier and bought some generic yellow nolothane rubbers with the 23mm centres for a $2 each and they fitted Ok.

Cheers

Garry

[Sitec]

Great info Stuee.. If you were to shift one of those larger washers to the other side of the rubbers (yeah it'd b a ***** to drill), it'd even them up and it might look a bit better.. I wouldn't cut the stub shorter to suit in case you decide to refit the originals. Garrycol, the part numbers are on the ends of the boxes in the pics.. I screen shotted those two photos and they'll go in my '101 notes' book! :)

[DasLandRoverMan]

I believe bottom bushes are the same as RRC/Disco body mounting rubbers.

I think part numbers are different but the same size.
Or, put another way I've fitted poly body mount bushes on the lower end of a 101 rear shocker before.

[stuee]

On using the split pins, since the rubbers are made for 19mm shafts they are bulging on the 23mm shaft. I can't push the final bush in far enough to get a washer and split pin because it wont fit in the shock eye, hence the need for the bolt. Had the rubbers been going on 19mm shafts it probably would have been fine.

Also on the shock numbers I ordered off vehicle models via the 4wd1 website using the info I found in the previous post. I didnt see the part numbers until I went to pay for the goods and they show up on the invoice. Doing a quick search on the numbers the front shocks, 24094FE, suite the following vehicles:
Nissan Patrol GQ Y60 LWB Wagon 1988-1998 Rear shocks (pair)
Nissan Patrol GQ Y60 SWB Wagon 1988-1998 Rear shocks (pair)
Nissan Patrol GU Y61 Cab Chassis & Ute 1997 On - (Coil Springs Front & Rear) Rear shocks (pair)
Nissan Patrol GU Y61 Wagon 1997 On Rear shocks (pair)
Toyota Landcruiser 76 Series Wagon 2007 On Rear shocks (pair)
Toyota Landcruiser 78 Series Troop Carrier 1999 On Rear shocks (pair)
Toyota Landcruiser 79 Series Trayback 1999 On Rear shocks (pair)


The rear shocks, 24640FE, suite the following vehicles:
Landrover Defender 110 Trayback 1984 On Rear shocks (pair)
Landrover Defender 110, 130 County/Dual Cab 1984 On Rear shocks (pair)
Landrover Defender 90 Series 1984 On Rear shocks (pair)
Landrover Discovery Series 1 1989-1998 Rear shocks (pair)
Landrover Rangerover 1971-1995 Rear shocks (pair)

So they look like rather generic shocks.

For the washers when delving around my parts bins last night I realised I only have 6 of the large washers, I thought each shock eye would have had two but nope, so it means it needs another two 24x2mm washers for each eye or one of the front shocks will miss out on the large washers which are spot on size wise for holding the bush in place.

That's good info on the lower mounts. It means it would be easy to source some new ones if needed. It does look like the tops rubbers will flog out a lot quicker than the bottoms though :(

[Brute]

Stu,
I have a new set of shocky rubbers that I got from 101 parts in uk.
You could use them as a sample to get some urathane ones machined up locally
If you want before I fit them
Cheers
Ian

[puma130tc]

AJ in Melbourne, supplied some nylon hand type replacement bushes for the original 101 shocks, however they are bigger and require the spindles to be tapped as you have already done, only the outer washer is then required.
I'm sorry I can't recall the brand, at this moment, I used them until I stripped my vehicle down, they were a great mod!
Possibly another option...

[Sitec]

AJ in Melbourne, supplied some nylon hand type replacement bushes for the original 101 shocks, however they are bigger and require the spindles to be tapped as you have already done, only the outer washer is then required.
I'm sorry I can't recall the brand, at this moment, I used them until I stripped my vehicle down, they were a great mod!
Possibly another option...

They r these.... Kept the packet in my 101 folder! :D

[puma130tc]

That be them!
I nearly had the name earlier.
I have the packet at work, was going to look for it tomorrow.
What did you think of them?

[stuee]

The standard 101 shock rubbers look like they will be too big for the ironman shocks. I have some flogged out ones which I did try but the OD means the shock eye doesn't cover much of the bush. I'll measure the eye ID's of the originals compared to the ironmans later today and put it up.

[Sitec]

That be them!
I nearly had the name earlier.
I have the packet at work, was going to look for it tomorrow.
What did you think of them?

They're good. You'd never fit them without tapping the center hole tho. They'd b too big for Stuee's shockers tho having thought about it.. :)

[stuee]

Just measured the shock eyes.

For the originals, the large inner diameter is approx 45mm, the small inner diameter is approx 32mm.

For the ironmans, the large inner diameter is approx 36mm, the small inner diameter is approx 28mm.

For anyone with the superpros, does it look like the bushes would machine easily - i.e drill out a larger hole for the shaft for the standard cruiser and discovery bushings?

[101RRS]

Just measured the shock eyes.

For the originals, the large inner diameter is approx 45mm, the small inner diameter is approx 32mm.

For the ironmans, the large inner diameter is approx 36mm, the small inner diameter is approx 28mm.



This highlights the issues I have had in trying to locate suitable shocks for my 101 in the past. Basically 4wd stuff have eyes that are too small and small trucks have eyes that are too big.

I stayed with my old 101 shocks and to be honest I have no idea whether they are good or bad. I did drive my 101 without shocks as a test and certainly when unloaded there was no difference in the feel of the vehicle when driving it so I doubt shocks actually do much - might be different when loaded though.

Garry

[stuee]

Well I ran into a small problem during the week. When fitting the drivers side front shock there is not enough thread for the 14x2 bolt to bite onto on the lower mounting shaft and it just slips out. The passenger side also felt very loose but plenty to bite and holds the shock on.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/04/584.jpg

I'd say this is due to either the lower mounting shafts being full of mud and crap when I first cleaned them which may have caused a lot of the metal to corrode away, or being Land Rover its a different wall thickness to the top shafts which have plenty of metal to bite onto. First attempt to fix will involve metal epoxy but if that doesn't work a long bolt will be able to be utilised and I can throw a washer and nut on the other end, or a threaded rod welded into from the opposite side to the shock shaft and a suitable nut. Problem with Good Friday is everything is closed, even Bunnings. Also keen to hear suggestions from others!!

Otherwise the shocks seem to go on just fine:
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/04/585.jpg
And a sneaky one of the new steering damper while pretending to show the passenger side front shock.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/04/586.jpg


This highlights the issues I have had in trying to locate suitable shocks for my 101 in the past. Basically 4wd stuff have eyes that are too small and small trucks have eyes that are too big.

I stayed with my old 101 shocks and to be honest I have no idea whether they are good or bad. I did drive my 101 without shocks as a test and certainly when unloaded there was no difference in the feel of the vehicle when driving it so I doubt shocks actually do much - might be different when loaded though.

Garry

I definitely notice the difference with shocks on reversing in and out of the driveway, it no longer pogo's when I use the brakes. I need working shocks for rego and the old ones are either seized or non-functioning. I agree its a compromise but if you want the originals then I believe the club is/has been getting some made - the only problem being you need to be a member and fork out what I think is ridiculous money.

[101 Ron]

I think on one of my shock mounts I had to go to 16 mm bolts and threads .

[Sitec]

I think on one of my shock mounts I had to go to 16 mm bolts and threads .

Stuee, there are different sizes of tube.. Mine was 50/50, so as Ron said, M16 is the go. Here's a shot of the front LH top on mine... as Im sat beside it and a fire watching the world go by at Melrose! :)

[stuee]

Poo. Sounds like I should have gone 16mm from the start. For now I have a M12 180mm bolt and nut doing the job, but I will sort a 16mm tap and new bolts after the turn around at work.

[Sitec]

Poo. Sounds like I should have gone 16mm from the start. For now I have a M12 180mm bolt and nut doing the job, but I will sort a 16mm tap and new bolts after the turn around at work.

That should work fine! :)