Best way to start in below freezing temps?

[schmoogene]

Hi all

We're going up to Perisher soon. Last time we were there, we left the car for a week... completely exposed to the elements. When I started it, it blew out heaps of smoke with roughish idle and then ran smoothly after that.

Is this normal and should I do anything different? Never seen so much smoke on a start up before or since.

2008 TDV6 D3

Cheers people!!!
Hooge

[snowbound]

Hey! It started, you got to be happy with that! :D

[camel_landy]

It started and now it's running smoothly... It was just cold, poor love. :D

M

[Homestar]

Try starting a K50 Cummins V16 when it's below zero - more smoke than a steam train pulling up a hill...:D

Some years ago, I was assisting with a test of a 6B Cummins that was in a -18 degree C test chamber in the piece of equipment needing to be tested for world wide conditions. With the correct oil in the sump, it started, blew a lot of smoke, rattled then threw a leg out of bed.... Oops....

Boss wasn't happy I put a cross in the box for 'Extreme cold start' :D

[Meken]

Alpine diesel?? & a blankey

[sniegy]

Fill the fuel tank with Alpine Diesel at the resort (as the resorts have their tanks filled with Alpine Diesel & you can't get it locally).
Drive with the tank that will get you there with 10 or so Litres left & then fill it at the Resort.

Also what Meken said Take a blanket & cover the engine bay. Just don't forget it is there when you leave. Sticky note on the steering wheel. :p

Cheers

[JamesH]

When you start the car in very cold weather are you supposed to push the start button with foot off the brake to get the ignition to warm the glow-plugs before pushing a 2nd time?

A couple of times Ive seen the glow-plug symbol light up and wondered if I had done the wrong thing.

Yes, I can read my handbook but it is out there in the cold in the car and I am in here in the warm...

[SBD4]

When you start the car in very cold weather are you supposed to push the start button with foot off the brake to get the ignition to warm the glow-plugs before pushing a 2nd time?

A couple of times Ive seen the glow-plug symbol light up and wondered if I had done the wrong thing.

Yes, I can read my handbook but it is out there in the cold in the car and I am in here in the warm...

James, the car takes care of it. It will not kick the engine over until the glow plugs are up to temp. Just hold the button in and when it's ready it will start.

[tiddy]

Depending on which way your going there, Alpine diesel is available in Canberra & in Cooma, that will assist.

[irondoc]

When I was in Lithgow last year and went to strat the car, a message came up on the dash saying something like "delay for cold start" or "wait for cold start" or something similar

[jonesy63]

James, the car takes care of it. It will not kick the engine over until the glow plugs are up to temp. Just hold the button in and when it's ready it will start.

I'm pretty sure that statement is true for a D4. IIRC, with a D3, you're meant to hold the key to "on" and wait until the glow plug light goes out - before moving to start position.

[Bigbjorn]

Give it a good sniff of ether down the air intake. We couldn't start the Cummins NTA-420's in Autocars in a hard Melbourne winter morning without and then they ran on varying numbers of cylinders, blew clouds and rings of fuel smoke until they warmed up. God knows how they got them running in Minnesota or the Dakotas.

All else fails hold a burning fuel soaked singlet over the air intake. This is how old diesel tractors used to get started up on the Darling Downs in winter.

[Piddler]

Depending on which way your going there, Alpine diesel is available in Canberra & in Cooma, that will assist.


I would fill up in Jindabyne before you head up the hill. That's the closest Alpine Diesel and your tank will have the least in it when you fill.

Cheers

[Dougal]

Fill the fuel tank with Alpine Diesel at the resort (as the resorts have their tanks filled with Alpine Diesel & you can't get it locally).
Drive with the tank that will get you there with 10 or so Litres left & then fill it at the Resort.

Also what Meken said Take a blanket & cover the engine bay. Just don't forget it is there when you leave. Sticky note on the steering wheel. :p

Cheers

What is the blanket going to do? There is no heat to hold in. It'll all be at ambient temp.

[solmanic]

If you're after alpine diesel and don't want to get raped by the bowser then fill up at give Caltex Woolworths in Cooma. It's just off Sharp St and a lot of tourists miss it and end up selling their kids for fuel in Jindabyne.

[Jojo]

How cold does it get?!? In a decently serviced truck with a good battery you won't have to worry. Especially with a modern engine that does it all on its own. As for the blanket, forget it.

[123rover50]

What is the blanket going to do? There is no heat to hold in. It'll all be at ambient temp.

I dunno:(
Back when I was a kid living near your location, people used to put a blanket over the tractor or car bonnet and wrap the exposed house water pipes with lagging etc to stop them freezing. Seemed to work.
I get you point about ambient temps but the frost seems to come from above.
Some of the orchards burnt waste oil in pots to create a smoke cloud to stop the frost coming down to damage the fruit.
Do they still do that?

[Bluepippa]

For 20+ years while living in Europe and spending weeks at a time in the snow! I never had a problem with any of my cars... Just have a great time and don't worry... My D4 will be in Thredbo from this weekend for a week and I'm not worried in the slightest :-)

[Bluepippa]

79600
Not a Landy, but a standard diesel and no worries starting after a week standing still !!

[Dougal]

I dunno:(
Back when I was a kid living near your location, people used to put a blanket over the tractor or car bonnet and wrap the exposed house water pipes with lagging etc to stop them freezing. Seemed to work.
I get you point about ambient temps but the frost seems to come from above.
Some of the orchards burnt waste oil in pots to create a smoke cloud to stop the frost coming down to damage the fruit.
Do they still do that?

If it's an overnight frost then yes any insulation can help. Normally with hard frosts here we've got a clear sky and can put on 20C when the sun comes up. Swings from -10C to +10C and back again are great fun.:eek:

Thankfully those days of hore-frost, being below zero and under cloud for days on end aren't that common outside July:
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachments/isuzu-landy-enthusiasts-section/26618d1277947692-t25-boost-response-img_4058.jpg

But at altitude you're going to be below zero the whole time and it'll be cold-soaked to the same temp throughout.

My 4BD1T without glowplugs starts in -10C as long as the batteries are good. You need extra throttle to keep it going for the first few minutes though.
My Nissan work car with working glow-plugs coughs white smoke at startup even at 10C. I think one or two cylinders have lost compression.
My VAG 2.0tdi doesn't even use the glow-plugs until close to zero. Starts second cylinder.

Any modern engine should be fine down to about -15C with no pre-cautions. Provided your battery is in excellent condition.
Occupants, well they start to suffer at warmer temps.

Does a D4 have an electric boost element in the heater box? All VAG cars have space for one.

*edit*
Oh yeah, the frost-pots.
Illegal now for pollution reasons, but I do remember them when I was younger. In the early 80's all orchardists switched to overhead sprinkler frost protection (only needed once blossom comes out in September). All the vine-yards and orchards on higher ground are running diesel powered wind-mills for protection from mild frosts. Vineyards pull helicopters in for more major frost protection to mix up the layer of cold air against the ground.

But I have heard of one small orchard away from others still using frost-pots.

[ytt105]

Filled up with 'alpine' diesel last night at the Woolies on the Monaro Hgy at Hume.

So, yes it is available in Canberra if you know where to look.

[letherm]

Does a D4 have an electric boost element in the heater box? All VAG cars have space for one.


I believe that Australian D4's don't have a diesel pre-heater. It normally sits in front of the battery where there is a square hole in the wheel arch.

[FeatherWeightDriver]

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachments/isuzu-landy-enthusiasts-section/26617d1277947672-t25-boost-response-img_4050.jpg


Off topic but what's that on the road in front of the car? Looks like ET?!?!?!?! :eek:

[Dougal]

I believe that Australian D4's don't have a diesel pre-heater. It normally sits in front of the battery where there is a square hole in the wheel arch.

The diesel preheater (webasto or fbh) is different again. I really want one of those. Considering buying one off eBay.

The electric element sits in the heater box and provides fast heat for defrost and comfort once the engine is running.






Off topic but what's that on the road in front of the car? Looks like ET?!?!?!?! :eek:

Frost moa.

[Meken]

The blanket was a joke - more for the driver ...

[Celtoid]

Off topic but what's that on the road in front of the car? Looks like ET?!?!?!?! :eek:

Looks like a fisherman walking up the road with an oncoming giant Discovery :-)

[Dougal]

The blanket was a joke - more for the driver ...

I put a joke up on Pirate about fitting LT230 internals to an altas transfer case and using a pajero super-select lever to give you rwd, fwd, locked 4wd or full-time 4wd.

The target believed it.:o

[Ben_Vapid]

I was buried last year up at Hotham and it took a good few tries for it to kick over, went into engine fault and eventually kicked over with a heap of smoke, and that was with alpine diesel. My only advice is don't freak out, if it doesn't kick give it a few minutes and try again :)

[Bluepippa]

Back from Perisher and Thredbo.... Great skiing and a faultless D4... On the coldest morning after removing 4 inches of snow off the car only one small cough before all 6 cylinders fired... Low range, off road height and rock crawl, got me out of the snow where all around me either had to fit chains, or just went nowhere... The only fault the whole holiday was with my wife's ACL :-(

[Epic pooh]

Likewise BP, just back from Perisher and Thredbo, very good snow this year ! No starting probs for me (V8 in a Garage so external temperature no issue).

[Pedro_The_Swift]

I was buried last year up at Hotham and it took a good few tries for it to kick over, went into engine fault and eventually kicked over with a heap of smoke, and that was with alpine diesel. My only advice is don't freak out, if it doesn't kick give it a few minutes and try again :)

advice from the grave!:o:angel:

[Dougal]

Likewise BP, just back from Perisher and Thredbo, very good snow this year ! No starting probs for me (V8 in a Garage so external temperature no issue).

Serious about the snow? Here it's so average I haven't yet bothered. Was forecast for 6 days of snow earlier in the week. We got flakes to 200m but didn't settle, followed by rain.
Forecast changed to only 2 days of snow. Now halfway through the second forecast, it's between 11-7C and raining.

Commercial fields have been relying on artificial snow. I haven't heard how the club fields are going.

[Epic pooh]

Yeah, heaps of snow ! Nice powdery fresh snow, very cold front came through last week and it snowed very nicely for several days. At one point I found myself chest deep in some snow - best season for years. I'll post some pics in the pics thread later !