D3 Jack Replacement - A solution of sorts.

[BSM]

My OEM Scissor Jack died last week, and despite the possibility of the Merc Sprinter alternative Replacement Jack - Group Buy which sadly didn't pan out, I could't even wait that long. I needed to find a solution in a hurry.

Here are the measurements of the ground clearance to the underside of the D3 chassis (extended height mode) that I took in working toward a solution.

- clearance when all wheels are at road pressure = 280mm
- clearance when one tyre is completely flat = 240mm, less 10mm just to be sure = 230mm. This is the amount of room you've got to put a jack under the car -
- an estimate of how much extra clearance is needed to put the inflated spare on the wheel hub (120mm).
- Giving a total jacking height clearance needed of 400mm.

These measurements above are what I worked out for my D3 sitting in the carport. You may come up with different numbers. (I also stuffed around trying to work out a theoretical ground clearance with a flat based in tyre dimensions, this is before I decided to just let all of the air out of the tyre)

Using these measurements I looked up details for about 15 different Jacks - Some mentioned previously on this forum.

The five key characteristics for a jack being:
1. The jack fits under with a flat tyre
2. The jack's lift , or stroke (without the use of any screw extensions) will give the wheel enough clearance to get the spare on.
3. The jack's load rating
4. The size and weight of the jack - It's got to be practical to fit in the car.
5. Price

Here's a spreadsheet that examines a number of jacks. Feel free to play with this and make improvements. You might come to a different conclusion than I did.

64385

According to my analysis, the best bottle jacks for a D3 are the ones made by Weber Hydraulik in Germany. Both the 3 Tonne and 5 Tonne have double pistons, with a very long strokes. It's no surprise that the Merc Sprinter Jack is thought to be good also. It's made by the same firm. Weber's Australian rep is PTHydraulics in Melbourne, but they don't import these jacks. These Jacks are not available in Australia as far as I can tell.

The Toolex 12 Tonne Jack, double ram has the stroke - but it's a heavy unit at 12kg, and I'm not sure how it tucks away in the car. - It's available from Gasweld

The Torin 4 Tonne double ram Jack - comes very close - but misses out by a whisker with the piston stroke. However it's not available in Australia - You can buy it from the US on ebay - but freight is the killer.

Most of the other jacks I looked at are single piston jacks, and these don't have the stroke that the double rams achieve.

However as I said I needed to find a solution in a hurry.

In the end I bought two jacks. I purchased a 4 tonne and 2 tonne jack from Supercheap Auto. The 4 Tonne were on special (still are I think). With both these jacks I can achieve the height. The 4 tonne jack has the height when the screw extension is used. The 2 tonne Jack will lift things up enough to slip the 4 tonne jack under with the screw fully extended. Then the 4 tonne will take it the rest of the way.

Each jack is on its own small enough and light enough to tuck away in the car. I put the 4 tonne jack where the old scissor jack was stowed.
64386

I put the 2 tonne jack on the other side. Tied down with some shock cord onto some shackles that I fitted and enough foam jammed around it to stop things knocking.
64387

It's not ideal - but it's a darn sight better than where I was last week. Sure it'd be better to have a Weber 3 or 5 Tonne jack - But I shudder to think what they'd cost to fly in.

[herrBlick]

So what are the specs on the bottle jack and what make is it,,,, looks great on the right side.... Very neat !,,

[BSM]

So what are the specs on the bottle jack and what make is it,,,, looks great on the right side.... Very neat !,,

You can see the specs for all the jacks I looked at in the spreadsheet in my post above. Just download and open in excel.

The supercheap jack specs are:

4 Tonne, 214mm to 430mm (Lift 140mm) ~4kg
2 Tonne, 183mm to 352mm (Lift 115mm)~3kg

They get them made in China under their own brand, however I think they,re identical to the Orcon jacks sold by Autobarn.

The right hand side jack fits nicely in the styrofoam stowage area after a bit of careful work with a Stanley knife. The left hand side is much harder to do neatly. There's not much there to work with. Not even a platform to sit it on.

[herrBlick]

Awesome thank you.
Do you think you need two?

[BSM]

Do you think you need two?

That's what I figured. My calculations indicated that the 4 tonne didn't have enough lift to do the job on its own. The thing is you need to be able to get the 4 tonne jack under the chassis (with a flat) with the screw fully extended. Only then will it raise the car to the height necessary.

A note of caution though. I haven't changed a wheel with this setup yet. (Although I have jacked the car up and it gives the clearance) but actual practice may result in an change of opinion, or the need for some judicious placement of wood blocks.

Anyway I took the safe option and got two. If your OEM scissor still functions then you can use that to get the lift started if you need it.

[herrBlick]

I have been talking to my local mechanic and what you have to consider is that your not lifting all the car, so he thinks on jack should be enough. I have changed out the the spare wheel with the scissor jack and it was ok on flat ground, enjoying action though....just wondering what is men't to be on the left hand space as mine was empty but some foam and strapping was there?

[~Rich~]

I have been talking to my local mechanic and what you have to consider is that your not lifting all the car, so he thinks on jack should be enough. I have changed out the the spare wheel with the scissor jack and it was ok on flat ground, enjoying action though....just wondering what is men't to be on the left hand space as mine was empty but some foam and strapping was there?

On the passenger side is for the tow hitch, UK style one.

[SBD4]

I have been talking to my local mechanic and what you have to consider is that your not lifting all the car, so he thinks on jack should be enough. I have changed out the the spare wheel with the scissor jack and it was ok on flat ground, enjoying action though....just wondering what is men't to be on the left hand space as mine was empty but some foam and strapping was there?

BSM is saying that you need two because the smaller one is too short to provide the clearance to change the tyre and the tall one is too tall to get under the chassis when the tyre is flat. So, you need the short jack to lift the car enough to then fit the tall jack under to finish the lift.

[CaverD3]

So how much more distance is need for the 2 ton jack to be high enough?

[herrBlick]

OIC. I understand now

[CaverD3]

Super crap also have air bag jacks on special. I bought one before and it is the best solution. I still carry the scissor jack which is quicker on level ground.

Super Cheap Auto Catalogues (http://catalogue.supercheapauto.com.au/catalogue/supercheap-auto-catalogue-full-on-father-s-day/4vfqiu93f.html?pid=promotedCatalogue#pageNo=20)

You will need a bung (test plug) for the other exhaust though (from plumbers supplies).

[BSM]

So how much more distance is need for the 2 ton jack to be high enough?

Have a look at the spreadsheet. It"s all calculated in there. But according to my calcs. The 2tonne jack is 28mm too short with its screw fully extended.

[BSM]

The 2tonne jack is 28mm too short with its screw fully extended.
Sorry, that's a typo. It's 48mm too short.

[BSM]

Super crap also have air bag jacks on special. I bought one before and it is the best solution.

I looked at those. They say the working load limit is only 1250kg. I wouldn't have thought that was enough. Do you find it okay?

[SBD4]

So how much more distance is need for the 2 ton jack to be high enough?

Based on what BSM is saying you need 170mm of lift(stroke) perhaps a little less if the car was put at off road height.

I still can't see why we can't jack the lower control arm. This would require nothing special in the way of a jack. Have a look at the posts in this thread by CUCO on disco3:

DISCO3.CO.UK (http://www.disco3.co.uk/forum/topic84316.html)

Here's a link to his gallery showing how he does it.

DISCO3.CO.UK Photo Gallery - Home > Member Galleries > CUCO (http://www.disco3.co.uk/gallery/index.php?cat=25524)

[SBD4]

Finally found one that fits the bill (heavy though):

5 Ton Telescopic High Lift Bottle Jack with 275mm Stroke (www.sgs-engineering.com/hydraulic-jacks/bottle-jacks/tbj5-5-ton-telescopic-bottle-jack)

Part Number TBJ5
Product Weight 7.8kg
Brand SGS Engineering
Capacity 5 Ton
Closed Height (A) 225mm
Stroke ( B ) 275mm
Fully Extended (D) 500mm
Base Width (E) 130mm
Base Length (F) 135mm

http://www.sgs-engineering.com/skin/frontend/default/sgs/images/catalog/jacks/technical/hyjacks-bottle-no-screw.gif

[BSM]

Finally found one that fits the bill (heavy though)

Yep, that'll do it. It might even fit in the right hand side stowage area. Whether it fits or not is mostly dependant on the dimension of the base. if you"re thinking of importing this one, just check that the base will fit in the stowage area (after doing a bit of cut out with a knife)

[CaverD3]

If you are only lifting a corner no problems but I have lifted the two front wheels and a whole side no problems.
Quoted ratings are always lower for a margin of safety anyway. But I always take an adjustable axle stand and place under for safety just in case.
Quality not brilliant but I recon if it failed I can buy another at that price.
Also I use rubber mats from the D3 on the ground rather than the thin ones that come with it.

[BSM]

Quality not brilliant but I recon if it failed I can buy another at that price.

Fair point. It's a pretty compact exhaust jack too I saw it in the shop. I looked at an Ironman maxi jack also. 4.2tonnes lifting capacity. But it's huge when packed away. Certainly wont tuck under a seat. I baulked at the size of it.

[borbor1313]

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/<iframe src=&quot;<a href=https://www.flickr.com/photos/10886646@N08/12896527243/player/0142cd4fd2&quot; target=_blank>https://www.flickr.com/photos/10886646@N08/12896527243/player/0142cd4fd2&quot;</a> height=&quot;500&quot; width=&quot;375&quot;frameborder=&quot;0&quot; allowfullscreen webkitallowfullscreen mozallowfullscreen oallowfullscreen msallowfullscreen></iframe>Hi All

My understanding of this situation is that a single 4ton SCA jack will suffice

The main issue identified by op is that it will not have enough lift unless screw is extended.
When car is in extended mode there is about another gap 5cm for screw extension until it meets the chassis anyway so top height is now ok

Depending on ground underneath if there was not enough room to extend the screw extension extend as much as possible then lower the car onto the jack to force it to go into super -extended mode .then extend the jack'sscrew extension fully. Or drive flat tire onto rock or wood block as previously suggested to raise the chassis

With its lift range it really only has to go as high as the sidewall so i assume people are not leaving the boot open when jacking which will stop the suspension from extending.Shouldn't need 2 stage jack unless not doing this

Also presuming in metropolitan area most people would use the RAA or RACV so assume will doing this in isolated/outback regions. Most people will have air compressor when 4WDing so could also let some air out of the spare then reinflate as well.

He is a picture of a $5 jack adaptor i made up
from a 32mm end cap,25mm plastic end caps from the sprinkler section of mitre 10 and for the pin used the head off a large dynabolt but could use any flat ended bolt of the right size and shape. Have to drill out the threads on the inside of the end caps so the 25mm will fit on the jack head and also so the 32 end will fit over the 25mm end cap.The inner 25mm end cap has a hole in the top large enough to accomodate the head of the dynabolt end,the 32mm end cap has a hole large enough to accomodate the shaft of the dynabolt end. This way pressure is applied/taken by the flat areas of the adaptor surrounding the pin.


Jack Fits neating in the left hand cubby hole perfectly as well

http://

[URL="http://www.flickr.com/photos/10886646@N08/12896527243/"]
[img]https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/03/1133.jpg
(http://www.flickr.com/phhttps://farm4.staticflickr.com/3820/12896527243_0142cd4fd2.jpg[/IMG)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/03/1077.jpg

[PhilipA]

You blokes do know that a D2 jack goes from 170Mm to 400MM?
I looked around for another suitable jack and couldn't find one.
I measured mine yesterday , I as I thought it may be suitable.
And you can get them on ebay for about $40.
Regards Philip A

[101RRS]

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/<iframe src=&quot;<a href=https://www.flickr.com/photos/10886646@N08/12896527243/player/0142cd4fd2&quot; target=_blank>https://www.flickr.com/photos/10886646@N08/12896527243/player/0142cd4fd2&quot;</a> height=&quot;500&quot; width=&quot;375&quot;frameborder=&quot;0&quot; allowfullscreen webkitallowfullscreen mozallowfullscreen oallowfullscreen msallowfullscreen></iframe>With its lift range it really only has to go as high as the sidewall so i assume people are not leaving the boot open when jacking which will stop the suspension from extending.Shouldn't need 2 stage jack unless not doing this
http://www.flickr.com/photos/10886646@N08/12896527243/

While the car will not try to rise as you jack off the chassis the wheel will go down under its own weight so you will need those two stages of the jack and most likely more even if you have gone to max height on the suspension prior to the jacking process..

Garry

[wbowner]

Instead of opening another thread on Jack replacements I am adding to this one which has some great info already.

I also have another thread on jacking up the car started to head in this direction any way but I think this is the best place for it. Sorry if not.

I have been looking around for a bottle Jack to take with me on my travels along with my ever reliable scissor Jack :), which I have never used. I better soon to make sure it is Ok.

I already have a 2t Masada one in the van as the van came with no jacking tools at all.

Unfortunately this Jack would not help me with the D4 .

So another Jack is needed.

A couple of jacks I have found may do the trick. Keeping in mind I do have another bottle Jack and can play the swap the Jack around trick mentioned by BSM, if required.

Before going on I did find one in the UK which cost 45 pound and 80 pound delivery so that is out.

Ok what I have found is the Omega jacks



1. BST2000 Omega Jack

2000kg telescopic
2 stroke
Min height 181mm
Max height 442mm
Stroke 201
Screw goes up 60mm

I am not sure if I understand what the stroke is but am assuming it is the height of the rise of the Jack, not including the screw

I think based on the figures presented earlier in the thread this would work assuming you use a base plate and a an adapter with the nipple on it

What do people think would this work?

Another alternative is the
BSI4000

Min217
Max 424
Stroke 132
Screw 75

BST 4000 telescopic one
Min212
Max 551
Stroke 264
Screw 75

I am leaning towards the BST2000 as should be strong enough I think and will have the correct heights

Richard

[wbowner]

Instead of opening another thread on Jack replacements I am adding to this one which has some great info already.

I also have another thread on jacking up the car started to head in this direction any way but I think this is the best place for it. Sorry if not.

I have been looking around for a bottle Jack to take with me on my travels along with my ever reliable scissor Jack :), which I have never used. I better soon to make sure it is Ok.

I already have a 2t Masada one in the van as the van came with no jacking tools at all.

Unfortunately this Jack would not help me with the D4 .

So another Jack is needed.

A couple of jacks I have found may do the trick. Keeping in mind I do have another bottle Jack and can play the swap the Jack around trick mentioned by BSM, if required.

Before going on I did find one in the UK which cost 45 pound and 80 pound delivery so that is out.

Ok what I have found is the Omega jacks



1. BST2000 Omega Jack

2000kg telescopic
2 stroke
Min height 181mm
Max height 442mm
Stroke 201
Screw goes up 60mm

I am not sure if I understand what the stroke is but am assuming it is the height of the rise of the Jack, not including the screw

I think based on the figures presented earlier in the thread this would work assuming you use a base plate and a an adapter with the nipple on it

What do people think would this work?

Another alternative is the
BSI4000

Min217
Max 424
Stroke 132
Screw 75

BST 4000 telescopic one
Min212
Max 551
Stroke 264
Screw 75

I am leaning towards the BST2000 as should be strong enough I think and will have the correct heights

Richard

In case anyone is interested in this the BST4000 is no longer being made.

However the BST2000 which looks like it will do the job any way is available.

Richard