Clutch / Hydraulic / Air Problems

[Gillie]

Need Help with diagnosis

My 2000 TD5 Defender 130 has some clutch problems.
the symptoms are.
1. the pedal randomly goes from normal to being hard to push in.
2. when it does this the clutch slips.

There are no external hydraulic leaks.

The previous owner had this set up
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/10/776.jpg[/URL]

The Booster is installed in front of the brake booster (and not connected obviously) The booster gets it air from a t piece in the brake booster line.

I am thinking the problem may be on the booster and may be related to loss of vacuum pressure? This would explain the clutch going soft to hard.
I am also thinking perhaps the vacuum pump is RS? Or maybe the slave and master cylinder are cactus.

I am not super keen to pull the gearbox and transfer case out if I don't have to.

Can anyone add their 2 cents worth on what they suspect may be the cause and how to test.
greatly appreciated.

[mick88]

More than likely the clutch booster if they both get their vacuum from the one pump, otherwise you would expect both the brakes and clutch to have issues.

Cheers, Mick.

[BilboBoggles]

Since it's slippijng when it's getting hard to push, that might mean there is resdual pressure in the hydraulic lines. Could it be the clutch pedal does not have enough free travel. Without free travel the pressure in the hydraulic line does not fully dissipate, so continual usage might cause it to lock up. Or perhaps the poppet valve in the master cylinder is sticking?

[Gillie]

More than likely the clutch booster if they both get their vacuum from the one pump, otherwise you would expect both the brakes and clutch to have issues.

Cheers, Mick.

I am not confident that the brake assist is working properly either so it it may be vacuum related.

[Summiitt]

I would put a vacuum gauge on your vacuum line to test...sounds very much like a vacuum pump issue or a hole in your main vacuum line.

[Gillie]

Here is the Latest.

I replaced the Master cylinder and the Slave cylinder. Oh what fun this was.

The result was no change and both the old ones looked fine, there was no sign of wear.

I have been able to bypass the Vacuum booster finally today with a hose made up to take it out of the system. The result? Well I believe i have isolated the problem to either the booster or the vacuum pump.

I suspect it is the booster as there is vacuum on the line and I think the brakes feel fine also.

Does anyone recognise the booster from the above picture? I haven't had a proper look but there isn't much to identify it. Perhaps a few numbers from memory. When I get a chance I will pull it out and have a look. It looks like it may have a diaphragm in there which may be a possible cause. I might just put a spring kit on the pedal as it doesn't have one and throw the Booster away. It is likely to be a something from the wreckers and not aftermarket and certainly not genuine I would think.

Any thoughts on what is the likely problem?
cheers

[JEFFRO]

I had a similar problem on my 85 3.5 county with the standard clutch. My the clutch pedal would become very hard to push in when hot and the clutch would start slipping. Replaced the flexible line problem solved.

Jeffro
85 3.5 v8 County

[Gillie]

I had a similar problem on my 85 3.5 county with the standard clutch. My the clutch pedal would become very hard to push in when hot and the clutch would start slipping. Replaced the flexible line problem solved.

Jeffro
85 3.5 v8 County

The flexible line? the vacuum line? or flexible hydraulic line?

[460cixy]

Check the clutch hydraulic hose could be breaking down internally the booster is a pbr vh40 or 44 very comon on older cars

[jimr1]

Hi Gillie I also have a 2000 td5 wagon , when I fist brought It I thought the clutch was a bit stiff to push down , compared to my 110 v8 wagon , but I soon got used to It . My question to you is do you need a clutch booster if not take It out and go back to standard , keep It simple = less problems . cheers jimr1 :)

[Gillie]

Hi Gillie I also have a 2000 td5 wagon , when I fist brought It I thought the clutch was a bit stiff to push down , compared to my 110 v8 wagon , but I soon got used to It . My question to you is do you need a clutch booster if not take It out and go back to standard , keep It simple = less problems . cheers jimr1 :)

Thats what I reckon. There is a a spring kit you can get which is standard on most defenders through the ages but isn't on a few. It is like the guy whose job it was to fit these springs went on holidays and no one did his job! Land Rover Defender TD5 Clutch Pedal Assistance Spring KIT EDP7510LKIT | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/LAND-ROVER-DEFENDER-TD5-CLUTCH-PEDAL-ASSISTANCE-SPRING-KIT-EDP7510LKIT-/271218179508?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&fits=Model%3ADefender&hash=item3f25dcfdb4&_uhb=1)
Apparently this makes a big difference to how heavy the clutch feels.

In saying all this I will still pull it out and apart and see if it can be identified and what the fault may be also............... When I get time

[Gillie]

Here is the latest call out to fellow land rover lovers!

The 130 has been behaving itself more or less lately until I got home last week and the wife told me she couldnt get it into gear and ended up walking home. I went down to investigate and found that there was no clutch fluid in the resoivoir. There may of been the smallest of weeps in the hydraulic line but rather odd that the whole resoivoir was drained with no obvious signs. I topped up the resoivoir and bled the system and got all the air out but the pedal still doesn't feel right. I left it overnight and it still wasn't right. I bled it many times over the next few days but still no air in the system. A test drive reveals that you need to turn the motor off to get it into gear and it can be driven by double clutching and picking revs but the clutch slips if you putnyour foot down. The resoivoir has not moved over maybe two weeks. I took the slave out to see if I could see anyhing but it gave no hints of any problems that I could see. What do other members thing is going on ? The air booster mentioned earlier in the thread has long been disconnected and is no way part of the system and the sytem is standard land rover. Any help appreciated before I drop the box which I don't have the time for but may not have a choice.
Note that the master and slave cylinder was replaced about a year ago 15000 km

[Gillie]

It was the clutch, Pressure plate, Throuwout bearing or flywheel. I will post a link to pics later.

On the bright side it is such a pleasure to drive now, and I also moved the Defender handbrake into a more suitable position. Funnily enough I try and pull it on where it used to be :D