trailer wiring

[boardrider]

hi everyone,
i am still trying to resolve this issue.
i have now had my trailer wiring done as required thru the tow fuse box.
my problem is that the car does not seem to recognise a trailer connection.
i have come to this conclusion as the trailer symbol does not come on when the ignition is switched on. the auto electrician has now givern up and told me to take to someone else.another question that i would like answered is,does anyone know what fuse would be controlling the trailer symbol on the dash. thanks,i need this fixed
boardrider;)

[MR LR]

Has it got LED lights?

[jsp]

.
i have come to this conclusion as the trailer symbol does not come on when the ignition is switched on.

What sort of car is it?

my P38 and L322 rangies only show that symbol when the indicators are on - not just when ever a trailer is connected.

[boardrider]

yes its got leds and i have fitted the divice to help pulsing.
its an 08 d3 diesel

[MR LR]

Try it with a trailer that has indandescent lights and see how that goes.

[Gippslander]

i have two trailers one with incandescent bulbs and one with led's the cars see the incandescent trailer but not the led trailer.
Cars are D3 Disco and P38 Rangie hope that helps.

Gippy:)

[boardrider]

hi there,
i think people are misreading my post.
the car does not recognise the trailer,by the symbol on the dash when i plug in the connection.
i have 2 trailers,both have leds,they work fine. it does not show the trailer symbol on the dash at start up ,therefore i assume that the car does not know a trailer is connected and therefore make engine system adjustments as they are required.
thanks for your interest,just hoping someone does read this that knows why it is not recognising the trailer
thanks
boardrider:cool:

[boardrider]

gippy.
thanks for that suggestion of the incandecent bulb,i will c if i can find a trailer to try that,cheers
boardrider

[MR LR]

LED lights don't have a high enough resistance, if your ballast isn't good enough it still won't recognize the trailer as the resistance will be too low, the resistance is what triggers the trailer circuit, eliminate issues with the car by testing with traditional incandescent trailer lights, this should pick up on start up, and signal.

If it doesn't the car is the issue, I assume the lights work anyway?

[boardrider]

mr lr.
thanks for that.
that is now my next step,try with normal lights.
yes all the lights work fine,just the car is not recognising a trailer.as i have said both my trailers have led lights,now i need to find the right trailer to try on .if it is the car any suggestions where to look as the auto elec cant work it out to date
boardrider:cool:

[MR LR]

I'd bet a lot of money that it's not the car...

[Homestar]

I'll move this to the D3 section guys.

[Torero22]

mr lr.
thanks for that.
that is now my next step,try with normal lights.
yes all the lights work fine,just the car is not recognising a trailer.as i have said both my trailers have led lights,now i need to find the right trailer to try on .if it is the car any suggestions where to look as the auto elec cant work it out to date
boardrider:cool:

Hi Boardrider,

The question is why do you need the car to detect the trailer ?? Does this activate trailer stability ? If you help me understand why you need it, I can design something to activate it.

The reason why it is not being detected is resistance - or more precisely current draw. LEDs are very power efficient and draw a fraction of the current drawn by normal bulbs. So one solution is for you to put a normal bulb in the circuit used to detect the trailer.

There is a CD with all of the service manuals for LR up to D3 on ebay $30 I think. If you buy it and send it to me, I will send it back, I can look at the wiring diagrams and tell you what you have to do.

If you don't add a bulb, you can add a resistor to draw enough current to trigger the detection device. Its quiet simple to solve.

Gippslander in this thread gave you the answer as he has one trailer with LED & another with bulbs. The bulbs one works, but why do you need the little light on the dash to tell you, that you have a trailer in the back ? am I missing something ?

Regards
Tor

[Geedublya]

If you search the forum you will find lots of info on trailers and LED lights.

The D3 needs more than just resistors as it sends a pulse out regularly to check if the trailer is connected. This causes the LED indicator lights on the trailer to pulse even if a resistor is fitted. To get around it a relay is fitted which isn't energised by the pulses but is energised when the indicators operate, a resistor also needs to be fitted to fool the ECU into thinking a load is connected, when this is done correctly the trailer (green) light will flash on the dash when you use the indicators. The dash light does not operate at any other time.

[Torero22]

If you search the forum you will find lots of info on trailers and LED lights.

The D3 needs more than just resistors as it sends a pulse out regularly to check if the trailer is connected. This causes the LED indicator lights on the trailer to pulse even if a resistor is fitted. To get around it a relay is fitted which isn't energised by the pulses but is energised when the indicators operate, a resistor also needs to be fitted to fool the ECU into thinking a load is connected, when this is done correctly the trailer (green) light will flash on the dash when you use the indicators. The dash light does not operate at any other time.

You seem to know - why do you need the light on the dash to tell you, you have a trailer ?? Does the LR do something different when it detects the trailer??

as he said -- -- try this link http://www.labtronx.com.au/pulsebusta-mk3.htm

It seems like a pretty important addition to a LED based trailer

Quote:
The rear parking aid sensors can be disabled as well as the vehicle’s rear fog and reversing lights in order to eliminate reflected glare from the front of a trailer.
The Body Computer can communicate its trailer recognition to the following:
Suspension – at highway speeds automatic changes to ride height can be disabled to reduce the possibility of directional instability in the vehicle and trailer.
Anti-Lock Brakes, Stability and Traction Control – when in motion alternate strategies can be applied to control the dynamics of the vehicle and trailer.
Power Train Control – engine fuelling, throttle response, automatic transmission shift points, enhanced dynamic engine braking, etc. for the vehicle.
Trailer lighting –turn signals, park and/or brake LEDs on the trailer that were continuously blinking will no longer do so.

Tor

[Epic pooh]

Turns off the reverse parking sensors and other things such as trailer stability and things like that in later models. Also the light tells you that the trailer indicators are working.

[Torero22]

Found the circuit - as others have said the information is in the Forum, circuit and all. Pretty cheap to make.

Option 1) add it to each trailer
Option 2) in line plug-in
Option 3) Switchable unit at rear of car

parts should be approx 30 to $40.
Resistors at $10ea http://www.ebay.com/itm/12v-load-Resistor-for-LED-lamp-globe-replacements-Truck-Trailer-Caravan-Ute-Car-/331121598397?pt=Caravan_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4d18629fbd&vxp=mtr


Q & A:
1) Does this happens to the D4? - Answer: you get no pulsing as disc has LED tails, but trailer detection is an issue. so needed.
2) Resistance & wattage values of the resistors needed ? Answer: Most people use : 6 ohm, 50 Watt - some suggestions of 8 ohm being used this would reduce the heat.
2a) I will try and find out what the highest Ohm is acceptable - to reduce heat dissipation and need for heat sinks.
3) It sends pulses down both turn indicator circuits - I guess redundancy, in case one of the turn bulbs blow.

Cheers
Tor

[SBD4]

Yes this is an issue on the D4 though, not to the same extent as the D3. D4 issue can be solved by a resistor in parallel with the blinker circuits to provide the appropriate load.

PS Tor, there are solutions already provided for both vehicles.

[Torero22]

Yes this is an issue on the D4 though, not to the same extent as the D3. D4 issue can be solved by a resistor in parallel with the blinker circuits to provide the appropriate load.

PS Tor, there are solutions already provided for both vehicles.

Yes - thank you I have been reading up on the HUGE thread - this has caused some trouble for people - lol :Rolling:

[sniegy]

hi everyone,
i am still trying to resolve this issue.
i have now had my trailer wiring done as required thru the tow fuse box.
my problem is that the car does not seem to recognise a trailer connection.
i have come to this conclusion as the trailer symbol does not come on when the ignition is switched on. the auto electrician has now givern up and told me to take to someone else.another question that i would like answered is,does anyone know what fuse would be controlling the trailer symbol on the dash. thanks,i need this fixed
boardrider;)
Hey Boardrider,
Re-reading your thread & this is just from what you have written.

The Trailer Icon does NOT stay illuminated. It just flashes when indicators are selected to let you know you have a working indicator.
There is no fuse that operates the trailer icon either it is part of the Instrument Pack ECU.

The easiest check to see if your trailer has been recognised is to connect your trailer & select reverse. If the park sensors are not working then the vehicle knows there is a trailer there. The icon flashing will be a wiring issue. To rectify this either one of these units will suffice, Linear Electronic Design | Home (http://www.linearelectronicdesign.com) PulseBusta Mk3 (http://www.labtronx.com.au/pulsebusta-mk3.htm)

Can you also explain what you mean by "I have had my trailer wiring done thru the fuse box mean" it may give some more depth as what has been done to the wiring.

Any auto elec should have a trailer board you can plug in & check, If your in Melb drop in & we can plug in & have a quick idea of what is happening.

Cheers

[boardrider]

torero and pete and others.
thanks so much for all your imput.
the trailer icon does not appear at all,nor does it blink.
i have the linear electronic device fitted with a switch ,on for towing,off for normal,appears to make no difference.
the wiring for the brake and tail light are now thru the towing fuse box in the rear,
i have the wiring diagram for the car and show to the auto elec,he could not see why it was not responding.
i cannot test with car in reverse as i have a kaymar rear bar with wheel carrier and the park assist do not like this as they cannot be switched off unless i disconnect the beeper,which is what has been done.
so from what i have read in the replies am i right in saying that a resistor need to be installed.
thanks so much for the help as i want this sorted
boardrider

[SBD4]

You say you have the Linear electronics box installed, this all you need to solve your issues on the D3.

It should be on when using a trailer with LEDs and off otherwise.

If it is not working I would try the following:

try the switch in both positions in case it is wired in opposite to what you expect
verify the unit is wired in correctly
verify the device is not faulty


Again, you should not need anything else if you have this device installed.

EDIT: let us know that you verified that the trailer dash light does not flash when you indicate.
As Pete said earlier, the light does not come on otherwise. from the manual:

The trailer warning indicator lamp illuminates as a bulb check when the
ignition is turned on and extinguishes when the engine is started.
If the lamp does not flash with the direction indicators, the trailer bulb may be faulty.

[Scary]

I have a pulse buster on the Camper Trailer that we used with the D3 (Because of LED Trailer Lights) - I have just bought a D4 - do I still run the pulse buster? or do the D4's pick up the LED's?

[Torero22]

torero and pete and others.
thanks so much for all your imput.
the trailer icon does not appear at all,nor does it blink.
i have the linear electronic device fitted with a switch ,on for towing,off for normal,appears to make no difference.
the wiring for the brake and tail light are now thru the towing fuse box in the rear,
i have the wiring diagram for the car and show to the auto elec,he could not see why it was not responding.
i cannot test with car in reverse as i have a kaymar rear bar with wheel carrier and the park assist do not like this as they cannot be switched off unless i disconnect the beeper,which is what has been done.
so from what i have read in the replies am i right in saying that a resistor need to be installed.
thanks so much for the help as i want this sorted
boardrider

If you have a device, then take pictures to help us help you - too many variables to consider.

If you can take the lid of the device, then more pictures please of the guts !

Sounds like you have a wiring fault.

Another thing I am surprised about is that your reverse sensors do not work with the Kaymar bar - I have seen these working on a D3 with kaymar. I suspect you have been seeing someone who doesn't really know what they are doing. Again my 2 cents worth, but it sounds like a plausible root cause of some of your troubles..............

Tor

[SBD4]

I have a pulse buster on the Camper Trailer that we used with the D3 (Because of LED Trailer Lights) - I have just bought a D4 - do I still run the pulse buster? or do the D4's pick up the LED's?

Scary, If you don't have the pulse buster, you'll still need the resistors in parallel to the trailer indicators.

[Basil135]

Lets see if we can clear this up a bit.

For starters, if your trailer has incandescent bulbs, then you don't need to do anything. The resistance that these bulbs produce, is enough for the cars to recognise that the trailer is connected.

So, if you have LED's on your trailer, then:

D3 - you might need a Pulsebuster or similar item. Basically the resistors & relays. The D3 sends a continual pulse down the line to check the trailer is still connected.

D4 - you only need a resistor across ONE of the indicator circuits, say the right turn for instance. Connect trailer, flick right indicator on, trailer light blinks in time on the dash, and the car knows the trailer is there.


NOW - common to both:

You do not NEED to add anything, even if you have LED's on the trailer. If, for instance, your towing consists of taking the 6 x 4 to the tip once every couple of months, then I wouldn't bother.

If you have a camper or are towing a bit more, or with heavy loads, then sure, you might want to get something arranged.



Lets put some of these into context:

Quote:
The rear parking aid sensors can be disabled as well as the vehicle’s rear fog and reversing lights in order to eliminate reflected glare from the front of a trailer. Parking sensors yes. Or, you can push the button. Why would you have your fog lights on anyway, when they are in the bumper & wont be seen if you have a trailer connected?
The Body Computer can communicate its trailer recognition to the following:
Suspension – at highway speeds automatic changes to ride height can be disabled to reduce the possibility of directional instability in the vehicle and trailer. Ummm. What speed does a D4 drop at? 160 kmh or similar?
Anti-Lock Brakes, Stability and Traction Control – when in motion alternate strategies can be applied to control the dynamics of the vehicle and trailer. Yes - the cars have a "Trailer Dynamic Stability Control program. Again, only really comes into play at higher speeds, and with higher loads.
Power Train Control – engine fuelling, throttle response, automatic transmission shift points, enhanced dynamic engine braking, etc. for the vehicle.This I don't know about for certain. But, I doubt it would make any difference on the D3 / D4
Trailer lighting –turn signals, park and/or brake LEDs on the trailer that were continuously blinking will no longer do so.Applicable for the D3. But, thats what you bought the box for anyway.



Boardrider - Before you go spending more time chasing this, drop into an auto electrician, or your local dealer, and get them to check with a lighting board. I would guess they have both incandescent & LED boards, so should be able to sort out what is going on pretty quick.

[SBD4]

Basil, a couple of things, you only get the button to disable sensors if you have front sensors too, so annoying if you cant switch them off, the trailer stability program is active from 60kph and yes it does make the adaptions to the "power train" as described.

[Basil135]

Basil, a couple of things, you only get the button to disable sensors if you have front sensors too, so annoying if you cant switch them off, the trailer stability program is active from 60kph and yes it does make the adaptions to the "power train" as described.

Thanks for that. Wasn't sure if the button was standard on all fitments or not. Mine has it, so presumed it was.

The trailer stability program is a great thing. I have seen it in action, on a couple of videos. My thinking was that if you have a lightly loaded 6 x 4, using it around town, then I doubt you would notice that behind the car.

And thanks. I didn't realise the cars were "that" smart to be able to adapt the powertrain as well. Learn something new every day.

[Meken]

Lets see if we can clear this up a bit.















Boardrider - Before you go spending more time chasing this, drop into an auto electrician, or your local dealer, and get them to check with a lighting board. I would guess they have both incandescent & LED boards, so should be able to sort out what is going on pretty quick.


Not necessarily so. Local dealer plugged in his led trailer lights test board to our vehicle after I had a bit of trouble with the trailer module & the linear elec box. Their led test light box worked fine no pulsing & recognised by car (without the linear elec box connected) . Get it home and plug in the van - no go still pulsing & not recognised :(

[Scary]

Double Post

[Scary]

Scary, If you don't have the pulse buster, you'll still need the resistors in parallel to the trailer indicators.
I still have the pulse buster - fitted to the camper trailer so all should be good then Cheers

I would have thought that as the D4 runs LED tail Lights they might have sorted out the trailer wiring to pick up LED's

[boardrider]

hi everyone.
to all who have contributed in this post.
update.
i think it might now be resolved,i have had great communication with the led module supplier.it was suggested the wiring including the turn indicators must be wired thru the landrover towing trailer wiring supply.
i have done this now and the icon on the dash now blinks when indicators are on and module is switched on.
when not towing switch off module.
i also had to reverse the wiring for the module as when installed would not work.as per their instructions
next thing will be to put the van on and see if it makes any difference.i hope so.anyway thanks for the advise along the way,it did help
boardrider:)