Which heater core

[rangerdanger]

After putting up with a bypassed heater for 3 years due to finding a rounder off clamp screw first time round, I finally bit the bullet and stuck with it to replace the heater core o rings. Thoroughly unpleasant job. Unfortunately, after pressure testing with water I still have a leak.

Those O rings will forever have me second guessing when the next leak is going to occur, so I have decided to go the Audi A6 heater core route and be done with it. There are so many posts on the subject my head is spinning.

My questions are,
1. How many forumites have done the conversion? Any long term issues?
2. There is a copper heater core (P/N 399910) and a plastic tanked aluminium heater core. Which has the best track record in Aus? Best brand / supplier? Anybody done a fully welded aluminium core?
3. There seem to be a few methods to access, either taking the entire dash out or removing the steering column. Which is best?
4. One post talked about unbolting the entire dash from the firewall and shifting back 100mm or so. I presume this only works for LHD vehicles?


Any guidance appreciated. I want to make this as painless and permanent fix as possible.


Thanks, Troy N.

[Hoges]

for dash removal... see Dash Removal | PaulP38A.com (http://paulp38a.com/range-rover-p38/dash-removal/)

If you are using the recommended red/orange coloured OAT coolant, it can react with copper and form a red-orange sludge which will clog up the radiator ...no doubt also the copper heater core. In which case get the plastic/aluminium heater core.

[rangerdanger]

I use the green coolant so no problems there, but I'm probably erring on the plastic / aluminium core, if only to avoid mixing metals in the cooling system. From what I have read there were cases of end joints failing on the plastic ones. There were also cases of soldered joints failing on the copper ones. Hence my dilemma.
Ebay seems to be the only place to buy them locally as far as I can tell, but there are comments to avoid buying the cheap and nasty ones on Ebay. Any manufacturers to avoid?

[Hammer H]

I also replaced mine with original, no removing dash as there is a shortcut cutting the frame, it is also advised to remove the steering wheel but was able to do it not removing the steering wheel.

[rangerdanger]

Still in two minds with the heater cores. There are a few cheap and nasty ones on Ebay which I'll steer clear of.


Presently aussie Ebay has plastic tanked version which is by the aftermarket supplier to Behr, Valeo.
Audi 5000 100 200 S4 A6 V8 Quattro 1987 1998 Heater Core 443819030 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Audi-5000-100-200-S4-A6-V8-Quattro-1987-1998-Heater-Core-443819030-/300811788964?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4609c7a2a4)


Then you have the OEM Behr versions on Ebay US
Audi 100 200 5000 A6 Quattro S4 S6 78 98 Heater Core Behr 443 819 030 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Audi-100-200-5000-A6-Quattro-S4-S6-78-98-Heater-Core-OEM-BEHR-443-819-030-/360671744818?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&fits=Make%3AAudi%7CModel%3AA6&hash=item53f9b61332)


Then there are the copper tanked aftermarket ones on Ebay US, which were the popular choice in the US.
Vistapro Proliance 399910 Heater Core | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/VistaPro-Proliance-399910-HEATER-CORE-/230701373870?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&fits=Make%3AAudi%7CModel%3AA6&hash=item35b6df99ae)


Any thoughts or opinions?

[Scouse]

Which way did you end up going?


I've just done O rings & was worried about some coolant residue near the plastic section of the joint. Fitted the O rings & cleaned up the area only to find coolant seeping through a crack.
I've fitted a 2nd hand heater core from a parts car (so far, so good) but I'm looking at going the Audi route too if the problem crops up again.


The local eBay seller seems decent enough but I always wonder about warranty with eBay sellers. This one has been member since 2004 though.

[Rage Over]

I'm also interested to know how you went. I just had the o-rings fail on both P38s in my family within a week of each other - go figure that one out!

I took the opportunity to install the BMW header tank in both when I looped them so I can set an alarm if I ever lose my coolant, so it wasn't for nothing. Now I need to decide whether to just change the o-rings or go to an alternate heater core.

At the worst time of the year to lose my heating, too... :mad:

[rangerdanger]

Hey guys, just to let you know I went down the track of ordering the full copper version, from Summit racing in the states. Also ordered some 'goodyear hi miler' heater hose which is supposed to be heavier duty to avoid having to replace it later. Also got some goodyear plastic 5/8 to 3/4 barb fittings. Total cost 175$ including freight from the US.


Quality seems OK. Made in Mexico so who knows.


It hasn't caused any problems yet, as it is still sitting in the box waiting to be installed. I have been procrastinating on performing open heart surgery on the dash I'm afraid.
Troy N

[FANTOM P38]

I took the opportunity to install the BMW header tank in both when I looped them so I can set an alarm if I ever lose my coolant, so it wasn't for nothing.

Hi Rage Over, can you be more specific as to which BMW expansion tank you installed as I have been considering doing the coolant alarm instal but dont want to risk leaks from drilling original expansion tank. Also does the said tank you installed need to be modified in any way to fit all relevant hoses & mounting points etc.

[Rage Over]

Sure, the BMW part number is 17111712641 and the genuine BMW tank (very good quality) can be bought for a good price from FCP Euro (they have some LR parts too but not many). The sensor is sold separately and there are two versions with different plugs. Either will work but I chose part number 61311378320 (two big round pins, rather than two small flat pins). It fits perfectly in the original bracket (exactly the same mounting).

I did not modify the tank at all however it doesn't have the little take-off at the bottom that runs from the throttle body heater (same function as a carb de-icer). After coming up with a perfectly good solution to keep it I realised that it really wasn't needed in this part of the world and decided to just remove it instead. The take-off in the intake manifold was capped. All other connections are present and in the correct positions.

Also, the main outlet of the header tank comes straight out perpendicular to the tank rather than at an angle, so the hose needs an awkward 90 degree bend in it. I found a suitable hose for now, but the hose does sit against the brake/ETC block (which I do not like). That's just a matter of using a more suitable hose.

Other than that, this gives a perfectly sealed system with no drilling into the tank or otherwise weakening reliability (other than the hose above, but that's easily solved).

If you are sure you need the throttle body warmer (snowy mountains residents?), the BA/BF Ford Falcon 6cyl heater hose has a perfectly sized reducing tee that you could safely connect the line from the plate heater to. There may be other cheaper ones but I've found it is fine with it disconnected.

If people are interested I can make a new thread and put some photos in it.

[davidsonsm]

Rage over. I've installed a level sensor in a discovery 2 diesel header tank that doesn't have the lower inlet/outlet nipple to/from the throttle body.

So the hose off the engine will be cut and blanked off with an air compressor safety relief valve. This will not operate at the engines operating pressures, but will allow me to manually bleed the engine if needs be.

[Rage Over]

Ah indeed, interesting. When I bled the system I just removed the cap, but I very much like the idea of the valve. You just gave me an idea, we could also use one of the small screw type compressor tank drains. Although the take-off would need to be removed and the manifold tapped for it but that would be a more reliable/permanent solution.

Something like this: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/280738859903

Also, do you mean you drilled and plastic welded a level sensor in or the tank already had it? I just had a look for photos of the D2 diesel tank and it doesn't appear to have a sensor built-in. Do you have a link to a photo of one, I'd be interested to compare.

EDIT: Alternatively just crimp down the original take-off in the manifold and drill and tap a new hole in the empty sensor spot on top of the manifold (I think there was one) to fit that 1/8" NPT drain tap.

[davidsonsm]

This it's what I've done to the tank:

[FANTOM P38]

Bleeding system is not an issue for me, as I had a bleed valve fitted to top tank of radiator when I had it it built & it works a treat.
My concern was creating a weak spot in system if I modified original expansion tank, so one with level sensor built in would be perfect!;)
would be good to see photo of yours in situ, (Rage Over ) so I could see what type of hose would be required.

[davidsonsm]

Can't get the photo to upload for some strange reason. Will try again tomorrow from the computer.

[FANTOM P38]

Can't get the photo to upload for some strange reason. Will try again tomorrow from the computer.

Hey Sean remind me to check yours out when we catch up at Wombat:)

[davidsonsm]

Hopefully I'll find some time to get it installed before then. It's been sitting in the garage for a while now.

[Rage Over]

My concern was creating a weak spot in system if I modified original expansion tank, so one with level sensor built in would be perfect!;)
would be good to see photo of yours in situ, (Rage Over ) so I could see what type of hose would be required.
Yes, that was exactly my concern as well. I'd considered plastic welding the spigot from another tank of the same plastic - that in theory would be no weaker (as opposed to just epoxy or some such), but I much prefer this tank (and I'm terrible at plastic welding).

Tomorrow when it's not so cold outside I'll take some photographs and make a new thread showing the tank.

[davidsonsm]

I'd included some photos back in this thread:

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/showthread.php't=182102

[Rage Over]

Ah, indeed. That's kind of what I was thinking, however I'm not too comfortable with the reliability of an epoxy join. Then again, the RV8 coolant isn't run up to a very high pressure so I'm possibly over thinking things.

Have you fitted it yet?

That thread also shows the exact BMW tank I'm using (albeit from one small angle). I'll haed over to that thread this afternoon when I've got time and post a few more photographs of that tank.

[davidsonsm]

Rage Over - the hole I drilled in the top of the tank was "threading diameter" i.e. slight smaller than the 32mm (or was it 40mm?) threaded union. The threaded union was screwed quite tightly in to the top of the tank. You have to be careful where you drill the hole in the tank though, because of the baffles within the tank. Mechanically, it shouldn't let go at 5-10psi (operating pressure). The cap relieves at about 20psi.

But to be sure, and to ensure pressure tightness, I used JB Weld around the exterior of the union to tank join. I'll pressure test and leak test it before fitting.

[TheTree]

Hi

Bringing up an old thread here

I ordered from Amazon what was listed as Vista Pro 399910 Heater Core, the picture showed a core with soldered copper tanks which is what I wanted.

When the core arrived today it has plastic tanks on it https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2015/05/1148.jpg

I contacted the suppler and they will arrange a return and credit but as I live in Australia I am going to take a hit on the return postage

So my question is are the plastic tank Audi cores OK or do they have issues?

Thanks
Steve

[daf11e]

Steve last I read on RRNet Marty (IIRC) has a plastic one fitted and was ok, another member said he got 2 years from plastic.....No doubt you'll post there and am sure they will advise.

[TheTree]

Scotty pointed out on rr.net that the raised lip on the end of the outlet pipes only goes about a third of the way around and he had trouble getting the hoses to seal properly.

A couple of others alos pointed out that I will not have to pay return shipping since this looks very much like a "bait and switch" transaction

Steve

[BritishCarComponents]

A couple of others alos pointed out that I will not have to pay return shipping since this looks very much like a "bait and switch" transaction

Steve

Another good reason to avoid buying on-line where possible.

[TheTree]

Another good reason to avoid buying on-line where possible.

Hi

In this case there is no other option as far as I know only the plastic tank version is available down under, and they are asking a motza for them so online it had to be!

Good thing about amazon is that you get 100% guarantee of the right part.

Steve

[Hoges]

IIRC there's an issue using copper heat exchangers where OAT -type coolant is involved.. causes problems with solids forming in solution and eventually blocking the core of the heat exchanger .... hence plastic header tanks.

[TheTree]

Yes copper and OATS coolant do not mix !

However the GEMS models use the older style green coolant so no worries there

Steve