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debruiser
18th May 2014, 12:23 PM
Just heard on the grapevine from someone who wasn't sure about rules. He thought that the use of copper brake lines was no longer allowed. And that I should use steel lines now.

Can someone let me know if this is right or not? I am about to order a brake line kit for my 1975 SWB - putting a dual line system in it too! :D

Phil B
18th May 2014, 12:40 PM
You are correct. Copper is not legal, have to be steel.
Watch out for the brake pipe kits from the UK. Their rules are different and the kits on Ebay are copper.
Best way is to get the pipes made up to a wire template at a brake fitter.

Phil.

debruiser
18th May 2014, 12:57 PM
Thanks Phil,

is that just a nsw thing or a Oz thing?

JDNSW
18th May 2014, 01:01 PM
They can't be copper, but they can be a special copper alloy that does not work harden. This is available, and can be supplied by at least some brake and hydraulic specialists. It looks much the same as copper but is marked along its length at close intervals, although I can't remember what the marking is.

John

chazza
18th May 2014, 01:05 PM
The regulations vary from State to State.

Ring an engineer in the Qld licencing Dept and ask them; if you want the most accurate answer,

Cheers Charlie

debruiser
18th May 2014, 01:10 PM
Ok, I'll just assume the worst then. :(

I guess at least I heard about it before I bought the kit and spent big $$ on it, then had to rip it all out and throw it away.

Thanks for your help guys. I'll be looking at prices on benders, flaring tools, pipe and fittings. Is there a standard fitting that I need? it's not the same all over the car is it....

JDNSW
18th May 2014, 01:16 PM
...... Is there a standard fitting that I need? it's not the same all over the car is it....

No, and furthermore, the threads vary with when the vehicle was made. As many parts are interchangeable between models, you need to check what is actually required on the hydraulic fittings you actually are using. UNF is probably the most common, but Series 1 is mostly BSF and some Series 3 or recent "pattern" parts are likely to be metric. A thread gauge is probably a good investment!

John

debruiser
18th May 2014, 01:28 PM
No, and furthermore, the threads vary with when the vehicle was made. As many parts are interchangeable between models, you need to check what is actually required on the hydraulic fittings you actually are using. UNF is probably the most common, but Series 1 is mostly BSF and some Series 3 or recent "pattern" parts are likely to be metric. A thread gauge is probably a good investment!

John

thanks....

WHY DO THEY MAKE IT SO HARD! lol.

I've got a 75 SWB with brakes from a 78 LWB 1ton going on it. SO really i've got a 78 Lwb :) I will see if I have a thread gauge that is appropriate.

debruiser
18th May 2014, 01:57 PM
So quickly measured some brakes lines - 5mm is what I got. Whats that in imperial? yes i know it's 0.196 850 393 7 inch but is that considered 3/16?

goingbush
18th May 2014, 03:07 PM
Just heard on the grapevine from someone who wasn't sure about rules. He thought that the use of copper brake lines was no longer allowed. And that I should use steel lines now.


Copper has never been legal as far as I know, (in Victoria anyway) when I was rebuilding my first Landrover in the early 80's I had to use steel back then !!

russellrovers
18th May 2014, 03:12 PM
[QUOTE=debruiser;2148387]Just heard on the grapevine from someone who wasn't sure about rules. He thought that the use of copper brake lines was no longer allowed. And that I should use steel lines now.

Can someone let me know if this is right or not? I am about to order a brake line kit for my 1975 SWB - putting a dual line system in it too! :D[/QUOTE no copper you can use but your insurance falls away jim

debruiser
18th May 2014, 03:17 PM
apparently it is.... unfortunately

schuy1
18th May 2014, 03:18 PM
I think the metal for regulation brake lines at a min is Cupru nickle, which is a copper alloy that takes bends, does not work harden, double flares without splittting and has a high burst pressure. Steel lines in smaller diam tend to kink on bending short and are harder to double flare. I am pretty sure landybitz on Evil bay has the Cupro lines sets. I very much doubt you could sell copper lines as brake lines in Australia.
Your '76 / '78 will be a mix of unf and metric! :D Its around the change over for landrover, but they still had drums of unf stuff for some things wit the odd bsf too! :D
Is that the SWB you got from rangitragic at Marybourgh?
Cheers Scott

debruiser
18th May 2014, 03:23 PM
thanks for that scott, i'll have a look.

No it's not for that one... dad is working on that one, i'm not sure what he's up to with brake lines so far. I have my own beasty that I'm working on... it's getting a few more goodies. look it up - thread is called Nicks 75 SWB or something like that

schuy1
18th May 2014, 04:23 PM
Oki :) was not sure which it was. I would double check the road worthy side of the brake line material any way, just to be sure.
Found this Vehicle Standard (Australian Design Rule 35/05 – Commercial Vehicle Brake Systems) 2013
4.1.6. All components and devices in the ‘Brake System’ must meet or exceed at least one appropriate and recognized international, national or association standard, where such standards exist, or the relevant parts thereof. ‘Recognized’ can be taken to include SA, SAE, BS, JIS, DIN, performance and design related ISO standards and UNECE standards.
Dunno if thats of help or hindrance! :D
Cheers Scott

JDNSW
18th May 2014, 04:24 PM
So quickly measured some brakes lines - 5mm is what I got. Whats that in imperial? yes i know it's 0.196 850 393 7 inch but is that considered 3/16?

Almost certainly meant to be 3/16". Some pipes such as reservoir to M/C are 1/4", but if you are going dual you won't have that.

John

JDNSW
18th May 2014, 04:32 PM
thanks....

WHY DO THEY MAKE IT SO HARD! lol.

I've got a 75 SWB with brakes from a 78 LWB 1ton going on it. SO really i've got a 78 Lwb :) I will see if I have a thread gauge that is appropriate.

It is the result of changes of recognised thread standards from BS to Unified, to metric, all during the production of what is essentially the same vehicle. Probably wouold have helped if they had used Unified threads from the start, but while these existed in 1948, hardly anyone in Britain had the tooling to make them.

And for parts that come from third party suppliers, such as brakes, Rover probably had to accept changes when the suppliers decided to make them - which would have been when the big car manufacturers changed! For their own bits, keeping parts backward compatible was a policy pretty much until the end of Series 3, leading to the retention of a few BSF (and many Unified) threads until then.

John

goingbush
18th May 2014, 07:50 PM
this might help, Mokes are the same as Landrovers as far as brakes are concerned
Making Brake Lines - MokeWerx - The Australian Moke Site (http://www.moke.com.au/in-the-garage/repairs/87-making-brake-lines)