What makes a 4x4, 4wd Unstoppable off road?

[4x4 MORE]

Hi guys just after some wisdom:)..

What makes a 4wd Unstoppable off road, and why?;)

[DBT]

Nothing beats a company car. :D

[scarry]

Traction,grip and good ground clearances.
With power and low down torque.:)

Oh, and a bit of LR engineering

[stealth]

No such thing as a 4WD that can't be stopped. Silly question

[sheerluck]

No such thing as a 4WD that can't be stopped. Silly question

You tell the Nissota crowd that, and tell us how it goes.

You just need to drive into ARB and empty your wallet, and the kids' uni fund. ;)

[DBT]

No such thing as a 4WD that can't be stopped. Silly question

Challenge!

I submit exhibit 1: the Land Rover 110 "Perentie".

Given the availability of certain ... accessories.

[MR LR]

Mattracks, that is all :p

[spudboy]

Articulation.

Diff Locks.

[Lucy]

The Driver!

[Dougal]

Momentum!

[vnx205]

The Driver!

Especially a driver that knows the capabilities of the vehicle and doesn't attempt anything that the vehicle can't manage. :) That way he/she doesn't get stopped.

[Blknight.aus]

Hi guys just after some wisdom:)..

What makes a 4wd Unstoppable off road, and why?;)

The driver.

Doesn't matter if the vehicle had the ablitiy to get somewhere if the driver can't get it there.

[spudboy]

The driver.

Doesn't matter if the vehicle had the ablitiy to get somewhere if the driver can't get it there.

And vice versa....

[Ancient Mariner]

A decent winch and something to attach to:D

[Alex 110]

A decent winch and something to attach to:D

Once you need a winch you've already stopped

Sent from my GT-I9505 using AULRO mobile app

[bob10]

As mentioned, the driver & common sense. Actually, it's a myth perpetrated by clever marketers on a naïve population, encapsulated in a popular range of magazines, in order for the aftermarket industry to prosper.


Alternatively , one of these could help
[ I once saw one of these pull a D9 bull dozer sunk in the sand from Mindel beach in Darwin. Driven by a WO Raeme chap called " Spike" Lear. They called him Spike because he had the habit of carrying a large spike with him, he would walk towards the recovery, dropping the spike into the ground. How far it went in, determined how close, or how far he drove the Wrecker, to the recovery.] Perhaps a spike could be added to any list . Bob


https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/08/960.jpg

[4x4 MORE]

Interesting..

But.. I was after the Technical side of things..not driver skill..

[bob10]

Interesting..

But.. I was after the Technical side of things..not driver skill..


But that is the point, nothing makes a 4x4 unstoppable. That is just propaganda. It is the driver that determines how far the vehicle will get. I suggest you post the question in the technical chatter section, you will find your answer there, Cheers, Bob
:D

[DBT]

It is a very difficult question to answer, as there are so many variables. And the end goal is not really achievable.

I'll give my opionion on what i think the first component that stops a new, stock 4WD: it's tyres.

Out of the showroom, pretty much all 4WDs come with H/T tyres. The only place off road these work ok would be the beach. And even then A/Ts would be an improvement.

As for standard 18-19" rims and 40 series tyres, Lose those ASAP.

Edit:

To start you on the path of enlightenment, follow these steps:
1: off road tyres
2: decent recovery points (get professional advice on this)
3: join a 4wd club

2 & 3 will get you further still than 1 alone. And should keep you out of too much trouble. :)

It will also give you the experience to decide what mod you want to spend your money on next. :D

[trog]

Oooops I think we are out of fuel. Didnt you fill it up ?

[frantic]

Maybe the title should be, "things that make a 4wd get further stuck off road" ;)
So a standard 4x4 will take 20 Min to pull out of a long boghole, a lifted, diff locked,landies with 35in tyres gets far further but is still stuck in the middle and will now take 2-4 hours, if it hasn't broken something else. Cvs, axles, gears, crownwheel etc.

[PAT303]

The driver.

Doesn't matter if the vehicle had the ablitiy to get somewhere if the driver can't get it there.

And it can't have any electrics,a fuel system that can't self prime,be made by Ford.;). Pat

[FeatherWeightDriver]

A mate of mine had a similar theory.

When I would go out in a relative softroader compared to their locked and lifted trucks he would tell me: having a more capable truck just means you are further in trouble when you do get stuck.

Knowing what not to do that will get your truck stuck is the key, and then drive to the strengths of what you have.

[Blknight.aus]

And it can't have any electrics,a fuel system that can't self prime,be made by Ford.;). Pat

Nah it can have some electricals, you've got to have something to listen to while the merc owners are whining about needing to get out of here and onto a highway so they can do a dpf regen run.

You can also have a system you Ned to manually prime but if you have to carry specialist tools, well that's just being silly

[Redback]

Flux capacitor:p

[DiscoMick]

Clearance and grip.

[Tombie]

Nothing beats a company car. :D

Hire car does...

I once had a Camry that saw more air time than a skateboard at the X-Games

[Barefoot Dave]

@Blknight: dog regen?

[Ancient Mariner]

CAT :D

[Dougal]

@Blknight: dog regen?

DPF I'll bet.

Autocorrect can be a vicious thing.

[Barefoot Dave]

Dougal, cheers.

Wait, What!
Cue, many burnt out Gs as they set fire to the grass around.
Let me guess, they also have a computer that forces limp-home mode when it 'Absolutely, positively MUST do a regen'?! Bit like the RFA Canters..:mad:

[Greatsouthernland]

Hi guys just after some wisdom:)..

What makes a 4wd Unstoppable off road, and why?;)

I'm thinking of the tractor pull comps, a sled like that with a sliding weight would have the same result with our tractor like LRs.

So eventually everything is stopped, by weight, power, traction, clearance, mechanical reliability etc., or combination of any or all of these.


Save the Jeep - YouTube

.

[vnx205]

The original question is asking for something that the laws of physics say is impossible.

Translate the question into something more realistic and it becomes:
What makes a 4wd so capable that when it eventually stops, recovery will be very time consuming and/or life threatening? :D

Remember the main difference between a 2WD and a 4wd is that the 4WD allows you go worse places o get stuck. :D:D

[Cammo]

"What makes a 4x4 unstoppable?"

That little green and gold oval shaped badge on the front grille. You could say the driver I suppose, as any driver serious about not being stopped will choose a vehicle equipped with aforementioned badge.....

[Sitec]

Hi guys just after some wisdom:)..

What makes a 4wd Unstoppable off road, and why?;)

Deep pockets!

Ok, in all seriousness, the vehicle you choose and how you drive it have a lot to do with it.. A SWB D90 straight out of the showroom is already very good off road, and so it would seem are the Disco 3's. Add to this a set of decent All Terrain tyres and some recovery kit and you'll go a lot further than you'd think. I ran a 130 for a while and I fitted a Detroit locker in the rear, a Trutrac in the front (both fit and forget diff centers.. The rear being a form of locker and the front a torque biasing diff that helps hugely).. I also upgraded all axle shafts and both CV's and the 130 happily lifted wheels and kept going. Once you achieve all this traction, you then have to start thinking 'do you actually want to push you're vehicle thru this'.. The 130 was heavy and flexed a lot so I sold it and bought a shorter, lighter stronger 101. I to this I've fitted a 5.9 TD Cummins and a Detroit locker. It too now seems to go everywhere I want it and without the flex or abuse... as its made for the job! Buy the vehicle u like, then go out on a few trips and see where you come unstuck, then add bits to suit. :)

[bob10]

Hi guys just after some wisdom:)..

What makes a 4wd Unstoppable off road, and why?;)


4x4 more, escape to the technical chatter part of the forum while you have a chance. They've been like this since Robyn Williams passed. Bob

[scarry]

I'm thinking of the tractor pull comps, a sled like that with a sliding weight would have the same result with our tractor like LRs.

So eventually everything is stopped, by weight, power, traction, clearance, mechanical reliability etc., or combination of any or all of these.


Save the Jeep - YouTube (http://youtu.be/aHmvg4bcm_I)

.

the first 2 and half minutes were great,then it went all downhill:(:p

[Kev the Fridgy]

the first 2 and half minutes were great,then it went all downhill:(:p

Yea, I was thinking the same

[Greatsouthernland]

the first 2 and half minutes were great,then it went all downhill:(:p

Sorry about that...:)

[wrinklearthur]

Dry Ground.
.

[slug_burner]

You can get too literal. I will interpret the question as "what is it that makes a 4x4 able to go further than your mates?"

Things that stop 4x4s:

Loss of traction and having parts of the vehicle get caught on the terrain.

Traction can be improved through tyres, traction aids (lockers, limited slip, auto torque basing diffs etc, electronics such as traction control) and to prevent getting snagged, shorter wheel base, taller tyres, reduced over hang to improve departure and approach angles.

Ground pressure is also something to keep in mind, a heavier or more correctly put a vehicle exerting greater ground pressure will break through the surface where a lighter or vehicle exerting less ground pressure will stay on the surface. One of the reasons why tracked vehicles have good mobility.

Mechanical or electrical failures will also stop a vehicle so strengthening components likely to fail and reducing points where electrics can be a problem by using barriers/coatings to keep water out or do away with the stuff as per diesels.

Once you have been stopped from proceeding you need to consider the need for recovery equipment.

I'm sure there will be other interpretations of the OP's question and many other opinions on what it is that will make your vehicle go further than your mates'

[4x4 MORE]

What makes a 4x4, 4wd Unstoppable off road?
Hi guys just after some wisdom..

What makes a 4wd Unstoppable off road, and why?

What makes a good 4wd?:confused:

[AndrewMilne]

Back to basics, I reckon: NO 4WD is unstoppable, off-road or anywhere else.
And, in my view & experience, the DRIVER is still a big part of how close a vehicle may come to that.
That's why a Holden ute with a good driver can go places most people would not believe.
Cheers, Andrew

[Blknight.aus]

The ability to place the wheels in such a position. That the available torque is transmitted to the ground In such a way that the available traction to that wheel is not exceeded while the sum total of all available motive power exceeds the drag on the vehicle as it moves over ground that has sufficient bearing ability to support the ground d pressure exerted by the vehicles tyres.

[Baggy]

First off ..... it has to have a green oval Landrover badge on it.

Second ...As Andrew stated its Driver experience that can save hose" I didnt see that coming moment" and an experienced driver can take a stock 4WD further than an novice.

As I stated first off ....having a landrover even in its stock form is the best platform to start from ...but I suppose I'm biased and preaching to those already in the know.

Cheers

Baggy

[Baggy]

Blknight

Beautifully put .....:D

Cheers

Baggy

[FeatherWeightDriver]

Hire car does...

I once had a Camry that saw more air time than a skateboard at the X-Games

Haha - ah yes the hire car, they might not be unbreakable but until they break they certainly are unstoppable!

They also do great circle work. Until the power steering packs up. Allegedly... ;)

[windsock]

Taking a slightly different tack to the OPs question...


Wet drum brakes and a slope... :)

[carjunkieanon]

The ability to place the wheels in such a position. That the available torque is transmitted to the ground In such a way that the available traction to that wheel is not exceeded while the sum total of all available motive power exceeds the drag on the vehicle as it moves over ground that has sufficient bearing ability to support the ground d pressure exerted by the vehicles tyres.

Which goes to show that yes, the bigger tires, lift, more power etc etc, with a competent driver will go further.

The whole, 'it just means you'll get bogged further in' thing bugs me because a well set up car will go through all sorts of things a poorly set up car won't.

[Dougal]

The whole, 'it just means you'll get bogged further in' thing bugs me because a well set up car will go through all sorts of things a poorly set up car won't.

This comes down to the whole "why" part of it.

If you are a recreational 4wder for the challenge, then the absolute last thing you want is bigger tyres, more lift, lockers, etc etc.
Because your whole aim is to find harder and harder terrain which results in vehicles being stuck more and more.

Relevant anecdote; I once got an old merc dump-truck stuck while the rear cross-locks were in (all three diff locks). The 6 ton dozer was first on the scene and couldn't move it. A 12t digger struggled to get me free but succeeded. Good thing as the 38 ton dozer was several km away.

If being challenged is your goal then stick to stock size rubber with tread to suit the conditions. You'll have the same amount of fun at lower cost and recovery becomes a hell of a lot easier.

If you truely need to get somewhere, then a 4wd is seldom the best way. Motorbike, tractor, helicopter, skidoo or even friggen walk.

Myself, I use my 4wd's for access for other activities (biking, skiing, hiking, work even). As such there is never a situation where I absolutely need to get through something.
Worst case is usually park sooner and walk/bike further. If it's a work site then there is always a more capable vehicle/machine to take you there.

Other people can pretend to be hard-core as much as they want. Even if we get 6" of snow I can still get to the mall just fine.

[alittlebitconcerned]

2 parts Pixie dust mixed with one part unicorn droppings, in a ratio of 200 to 1 into a full tank of rainbow light. Unstoppable.

[67hardtop]

Taking a slightly different tack to the OPs question...



Wet drum brakes and a slope... :)


X2.
any series with wet brakes is unstoppable [bigrolf][bigrolf][bigrolf]

Cheers Rod:wasntme:


If the clutch is wet it don't go either...lol

[vnx205]

Taking a slightly different tack to the OPs question...


Wet drum brakes and a slope... :)

I inadvertently tested that coming out of Bendethera Valley a few years ago in the Series III.

Shortly before the track begins to climb, it crosses the Deua River. I did my usual left foot braking for several hundred metres until the brakes seemed to be back to their usual standard.

The track continues climbing for a few kilometres before a couple of reasonably steep , but fortunately short, downhill sections. By then, all thoughts of wet brakes had gone from my mind and after all, I had dried them out before starting the climb.

Apparently there is some clever design in the drum brakes on a Series LR that retains a bit of water ready to seep back onto the brake linings at the worst possible moment.

Fortunately I started the short downhill section at fairly slow speed because in spite of all my pressure on the brake pedal, we continued to gain speed until the brakes finally dried out again just near the bottom of the slope.

Because of the nature of the track at that point, there was no real danger, just a feeling of mild panic.

For a short time the Series III was definitely unstoppable.

[4x4 MORE]

I meant in off road ability mate:)

[eckwalsh]

Hi guys just after some wisdom:)..

What makes a 4wd Unstoppable off road, and why?;)

No brakes. Lol

[benji]

I got my first puncture offroad just the other day. However it wasn't all lost- my secret to infinite traction is zero psi.

Articulation, clearance, tires, lockers, gearing, weight, power in that order.

But above all is experience

Sent from my GT-I9305T using AULRO mobile app

[bee utey]

The perfect accessory for the 4WD owner who has to get over every known obstacle...














https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/09/955.jpg

:wasntme:

[4x4 MORE]

cheers guys!

I thought this was a good read!:)

This Is What Makes A Vehicle Unstoppable Off-Road (http://jalopnik.com/this-is-what-makes-a-vehicle-unstoppable-off-road-512501606)

[2stroke]

Well that pretty much tells it like it is. Still there's no such thing as unstoppable. I have both a twin locked LJ50 on 235/85/16 muddies with enough mods that a friend calls it a "pseudo buggy", as well as a Defender 130 on 33" muddies with a locker in the rear only and there are still some rare conditions that allow the Deefer to do what the pseudo buggy can't.

[workingonit]

Is this what you were talking about earlier Blknight?

83920

[4x4 MORE]

Well that pretty much tells it like it is. Still there's no such thing as unstoppable. I have both a twin locked LJ50 on 235/85/16 muddies with enough mods that a friend calls it a "pseudo buggy", as well as a Defender 130 on 33" muddies with a locker in the rear only and there are still some rare conditions that allow the Deefer to do what the pseudo buggy can't.

Like what?

[2stroke]

They are 2 very different horses for very different courses, and the Defender is rarely taken out to wheel these days (other than on Straddie) just for wheeling's sake. The Suzuki is good on local tracks where distance or load capacity are not an issue, as well as 4wd parks where it gets towed by the Landie. The 130 can carry plenty of gear and go about 1600 km between fuel without jerry cans. Still in terms of pure wheeling the Defender doesn't have the same tendency to tip over back and to one side in wombat holes on a steep hills. The Defender is 127"wb, the Suzi is 77", there's nearly 1.3m of stability there. The article you linked mentions short wheelbases on steep hills.

[4x4 MORE]

Thanks mate:)

[101RRS]

Still in terms of pure wheeling the Defender doesn't have the same tendency to tip over back and to one side in wombat holes on a steep hills. The Defender is 127"wb, the Suzi is 77", there's nearly 1.3m of stability there. The article you linked mentions short wheelbases on steep hills.

You need a LWB Sierra - I had one for a few years and it got over most of the deficiencies of the SWB and the extra length didn't seem to impact ramp over too much.

Garry

[2stroke]

You need a LWB Sierra - I had one for a few years and it got over most of the deficiencies of the SWB and the extra length didn't seem to impact ramp over too much.

Garry

Nah quite sure I don't need a long Sierra, or a short one for that matter. I enjoy living dangerously and stability is for pussys. The LJ can mix it with anything road legal and a lot of things that aren't and it's a lot of fun trying to stay with the rest. And a car with a 2stroke engine is a great conversation starter.

[2stroke]

Surely a bloke who owns a Haflinger knows that some folks just have to be different.:D

[vnx205]

When I had my Haflinger, I was even more different as mine was a LWB Haflinger. :D

I believe they were fairly rare in Australia.