Ian's Volvo TGB13 6x6

[roobar_and_custard]

Not sure if I am allowed to post here, but as a direct competitor to the 101 (it came second) and sharing some parts with Land Rovers I’m hoping to be accepted here. I also hope you are all going to be patient as it has taken 7 years to get this far…!

Well my truck is a Volvo TGB13 Command Cab 6x6, or C303 in civilian guise. It’s powered by the B30e engine, a 6 cylinder 3 litre petrol, and sits on 3 portal axles (all with diff locks), 7 seats and a full hard top. With a GVM of 4.4 tonnes, it also can be driven on a normal car licence.

So where to start?

I bought it from Sweden back in 2006 and shipped it out unseen. The guy I dealt with was very helpful, even assisting with the shipping. There wasn’t much choice as this particular variant is quite rare.

Why the Volvo? Well why not? We had a Defender 110 Hardtop (ex FFR) which we imported from the UK after traveling through the Middle East for 6 months, but then when kids arrived, the layout became a problem. We wanted something bigger to convert to an overland truck, and having the ability to live inside is a definite advantage, but it needed to be able to be containerised. I looked at Pinzgauers, but couldn’t find a hardtop, and the unconventional drivetrain, whist clever, put me off. They also come with a price. I looked at the 101 Ambulance, but was put off by layout and the slightly ungainly appearance. The Volvo, was a much more conventional and cost effective option. I always wanted to convert to diesel, and this conventional layout has some advantages.

Import approval was easy (pre 89), and registration in Victoria was also uncomplicated. The only modification was to the seatbelts to meet ADR requirements. It is still LHD as it is more than 30 years old and therefore no requirement to convert. In fact the hardest part was finding someone to complete the Roadworthy, as I got turned away by many garages with a multitude of excuses.

There was quite a bit of excitement at registration with Vicroads due to paperwork errors, but easily fixed. On top of that, the CV boots decided to fail as I pulled up in the inspection bay, dumping a small pool of oil under the front axle. With some strategic wheel placement, this went unnoticed, and the first, of many fixes, went onto the list.

Ian

[Homestar]

That my friend is a very nice bit of kit.:)

What part of Vic do you live in? I'd love to check it out first hand.

Edit - just done some detective work - Hoppers Crossing?

[Sitec]

Well, its different! You'd get the same vacant 'what the' looks we get in the 101's... Wouldn't mind looking over that, as it looks very different. Portal axles too! You mention a diesel conversion.... Any more thoughts on that, and if so, what engine are you thinking of using? Cheers.

[roobar_and_custard]

Thanks, and yes you're welcome to come and "check it out" - but I warn you - it is currently not running.
Location 180 degrees out - Dandenong Ranges. I've had it 7 years, and we moved. Otherwise impressive detective work as yes that is the Vicroads office in Hoppers.

Hmm... Diesel... now that is a topic for future discussion - I don't want to open that can of worms just yet... Suffice to say, it won't be as impressive as your plan.

[rangieman]

Noice:D

[101 Ron]

I have always wanted one of these vehicles.
I hope you get it sorted.
With the little bit of research I have done on them, they are hard to do engine transplants on as the engine is offset somehow.
I know a 4x4 version has travelled around Aust with that Dr Karl Z>>>>> bloke.
Its cruising speed was about 80kph, but he did place a lot of weight in it.
Volvo has always made good gear.
I know the 6 cylinder Volvo motor is a very good one and is efficient and tuff.
In some Volvopenta applications they ran three carbies.
can you tell us more about it.
Whats it like to drive.????
I know one amphibious one was made too.
Thanks for sharing
Ron

[Mick_Marsh]

Thanks, and yes you're welcome to come and "check it out" - but I warn you - it is currently not running.
Location 180 degrees out - Dandenong Ranges. I've had it 7 years, and we moved. Otherwise impressive detective work as yes that is the Vicroads office in Hoppers.

Hmm... Diesel... now that is a topic for future discussion - I don't want to open that can of worms just yet... Suffice to say, it won't be as impressive as your plan.
Actually, Gav was closer to 90 degrees out.

You'll be very welcome amongst this lot. We even welcome Toyota owners, ex-military of course.

Road trip Gav? We can get a photo of a Volvo flanked by 101's.

[101RRS]

Nice vehicle - are you on the Real 4x4 Forum? The Portal Hub: All things Pinzgauer, Haflinger, Volvo 303 and more. - Index page (http://www.real4x4forums.com)

[isuzurover]

...


Its cruising speed was about 80kph, but he did place a lot of weight in it.

...


That would be this one:
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/09/1130.jpg

[roobar_and_custard]

For those that don't know what one of these is, and those that would like some more info...

[101RRS]

Volvo listed the 4x4 for sale in Aust around 1980 but I think they only sold one or two - I remember a 4x4 magazine kitting one out and then giving it away as some sort of prize.

Garry

[isuzurover]

Previous thread discussing C303s
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/general-chat/146944-spudboys-dutch-german-jaunt-110s-101s-series-expedition-vehs-even-unimog-2.html

[Sitec]

Dependant on which way it leans, VW used to fit a 2.4 6 cylinder turbo intercooled diesel to the Volvo 740/760's. I fitted one to a Land Rover in the UK, and it sounded and went very well.. Incidentally, it leans heavily to the vehicle RHS...

[robbotd5]

Awesome truck!!!
The B30 is an excellent engine. Well worth keeping. In the 164E it produced 175 HP and it will go for ever. I remember the C304 that Dr Karl drove around Australia. I understand that they were offered to the Army but did not get the contract.
Great to see someone enjoying one. I'd love a 101 but I'd much prefer a C303!!!
Regards
Robbo

[roobar_and_custard]

CV boot failure is quite a common issue on these trucks. Mostly this is age fatigue, as the trucks are over 30 years old. However, when they do split, oil from the axle and CV is able to escape. It took a little while to find the parts, and I ended up getting 4 (2 for now and 2 as spares) sent over from the US via a very helpful C303 owner there.

Replacing isn’t too hard, but does require removing the ends off the axle and those portal boxes are not light!! Seating the new boot against the outer casing is tricky, but with careful application of a “stick” it was possible to slowly tap it into place without damaging the rubber.

Old bit coming out...

[roobar_and_custard]

And new bits going back in...

[Chops]

Nice looking unit you have there, and looking very capable from the brochure you posted.

Mick, Gav, if and when you slide on over, you should probably let me know,, I might have to join you for a gander at it :D

[loanrangie]

Love the C303's, i remember a few years there was some one on outerlimits that was bringing in C303 portal axles from Malaysia as there is/was a huge surplus of spares over there from the ex Army fleet.

[Homestar]

Road trip Gav? We can get a photo of a Volvo flanked by 101's.

Sounds like a plan.:)



Mick, Gav, if and when you slide on over, you should probably let me know,, I might have to join you for a gander at it :D

No probs, always a spare seat.

[roobar_and_custard]

Hmmm... Whilst you are more than welcome to come around and crawl all over it, some expectation setting is needed.
I started this thread as the first priority is nearing completion and the Volvo is finally coming to the top of the pile of jobs to do. However, during the house ronnovation, it has become an incredibly convenient shed and still is as I write.
So, whilst it could be made to run, it doesn't, and crawl around space is somewhat limited - latest picture of truck attached.
Owner builder is somewhat time constraining...
Ian.

[roobar_and_custard]

What is it like to drive? Two observations really – firstly it is noisy. Not a little bit noisy, but really, really noisy. There are a number of reasons for this. It is an empty tin can with no sound proofing and the body attaches directly to the chassis. On top of this, when on a very light throttle, there is a truly awful growl from the rear. I think this is the PTO from the first rear axle taking drive to the rear. Without the 3rd prop shaft in place, this growl completely disappears. When the work starts in earnest, this is the first fix.

Secondly, the ride is amazing! I had a GS in the UK and this is a massive improvement. It is much more comfortable, it tracks really well in a straight line, and is not upset by potholes. It is rather strange with the twin rear axles on a load share spring set up when running over speed humps. It has a good bounce off the front axle (as expected) and almost no movement from the rear.

Performance is ordinary. The GS definitely has more grunt, but it is not a disaster and quite acceptable. I’ve no idea on fuel economy, and with these things, it is better not to know.

The steering is manual, with too many turns lock to lock. It is surprisingly light when moving, but requires tight turns to be taken slowly just to allow enough time to wind through the steering.

I have no idea what it is like in the mud, as sadly it hasn’t yet made it there in my hands. It should be alright though...

[roobar_and_custard]

Not long after I got it, the head gasket blew, and needed to be replaced. It went pretty badly at the back, and could be heard puffing. I bought the last head gasket in Australia (after the first one arrived bent).

Currently, the engine is not in the best of health. It uses both oil and water. In fact it has an issue which has been getting progressively worse. When driving normally, all is well, but when running down hill on overrun, it starts to smoke, building to quite significant proportions. A quick blip of the throttle and it runs clean again. I was advised to replace the valve guide seals, which I did, but to no effect. It smokes just as badly.

So, if I have to take the engine out, the plan is to change to diesel…

[Sitec]

TD 42 would go in there nicely! Is the old engine rebuild able then run gas or is that not an option? I'm a diesel fan so that wasn't an option for me!! :D

[roobar_and_custard]

Diesel fan too. I'm sure engine is rebuildable (parts should be readily available), but it's a diesel for me.
4.2's have been fitted to these, but they are too expensive for me...

[Sitec]

They're about cheep.... If we'd had this conversation a few months ago I'd have had one for you.. Bought an old Patrol GQ for $1500.. More rust than car! Plan was to use the Td42 in the 130, but then the 101 bug made a reappearance thanks to Ron, Mick, Gav, (but to name a few), and the 130 went! So, the patrol went to a neighbours for $1500 too!!! Don't think a 6bt will fit in there... Still not sure it'll fit in a 101!!!! :D

[roobar_and_custard]

The space between the seats in the Volvo is less than a 101, so limited on width for an engine. I really want to keep the conversion simple to make parts easy to get hold off. Would actually like to head overseas in it too (in the very distant future), so part availability is a big factor.
I also have the donor vehicle on the drive already...

[Sitec]

Tell us more... I'm intrigued! :)

[Bigbjorn]

Chrysler Hemi Six were a good conversion in the Volvo 164 car. The Volvo three litre is a pretty bulky heavy engine. The Chrysler is physically more compact and lighter, and nearly 50% larger in displacement. The car conversion was quite easy in an automatic version. The Valiant and Volvo used the same auto. You needed a Valiant bell housing and converter and all bolted up after some fabrication of engine mounts and other fiddly things.

[rathgar]

I have an interest (or crazy idea ) in having one of these volvos (4x4 not 6x6) and would like to know more about the purchase and import process. Did you buy from a dealer? What were the shipping and import costs like?

[roobar_and_custard]

There are many different types - military and civilian.
The military come in 4 basic types TGB1111 (open top tank killer), TGB11 (4x4 hardtop), TGB13 (6x6 hard top/ambulance/radio body) and TGB20 (6x6 troop carrier). The civilian derivatives are refered to as C303, C304 and C306, but I have not yet found a definitive explanation on these.
Mine is a TGB13 Command Cab, which is a 6x6 full bodied hard top.
I got mine from a guy who trades in Sweden, Michael Hultengren (hultis4x4@hotmail.com (hultis4x4@hotmail.com)). I had a great experience, but to be honest, that was over 6 years ago.
There are a number of places which appear to deal in them, but as I have not dealt with any of these I have no recommendations.
http://www.staaling.dk/ (http://www.staaling.dk/)
http://www.bachint.dk/shop/search-1.html?keyword=volvo (http://www.bachint.dk/shop/search-1.html?keyword=volvo)
http://volvo4x4.eu/ (http://volvo4x4.eu/)
http://fmv4x4.com/web/ (http://fmv4x4.com/web/)
http://fmv4x4.com/web/ (http://fmv4x4.com/web/)

Are you a member of the yahoo groups Volvo forum and the Real 4x4 forum in the states. Occasionaly cars come up here (mostly Real 4x4 and mostly in the states). There not the most active, but if youe speak German or Swedish then there are plenty of others which are. You may also be able to get a recommendation on a dealer.
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Volvo303/info (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Volvo303/info)
http://www.real4x4forums.com/PinzgauerBBS/index.php (http://www.real4x4forums.com/PinzgauerBBS/index.php)

Importing is straightforward, but requires lots of paperwork and funds to change hands. You can import these without restriction as they are are all pre-01 Jan 89, but make sure the date of registration or manufacture is clearly documented. You must get an import approval first, before even commencing shipping. These are available from DOTRS.
Importing Vehicles into Australia (http://www.infrastructure.gov.au/vehicles/imports/)

There are many companies that ship - mine came Ro-Ro (Roll-on Roll-off) with Wallenius Wilhelmsen, and an agent in Sweden organised this for me. Whilst waiting for the import approval, your vehicle will need to be stored.

I used an agent in Melbourne to clear customs for me. Plan to pay tax, and lots of it - all up it cost me around 2000AUD in Tax - including quarantine cleaning the car. Again, this is quite straight forward, assuming you find a capable agent.

Registration was also easy, that will depend on which state you are in, but engineering approval will be required. Mine required only modification to lap/sash seatbelts for the rear outboard seating positions and changing the perspex rear windows to safety glass to comply with ADRs, but I also had to prove it was being assessed as a Motor Vehicle in ADR and not a passenger vehicle (see attached). Mine is still LHD as it is over 30 years old.
It then had to have a roadworthy - bizzarly this was the hardest part as many places refused to assess, something to do with the size... Minor work was required to pass, but that is no different to any other roadworthy.
Finally - show up at your local registration authority with Import Approval, Engineers Certificate, Roadworthy Certificate and a means to pay more taxes - I think these are called registration fees - and smile sweetly while they scruitinise the paperwork...

And that's it.

If you need any more specific help, then let me know.

[Sitec]

There are many different types - military and civilian.
The military come in 4 basic types TGB1111 (open top tank killer), TGB11 (4x4 hardtop), TGB13 (6x6 hard top/ambulance/radio body) and TGB20 (6x6 troop carrier). The civilian derivatives are refered to as C303, C304 and C306, but I have not yet found a definitive explanation on these.
Mine is a TGB13 Command Cab, which is a 6x6 full bodied hard top.
I got mine from a guy who trades in Sweden, Michael Hultengren (hultis4x4@hotmail.com (hultis4x4@hotmail.com)). I had a great experience, but to be honest, that was over 6 years ago.
There are a number of places which appear to deal in them, but as I have not dealt with any of these I have no recommendations.
http://www.staaling.dk/ (http://www.staaling.dk/)
http://www.bachint.dk/shop/search-1.html?keyword=volvo (http://www.bachint.dk/shop/search-1.html?keyword=volvo)
http://volvo4x4.eu/ (http://volvo4x4.eu/)
http://fmv4x4.com/web/ (http://fmv4x4.com/web/)
http://fmv4x4.com/web/ (http://fmv4x4.com/web/)

Are you a member of the yahoo groups Volvo forum and the Real 4x4 forum in the states. Occasionaly cars come up here (mostly Real 4x4 and mostly in the states). There not the most active, but if youe speak German or Swedish then there are plenty of others which are. You may also be able to get a recommendation on a dealer.
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Volvo303/info (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Volvo303/info)
http://www.real4x4forums.com/PinzgauerBBS/index.php (http://www.real4x4forums.com/PinzgauerBBS/index.php)

Importing is straightforward, but requires lots of paperwork and funds to change hands. You can import these without restriction as they are are all pre-01 Jan 89, but make sure the date of registration or manufacture is clearly documented. You must get an import approval first, before even commencing shipping. These are available from DOTRS.
Importing Vehicles into Australia (http://www.infrastructure.gov.au/vehicles/imports/)

There are many companies that ship - mine came Ro-Ro (Roll-on Roll-off) with Wallenius Wilhelmsen, and an agent in Sweden organised this for me. Whilst waiting for the import approval, your vehicle will need to be stored.

I used an agent in Melbourne to clear customs for me. Plan to pay tax, and lots of it - all up it cost me around 2000AUD in Tax - including quarantine cleaning the car. Again, this is quite straight forward, assuming you find a capable agent.

Registration was also easy, that will depend on which state you are in, but engineering approval will be required. Mine required only modification to lap/sash seatbelts for the rear outboard seating positions and changing the perspex rear windows to safety glass to comply with ADRs, but I also had to prove it was being assessed as a Motor Vehicle in ADR and not a passenger vehicle (see attached). Mine is still LHD as it is over 30 years old.
It then had to have a roadworthy - bizzarly this was the hardest part as many places refused to assess, something to do with the size... Minor work was required to pass, but that is no different to any other roadworthy.
Finally - show up at your local registration authority with Import Approval, Engineers Certificate, Roadworthy Certificate and a means to pay more taxes - I think these are called registration fees - and smile sweetly while they scruitinise the paperwork...

And that's it.

If you need any more specific help, then let me know.

Ooooooohhhh Yeeeeaaaahhhh! U hit the nail on the head... Taxes, washing, dock handling... Taxes, a bit more washing... Storage because they (the people who wash it correctly) didn't wash it properly, oh and did I mention taxes! :D Still, worth doing to have something unique tho! The Cummins for my 101 that Ive shipped out of the UK still worked out at half what I'd have had to pay for the same engine over here... and it came with a gearbox, PTO, rad, engine mounts etc. Roll on the 4" exhaust!

[roobar_and_custard]

And after all that, I still found 3 live rounds in it...!

[rathgar]

Thanks for that. I have read the forums and done research on importing I will have a look at those links. Hopefully I might ask a few more specific questions in the future - no rush !! Pity I'm not closer I'd come and have a look.

[Sitec]

And after all that, I still found 3 live rounds in it...!

Wow! Just shows how well they check stuff!!! Well, I'm sat in the container yard, with the engine on the truck..... and have been for the past two hours... Some numpty used a wrong form, so even though it has been customs cleared and quarantine cleared... They have to express clear it again! Another hour to wait.. as they've all gone to lunch!!!! Talk about frustrating! :(

[roobar_and_custard]

Well no significant progress on the Volvo, but at least some for a change.

Most of the energy in the last week has been around wrestling the diesel from the donor vehicle.

However, managed to start pulling apart the drive train to start looking into the "awfull noise" I get from th erear axles when on a feathered throttle.
So far, have pulled off the PTO on the first rear axle as this was proposed as being the source of the noise, but to be honest it feels really smooth and with no apparent play. Slightly relunctant to take it apart.
The propshaft to the rear axle is good too, nice sliding action and smooth UJ knuckles.
The rear diff however feels a little grumbly on the pinion bearing, so hopefully this is the source of the noise. Especially as I have 3 new CW&Ps to go in (higher ratio in readiness for the diesel) and will be getting all the diffs rebuilt anyway.
I think I'll be pulling out the diffs next.
Ian.

[roobar_and_custard]

Finally, diffs 1 and 2 now out... diff 3 held up by bad weather and a hasty retreat into the dry.
Sadly diff three is the one I suspect is causing the noise, but no chance as yet to examine.

Front portal boxes are SOOO heavy!! Not Stolly heavy, but really not a 1 person lift... so many bruises now! And rather disappointingly, looks like I'll be replacing the CV boots again as they have both split. I suspect that this is due to old rubber, even though these parts were "new" a few years ago.

I'll add these to the growing list of parts needed...

Last week it was a runner, and this week it doesn't drive, which is lucky as it no longer stops! I think this is progress.:bangin:

[roobar_and_custard]

Also played around with putting some Discovery seats in to replace the standard vinyl seats...

Not 100% convinced they are the right choice, but a big improvement over the originals.

Ian.

[Sitec]

They look good in there... More room in that cab than a 101... That's for sure! :)

[roobar_and_custard]

Finally started on the rear axle to get the last diff out (nearly there). However on the way have taken the opportunity to dismantle one of the hubs to use as a reference for a custom disc conversion.

The hub is self contained in its own casting and is the same on each axle, so I'm hoping that this will be quite simple. Pending measuring up, I will be using Disco 2 rotors (vented fronts and solid rears) as I prefer the front mounted rotor option.

This also keeps the tradition of using Land Rover brakes - do the shoes and slave cylinder look familiar?

I suspect at some point in its life this truck has had the stub axle come loose and the portal gear has had a good chew at the axle end casing. Some very distinctive marks there! Fortunately the gear is unmarked, so its either harder or new. I prefer the idea of new.

[roobar_and_custard]

So whilst work goes on in the background on the disc conversion and the refurb of the proposed diesel, had a play with the fuel filler.

The Volvo one has always been a pet hate of mine - possibly the worst considered fuel filler in the history of cars! So the weekend saw the first step of the conversion to something more conventional.

The ali casting came from the US, the filler from a Series Land Rover and the hose from a Defender (keeping to a common source of parts if possible).

Pretty happy with the outcome, but the final plumbing (through the floor) still needs to be finished.
Ian.

[roobar_and_custard]

Time flys and so little gets done...

Diffs still out being rebuilt, and no progress on disc conversion as yet, although I do now have a pretty clear idea on what I'll do and calcs to validate. Still waiting for the hub to be 3D scanned to confirm the design details and get approval from the engineer to progress.

Two balls in the air at the moment.

1) Build a garage! Money now arranged, just need to convince the council to allow me to build one where I want to. It's going to be impossible doing an engine swop on a gravel drive and downright dangerous having it up on 6 axle stands for the disc conversion, so this next step is critical.

2) Sort out the power steering conversion. Lots of thinking been done on this and a clear plan of attack developed.
It starts with a Land Rover Freelander steering column which allows me to get the steering wheel into a more ergonomic position.
Then though the floor to a bevel box which turns the drive 90degrees (well 70 actually) to a Discovery power steering box mounted backwards. This will give me power steering, less turns lock to lock as well as eliminating an intermediate drag link.
I have most parts in hand now and was finally able to get on with the installation.
New column bracket fabricated (between rain showers - see 1), and column set in place. Position was previously confirmed by an MDF mockup some 2 months ago. Bracket has worked out really well and incredibly stiff!
For those amoung us who can weld - might be best to look away now...
Bevel box position is still under development, but pretty sure I know where it will live now I have the column in place.

Good part is - all these changes are reversible (but why I would ever do that I am not sure).

Steering wheel in the post, and bulkhead bearing also... Hope it doesn't rain next weekend too...

[Sitec]

What's that angle box off? Looking good!! :)

[roobar_and_custard]

Hi Sitec,
Pretty pleased to have made some actual progress at last. :D

Bevel box is off a Holden Frontera - or actually a Honda Passport or Isuzu Rodeo. It's the same as the one DasLandRoverMan used on the 2B Forward Control he built.
It was surprisingly cheap too (for a new part) ~70USD + shipping from US. It has 5/8"-36spline shafts, so a bit of fiddling needed to convert all the splines together...
Still need to work-out what the splines are on the Freelander column.

I plan to fix this to the body on the outside of/under the footwell keeping all the internal shafts fixed (no relative movement) and then run from the bevel box rearward to the chassis mounted steering box. As my body sits on isolators (yes - luxury), any relative body to chassis movement will be accommodated in this shaft.

Need to work out if I will get permission to play outside this weekend too...

Cheers,
Ian.

[chazza]

Nice work Ian!

With your welding, remember that slag inclusion is a weakness - treat it as being no weld there. On your bracket I would turn the amps up a bit more; weave from side-to=side to create a nice bead; and weld the full length of the joins.

Looking good :D

Cheers C

[101RRS]

Ian - in the bevel box is the rotational direction on the output shaft the same as the input shaft or does it change.

Thanks Garry

[roobar_and_custard]

Hi Chazza,
Good advice - thanks. Still new to welding, guess I'll be grinding back some of those welds then... Sadly those are the best looking ones I did. :( On the plus side - it is a little bit over-engineered. :D

Garry,
Clockwise in Anti-clockwise out. Picture of internals attached (from the web).

Cheers,
Ian.

[Sitec]

I can see Garry and I r thinking along the same lines... 101 power steering!!! :)

[DasLandRoverMan]

Worked fine on the Coiler IIB.

I think a RHD P38 box mounted behind the crossmember (or possibly in place of the relay) with the drop arm on backwards.
Everything will work correctly at that.

Standard L/R splines are (I think) 3/4 x42 spline. Both splines are standard enough.
For the IIB we had a pair of joints made up with different splines at each end by Kiley clinton. Steering Racks Rack and Pinion Steering Kiley Clinton (http://Www.steering-racks.Co.uk)

[roobar_and_custard]

Same, but in my case substitute P38 with Discovery... And pitman arm on backwards of course...

Am also in process of tracking down a 5/8"x36 to 3/4"x48 UJ which may help simplify the set-up. Still waiting confirmation from the US supplier...

Ian.

[roobar_and_custard]

Hijack away, all good info. Nice to be able to transfer Volvo know how to 101s;)

Schematic of mine a bit like this...
Wheel to column, through shaft to bevel box. Bevel box facing rearward to power steering box with pitman arm reversed.

Hopefully, with all that, when I steer right (clockwise), the bevel box changes to anticlockwise which in turn causes the steering box to turn right too. Otherwise I'm in trouble...:o

[Homestar]

I've moved the last 8 posts to the power steering thread as we had gone off on a bit of a tangent.

We can discuss 101 PS here - 101 Power Steering (http://www.aulro.com/afvb/101-forward-controls-variations/154802-101-power-steering.html)

And leave Ian's thread to talk about his Volvo and how he can get the PS to work of that.

Hope this suits everyone.:)

[Homestar]

Hijack away, all good info. Nice to be able to transfer Volvo know how to 101s;)

Schematic of mine a bit like this...
Wheel to column, through shaft to bevel box. Bevel box facing rearward to power steering box with pitman arm reversed.

Hopefully, with all that, when I steer right (clockwise), the bevel box changes to anticlockwise which in turn causes the steering box to turn right too. Otherwise I'm in trouble...:o

Yeah, that's the trick - finding a box that moves the pitman arm in the right direction. I believe the GQ unit does this for the 101 and may also be suitable for your application. I'm going to play with one at a wreckers tomorrow and make sure it's right - I'll report back on my findings.

Just looking at your drawings, I think it needs to run the same as the 101, so you may be in luck.

[Homestar]

Ian, after looking at you pic, I think you need a box that operates in the reverse to what the 101 needs. That would mean a GQ Patrol box would work for you.

....I Think..... Go and check one out at a wreckers, but I think I'm right...:)

[roobar_and_custard]

I've drawn that picture a 100 times and I'm still not 100% sure - maybe 99%.

The best point of reference is the Series FC that DasLandRoverMan built, which as far as i can tell is exactly the same concept. I'm pretty sure that one worked fine with the pitman arm reversed - ie pointing forward on a backward box.

The only way I'll know for sure is to finish off the steering. I'll either end up with a nice conversion or a quirky fairground ride. :p

Note that AJs conversion has a reversed steering box (allegedly) and standard pitman arm position on a backward (ish) box...
Arrgh... now i'm all confused again.... :mad:

[Homestar]

I've drawn that picture a 100 times and I'm still not 100% sure - maybe 99%.

The best point of reference is the Series FC that DasLandRoverMan built, which as far as i can tell is exactly the same concept. I'm pretty sure that one worked fine with the pitman arm reversed - ie pointing forward on a backward box.

The only way I'll know for sure is to finish off the steering. I'll either end up with a nice conversion or a quirky fairground ride. :p

Note that AJs conversion has a reversed steering box (allegedly) and standard pitman arm position on a backward (ish) box...
Arrgh... now i'm all confused again.... :mad:

It does. There are 2 different boxes that look similar - one (patrol) has the pitman arm facing forward and moves left as the input is turned left. The other box has the pitman arm pointing backwards and moves left as the input is turned left - the reverse of the Patrol box.

Make any more sense?:D Easiest way is to go to a wreckers and look how they work - it helped me a lot.

[DasLandRoverMan]

Standard land rover is turn right for right with the arm pointing forward, and turn right moves the arm left if it's backward.
This used the same bevel box as you have got for the job.

A left hooker with a RHD disco box mounted with the input facing forward and the pitman arm also facing forward will operate the steering correctly if the drag link is on the front of the axle.

[roobar_and_custard]

Well I'm sure now. Checked the steering box (from a Disco) and confirmed rotation is correct.
Picture shows standard set-up as removed from Discovery, pitman arm in original position. Still need to remove and turn 180 degrees, which has the effect of reversing the steering direction.

[roobar_and_custard]

And some progress on the remaining steering set-up.

Fitted boss and steeing wheel - position is pretty good really and heaps better than the original.

Cut the hole in the floor for a "bulkhead" bearing after lots of measuring, for the lower shaft to exit through the floor. And yes, it does work with the pedals.
Top of shaft needs to be supported (parts in post).
Needless to say, hole saw was too small, so after some 60 minutes of filing...:mad:

Murphys law dictated that the ideal location happened to line up with an underfloor reinforcement... exactly! What were the odds?:mad:

Lower shaft is currently made of wood (my favourite prototyping medium - see picture) to confirm the basics work ok.:p

Will need custom lower shaft to be made with the purchased coupling welded on and a spline to match the Freelander column - any recommendations on a suitable company who could help?

Cheers.
Ian.

[roobar_and_custard]

And made up bracket in MDF for bevel box, but as yet this final(ish) version untried...

[101RRS]

Well I'm sure now. Checked the steering box (from a Disco) and confirmed rotation is correct.
Picture shows standard set-up as removed from Discovery, pitman arm in original position. Still need to remove and turn 180 degrees, which has the effect of reversing the steering direction.

So in that pic - when you turn the input shaft to the right does the pitman arm come towards you or go away from you? - as the steering box is in the pic.

Garry

[Homestar]

And made up bracket in MDF for bevel box, but as yet this final(ish) version untried...

Great idea prototyping in MDF - never thought of that - I'm stealing that idea.:)

[roobar_and_custard]

Turn the input shaft clockwise (right?) and the pitman arm swings towards you.
Does that help?

[101RRS]

Yes thanks - in theory the right power steering box could just replace the 101 one without the use of a bevel box and locating a nissan power steering box on the front x member.

In my bits and pieces I have a Jeep Cherokee box that will fit perfectly with just a little modification to the mounts and steering column but the pitman arm goes the wrong way so is of no use in that position.

I just checked my Jeep box and in the same layout as your pic, my pitman arm goes away so the Disco box turns the right way. Conventional wisdom says to fit it the chassis needs to be cut but some have said the P38 box works without cutting. I haven't been able to get my hands on either so this information is helpful.

So no more discussion on 101s in your Volvo thread or the gods will get angry.

Cheers

Garry

[roobar_and_custard]

You mean like this...
untitled (http://members.westnet.com.au/profpinz/mypinny/modifications/powersteering.htm)

[roobar_and_custard]

Small success today. Managed to get the 3D scan data for my hub.

Excellent quality scan, which will need some cleaning up in CAD, but then I will be able to play to confirm if the disc conversion is viable.

The scanner struggled with the shiny shaft, but great result on the rusty hub.

Another small step taken. :p

[loanrangie]

Have you considered going RHD since you are doing steering mods or is there too much involved for the rest of the controls ?

[roobar_and_custard]

I get your point and did consider this too, and as the truck is being converted to an auto, having that column shaft running through where the clutch used to be would have worked better.
However there are some real problems with doing that (and 1 not very good reason).
On the RHS I have the primary fusebox (could be relocated) and main heater/blower (more difficult to fix), but most importantly there are no bulkhead reinforcements on this side for the pedal box - which I was a little surprised by. On a 101, the pedals can be swopped RHD to LHD quite easily as the body was made non-handed - but not in my case.
The slightly less good reason is that I quite like the LHD layout... sad I know, but the looks on the faces of oncoming motorists when a 6 year old is waving at them from the "driver" seat... priceless! :p

[Sitec]

The slightly less good reason is that I quite like the LHD layout... sad I know, but the looks on the faces of oncoming motorists when a 6 year old is waving at them from the "driver" seat... priceless! :p


Reminds me of driving a Series 2 about whilst looking thru the flaps... Also priceless!!!! ;)

[roobar_and_custard]

What sad fools we are. :wasntme:

[roobar_and_custard]

Stole some more time outside today and managed to progress beyond the MDF into steel.

Roughed out the Bevel box bracket, but then had to remove the radiator to fit as you can't flex steel as easily as MDF to fit. As always this leads to a brogressive deconstruction of the front end as I ended up having to remove the bumper to get the radiator out.

Brackets fits pretty well, the curved edge on the front needs to be bent around, but I didn't want to do that until I was sure it fitted. Gets pretty close to the front, but is still behind the chassis rails. Eventually I will fit a guard over the front, which will keep it well protected.

Have installed temporarily the top shaft support bearing, and will have to adjust the hole in the floor - but progress nevertheless.

Last picture shows one of those "special" finds that you make when working on an ex-military truck - this one trapped in front of the radiator.

[roobar_and_custard]

Tidied up some of the brackets today. Decided I didn't like the top bearing bracket so remade it - much happier with this one.
Some more fettling required to make sure the bottom bearing block doesn't support the lower shaft, as it only really needs to act as a seal. This is my third attempt and still not quite there yet...:(

I also unpacked the replacement radiator that I bought several years ago, and has been waiting patiently for the rebuild. Only temporarily fitted to make sure it clears the bevel box bracket as this new one is slightly thicker.
Every time I look at this radiator I remember my wife's words when I first got it - "you can't put that in the truck, its much too pretty, we should hang that on the wall"... It's been tempting!

[roobar_and_custard]

And I stuck on a new door mirror (Defender one)...

[Jaster]

Hi Ian,

I'm very jealous, I've been lusting after one of these for a few years now after seeing the Team Havast truck, but like you, had decided that the "van" would suit my intended usage better (camping with the family). I'd be keen to come and have a look at the Volvo some time, compare grand plans, and maybe, just maybe convince the wife of it's merits ;)

I trust you'll be keeping us posted on how things go, I'm taking notes for *WHEN* I get mine ;)


Cheers,
Josh.

[Sitec]

Looking good there! Liking that steering support bracketry! Not sure the wooden shafts r going to cut it long term tho! :D

[lightning]

This is very interesting...... I have subscribed to this thread.

I also would love to buy one of these as a touring vehicle, I think they would be an excellent platform to customise a unique, reliable and capable tourer.

Can I ask what plans you have for the camping side of things ? You mention that you have kids, are you intending to have everyone sleep in the vehicle ?

What creature comforts would you like in the vehicle ?

[roobar_and_custard]

Well it's been a while since I last posted... School hols and big tree down in the back yard chew up weekends pretty quickly.

So, wooden steering shafts not the go then? Shame really as they are much easier to make... :(

Camping plans for the truck. Pop top should allow sleeping space on the roof for the kids and then rear seating area will convert to bed for adults, though I am not entirely sure how yet. Pop top will also allow standing space in the rear for a small kitchen and easy changing. Would like to add a lift up tailgate with a drop down tent to allow easy expansion should that be needed, but now into luxuries which never really ever happen.

[sclarke]

I used to rally a Volvo 164. Tough motor.

[Landy Smurf]

Looks similar to one of the Volvo's I drove in Sweden.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/11/1182.jpg (http://s948.photobucket.com/user/tonysmera/media/sweden/tgb11.jpg.html)
here are some others I drove(not me shown driving it however)
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/11/1183.jpg (http://s948.photobucket.com/user/tonysmera/media/sweden/Volvo903.jpg.html)
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/11/1184.jpg (http://s948.photobucket.com/user/tonysmera/media/sweden/TGB30medkran.jpg.html)
and while still on ex army
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/11/1185.jpg (http://s948.photobucket.com/user/tonysmera/media/sweden/bike1.jpg.html)
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/11/1186.jpg (http://s948.photobucket.com/user/tonysmera/media/sweden/bike.jpg.html)
sorry for the hijak

[roobar_and_custard]

Nice. Did you buy one?

[Landy Smurf]

No, I just drove them and did a bit of service work on them

[roobar_and_custard]

Shame really - would be fun to get a few more out here...

Were any available for sale?

[roobar_and_custard]

No progress on the truck to speak of, but I did manage to make some progress on the powertrain components.

Plan for the truck is to replace the trusty (and oil burning) 3lt petrol with a 300tdi oil burner. Behind this will sit a ZF4HP22 with an LT230 T/Fer case (thanks Sitec).

The current gearbox/tfer case is surprisingly short, which makes finding a suitable doner a little tricky. The hope is that the 4 cylinder TDi, being shorter than a 6 cylinder, will allow more space for the gearbox, but it is still tight... and then I found out about this little trick...

A V8 ZF has a shorter spacer that a TDi ZF, so if you graft the back of one onto the front of the other, the whole unit ends up around 50mm shorter. :p

Picked up a 94 V8 autobox at the weekend, which had been reported as "slipping". Took it apart and I can confirm that it was definately toast. Put it back together purely for training purposes, before opening up the real box.

Then took apart the auto from my 98 donor Disco - not toast, but nice and shiny, and then reassembled.

And voila!

Left overs anyone?

[DasLandRoverMan]

I presume by 'spacer' you mean the tail housing?
Not one I've heard before, but does explain a couple of things I've wondered for a while.

[Landy Smurf]

Shame really - would be fun to get a few more out here...

Were any available for sale?
None of these were for sale. I met a guy who lived a bit further north from where I was. He had quite a few of these and land rovers as well. including series and lightweights. he had 2 6x6 volvos like yours out the front.
They are fun to drive. I use to drive the 4x4 version of yours into town(illegally). I felt like a bit of a legend :p

[roobar_and_custard]

Steering box in place now. Bracket made up and tack welded to cross member.
I made the bracket the same size as a Discover chassis rail, to allow re-use of the bolts and tubed it internally.

The steering shaft from the bevel box to steering box went through a body cross member, thanks to "murphy"...
Will need to reinforce this cut (of course) and fully weld the bracket onto the cross member, but as access is limited and my welding isn't up to the job just yet, that will wait until I take the body off later.

Will need a custom shaft to be made up here, but should be pretty straight forward.

Pitman arm is in the right place too, but too long I think. Will need to get machined with the right taper.

Good news is - it steers the right way. :D

[roobar_and_custard]

Happy New year to all! First update for 2015 on the Volvo.

Not much happened on the Volvo over the new year as spent most of the time away. :D

But, now back into the fray...

I had all the diffs (3 of them) rebult with new CW&P sets in a higher ratio to help improve RPM/Kph - the diff ratio changes from 3.44 to 2.91, the overall axle ratio from 7.09 to 5.99 considering the portal box reduction. CW&P were custom made in the UK by a Volvo enthusiast to the same ratio as the 4x4 but including the added spline the 6x6 requires for the rear axle pto drive.
This new ratio should help when the diesel conversion is done.

Rear axles installed, and I even had help (briefly). Will eventually repaint all the axles, as they now look a little shabby.:(

Front axle yet to be done, and will require new CV boots to be fitted at the same time.

[roobar_and_custard]

Have been playing with the dash panel. Now that the steering column comes out through the midde of the speedo some modification was necessary.
Usual mock up made - in cardboard this time.

Took a couple of attempts to get a gauge layout I was happy with. mostly due to retaining the heater control position due to cable lengths, as well as trying to find sapce for all the switches.

Will be running a combination of 12v and 24v systems, just to keep things unecessarily complicated, with most of the new stuff (gauges) changing to 12v.

[roobar_and_custard]

And just as a reminder - the original.

[roobar_and_custard]

And now in steel...

Stick welding 2mm has been challenging, but pretty happy with the result. Went with steel as this adds some structure to the column. Now the column hangs off the dash instead of being attached to the chassis, adding in this extra stucture sould help prevent unwanted steeing wheel vibration - but only time will tell...

Fuses can be accessed through the glovebox (false floor to be added), centre section unbolts as this will make wiring up the new stuff much easier.

Eventually will add a top panel in ply, covered in vinyl, which clips down - I'll still need to access the brake reservoirs as well as the new expansion tank for the yet to exist water/air intercooler.

Now for the task of cutting all those switch/gauge holes... :(

[roobar_and_custard]

After having spent many weekends, and still going, clearing up the garden after we had three trees taken down (which including having to move the Volvo off the drive on 5 wheels - from under one of the trees :o).

Spent some time on the transfer case shift mechanism, which needs to be a unique set-up for obvious reasons.

Diff lock actuation uses the standard Volvo vacuum actuator, which has an internal spring to return when no vacuum is available. This set up means that the diff will be locked when the engine is off, and open when a vacuum is applied - similar principle to the original Volvo set up. It also means that under heavy braking, a pressure switch in the brake circuit switches off the vacuum causing the diff to lock and preventing either front or rear wheels locking independantly. This is how the part time transfer case worked, and I hope the LT230 is strong enough for...
Appears to function so far, but have yet to try with a vacuum.

High/Low range is to be actuated by the bowden cable, with a yet to be decided lever in the cab.

[Sitec]

Very neatly done! Good work! :)

[rathgar]

Hi there Roobar,

Just wondering how your build was going. And... While looking at the "rust wrecks" page on Facebook last night I came across an Australian delived 4x4 volvo cab chassis version for sale at Lismore. Has now disappeared from Facebook. But the compliance plates definitely labeled it as a C304 which I thoght was 6x6. Can you shed any knowledge on that?

[roobar_and_custard]

Never seen Rusty Wrecks before as I don't have Facebook - my wife does, and have to admit, it is a pretty cool thread,
My trucks progress has stopped. We've had visitors from the UK for the last 8 months, and finances and time were pretty much exhausted. Trying to get approval for a garage and then I hope to be able to get stuck in again.

For reference C303, C304 and C306 are civilian references for the Volvo - see attached.

Cheers, Ian.

[rathgar]

Never seen Rusty Wrecks before as I don't have Facebook - my wife does, and have to admit, it is a pretty cool thread,
My trucks progress has stopped. We've had visitors from the UK for the last 8 months, and finances and time were pretty much exhausted. Trying to get approval for a garage and then I hope to be able to get stuck in again.

For reference C303, C304 and C306 are civilian references for the Volvo - see attached.

Cheers, Ian.

Thanks for that. I think I've got it now C303 and C304 are the 4x4 variant with the C304 having approx. 250mm longer wheelbase and the C306 is the 6x6. Lesson learnt Don't trust Wikipedia it is wrong in this case (and then the mistake is repeated all over the internet). Actually I think the way you have your vehicle listed in your signature line is also wrong should be C306;)

[Nick S]

Thanks for that. I think I've got it now C303 and C304 are the 4x4 variant with the C304 having approx. 250mm longer wheelbase and the C306 is the 6x6. Lesson learnt Don't trust Wikipedia it is wrong in this case (and then the mistake is repeated all over the internet). Actually I think the way you have your vehicle listed in your signature line is also wrong should be C306;)

Rathgar
mine is a Volvo C304 TGB1314 and is a 6X6 Ambulance
Nick

[rathgar]

Rathgar
mine is a Volvo C304 TGB1314 and is a 6X6 Ambulance
Nick

Does it have that on the comliance plates? That doesn't tally with the document Roobar posted! Maybe its not as simple as I thought! Did you import yours yourself?

[Nick S]

Hi Rathgar
I'll have a look at id plate and let you know. I bought it locally from a friend who imported 2 304s. Have you been to Terrangbil.net? Swedish website for Volvo 4x4 and 6x6 military vehicles + other stuff
Cheers
Nick

[roobar_and_custard]

Mine is definitely a TGB13, based on it's military designation.

The compliance plate refers to C03 6x6, and is consistent with the reference to the C03 series of trucks from Volvo.

Outside of the military, I can find references in Volvo press literature to these being called C303s and C304s. I'm not sure even Volvo really new what to call them...

My family calls ours "The Beast", and when it is running, I hope most people will call it "sir" and move politely aside :wasntme:

[rathgar]

Mine is definitely a TGB13, based on it's military designation.

The compliance plate refers to C03 6x6, and is consistent with the reference to the C03 series of trucks from Volvo.

Outside of the military, I can find references in Volvo press literature to these being called C303s and C304s. I'm not sure even Volvo really new what to call them...

My family calls ours "The Beast", and when it is running, I hope most people will call it "sir" and move politely aside :wasntme:

Pretty sure the compliance plate of yours would be different to the one I saw as it was an Australian delivered vehicle. The C304 designation was on a (Volvo Australia? ) plate with Australia ADR designations on it.

How many other C30 what ever ot TGB vehicles are you or Nick aware of in Australia?