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View Full Version : Fire extinguisher location - passenger side only.



BSM
27th April 2014, 03:57 PM
I bought an el-cheaply $15 powder type fire extinguisher from Aldi with the intention of mounting it down in the footwell forward of the drivers seat.

To my surprise there's no immediately obvious mounting point for these. (I have manual seats). After much faffing around looking for some clues from the UK forum I eventually turned to TOPIX, where I downloaded the instructions for fitting the OEM fire extinguisher.

Turns out ( according to the LR fitting instructions) that you mustn't mount the fire extinguisher in front of the drivers seat. It must be mounted instead in front of the passenger seat.

I suppose the thinking for this is that it restricts the drivers footspace, and could be dangerous. Is this normal practice? I've always placed them on the drivers side previously.

warren9981
27th April 2014, 04:40 PM
The thinking would be safety related in that if the extinguisher came loose from the mounting bracket it could get fouled with the pedals and potentially cause an accident.
On my D2, I have 1 extinguisher mounted on each side of my cargo barrier so they are easily accessible if needed.

BSM
27th April 2014, 05:53 PM
Yes that makes sense.

I also agree that the cargo barrier is a great place to mount them. I just don't have one. So the footwell it is.

letherm
27th April 2014, 06:11 PM
I also mount mine on my cargo barrier.

What about just behind the second row of seats at about shoulder height?

IMHO if you've got a fire, you're unlikely to want to fossick in the footwell to get the extinguisher. In the back is pretty common from my experience.

warren9981
27th April 2014, 06:15 PM
Just make sure you don't cause interference with any curtain or side airbags, if fitted.

PaulGOz
27th April 2014, 08:07 PM
I have mounted mine twice now on the underside rear of front passeger seat there is some black metal that is relatively flat and holds a CAMS approved mount I picked up from one ofvthe racecar accesory retailers. Pm me if interested in a pic.

irondoc
27th April 2014, 09:03 PM
I ordered the factory fire extinguisher mount. It took me many months to finally work out how to do it, as it didn't come with a template for cutting the carpet in the passenger footwell.

See attached image.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/04/170.jpg

Tombie
28th April 2014, 12:42 AM
Got the part number at all?

camel_landy
28th April 2014, 03:10 AM
What you don't want is for the extinguisher to become a projectile if you have a crash. Mount it securely and preferably facing to the rear... Try to avoid mounting it forward facing, at head height, on a cargo barrier!!

M

irondoc
28th April 2014, 07:44 AM
VPLAS0041

I ordered it from the UK. As you can't ship a fire extinguisher, I ordered the whole kit and told the shop to keep the extinguisher and just send the mounting stuff. From memory it was an expensive exercise, around A$200 ????

Cheers
Lucas

irondoc
28th April 2014, 07:46 AM
Note that it interferes with the passenger feet - it juts out a bit, so i only use it there when I am by myself, otherwise it is in the back behind the cargo barrier.

cheers
Lucas

BSM
28th April 2014, 08:35 AM
Note that it interferes with the passenger feet - it juts out a bit, so i only use it there when I am by myself, otherwise it is in the back behind the cargo barrier.

cheers
Lucas

Mmmm. Mutiny has been threatened by her beloved if any passenger footwell space is taken up by bulky equipment. "There's less room even than in the VW Jetta" apparently.

This is going to be trickier than I thought.

Brad
28th April 2014, 08:41 AM
Has anyone had cause to (effectively) use an onboard fire extinguisher and if so, could you please outline the scenario?

The RFS people I've talked to thus far have been consistent in calling it a waste of time, argument being any car fire you come across will not be put out by a portable extinguisher.

BSM
28th April 2014, 09:21 AM
Has anyone had cause to (effectively) use an onboard fire extinguisher and if so, could you please outline the scenario?

The RFS people I've talked to thus far have been consistent in calling it a waste of time, argument being any car fire you come across will not be put out by a portable extinguisher.

There's a scenario described here (http://www.disco3.co.uk/forum/topic51788.html?highlight=Fire+fire+fire).

discotwinturbo
28th April 2014, 10:57 AM
I have used two extinguishers to put out fire under engine bays, on cars on freeways,

Never again though...as both never replaced my extinguishers.

Brett....

Willsy
28th April 2014, 11:14 AM
I just enquired about the mount, after finding the install instructions on the net. I was quoted $430 by a WA dealer.

I think I will be fashioning my own bracket from the install instructions....

BSM
28th April 2014, 05:26 PM
I just enquired about the mount, after finding the install instructions on the net. I was quoted $430 by a WA dealer.

I think I will be fashioning my own bracket from the install instructions....
$430? Outrageous. I always intended to make up my own bracket too. How hard can it be?

irondoc
28th April 2014, 07:09 PM
If you order it from the UK it will be cheaper.

If I had my time again, I would probably try and make a bracket to mount it to the passenger seat so it was tucked away further under the seat and out of the way.

cheers
lucas

idrabble
28th April 2014, 08:04 PM
tucked away further under the seat and out of the way.

Makes sense, put it where it's hard to get at:D

phl
28th April 2014, 09:34 PM
The RFS people I've talked to thus far have been consistent in calling it a waste of time, argument being any car fire you come across will not be put out by a portable extinguisher.

I think that's like saying a fire extinguisher is useless without knowing more about it, such as size and composition. Most 1kg sold at places such as Bunnings would not be great, but probably better than nothing, but you can get motorsports rated 2.5kg units that will be useful.

MattyGM
28th April 2014, 09:50 PM
Has anyone had cause to (effectively) use an onboard fire extinguisher and if so, could you please outline the scenario?

The RFS people I've talked to thus far have been consistent in calling it a waste of time, argument being any car fire you come across will not be put out by a portable extinguisher.

One word in the bush as to why you carry an extinguisher, SPINIFEX

bbyer
28th April 2014, 10:52 PM
Has anyone had cause to (effectively) use an onboard fire extinguisher and if so, could you please outline the scenario?

The RFS people I've talked to thus far have been consistent in calling it a waste of time, argument being any car fire you come across will not be put out by a portable extinguisher.It was a few years back now, but one of our one ton single axle GMC's suffered only minor damage from a fire caused by a broken fuel line in the engine compartment. We credited the 2.5 pound fire extinguisher rather than just the fire going out by itself.

Up until then, I had always regarded these itty bitty fire extinguishers as a waste of money.

Discomark
29th April 2014, 07:06 PM
Double post!

Discomark
29th April 2014, 07:13 PM
[Originally Posted by Brad
Has anyone had cause to (effectively) use an onboard fire extinguisher and if so, could you please outline the scenario?]

I've had a 1KG powder type mounted to the cargo barrier since I bought the Disco in 97. Never needed it until last week when I took the Disco for a short drive around the block after standing for two months. Passed a Mazda hatchback with smoke pouring from the hood and pulled over to lend a hand, first thought was to disconnect the battery but after popping the hood the battery was already well alight and even the insulation under the hood was on fire. I grabbed the 17 year old extinguisher which I know I should have changed years ago but it worked a treat and the fire was out in seconds. I guess all the bouncing around in a 4x4 stops the powder from settling too much.
Anyway the lady was very grateful and she popped around to my place with a couple of bottles of wine and a Bunnings voucher to say thanks and to replace the extinguisher.
Apparently the insurer wrote the car off though as the car was about 10 year old it was probably not economical to repair at todays rates.

I picked up a shiny new Extinguisher at the Rosehill show :)

Cheers
Mark

Basil135
1st May 2014, 11:52 AM
I carry at least 1 x 2.5kg DCP extinguisher (ABE) with me on any long travels.

A 1kg is better than nothing thou, and takes up much less room.

Only time I have had to use it in anger, was when I was coming along the freeway, and a car with a trailer had pulled over with smoke pouring out of his trailer bearings. They were shot, and had caught alight.

Quick squirt with the extinguisher, and problem sorted.


Just a word of caution. If you do ever have, or come across, an engine fire, do NOT lift the bonnet. Release the catch, and shoot your extinguisher thru the gap, over the top of the engine.

The reasons are two-fold.

1) The sudden in rush of air can fuel & flare the fire up, not only making it worse, but if you are holding the bonnet at the time, you are right in line for getting engulfed.

2) DCP (Dry Chemical Powder) extinguishers work best in still air. If the bonnet is up, and you have wind coming from the side, it may blow the powder away from the fire you are trying to put out. By leaving the bonnet down, you reduce this, plus the powder can settle onto the engine & fire.



Personally, if a DCP extinguisher is discharged in my engine bay, or inside the cab, I would be pushing the insurance company HARD for a complete write off. You will never get rid of the powder, and eventually, it WILL eat your wiring, rubber, plastics, stainless steel.....

LiamO
1st May 2014, 01:09 PM
Mounted in the rear covered by the cargo blind

dukemasterpro
1st May 2014, 04:52 PM
Bought the one that Drifta sell and it fits perfect in the passenger door cubby at the bottom. Smaller size so easy to store with a larger one in the tailgate of the camper trailer

BSM
2nd May 2014, 07:22 AM
Bought the one that Drifta sell and it fits perfect in the passenger door cubby at the bottom. Smaller size so easy to store with a larger one in the tailgate of the camper trailer

If by passenger door cubby, you mean the drink/wine bottle holder, I'd be concerned that the fire extinguisher is not restrained in that location and becomes a deadly projectile in a collision.

dukemasterpro
2nd June 2014, 08:12 PM
If by passenger door cubby, you mean the drink/wine bottle holder, I'd be concerned that the fire extinguisher is not restrained in that location and becomes a deadly projectile in a collision.


Late reply to this but we keep it stored horizontal the wine bottle slot has my wife's lotions and potions for the sun

dukemasterpro
2nd June 2014, 08:25 PM
If by passenger door cubby, you mean the drink/wine bottle holder, I'd be concerned that the fire extinguisher is not restrained in that location and becomes a deadly projectile in a collision.


Late reply to this but we keep it stored horizontal the wine bottle slot has my wife's lotions and potions for the sun

ADMIRAL
2nd June 2014, 08:48 PM
I bought an el-cheaply $15 powder type fire extinguisher from Aldi with the intention of mounting it down in the footwell forward of the drivers seat.

To my surprise there's no immediately obvious mounting point for these. (I have manual seats). After much faffing around looking for some clues from the UK forum I eventually turned to TOPIX, where I downloaded the instructions for fitting the OEM fire extinguisher.

Turns out ( according to the LR fitting instructions) that you mustn't mount the fire extinguisher in front of the drivers seat. It must be mounted instead in front of the passenger seat.

I suppose the thinking for this is that it restricts the drivers footspace, and could be dangerous. Is this normal practice? I've always placed them on the drivers side previously.

If you have the 1/3 - 2/3 seats in the rear, the extinguisher can also fit onto the front of the seat mount directly behind the driver. When you flip the seat up, the extinguisher moves with it and rolls forward and down. Yes the passenger in that seat cannot quite get their feet back as far as they used to, but they can still use the seat effectively. ( adults that is - kids probably won't even notice the difference ) The extinguisher is accessible and out of the way. Mine is a 1.5 kg dry powder.

Tombie
2nd June 2014, 10:27 PM
If you have the 1/3 - 2/3 seats in the rear, the extinguisher can also fit onto the front of the seat mount directly behind the driver. When you flip the seat up, the extinguisher moves with it and rolls forward and down. Yes the passenger in that seat cannot quite get their feet back as far as they used to, but they can still use the seat effectively. ( adults that is - kids probably won't even notice the difference ) The extinguisher is accessible and out of the way. Mine is a 2.5 kg dry powder.


A photo would be great!

BSM
3rd June 2014, 02:07 PM
A photo would be great!

Yes please. Can we have a photo Admiral? This sounds good.

AndyG
3rd June 2014, 02:46 PM
A friend has just imported a vehicle into NZ, from Japan. As part of the Rego process, the existing fire extinguisher had to be removed from the front passenger foot well. Not sure if Oz has similar restrictions.

ADMIRAL
3rd June 2014, 08:19 PM
I got the size on the extinguisher wrong. It is 1.5 kg, not 2.5kg. I will try to upload some pics. Apologies for the light. Not good in the garage at night, and not a lot of room to move around with a camera.
The odds n sods under the seat are my storage boxes.
You can mess around a bit trying to find a good compromise on position and restriction of the seat action.

78200

78201

78202

78203

78204

dick180641
3rd June 2014, 08:31 PM
Its gotta be OUTSIDE the vehicle....when your cars on fire the LAST place you need the extinguisher is inside WITH the fire!!
On the bull bar, roof rack, ladder, wheel arch, &tc. OR just inside the back door ( the last place to catch fire...generally!)

Bytemrk
3rd June 2014, 08:38 PM
Its gotta be OUTSIDE the vehicle....when your cars on fire the LAST place you need the extinguisher is inside WITH the fire!!
On the bull bar, roof rack, ladder, wheel arch, &tc. OR just inside the back door ( the last place to catch fire...generally!)

I think it depends on the situation.... if trapped in a vehicle that has caught fire.... personally I'd rather have it within reach in the drivers seat than be looking out the window at it my bull bar...

I can see arguments for both....but I'll stick to inside.

Mark

Basil135
3rd June 2014, 10:52 PM
Its gotta be OUTSIDE the vehicle....when your cars on fire the LAST place you need the extinguisher is inside WITH the fire!!
On the bull bar, roof rack, ladder, wheel arch, &tc. OR just inside the back door ( the last place to catch fire...generally!)

The place with the greatest chance of a fire starting, is under the bonnet.

If a hydraulic hose splits, and shoots oil onto a hot exhaust, smoke & flames will quite possibly follow shortly after.

Main type of fire inside the cabin, will be electrical, and all circuits are (or should be) protected by fuses. This, obviously, greatly reduces the chances of ignition.

So, having the extinguisher inside with you, within reach, is possibly going to save you valuable seconds.

Keep in mind that a 1.5kg is better than nothing at all, but they are a "one shot wonder" If you dont knock the fire out with it first go, then you wont have a second chance.

Lotz-A-Landies
4th June 2014, 10:05 AM
Has anyone had cause to (effectively) use an onboard fire extinguisher and if so, could you please outline the scenario?

The RFS people I've talked to thus far have been consistent in calling it a waste of time, argument being any car fire you come across will not be put out by a portable extinguisher.Yes in the days when you could use extinguishers that work, BCF. A VW bug with flames coming out from the engine compartment (rear) the BCF was discharged into the air intake till the flames disappeared and then the engine lid opened and the remains of the BCF discharged over the engine.

The only damage to the car were some burnt wires and scorching of the paint. More than that there was none of that burnt baked powder to clean away.

The owner's insurance company even paid for the cost of the extinguisher.

Also, IMHO, the comments from your firies is probably referring to a car already engulfed in flames. If you watch car fires ignite there is a period when there is merely a flicker of flame before catching a fuel source. It is in this period where an entinguisher can be of use. If you're out in the bush and see a flicker of flame are you going to throw your hands up in the air and say its no use the car is gone. I hardly think so.

With the radial engines in the WWII tanks, they have a habbit of flame out during initial starting, there is always a crew member with a CO2 extinguisher standing to the side. If the flame out happens it gets put out immediately, with the its no use philosophy we would have lost a $100,000 tank many times over. Same with antique aircraft.

Purnell's at Blakehurst suggest fitting the extinguisher in the drivers door with a velcro retaining strap. I use that space for my house keys so haven't taken up the idea but can see the merits.

Basil135
4th June 2014, 10:49 AM
Ahhhh BCF (Bromochlorodiflouromethane) Not Boating Camping Fishing.... ;)

One of the best extinguishing agents.

I believe they are now illegal to possess, let alone discharge, without a permit.

And VW fires were as special as the people that drove them... :cool:

Lotz-A-Landies
4th June 2014, 02:38 PM
...

And VW fires were as special as the people that drove them... :cool:T'was a nurse on the side of the road the car had just stopped.

ozscott
4th June 2014, 06:29 PM
Just think wherever you mount it the plastic arms will never hold it in a major head on...personally I wouldn't mount it on the passenger side of the cage. I just saw camel landy's post and agree.

Cheers

crawal
4th June 2014, 06:40 PM
The local wrecker has a D3 that suffered an engine fire , and mention " mate it happens to these things all the time"
Any one heard of this happening ?

benji
4th June 2014, 07:09 PM
A one shot wonder indeed, anything under 4 kg is!

I'll be putting mine on the lower tailgate soon. Right on the edge so it just clears the sealing rubber should be relatively out of the way.

I like the idea of putting them infront of the rear seat though.

Sent from my GT-I9305T using AULRO mobile app

discotwinturbo
4th June 2014, 07:31 PM
The local wrecker has a D3 that suffered an engine fire , and mention " mate it happens to these things all the time" Any one heard of this happening ?

Have not yet heard of it....so guess it does not happen all the time.

Have friends with D3's...not happened to them either.

He may drive a grenade or an oil burner, so bit of jealousy I guess.

Brett.....

phl
4th June 2014, 09:34 PM
Just think wherever you mount it the plastic arms will never hold it in a major head on...personally I wouldn't mount it on the passenger side of the cage. I just saw camel landy's post and agree.

Cheers

If you mean under the front seats, there is a metal cross-bar behind the plastic, or at least there is in mine. I know it's slack, but have mine zip tied to that metal cross-bar, albeit with two 75kg rated zip ties.

ozscott
5th June 2014, 07:40 PM
Mate I meant the usual plastic cradle for the 1kg bottles...even the stainless strap cradles are doubtful. You would hope the cams ones would hold but who knows...

Cheers

ozscott
5th June 2014, 07:41 PM
They dont catch on fire as often as Jeeps so that's a good thing.

Cheers

phl
5th June 2014, 09:40 PM
Ah! Mine, being 2.5kg, comes with a metal cage and cam to lock it in. The cam is a touch flimsy though, as it's rather thin steel.

ozscott
6th June 2014, 07:13 PM
Mate I was talking the CAMS (confederation of Australian motor sports) rated ones...sorry I wasn't clear.

Cheers

phl
6th June 2014, 09:19 PM
FWIW, mine is suppose to be CAMS rated, with the powder supposedly of a higher rating than the Bunnings job.

Basil135
8th June 2014, 10:03 PM
FWIW, mine is suppose to be CAMS rated, with the powder supposedly of a higher rating than the Bunnings job.

Any chance you could snap a pic of the label & post it up?

Just be interested to know what is in it.

Cheers

jon3950
9th June 2014, 04:26 PM
Here's an example from the weekend of just how effective "cams approved" fire extinguishers are. What started as an under-bonnet fire, quickly became this:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/06/1186.jpg


One 4kg fire bomb, two 1kg hand-held and one 2kg hand-held extinguishers later:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/06/1187.jpg


Fire bombs have to be FIA approved and use AFFF as the extinguishant. Hand-helds are just ABE to AS1841 - nothing special. The only thing cams requires above AS1841 for hand-helds is that the extinguisher must remain restrained under an acceleration of 25g (how they measure it is beyond me). Here's the link to schedule H of the cams manual if anyone is interested:

http://docs.cams.com.au/Manual/GeneralRequirements/GQ09-Schedule-H-2014-1.pdf

They are all pretty much useless, especially with anything turbocharged. All they are really designed to do is give you a little extra time to get out of the car.


Cheers,
Jon

~Rich~
9th June 2014, 04:49 PM
Would that be a "T Rex?" ( Toasted) :wasntme: