Engine mounted, belt driven air compressors? Has it been done?

[Toxic_Avenger]

I'm in the market for an air compressor, been looking at the usual suspects that people recommend, but more and more it seems that the 12V power supply is the limitation of getting to good air flow (CFM or LPM) value. An engine driven compressor looks appealing, able to offer double the LPM flow for similar price.

I've notice Endless Air make a belt driven compressor unit for mounting to the engine, and have suitable mounting kits for the range rover / disco V8. Similar in make and size to an AC compressor, it seems like a good way to get some great flow for fast tyre inflation, air tools etc.

Has anyone doe this on a defender? At a stretch a Puma?
Has anyone modded / re-purposed an AC compressor to work as an onboard air compressor?

[LR V8]

Some Perenties have them, but its mounting brackets would be designed around the Isuzu engine.

Pete

[jboot51]

I'm in the process of getting a bracket laser cut for my 300 tdi defender.
It will retain the original a/c compressor with a second modified sanden sd7 as the air compressor.
Seems like it will work using the exiting a/c tensioner with a longer belt.
The back plate on my existing a/c compressor will have to changed to allow the a/c hoses to attach to the rear of the pump instead of the side.


$ wise it's probably not worth it as the mods to the a/c pump + regas will be about $310 alone.


Boss make a 12v 3.5 cfm compressor for ~$305


12 Volt Air Compressor PX07 Bare | Boss Air Suspension Shop (http://bossairsuspension.com.au/product/com-px07-12-volt-air-compressor/)

[Blknight.aus]

I'm.quietly.certain that there's some fool on this forum who made an air compressor out of a York reciprocating ac compressor a starter motor from a petrol series and some other miscellaneous junk. Then went and used it in support of a cape York trip.

You want to try and get a old school reciprocating piston compressor if you can as they survive nor having lube in the gas a little better than the other types.

[weeds]

Some Perenties have them, but its mounting brackets would be designed around the Isuzu engine.

Pete

If it's the twin piston jobbies I doubt they would have survived this long.........they were pieces of crap to say the least and removed from all the 6x6 I came across, we had bins full of them

[bee utey]

I've been using York twin piston a/c compressors as air compressors (shed and vehicle mounted) for the last 30 years or so. For compressor duty you have to remove the head and look for the oil gallery that connects the low pressure side to the front bearing behind the crank seal. Plug this gallery with a small grub screw and it won't spit much oil at all. Basically you just fill the sump of the compressor with around 25mm of oil, there used to be a drawing somewhere on how to make a dip stick out of a piece of wire and insert it into the filler plug on each side.

Another compressor that came recommended was a twin piston Diesel Kiki model although they are quite rare, being used in the 70's, same deal with the oil gallery. I've never looked at a Sanden Rotary compressor for air duty but it can't be too hard as that is the one used by the Endless Air people I believe.

Be warned though that you need a relief valve and/or a pressure switch as these compressors happily pump up to 300psi if you forget.

[Toxic_Avenger]

So I made up some cardboard mock ups of ARB compressors, the CKMA12 (single pump) and the CKMTA12 (twin pump) using the dimension in their catalogue.

If I go 12V, then I can fit the CKMA12 in the channel down behind the passenger seat in my puma 90. Going the twin pump CKMTA12, it will fit either on the sloped section behind the passenger seat (at the expense of fore/aft seat adjustment) or very nicely on the top of the wheel arch. Nice and convenient for cable routing too.

I'm yet to scope out available real estate in the Puma engine bay for a belt driven unit. Still chasing info on dimensions and suitable pumps though.
I think going this route would be preferential but more costly with much more dicking around to make it work. It would be a long term solution though.

The thing I'm seeing is that a lot of compressors rate their flow rates at no load, while what we all really need to know is how they flow at higher pressures (for example getting the tyre up to road pressure from say, 18psi).

[BadCo.]

Some good talk of compressor brands in this tgread
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/technical-chatter/203088-12-volt-air-compressor-general-use.html

[BadCo.]

If it's the twin piston jobbies I doubt they would have survived this long.........they were pieces of crap to say the least and removed from all the 6x6 I came across, we had bins full of them

Is this the one you are bagging?

Isuzu Perentie 4×4 (http://rockford4x4.com/sample-page/complete-kits/isuzu-perentie-4x4/)

I hope not, because it would be awesome to have one in my Personnel Carrier! :D

[Toxic_Avenger]

Some good talk of compressor brands in this tgread
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/technical-chatter/203088-12-volt-air-compressor-general-use.html

I've been reading a lot both online and on this forum (including that tgread), so far I have been unable to find flow rates of the Dr Air compressor under load. Would be interested to see some figures to make a true comparison.

I've mocked up the mounting position for a 12v ARB item, so next step is to gather data on the alternatives - engine mounted air on board, endless air, and other 12v options- Dr Air pro flow, and perhaps some other common alternatives. Hopefully that's where the forum can offer some assistance.

Going blindly on one 'shootout' review by a 4wd magazine without knowing alternative performance information is not really my thing. I like informed, educated comparisons.

[weeds]

Is this the one you are bagging?

Isuzu Perentie 4×4 (http://rockford4x4.com/sample-page/complete-kits/isuzu-perentie-4x4/)

I hope not, because it would be awesome to have one in my Personnel Carrier! :D
Not bagging....fact

Buy one, fit it and give us a review........there is a reason we had a bin full of them in the workshop. We ended up with little blue compressors with alligator clips as a replacement so go figure.

They might of have improved there design......since the early/mid 90's, happy to be proven wrong.

[TonyC]

Yes it's been done.
Have a read of this thread.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/projects-tutorials/37689-board-air-200tdi-defender.html

Tony

[BadCo.]

Not bagging....fact

Buy one, fit it and give us a review........there is a reason we had a bin full of them in the workshop. We ended up with little blue compressors with alligator clips as a replacement so go figure.

They might of have improved there design......since the early/mid 90's, happy to be proven wrong.

What exactly was wrong with them? I am interested enough in them to want to email the people and find out if they have improved them over the years or not. Just need to know where they fell short...

[Kevin B]

I'm.quietly.certain that there's some fool on this forum who made an air compressor out of a York reciprocating ac compressor a starter motor from a petrol series and some other miscellaneous junk. Then went and used it in support of a cape York trip.

:Rolling::Rolling::Rolling::Rolling::Rolling:

[Homestar]

I run a twin piston York compressor in the 101. It fills a 24 litre tank to 110PSI in under a minute at idle. Biggest problem with the York units is their physical size. Not sure how much room you have in the Deefer.

[LR V8]

If it's the twin piston jobbies I doubt they would have survived this long.........they were pieces of crap to say the least and removed from all the 6x6 I came across, we had bins full of them

I was more thinking of the concept of the mounting etc...

But yes, you are spot on wrt the pumps quality. I distinctly remember thinking the same thing when I first saw my new crew cabs in 92/93. The front pulley wheel appeared very flimsy.

Cheers,

Pete

[Blknight.aus]

What exactly was wrong with them? I am interested enough in them to want to email the people and find out if they have improved them over the years or not. Just need to know where they fell short...

The over speed thow out used to stay engaged die to lack of servicing and then the rings would melt.


Good if looked after but only.marginally better than a 12v dc co oressor of similar disolacmenr. Due to enibe speed limits before the throw out was supposed to disengage it.

[Aaron IIA]

I run a York style compressor on my SIIa using a home made bracket. I feed it into an old 240v compressor tank, which still has all the original fittings. The pressure switch turns the compressor on and off, with an override switch in the cab. I have used it to run a 3/4" rattle gun, a die grinder and a paint sprayer. The compressor has not been modified in any way. I generally run the engine at about 1000rpm for inflating tyres and 1500rpm for the more air demanding tasks. Beware though, when it comes time to inflate your tyres after a drive through sand, your friends will want theirs done too. I can usually do three cars in the time the fourth uses his electric compressor.
Aaron

[weeds]

What exactly was wrong with them? I am interested enough in them to want to email the people and find out if they have improved them over the years or not. Just need to know where they fell short...

Pretty much what blknight said...........plus they used to leak air at each end of the block between the cylinders.......we looked after ours as Everyman and his dog didn't drive it. Output was average as well.

[Toxic_Avenger]

Looks like 6-10 CFM is a solid performing range for a belt driven, rotary vane style compressor. I still need to do more research in this regard.

At worst this is on par with a high spec twin pump 12v job.

Looking over the 4wd Action compressor shootout that everyone references, the Dr Air Pro Flow won the majority of its points due to the warranty and price categories. In terms of inflation under load, the ARB twin pump ****s all over it- inflation times being a minute LESS per tyre from 16-40psi. http://www.haigh.com.au/docs/4WD169%20036-054%20FEATURE%20air_web.pdf


I'm still taking these results with a grain of salt... can never bee too certain which magazines have what allegiance with certain suppliers, but from my research on paper, the ARB twin looks to be the pick of the lot.
So if the dollars are there to support the initial purchase price, then why not go for it. I know, personally, I want something fast. The pain in the ass that comes from standing in line at the servo, holding up a pump, while airing up, is the reason why I don't run correct pressures offroad most of the time. If I get the speed of inflation, longevity and quality out of a product that is more expensive, then that's where my money goes for a 12v.

[Aaron IIA]

Forgot to mention, my workshop compressor is also a york style unit filling a 60L tank. I have had no problem using that style of air-conditioner comoressr to supply air.
Do clisby still make 12 volt air compressors?
Aaron

[Bigbjorn]

Go to a truck wrecker and look around the engine bays. You will find something that may already be belt driven or able to have belt pulley fitted.

Dave, did you ever do anything with that Bendix Tu-Flo 12 cfm compressor I gave you?

[phibbzy]

I use a Sanden SD7 air con compressor, grease lubricated crank case with the gallery to the head blocked to prevent grease leaking into the air ways.

It's not finished yet but I can fill a 33x12.5R15 tyre from empty to 35psi in 2 minutes 10 seconds, rattle gun 5 wheel studs off without recharge and run the drill without load endlessly. The 9L tank fills from 0 to 120PSI is around 30 seconds or so.

I will upload a test video I made of it and post it here.

I will have it plumbed into a 9L tank fitted under the drivers well.

On top of having oodles and oodles of pressure at around 9-10CFM, the torque of engine means that the compressor does not lose this capacity when the pressure increases as it will with 12v units. It provides a constant pressure which is great.

[Blknight.aus]

Go to a truck wrecker and look around the engine bays. You will find something that may already be belt driven or able to have belt pulley fitted.

Dave, did you ever do anything with that Bendix Tu-Flo 12 cfm compressor I gave you?

Got it all prepped up to go on the 2.25, then got the offer of the Suzi and matching lt95. Since then, she who is now divorced kept the brakes on the money for work on fozzy so he sits forlorn and in pieces.

Had I known, I'd have kept the 2.25 in him and built around that...

[scottvdw]

I use a Sanden SD7 air con compressor, grease lubricated crank case with the gallery to the head blocked to prevent grease leaking into the air ways.

It's not finished yet but I can fill a 33x12.5R15 tyre from empty to 35psi in 2 minutes 10 seconds, rattle gun 5 wheel studs off without recharge and run the drill without load endlessly. The 9L tank fills from 0 to 120PSI is around 30 seconds or so.

I will upload a test video I made of it and post it here.

I will have it plumbed into a 9L tank fitted under the drivers well.

On top of having oodles and oodles of pressure at around 9-10CFM, the torque of engine means that the compressor does not lose this capacity when the pressure increases as it will with 12v units. It provides a constant pressure which is great.

Exactly the compressor I have on my 300TDI defender - mounted on a home made bracket next to a 2nd altenator in the standard A/C position.
I changed the oil fill hole for a grase nipple and put a grubscrew in the gallery hole to the head. Even without a tank, it will still push tubeless tyre beads back on if you give the engine a few revs.

Scott

[Aaron IIA]

Does anybody have any experience with this type of compressor?
As soon as I can figure out how to attach the picture.
Aaron