Angle between steering relay levers

[Johnno1969]

Hey up,

Question time: The angle between the upper and lower levers on the steering relay..... The Haynes manual says set them at 90 degrees to each other (which mine were when I disassembled them) and the Green Bible says eighty-one degrees (Series III book...but surely this did not change between Series IIA and III...?).

Which is correct? Has Haynes got it wrong, or did it change between the IIA and III?

Toodle pip,

John

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Who would you believe, the manufacturer or some after market book seller?

There is a difference between the grill panel on a SII/SIIa up to suffix G and the SIII (and suffix H SIIa) specifically the dome where the longitudinal rod would hit the grill when on full Right lock.

So maybe there is a difference.

I always set my steering levers by position, arc and rotations.

The bottom lever is straight ahead with the wheels straight ahead, i then put the wheels on full right lock and then fit the upper relay steering lever making sure there is clearance between the front tie rod end (on the longitudinal rod) and the back of the grill panel. Then return the steering to straight ahead.

After that, I calculate mid-point on the steering box by counting turns and returning to half (when I check that the steering wheel is in the correct orientation and move if necessary) only then do I fit the lever on the steering box and check that it is clear from lock to lock. If it hits anything (such as the firewall) then I shorten the longitudinal rod.

Never measured angles with a protractor.

Diana

[chazza]

Thank you Diana for that excellent description! :D

It is important to clarify also, that the lock-to-lock testing should be done with the wheels either on turntables, or with the car supported off the ground, so that the steering box is not overloaded.

Using Diana's method I discovered that my S3 not only had the steering box drop arm in the wrong place, but also that the securing nut was loose!

When the adjustments off-ground have been completed, test it outside by driving forward onto full-lock and inspecting for fouling on any component.

My Land Rover S3 manual says to set the levers to 81 degrees, which equals one spline off 90 degrees. My S2A manual has a diagram showing 90 degrees,

Cheers Charlie

[Johnno1969]

Thanks very much, folks! Always good to get some thoughts.

Cheers,

John

[mick88]

I just changed my series 3 steering relay the other day and i checked a couple of other series 3's i have here and they were all less than 90 degrees to each other, so the quoted 81 may be correct. With the wheels straight ahead the top arm runs parallel with the cross member centre line and the lower arm favours the right hand side of the vehicle, not straight ahead/perpendicular to the cross member. However there is nothing to say this is how they left the assembly line, they may have all been tampered with at some time in the vehicles life.

Cheers, Mick.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Hi Mick

Simply changing the tie rod ends on the drag link can make the drag link rod longer or shorter. Many people count the turns and re-fit the new end the same number of turns, but that requires both the new and old tie rod end to be the same in the first place, and many are not the same. Other people just screw it in till it stops or they feel its enough turns.

A better practice would be to measure the rod before and after.

However you never know the last time it was set up correctly and this is why I systematically go through the steering one point at a time: wheels straight ahead; lower relay lever (pitman arm) straight ahead: then adjust the drag link to match.

Then the upper relay lever etc etc.

[Johnno1969]

Hi Mick


A better practice would be to measure the rod before and after.


Yep, I made sure that I measured all the steering rods before disassembly (and also put some neat little marks on the bench) so I have them as a reference point. Now I am basically checking, checking and rechecking how it all best fits together to give me the best lock and avoid strain or potentially damaging contact between parts that should not be colliding.

Thanks,

John

[Lotz-A-Landies]

John

One of the areas that a lot of people have problems in the LH end of the drag link hitting the LH spring pack.

Make sure that tie rod is screwed in as far as possible (appropriate) and the collar over the clamping area, as close to the end of the tube as is safe.

There is one safety issue not mentioned. SIIa should have tie rod ends with a raised shoulder for about the last 1/2" from the thread.

If you have a tie rod end with a thread all the way, you likely have a SIII tie rod end. (Some vendors say it doesn't matter) However there is less thread inside the tube of the SII/SIIa steering rod tubes and they rely on the clamping pressure on the flat shoulder, particularly if the threads inside the tubes are worn.

If you are concerned, remove the tie rod end and feel if there is a full cut thread inside the tube all the way to the end or there is a flat area. My advice if there is the flat area, you need the shouldered tie rod ends.

The other way around and the tie rod end will not screw all the way into the tube. Also unsafe.

Diana

[Johnno1969]

John

One of the areas that a lot of people have problems in the LH end of the drag link hitting the LH spring pack.

Make sure that tie rod is screwed in as far as possible (appropriate) and the collar over the clamping area, as close to the end of the tube as is safe.

There is one safety issue not mentioned. SIIa should have tie rod ends with a raised shoulder for about the last 1/2" from the thread.

If you have a tie rod end with a thread all the way, you likely have a SIII tie rod end. (Some vendors say it doesn't matter) However there is less thread inside the tube of the SII/SIIa steering rod tubes and they rely on the clamping pressure on the flat shoulder, particularly if the threads inside the tubes are worn.

If you are concerned, remove the tie rod end and feel if there is a full cut thread inside the tube all the way to the end or there is a flat area. My advice if there is the flat area, you need the shouldered tie rod ends.

The other way around and the tie rod end will not screw all the way into the tube. Also unsafe.

Diana

Thanks Diana,

I will certainly be very careful with the adjustment. My rods are the earlier type which require the shouldered tie-rod ends. The clamps are positioned as close to the end of the tubes as possible to make sure that I clamp the unthreaded portion of the tube down onto the unthreaded shoulder of the tie-rod end. I was interested to note that (if I may mix metric and Imperial measures here) the unthreaded portion of the tube was approximately one inch and the unthreaded shoulder on the tie-rod end 20mm - which makes it all the more important to clamp right at the end of the tube, rather than have the unthreaded tube section trying to clamp down at least in part on thin air and the margins of a section of thread.

You are right that some vendors can't/won't see the significance of this. I was amazed at the number who tried to sell the later balljoints to me, telling me that they did it all the time and didn't think it mattered. In the end, I got some of them from the UK as my usual supplier in Australia only had the LH thread ones in stock (which I bought) and their supplier (QH) had gone into receivership. The RH thread items appear to be reasonable quality, though I had previously tried to get QH and avoid generic aftermarket stuff.

Thanks for your help.

John