SMH struggling to be fair and balanced

[nugge t]

Given the constant claims of bias by News Corp and the staunch defence of the unbiased ABC and SMH, it is interesting that the Sydney Morning Herlad's editor has reportedly admitted that he is struggling to keep the paper "fair and balanced".

Given recent events it would appear that he might be more than struggling. I would declare openly that I am not a SMH reader but have followed the reported recent events re cartoons and Mike Charlton.

FAIRFAX Media is under pressure to sack columnist Mike Carlton, who has been ordered to apologise for using anti-Semitic and abusive language towards readers, calling one a “Jewish bigot” and telling several others to “f..k off”.

As The Sydney Morning Herald’s editor-in-chief Darren Goodsir admitted to a former Fairfax director that he was not finding it easy to keep the newspaper “fair and balanced”, he has spent the past few days responding to readers incensed over Carlton’s columns and the paper’s coverage of the conflict in Israel.
“I deeply regret the insulting, discourteous and unprofessional remarks Mike Carlton made to you,” Goodsir emailed one businessman on Friday. “Your points are valid, and well made — and, while I am not sacking him as you have urged, please rest assured that I have admonished him in the strongest terms. I apologise for his inappropriate conduct, and have stressed to him the need for higher standards in future.”
While Goodsir was apologising on his behalf, Carlton continued to inflame the situation, tweeting this week: “Now the loony Likudnik racists are infuriated I have a Jewish son-in-law. That’s okay. I’ll have him taken out and shot …” This was followed by: “No, they’re turds. The truly astounding thing of the past week has been the racism, hatred and bigotry of the Likudniks.” Another tweet said: “Oh FFS, you stupid little ****ant.”

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/media/jewish-bigot-****ant-likudnik-mike-carlton-ordered-to-apologise-for-torrent-of-abuse/story-e6frg996-1227014738512?from=public_rss&utm_source=The%20Australian&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=editorial&net_sub_uid=38973823

[frantic]

Rofl:D

The correct saying here is "it's the pot calling the kettle black".;)

[Tote]

I used to read news.com.au and then switched to a less tabloid smh.com.au but it seems to be headed the same way....
Regards,
Tote

[nugge t]

you might want to actually read what was said and by whom it was said.

They were quoting a discussion had and remarks attributed to the editor of the SMH.

I would invite you to comment in your own thread as I do not wish to have any discussion with you nor do I wish to torment V8Ian ;)

[incisor]

i suggest a couple of you use this function

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/profile.php'do=ignorelist

if it continues there will be unhappiness....

[trog]

for me both these papers went down hill as they slowly reduced the published letters to the editor section. with a worful world news section to boot they were only good for the puzzles.

[nugge t]

Yes there would be hence my request. Having said that I would have preferred his post had not been edited so that others could judge the relevance of my post for themselves.

[incisor]

just put him on your ignore list :p

and i will make sure he does the same...

PLEASE!

[Rurover]

I think problems with editorial independence at both Fairfax and News Ltd are the main reason the UK based Guardian is now pushing its presence in the Australian media scene.

They obviously see a market for a publication (albeit online) that is perceived as having no overt political or financial affiliations.

They have also managed to break a surprising number of major stories since being in this market for just over a year, though there's apparently some sort of working relationship they have with the ABC, but I'm not sure how that works.

Their website even runs Land Rover adverts on its banner (or maybe they're just "personalising" their ads for me!!)

Alan

[Lotz-A-Landies]

...
Their website even runs Land Rover adverts on its banner (or maybe they're just "personalising" their ads for me!!)

AlanGoogle would never track your online activity and target the adds it provides you would it?

[JDNSW]

Google would never track your online activity and target the adds it provides you would it?

In Ron's absence I have to point out that 'add' is a verb meaning "to sum". Perhaps you meant to write 'ad', a colloquial abbreviation for 'advertisement'?

John

[Bigbjorn]

I can't ever remember a Fairfax, Murdoch, or Packer newspaper being fair and balanced. They always played the owners tune.

[VladTepes]

Relying on the media for facts, let alone balance, is like relying on Charles Manson for babysitting.

Inherently dangerous.

[nugge t]

I can't ever remember a Fairfax, Murdoch, or Packer newspaper being fair and balanced. They always played the owners tune.

That about leaves the ABC and their track record is pretty ordinary at best. :D

[incisor]

That about leaves the ABC and their track record is pretty ordinary at best. :D

must be a perception thing...

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/media/audits-exonerate-abc-over-bias-claims/story-e6frg996-1226852398864

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw/abc-clears-itself-of-gross-bias-on-asylumseeker-coverage-with-report-that-says-only-four-reports-were-questionable/story-fni0cx12-1226852983199

Study finds ABC bias leans towards Coalition (http://www.theage.com.au/business/study-finds-abc-bias-leans-towards-coalition-20090902-f8gm.html)

[Ausfree]

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2015/04/153.jpg (http://www.sherv.net/)

[nugge t]

probably the same perception used in claims against News ect by other posters.....

Perhaps Stone should have watched tonights 7.30 Report where the interviewer constantly interupted Christopher Pyne whilst he was trying to answer her question. As soon as he said something she didn't agree with she interupted. After 5 interuption in less than 5 minutes I turned it off.

It was like watching a female Kerry O'Brien letting Hawke and Keating rattle on and constantly interupting and arguing with Howard and Costello.

Obviously nothing has changed so I'll stick to Fox thanks all the same.

[bob10]

This one? go to 13.42 make your own judgement, Bob


7.30 : ABC iview (http://iview.abc.net.au/programs/7-30/NC1405H129S00#playing)

[frantic]

Why Rupert Murdoch can (http://www.themonthly.com.au/issue/2013/november/1383224400/robert-manne/why-rupert-murdoch-can-t-be-stopped)
;)
It's a long read but some interesting figures.

[Chucaro]

This one? go to 13.42 make your own judgement, Bob


7.30 : ABC iview (http://iview.abc.net.au/programs/7-30/NC1405H129S00#playing)

I saw it Bob and not complains for me.
She interrupted Payne when he try to change the subject.
She is not a over IMO.
The rest of the program was very informative.

[Rurover]

tonights 7.30 Report where the interviewer constantly interupted Christopher Pyne whilst he was trying to answer her question. As soon as he said something she didn't agree with she interupted. After 5 interuption in less than 5 minutes I turned it off.


Nugget,

I don't perceive Sarah Ferguson to be politically biassed in her interviews in that she tends to interrupt ALL her subjects in that rather irritating manner.

Like you, I am tempted to turn off, because her interviewing style bugs me so much. (But not because I feel she pushes a particular political philosophy).

Yeah, I'd hate to be married to her!

Alan

[isuzurover]

... I'll stick to Fox thanks all the same.

:D :D :D That explains a lot. As long as your news is biased the way you like you are happy... Even the US 4x4 websites full of rednecks think fox is biased...

[bee utey]

A lover of Faux News....:cool:

[nugge t]

I saw it Bob and not complains for me.
She interrupted Payne when he try to change the subject.
She is not a over IMO.
The rest of the program was very informative.

All in the eyes of the beholder I guess but it appeared she had a specific agenda which was woman and she cross over him ever time he tried to explain the effect of the policy on everyone, not just her specific agenda.

[nugge t]

:D :D :D That explains a lot. As long as your news is biased the way you like you are happy... Even the US 4x4 websites full of rednecks think fox is biased...

there wouldn't be a discussion with you bringing out the rednecks claim..sad really.

I think you might find Fox Australia has a wider ownership base than you might think.

Actually when I turned off the 7.30 Rubish, I turned on Fox and whatched Richo. Yep raham Richardson has his own show on Fox in fact he has 2, Richo and one he shares with Alan Jones, Richo and Jones. Even Richo let the guests on his show finish their answers.

Perhaps when the ABC gives Andrew Bolt a show, some on here might actually have an arguement.

[nugge t]

Gerard Henderson
From: The Australian (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/)
August 01, 2014 3:29PM
● SARAH FERGUSON’S SOFT INTERVIEW WITH GILLIAN TRIGGS
7.30 presenter Sarah Ferguson has become adept of late at asking leading questions. That is, queries which suggest answers suitable to Ms Ferguson’s mindset. The couple of recent examples are set out below:

▪ Here is a question which Sarah Ferguson addressed to Mark Regev, a spokesman for Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu, on 14 July 2012:
Sarah Ferguson: You say you don’t target civilians, but the question is the amount of care that’s taken to avoid hurting civilians. There was a rocket attack on the home of the Gaza police chief. He has known sympathies to Hamas. At the same time, a number of children were killed in that attack. Do you take enough care to avoid those casualties, because it appears the answer is no?
How about that? Sarah Ferguson asked a question and provided an answer (in almost the same breath?)

▪ And here is a question which Sarah Ferguson addressed to Immigration Minister Scott Morrison on 30 June 2014:

Sarah Ferguson: Alright. Just very briefly, because we need to clear this up before we go. So there’s no confusion over the orange boats. You did consider the use of the orange boats to return those asylum-seekers to India?
So once again Sarah Ferguson made a statement — and put a question mark on the end of her statement of belief.

To which Scott Morrison remarked: “Sarah, I’m not going to let you put words in my mouth.” Quite so.

However, Sarah Ferguson did not engage in leading questions last night when interviewing Professor Gillian Triggs, the president of the Human Rights Commission.

In an extraordinary display, Professor Triggs decided to comment publicly on a Human Rights Commission hearing over which she is currently presiding — namely children held in immigration detention. This would be equivalent to a judge giving a running media commentary while presiding over a court case.
In her soft interview, Sarah Ferguson neglected to ask the telling question. Namely, why did Professor Triggs and the Human Rights Commission totally ignore the plight of children in detention during the time of the Rudd/Gillard/Rudd Labor government? And why is it that the HRC only seems concerned when children are detained under a Coalition government?

And the 7.30 presenter did not query Professor Triggs commenting on evidence presented to her in the midst of an Inquiry.

So there are two kinds of Sarah Ferguson interviews. There are tough interviews with many an interruption and many leading questions. These are directed at interviewees with whom Ms Ferguson essentially disagrees. And there are soft interviews with no assertions or interruptions — these are directed at interviewees with whom Ms Ferguson agrees.

[nugge t]

Asylum-seeker burnt hand ‘while lighting fire’


by: JARED OWENS
From: The Australian (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/)
August 07, 2014 12:00AM
AN asylum-seeker who suffered burns to his hand while detained by Australian authorities was trying to light a fire in the ship’s engine room, according to Department of Defence documents.

Interview records with five Operation Sovereign Borders personnel further undermine allegations aired by the ABC in January that asylum-seekers were deliberately abused by Australian personnel who forced them to hold on to their boat’s hot engine pipes.

The torture allegations unravelled when The Australian interviewed the asylum-seekers in Kupang, West Timor, and concluded they could not be corroborated.

The Department of Defence documents, released under Freedom of Information, include copies of five conversations with Operation Sovereign Borders personnel.

One of the documents reads: “Burn to left hand ½ palm … Burn associated with attempt to light fire in engine room.”

Another report indicates the officers applied first-aid to the wound, using field dressings to assist the wounded man.

Immigration Minister Scott Morrison and Defence Minister David Johnston rejected the allegations at the time, but they declined to elaborate on the OSB officers’ version of events.

The Department of Defence initially refused access to the documents, but the department changed its decision after freelance journalist Paul Farrell sought a review by the Australian Information Commissioner.

Farrell republished the documents on the Guardian Australia website last night.
The ABC’s reporting antagonised the Abbott government and drew sharp criticism from the broadcaster’s own Media Watch program, which found the broadcaster had “overreached”.

Tony Abbott in February accused the ABC of rushing to believe accusations with “little foundation” and said the accusations were “extremely damaging”.
“It dismays Australians when the national broadcaster appears to take everyone’s side but our own and I think it is a problem.

“You would like the national broadcaster to have a rigorous commitment to truth and at least some basic affection for the home team, so to speak.’’

[Chucaro]

Henderson opinion?

Henderson has a long history of incessant and obsessive criticism of leading Australian writers, journalists and thinkers with whom he disagrees politically.

This can be seen at his Media Watch Dog blog, in his numerous newspaper columns and extensive correspondence.

He is an ideological warrior whose regular targets include David Marr, Peter FitzSimons, Robert Manne, Elizabeth Farrelly, Margaret Simons, Malcolm Fraser, Virginia Trioli, Mungo MacCallum, Waleed Aly, Guy Rundle, Laura Tingle, Jonathan Green, Fran Kelly, Malcolm Farr, Mark Latham, Paul Bongiorno, Phillip Adams, Tim Flannery, Tim Soutphommasane, Nick Dyrenfurth and Hugh White.

The point is everything is politics for Henderson. His public life is a series of ideological campaigns and personal vendettas. There is no precedent for a chairman of this kind – someone who spends all his time attacking those he singles out as deviating from his correct line – judging the year’s best non-fiction.

Good reference IMO :D

In other words, among Henderson’s political targets are many of Australia’s leading writers, commentators, historians and journalists.

[Ferret]

Perhaps Stone should have watched tonights 7.30 Report where the interviewer constantly interupted Christopher Pyne whilst he was trying to answer her question. As soon as he said something she didn't agree with she interupted. After 5 interuption in less than 5 minutes I turned it off.
...

Well the lady in question is leaving (http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment/tv-and-radio/the-best-of-sarah-fergusons-730-interviews-20140806-101259.html). Coincidently the newspaper in question reports


Some viewers are calling her the best interviewer in the country.

I'll think she be back in one form another given her success.

[nugge t]

So you didn't bother to read what Sarah Ferguson said, just shoot the messenger. That seems fair, balanced and unbiased.

Among the list supplied is a who's who of Team Puce's pin up brigade. If you are seriously suggesting that Marr, Manne, Flannery, Bongiorno are balanced observers, me thinks rose coloured glasses are being used. :D

[nugge t]

Well the lady in question is leaving (http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment/tv-and-radio/the-best-of-sarah-fergusons-730-interviews-20140806-101259.html). Coincidently the newspaper in question reports



I'll think she be back in one form another given her success.


Interesting link to the SMH where they decided her best 5 interviews.

3 were coalition members and 2 from PUP including Clive. Does that infer she doesn't do her best work when interviewing ALP members, is the SMH as biased as she is or does she go soft on those she agrees with, which brings us back to a point made by henderson.:D

[isuzurover]

there wouldn't be a discussion with you bringing out the rednecks claim..sad really.



I cannot find a single post of mine (other than the post above) where I have used the terrm redneck in the context you are referring to.

Please apologise and retract the statement.

[DiscoMick]

All media are biased in the sense that they are written by people and everyone has a bias of some sort, everyone.
The real issue is whether they try to be fair and balanced, meaning to give space to a wide range of views, or whether they distort everything to fit their preconceived bias.
Everyone will disagree about that of course.
My opinion is News Limited is unashamedly pro-LNP most of the time, with only token attempts at balance, and invariably spins political stories to suit its former employee Abbott and his cause.
The opposite end of the spectrum is The Independent, which is blatantly Left-wing and makes no more attempt than News Limited to hide its bias.
Both News Limited and The Independent are blatantly biased.
Other media have their own biases, but at least try to some extent (much more than News Limited) to be fair and balanced.
If I want a fair and balanced coverage I wouldn't bother looking to News Limited outlets or to The Independent. I'm more likely to find things I both agree and disagree with in the other media, particularly The Guardian, the ABC and SBS, because they give space to a wider range of views.
I think the Guardian moved into Australia because it saw News Limited was so biased towards one side of politics, saw that Fairfax was losing its dominance because of bad leadership a decade ago which saw it mostly miss the boat on online news and advertising, and saw a chance to capture the Centre-Left audience. It has been very successful so far.

[nugge t]

I cannot find a single post of mine (other than the post above) where I have used the terrm redneck in the context you are referring to.

Please apologise and retract the statement.

Unlike others on here I will retract if I have confused you with someone else or the manner in which you have previously used the term.

It is disappointing however that many feel the need to use the term as you have..

"Even the US 4x4 websites full of rednecks think "

You are calling people who I assume have a different view to yourself as rednecks as a derogatory term. There are many ways you could have phrased that but you chose the low road, in my opinion.

[nugge t]

All media are biased in the sense that they are written by people and everyone has a bias of some sort, everyone.
The real issue is whether they try to be fair and balanced, meaning to give space to a wide range of views, or whether they distort everything to fit their preconceived bias.
Everyone will disagree about that of course.
My opinion is News Limited is unashamedly pro-LNP most of the time, with only token attempts at balance, and invariably spins political stories to suit its former employee Abbott and his cause.
The opposite end of the spectrum is The Independent, which is blatantly Left-wing and makes no more attempt than News Limited to hide its bias.
Both News Limited and The Independent are blatantly biased.
Other media have their own biases, but at least try to some extent (much more than News Limited) to be fair and balanced.
If I want a fair and balanced coverage I wouldn't bother looking to News Limited outlets or to The Independent. I'm more likely to find things I both agree and disagree with in the other media, particularly The Guardian, the ABC and SBS, because they give space to a wider range of views.
I think the Guardian moved into Australia because it saw News Limited was so biased towards one side of politics, saw that Fairfax was losing its dominance because of bad leadership a decade ago which saw it mostly miss the boat on online news and advertising, and saw a chance to capture the Centre-Left audience. It has been very successful so far.


I agree with a lot of what you say if not with the view of the ABC :D

I don't mind that they push a certain line as long as they are open about it. What gets to me is those, such as the ABC (IMHO) who profess to be unbiased but push certain issues to the max or in the ABC's case on issues such as asylum seekers and the AWU/Gillard issue, not give it any air time at all.

One of the reasons I enjoy Richo and Jones is that you have 2 blokes sharing a show, who are unashamedly biased in opposite directions going head to toe.

If you watch Richo, you know what you are going to get and he doesn't try to hide it as opposed to the masquerade that is Q & A.

[Ferret]

Interesting link to the SMH where they decided her best 5 interviews.

3 were coalition members and 2 from PUP including Clive. Does that infer she doesn't do her best work when interviewing ALP members, is the SMH as biased as she is or does she go soft on those she agrees with, which brings us back to a point made by henderson.:D

Who should decide her 5 best interviews? National election? :D.

The author was Craig Mathieson (http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment/by/Craig-Mathieson?offset=0), film and media critic for the SMH. I assume they were his choices. Previous stories published under his name contain no political content so I would say he does not see himself as a political commentator, nor does the SMH, I would imagine, either.

[nugge t]

Who should decide her 5 best interviews? National election? :D.

The author was Craig Mathieson (http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment/by/Craig-Mathieson?offset=0), film and media critic for the SMH. I assume they were his choices. Previous stories published under his name contain no political content so I would say he does not see himself as a political commentator, nor does the SMH I would imagine either.

Don't now but you put the link up so I assume you agree with it. :D

From the little I have seen I would have thought that the article could have been titled "The best of her Bad" or " Lowering the bar for the ABC to jump over" :D

[DiscoMick]

I understand what you mean about Richo and Jones, but I'm not a fan of either of them.
Personally, I'm quite happy to admit I'm biased towards certain points of view. Really, I like to think in my case my bias is not towards particular political parties, but towards certain ideas of what is important and right. Sometimes I agree with parties on those issues and sometimes I disagree.
For example, on asylum seekers I disagree with both the LNP and ALP - I think they've both screwed up chasing votes and created an unnecessary, expensive and divisive mess.
On other issues I agree with some and not others.
I think its great when people seriously think about issues and make up their own minds, independently of political parties.
I get annoyed when news media are so blatantly biased that its clear they're trying to indoctrinate us into agreeing their viewpoint, no matter the merits of it. I want more information and less opinions. The rush to broadcast opinions to chase audiences has divided the country unnecessarily and is bad for our democracy, I think.
There, now I sound like a starry idealist, when actually I'm just a deeply cynical old fart!

[Chucaro]

This thread was about the SMH or the ABC ? :confused: :D

[nugge t]

The ABC debate getting a bit uncomfortable then? :D


The interesting thing that many might have missed was that the admission came from none other than the editor of the SMH not some right wing crack pot...what was the term isuzurover used...redneck????


Pretty damning admission from the papers own editor I would have thought.

[Chucaro]

The ABC debate getting a bit uncomfortable then? :D


The interesting thing that many might have missed was that the admission came from none other than the editor of the SMH not some right wing crack pot...what was the term isuzurover used...redneck????


Pretty damning admission from the papers own editor I would have thought.

You have to be joking or dreaming :D
I do not give a dam what the editor of the SMH or any other private media organization have to said about the ABC.
I source info from ABC, SBS, The Guardian and Al Jazeera before the SMH or News Ltd.

[bob10]

This is interesting, Bob


Unemployment surges to 12-year high at 6.4 per cent; youth jobless figure hits 14 pc - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-08-07/unemployment-data-abs-july/5654926)

[bob10]

Also this, Courier Mail, Business, Wed. Aug. 6


Thousands of jobs lost in a single day. Bluestone Global in receivership, went into administration on Monday evening with 3,500 contract workers & 180 permanents retrenched. These figures would not be taken into account in the latest unemployment figures. Bob

[Chucaro]

This is interesting, Bob


Unemployment surges to 12-year high at 6.4 per cent; youth jobless figure hits 14 pc - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-08-07/unemployment-data-abs-july/5654926)

Bob, that news are form ABC, for sure News Ltd figures will be different :p

Then again, in The Australian Shock jump in unemployment rate to 6.4pc (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/economics/shock-jump-in-unemployment-rate-to-64pc/story-e6frg926-1227016459973) :eek:

[nugge t]

You have to be joking or dreaming :D
I do not give a dam what the editor of the SMH or any other private media organization have to said about the ABC.
I source info from ABC, SBS, The Guardian and Al Jazeera before the SMH or News Ltd.





Mate with all due respect you might want to actually read what the thread is about and THEN comment :D


Ha was not commenting on the ABC but on his own organisation.

[nugge t]

This is interesting, Bob


Unemployment surges to 12-year high at 6.4 per cent; youth jobless figure hits 14 pc - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-08-07/unemployment-data-abs-july/5654926)



very interest but where is the relevance to the thread?

[nugge t]

Bob, that news are form ABC, for sure News Ltd figures will be different :p

Then again, in The Australian Shock jump in unemployment rate to 6.4pc (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/economics/shock-jump-in-unemployment-rate-to-64pc/story-e6frg926-1227016459973) :eek:



Sky Business was quoting 20% youth unemployment..clearly biased :D

[ramblingboy42]

When you bracket the ages you can get 20%.

that's why politicians use statisticians .....

[bob10]

very interest but where is the relevance to the thread?


Nugget, just work it out. The thread can be expanded, but that may annoy you. Best to humour you, & be nice. Bob

[nugge t]

Must be way too tricky for a me. Probably best that you remain patronising.

[Chucaro]

Tonight it was the last night of Sarah Ferguson. Next week will be Chris Uhlmann at the helm of the program.
Going by her interviews in the last 8 weeks to politicians of different parties including what happens with Clive Palmer it would not surprise me if there was not a complain.

[nugge t]

Strange way to get the thread back on topic and away from the ABC by continuing to post comments about the ABC.

[Chucaro]

I guess that we can call the thread "The Australian Media" :)

[bob10]

Must be way too tricky for a me. Probably best that you remain patronising.


Yep, got it in one, Bob

[nugge t]

I guess that we can call the thread "The Australian Media" :)



You can call it whatever you like but I'll stick with "SMH struggling to be fair and balanced" as quoted by the SMH editor surprisingly with no reference at all to the ABC :D

[nugge t]

Yep, got it in one, Bob


You probably get to put Dip AAH after your signature too.

[Chucaro]

You can call it whatever you like but I'll stick with "SMH struggling to be fair and balanced" as quoted by the SMH editor surprisingly with no reference at all to the ABC :D

Was you on post #14 that mentioned the ABC ;)

[nugge t]

Yep..in response to someone naming other media organisations in post #12 ;)


In fact very little has actually said about what the editor said about the SMH which surprises me as many seemed happy to quote it before the editor let the cat out of the bag.

[Bigbjorn]

Whilst the usual protagonists are flapping their gums about political bias, I thought I would post this aide memoire.

does anyone remember the student song of the 50's-60's "There'll always be a Menzies" to the tune of "There'll always be an England"?

One section went:

There'll always be a Menzies as you can plainly see,
While Sir Richard Boyer rules the faithful ABC.

[DiscoMick]

Fox is a joke in America.

[frantic]

Actually getting back on thread, would you rather a SMH "struggling" to be fair and balanced or a courier, tele etc that have thrown that idea out the window and just follow their owners wishes?
P.s mike Carlton who was the cause of this has resigned from smh .

http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2014/s4062352.htm
This interview was so biased, biased by pyne against women, and equal rights. But obviously very wrong of the abc to point it out to him. Very wrong of the uni chancellors to say exactly the same.



SARAH FERGUSON: However, do you accept that there is a hit in the way that you've set up the loan repayments that hurts women and poorer people more than it does high income earners? Do you accept that's the consequence?

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: No, absolutely not. And I don't accept it because what will happen at universities is that vice chancellors and their leadership teams will know that they should not charge and will not charge higher fees for courses which are typically going to be studied by people who'll be nurses and teachers and therefore not earn high incomes over a period of time. Now, women are well-represented amongst the teaching and nursing students. They will not be able to earn the high incomes that say dentists or lawyers will earn, and vice chancellors in framing their fees, their fee structure, will take that into account. Therefore the debts of teachers and nurses will be lower than the debts, for example, of lawyers and dentists. perfect example of sexism

SARAH FERGUSON: But what happens to a female lawyer or a female dentist who takes, say, 10 years out of from the workplace to raise a family? She will pay a great deal more for her degree than a man who has no children. Equal choice question

CHRISTOPHER PYNE: Well, Sarah, I feel like you're sort of caught up on this subject and the reforms, the higher education reforms are a great deal more than simply the deregulation of fees. So, while you're a bit caught up on one aspect of it, there are many very good aspects of this reform package which I think the Senate will find very attractive. no answer, just dodge and avoid

So for a simple example, if you have twins, m/f both do law with a uni debt, both get married at 25 and have 3kids 27-33, male twin has virtually paid off his loan by 35 female twin sister has 6-10 years interest on her uni debt.

[JDNSW]

.....
does anyone remember the student song of the 50's-60's "There'll always be a Menzies" to the tune of "There'll always be an England"?

One section went:

There'll always be a Menzies as you can plainly see,
While Sir Richard Boyer rules the faithful ABC.

Yes, remember it, but I don't remember those lines!

John

[nugge t]

Fox is a joke in America.

and the implication for Fox in Australia is.....

[Bigbjorn]

Yes, remember it, but I don't remember those lines!

John

And.......

....while there's a BHP
for they have drawn their dividends since 1883.

.... for Menzies can not fail
as long as nothing happens to the Bank of New South Wales

[DiscoMick]

Fox is an American company. Do you want your news menu controlled by a company which is a joke in its home country?

[trog]

with all the tools available , ie computers and such , if you want a publication to follow a particular slant , then publish yourself. if others agree and buy you are a success. but maybe you will fail ?

[nugge t]

Fox is an American company. Do you want your news menu controlled by a company which is a joke in its home country?

In Australia as far as I can see news is delivered by Sky News Australia on Fox, not American Fox.

[ramblingboy42]

Whilst the usual protagonists are flapping their gums about political bias, I thought I would post this aide memoire.

does anyone remember the student song of the 50's-60's "There'll always be a Menzies" to the tune of "There'll always be an England"?

One section went:

There'll always be a Menzies as you can plainly see,
While Sir Richard Boyer rules the faithful ABC.

I don't know "there'll always be an england"

perhaps you could record yourself singing a few bars and put it up in here for us to learn:D:D:D:D:D

[PhilipA]

BTW did anyone see the ABC 7PM news 2 nights ago when Juanita Phillips, "sort of" acknowledged that the ABC had beat up the burnt hands episode.

AFAIR , she said words to the effect that some considered that the ABC had given too much credence to the statements of the complaining people.

I thought that it was not much of an apology to the Navy .

But then a few months ago , I doubt whether they would have said anything.

Regards Philip A

[incisor]

BTW did anyone see the ABC 7PM news 2 nights ago when Juanita Phillips, "sort of" acknowledged that the ABC had beat up the burnt hands episode.

AFAIR , she said words to the effect that some considered that the ABC had given too much credence to the statements of the complaining people.

I thought that it was not much of an apology to the Navy .

But then a few months ago , I doubt whether they would have said anything.

Regards Philip A

why should a news agency be apologising for reporting that aslyum seekers were saying that they had their hands burnt by australian sailors?

talk about two sets of standards...

[nugge t]

I think the issue was in relation to due diligence by the reporter who does have a responsibility to check the facts.

[bob10]

You probably get to put Dip AAH after your signature too.


Unlike some, I never claim qualifications I don't earn. Bob

[bob10]

I don't know "there'll always be an england"

perhaps you could record yourself singing a few bars and put it up in here for us to learn:D:D:D:D:D


One version went " There will always be an England
and England shall be great
As long as there is Australia
To carry the bloody weight. "


The English version


There'll Always Be An England - Vera Lynn - YouTube


And the scots

Scottish Anthem & Lyrics (Please Read Description) - YouTube

[ramblingboy42]

love pipes and drums...much better than the SMH.....

[bob10]

love pipes and drums...much better than the SMH.....
Rambling man, you should know by now you should never encourage me. We have Scots blood , a wee bit. According to family history, one of our mob fought in the US civil war, for the South, after the war went whaling. Left the whaling fleet to look for gold in north Qld. Ended up marrying an aboriginal woman from Alpha. Bob


Scottish Music ~Bonnie Lass O' Fyvie ~ Royal Scots Dragoon Guards - YouTube


And that means, I'm an Australian, with Attitude :D
Aboriginal Music by Richard Walley - YouTube




Bob 10.5

[bob10]

why should a news agency be apologising for reporting that aslyum seekers were saying that they had their hands burnt by australian sailors?

talk about two sets of standards...


Apart from anything else, Australian sailors would never do that. What a sad state of affairs, to be drawn into politics, for just doing your job. And, they do their job very well , indeed. When we came back from Vietnam, the mantra was punch a newspaper writer. Not much has changed. Bob

[Chucaro]

It is sad and a shame that people that join the Navy, Air and Arm forces in a country are used as "ball" to be hit by a "political bat" in any direction that would please their political leaders .
On the top of that when they come back for their designed duties if they are in poor health they just ignored and treated like a used by product. :(

[nugge t]

Unlike some, I never claim qualifications I don't earn. Bob


you have earned that one :D

[nugge t]

It is sad and a shame that people that join the Navy, Air and Arm forces in a country are used as "ball" to be hit by a "political bat" in any direction that would please their political leaders .



In this case they were used by the ABC to push their own agenda. They didn't even interview the people who made the claims but reported on a claim by a 3rd party. Very sloppy at best would be the polite way to put it. Turns out they burnt them selves trying to set fire to the boat.


It is appalling that our service people should treated that way by the ABC and I think the Guardian but stand to be corrected on their involvement. The worst part was the continued unqualified defence of the reports by the ABC despite severe doubt being cast over the claims right from the beginning.

[Chucaro]

In this case they were used by the ABC to push their own agenda. They didn't even interview the people who made the claims but reported on a claim by a 3rd party. Very sloppy at best would be the polite way to put it. Turns out they burnt them selves trying to set fire to the boat.


It is appalling that our service people should treated that way by the ABC and I think the Guardian but stand to be corrected on their involvement. The worst part was the continued unqualified defence of the reports by the ABC despite severe doubt being cast over the claims right from the beginning.

No, there are there for a political and ideological agenda.

[nugge t]

No, there are there for a political and ideological agenda.


Finally we can agree on what the ABC do :)


However, it is not their charter to push a political agenda but again we agree that they do.

[Chucaro]

Finally we can agree on what the ABC do :)


However, it is not their charter to push a political agenda but again we agree that they do.

Yes they, the NAVY is used for a political agenda. ;)
Glad you agree :)

[JamesH]

Henderson opinion?



Henderson has a long history of incessant and obsessive criticism of leading Australian writers, journalists and thinkers with whom he disagrees politically.



This can be seen at his Media Watch Dog blog, in his numerous newspaper columns and extensive correspondence.



He is an ideological warrior whose regular targets include David Marr, Peter FitzSimons, Robert Manne, Elizabeth Farrelly, Margaret Simons, Malcolm Fraser, Virginia Trioli, Mungo MacCallum, Waleed Aly, Guy Rundle, Laura Tingle, Jonathan Green, Fran Kelly, Malcolm Farr, Mark Latham, Paul Bongiorno, Phillip Adams, Tim Flannery, Tim Soutphommasane, Nick Dyrenfurth and Hugh White.



The point is everything is politics for Henderson. His public life is a series of ideological campaigns and personal vendettas. There is no precedent for a chairman of this kind – someone who spends all his time attacking those he singles out as deviating from his correct line – judging the year’s best non-fiction.



Good reference IMO :D



In other words, among Henderson’s political targets are many of Australia’s leading writers, commentators, historians and journalists.


And a very worthy list of targets they are.

You deserve congratulations on this. You've done a better job of listing the dregs of "public intellectualism" than I could.

[PhilipA]

Adding spice to the mix The australian site today reports that



MUSLIM groups have condemned the suspension of Fairfax columnist Mike
Carlton and have accused the media organisation of losing its independent and
respected stance.

In a letter to Fairfax CEO Greg Hywood and Sydney Morning Herald
editor-in-chief Darren Goodsir, the Australian National Imams Council, Islamic
Council of NSW and the Muslim Legal Network NSW among others say they will
boycott the SMH unless the outspoken writer is reinstated.

On the same subject I am appalled at the almost total Australian media allowing itself to be censored by Hamas so they can stay and report from inside Gaza, particularly TV stations.

I personally am much more inclined to believe Israeli statistics on how many so called Hamas "civilians" have been killed vs Hamas "soldiers".
No dispute on any network that I could see. They swallow all the BS day after day.
Half a story. Sobbing "civilians" complaining their homes have been destroyed. How many had tunnels in the basement? Not even a tiny bit of actual reporting there , just regurgitations of Hamas news releases .

There are some stories in overseas publications on how reporters are threatened if they reprort any tiny thing critical of Hamas even when they personally post on Twitter or Facebook..

BTW has Hamas arrested the murderers of the 3 Israelis as the Israelis have done to the Israeli who subsequently killed a Palestinian. NOT a trace in the news anywhere. After all that is what started this bout.
And now the result. Dickheads attacking Jewish schoolkids.

Regards Philip A

[DiscoMick]

Who do we trust in the media?
Not the Daily Telegraph apparently, or News Limited in general. The more biased they become the more their sales fall. Might be a message there.
We do trust the ABC and SBS. The Age and SMH do well, but commercial TV's support is falling.
Interesting survey.


Trust in Australian media: Essential Research poll on media | Crikey (http://www.crikey.com.au/2013/12/18/trust-in-media-abc-still-leads-telegraph-takes-a-hit/)

[nugge t]

Be interesting to know how Crikey classifies themselves. At best a News and Opinion Website which puts them 1% above Commercial Radio News and way below the newspapers they are bagging.

At worst an Internet Blog which puts them between Used car sales men and politicians.

Using 18 month old surveys wouldn't help their credibility much Iwouldn't have thought.

[DiscoMick]

Here's a more recent media survey for you.
Essential: Post-election rebound lifts trust in media from the deep | Crikey (http://www.crikey.com.au/2014/08/06/essential-post-election-rebound-lifts-trust-in-media-from-the-deep/)
Not sure what it all means really, except maybe that there is a growing level of cynicism about the media in general, which could be fed by increasing access to other news sources through the Internet.
Also not sure myself how much reliance to place on this stuff. For example, what's the margin for error? In regular opinion polling its usually said to be about 3%.
I notice their figures for each paper are based on actual readers of that paper, so that's interesting. Presumably people who don't read a paper have less trust in it then do people who do pay to read it. If you're prepared to pay to read a paper, presumably you are more likely to trust it. If you don't have at least some trust in it, why pay for it?

[Ausfree]

Here's a more recent media survey for you.
Essential: Post-election rebound lifts trust in media from the deep | Crikey (http://www.crikey.com.au/2014/08/06/essential-post-election-rebound-lifts-trust-in-media-from-the-deep/)
Not sure what it all means really, except maybe that there is a growing level of cynicism about the media in general, which could be fed by increasing access to other news sources through the Internet.
Also not sure myself how much reliance to place on this stuff. For example, what's the margin for error? In regular opinion polling its usually said to be about 3%.
I notice their figures for each paper are based on actual readers of that paper, so that's interesting. Presumably people who don't read a paper have less trust in it then do people who do pay to read it. If you're prepared to pay to read a paper, presumably you are more likely to trust it. If you don't have at least some trust in it, why pay for it?

Not quite true, I buy the Sydney "Sunday Telegraph" for it's entertainment and amusement value (sarcastic emoticon, inserted here). It really is a good laugh and I find the Piers Akermans column the funniest of them all.( sarcastic, emoticon)

Do I believe what I read in it???? NAH!!! It's crap..........the cartoons are good though.:D

I just buy it to sit down with on a Sunday morning with a cup of coffee for amusement and to brighten my day!!!!!:D

[rick130]

[/B]

and I find the Piers Akermans column the funniest of them all.( sarcastic, emoticon)



Good God, is Citizen Murdochs mouthpiece and apologist still fulminating about crap ??!! :angel:

[Ausfree]

Good God, is Citizen Murdochs mouthpiece and apologist still fulminating about crap ??!! :angel:

Yup!!!! He is ridiculously funny, with the accent on ridiculous.!!:)