Abbot Point coal terminal

[Chucaro]

Great news as far as I am concerned, we need more ethical investors like them were the environment is more important than greed for money.

Deutsche Bank rules out funding for controversial Abbot Point coal terminal (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-05-23/deutsche-bank-abbot-point-coal-terminal/5473614)

[bob10]

Just wondering if it could have something to do with the $300 billion dollar gas deal between Russia & China. It would be a first, a bank with a social conscience .Bob :D

[Chucaro]

Just wondering if it could have something to do with the $300 billion dollar gas deal between Russia & China. It would be a first, a bank with a social conscience .Bob :D

I am a bit cynical and perhaps it have something to do with the price of coal ;)
In any case it is good for the reef providing that do not come another greedy lender and chip in with money.

[ramblingboy42]

well, I daresay Clive and Gina...even though they don't like each other , could reach a deal with the current queensland and federal government and broker some foreign banking organisation , in the name of prosperity and of course jobs, jobs, jobs.....it's really all about the Gallilee basin coal.

[Tank]

well, I daresay Clive and Gina...even though they don't like each other , could reach a deal with the current queensland and federal government and broker some foreign banking organisation , in the name of prosperity and of course jobs, jobs, jobs.....it's really all about the Gallilee basin coal.
Yes it is certainly about jobs, hundreds of thousands of jobs in Tourism all along the full length of the Great Barrier Reef, Regards Frank.

[Chucaro]

.......and many of that jobs will be for the Visa 457 holders.

[UncleHo]

The Tourism jobs might ot have a lot of 457's but the mining jobs etc. would!

[Hymie]

Well to be realistic, it's a bit of a joke a bank advertising it's not going to lend money to somebody that hasn't even applied for it in my opinion.

[Chucaro]

Well to be realistic, it's a bit of a joke a bank advertising it's not going to lend money to somebody that hasn't even applied for it in my opinion.

Well then what it is this back in October 15, 2013?

COMMONWEALTH Bank of Australia, Deutsche Bank and Westpac have been appointed as joint lead managers for $1.25 billion of debt issuance which will help refinance Adani Abbot Point Terminal, a person familiar with the matter said (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/mining-energy/banks-appointed-on-adani-abbott-point-debt-issue/story-e6frg9df-1226740165990)

[Hymie]

Well then what it is this back in October 15, 2013?

COMMONWEALTH Bank of Australia, Deutsche Bank and Westpac have been appointed as joint lead managers for $1.25 billion of debt issuance which will help refinance Adani Abbot Point Terminal, a person familiar with the matter said (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/mining-energy/banks-appointed-on-adani-abbott-point-debt-issue/story-e6frg9df-1226740165990)

2 seperate matters.
One was refinancing a debt.
The other was financing an expansion.
Deutsche Banks quote was , "Since our guidance requires such a consensus as a minimum, we would not consider a financing request."

[Chucaro]

How do you know that an application was not served?
It was not the case that an application was served and due to the leak of the information a massive collection of signatures in Germany forced the bank to reconsidering it?

[ramblingboy42]

Great news as far as I am concerned, we need more ethical investors like them were the environment is more important than greed for money.

Deutsche Bank rules out funding for controversial Abbot Point coal terminal (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-05-23/deutsche-bank-abbot-point-coal-terminal/5473614)

I have some money invested in Deutsche, which returns a handsome dividend.

It makes me feel a bit warmer towards them when they are showing ethics.

[Hymie]

IIn a statement, the company said there was speculation that it was the "most likely" bank to fund the expansion.

However, it said it would not finance an expansion without the assurance of both the Government and UNESCO that it would not damage the Great Barrier Reef.


How do you know that an application was not served?
It was not the case that an application was served and due to the leak of the information a massive collection of signatures in Germany forced the bank to reconsidering it?

I'm just getting my information from the articles you are posting.
You see, I'm actually reading the articles and not just selectively grabbing the headlines.
Maybe you could try doing that? Things sort of snap into focus when you do.

[DiscoMick]

The federal government should never have approved dumping the dredging spoil in the water instead of on the land. Just irresponsible IMO. If it went on land there would be far less concern about it.

Sent from my GT-P5210 using AULRO mobile app

[BMKal]

IIn a statement, the company said there was speculation that it was the "most likely" bank to fund the expansion.

However, it said it would not finance an expansion without the assurance of both the Government and UNESCO that it would not damage the Great Barrier Reef.



I'm just getting my information from the articles you are posting.
You see, I'm actually reading the articles and not just selectively grabbing the headlines.
Maybe you could try doing that? Things sort of snap into focus when you do.

Yep - I too find it amusing that the usual group on here are quick to post links to articles with attention grabbing headlines, but then don't seem capable of reading the content.

Like all the usual ill informed lot who seem to think that the 457 visa issue is predominantly the realm of the mining industry - but they don't seem capable of reading fully the article that they posted a link to - where it shows the following -

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/05/264.jpg

Not much mention of the mining industry in that lot ............... ;)

Interestingly, the same article also quotes Barry Fitzgerald (head man at Gina's Roy Hill Project) saying "Barry Fitzgerald, backed away from using foreign workers on 457 visas, saying he was confident he could find the staff locally".

Yet according to some on here - it's all Gina's and Clive's doing. :o

I was at Roy Hill recently - they must be doing a really good job of "hiding" all their 457 visa workers. ;)

Still - don't let the facts get in the way of a good story ...................... :p

[ramblingboy42]

None of those mines are at operational status yet.

Roy Hill is operating under some sort of exploratory or trial basis.

We don't really know what the required number of personnel will be yet.

Will their rear dumps or whatever they choose to use be remote controlled?

The logistics and personnel involved to get coal from the Gallilee Basin to the port facility are absolutley mind boggling.

The 3 'major' contenders.....and I believe there are 7 applications.....will need to employ about 10,000 people across the board to get the coal onto ships.

I don't really think enough australians will step up to the plate to enable this to happen without some manpower from 'outside'.

I have just spent a bit over 2 years in the coal and have seen the whole operation from the pit to the port in that time.

If anyone doubts or wants an idea of the logistics and required personnel I'm happy to put up some outlines.

[Hymie]

None of those mines are at operational status yet.

Roy Hill is operating under some sort of exploratory or trial basis.

We don't really know what the required number of personnel will be yet.

Will their rear dumps or whatever they choose to use be remote controlled?

The logistics and personnel involved to get coal from the Gallilee Basin to the port facility are absolutley mind boggling.

The 3 'major' contenders.....and I believe there are 7 applications.....will need to employ about 10,000 people across the board to get the coal onto ships.

I don't really think enough australians will step up to the plate to enable this to happen without some manpower from 'outside'.

I have just spent a bit over 2 years in the coal and have seen the whole operation from the pit to the port in that time.

If anyone doubts or wants an idea of the logistics and required personnel I'm happy to put up some outlines.

Need any Tubies and Instros yet?

[bob10]

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/05/264.jpg





...................... :p


And that is exactly the point. This thread should be about nurses, but any 457 worker who is filling a position an Australian could, leaves another young person out of a job. The usual obdurate deniers have joined in to add their spin, against all evidence. Situation normal, I guess. Bob [ I'd add a smilie, but it is really nothing to smile about.]


Lateline - 23/05/2014: Nurses cant find jobs (http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2014/s4011254.htm)

[Tank]

Yep - I too find it amusing that the usual group on here are quick to post links to articles with attention grabbing headlines, but then don't seem capable of reading the content.

Like all the usual ill informed lot who seem to think that the 457 visa issue is predominantly the realm of the mining industry - but they don't seem capable of reading fully the article that they posted a link to - where it shows the following -

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/05/264.jpg

Not much mention of the mining industry in that lot ............... ;)

Interestingly, the same article also quotes Barry Fitzgerald (head man at Gina's Roy Hill Project) saying "Barry Fitzgerald, backed away from using foreign workers on 457 visas, saying he was confident he could find the staff locally".

Yet according to some on here - it's all Gina's and Clive's doing. :o

I was at Roy Hill recently - they must be doing a really good job of "hiding" all their 457 visa workers. ;)

Still - don't let the facts get in the way of a good story ...................... :p
Well Brian why are Gina and Chevron pushing Abbot to scrap the "Skills requirement", wouldn't be because they want more 457 workers on their sites? Regards Frank.

[bob10]

Well, this looks like a rort to me, whatever industry you work for. This never would have happened under Menzies, or Curtin. Bob


Rort fears as 457 visa loophole reopened (http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/rort-fears-as-457-visa-loophole-reopened-20140311-34kgr.html)

[ramblingboy42]

what will they gain from that? non union labour?

[BMKal]

Well Brian why are Gina and Chevron pushing Abbot to scrap the "Skills requirement", wouldn't be because they want more 457 workers on their sites? Regards Frank.

Who knows what their motives are Frank. I'm just re-posting the numbers already linked to by a number of people in the other thread - which clearly dispute the inferences made by some that the mining industry is the one that is "driving" the 457 visa issue. If the numbers above are correct, then those claims are clearly baseless.

Personally, I don't agree with 457 visas at all. I'd rather see the positions filled by Australian trained people any time - but there are obviously some cases where that is just not achievable. Other than for specific skills and qualifications that we just don't have here (as in a couple of specific examples quoted by people on here) - I don't think we should have this system at all.

As to the claim that mining companies have stopped employing FIFO workers and are replacing them with 457 visa employees - I don't know what's happening over in the eastern states, but I can assure you that this is definitely not the case over here. I would be surprised if it is the case anywhere - in fact I have recently read reports of at least one coal mine over in the east which is being heavily criticized for building / establishing camps and employing FIFO workers from the cities and not giving the local residents (many of whom were already working in the same mine until it closed and then re-opened) the opportunity.

Regarding Roy Hill - Barry Fitzgerald has said that he believes he can fill all the positions there from within Australia. I would tend to believe him before any of the beat up's in the media based on Gina's ravings. I know Barry - he used to be my boss in a previous position. You can probably guess - I'm not a fan of Gina (or Clive either for that matter). But fortunately, what they say in public is usually not what really happens - even on their own minesites. ;)

[Chucaro]

IIn a statement, the company said there was speculation that it was the "most likely" bank to fund the expansion.

However, it said it would not finance an expansion without the assurance of both the Government and UNESCO that it would not damage the Great Barrier Reef.



I'm just getting my information from the articles you are posting.
You see, I'm actually reading the articles and not just selectively grabbing the headlines.
Maybe you could try doing that? Things sort of snap into focus when you do.

I am sick of smart arse comments, just because I have interpreted the article in a different way it does not mean that I have not read it :mad:
In my interpretation when the articles in the web are saying, quote:
Deutsche was targeted for its role, with the Commonwealth Bank and Westpac, in refinancing a $1.25bn loan to Adani to buy a 99-year lease on the Abbot Point terminal from the Queensland government in 2011. end of quote
If the bank was targeted it is because at the very least initial approaches were taken place or the institution was considered as an investor.

[bob10]

what will they gain from that? non union labour?


And that is the end game. Bob

[AndyG]

We currently have a system where a very large number of Australians work overseas. If you follow the logic of no 457, the corollary is no foreign work for ozzies.

What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

[bob10]

We currently have a system where a very large number of Australians work overseas. If you follow the logic of no 457, the corollary is no foreign work for ozzies.

What's good for the goose is good for the gander.


That is a very simplistic viewpoint. No one is suggesting companies that can not find qualified people in Australia to fill positions, should not use the 457 visa to do so. The problem is ,certain companies are rorting the system, importing 457 visa workers, paying them less than award wages, and conditions . Evidence suggests that certain companies do not even advertise in Australia for these positions. When the 457 visa excludes Australian workers from Australian jobs, I say to you, that is wrong. Bob

[frantic]

We currently have a system where a very large number of Australians work overseas. If you follow the logic of no 457, the corollary is no foreign work for ozzies.

What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

Hmm, 30 seconds of google:
http://www.workpermit.com/uk/uk.htm
Guess what, UK has 2 types of visa, holiday workers, under 30 and the second is skilled sponsored, that have to be a position no local can fill, but here's the killer, it has an upper limit OF TWENTY THOUSAND! .
Not the 120,000 we bring here in a country with less than 1/3 the population!