Newbie welder recomendation?

[twr7cx]

I have a SIP Group Weldmate SWT130TP arc welder here that I have been playing with and trying to learn some of the basics of welding. It's a 140amp welder, but I'm finding at 80amp the duty cycle is very low and it's regularly cutting out on me - likely due to being a cheap unit.

I'd like to get into welding a bit more as a hobbyist and am looking to upgrade the hardware. Reading some threads Token Tools has received a good recommendation numerous times and they currently have some big discounts on their equipment.

At first I thought to get a bigger arc welder such as their Miniarc 205 STL < Inverter Arc Welder - DC Lift Arc Tig - Miniarc 205 STL (http://weldingstore.tokentools.com.au/tig-welding-equipment/tig-welding-machines/inverter-lift-arc-tig-welders/inverter-arc-welder-dc-lift-arc-tig-miniarc-205-stl.html) >, but as the type of welding that I'd like to do is generally smallish stuff and the guys that I usually take the jobs too seem to use MIG's I thought perhaps something like the Synergic Mig Welder Multi-Process MIG210S < Synergic Mig Welder Multi-process Digital 3in1 MTS Mig Tig Stick - Tokentools MIG210S (http://weldingstore.tokentools.com.au/mig-welding-equipment/mig-welding-machines/inverter-synergic-mig-welders/synergic-mig-welder-multi-process-mig210s.html) > might be a better choice as it offers both MIG and arc capabilities?

I am limited by single phase 15amp connection only.

So, the purpose of this thread is to ask for any recommendations/advice for essentially a newbie to welder for hardware purchase. Happy to consider other brands/models. I have had a look locally on Gumtree and there is not much available.

[Slunnie]

15amp is ok, that still runs you to around 200amps welding. I think onces you start MIGing you wont be doing my more arc welding anymore.

We use Unimig, Kemppi, ESAB, Air Liquide. Lincoln are also very good. Air Liquide to me is the standout for flexability in setup and reliability though but the others I have listed are all very good machines too.

[twr7cx]

Did the run around today to the local welding suppliers and found the following local purchase options:


BOC Smootharc Multiprocess 175 - $928.15 (end of financial year special price that they are still willing to do - according to website price is $937.53 exGST so $1,031.38 including):

BOC Smootharc 175 Multi-Process Welder | BOC Australia (http://www.boc.com.au/shop/en/au-boc-industrial-store/boc-smootharc-multiprocess-175)
Tech sheet - http://www.boc.com.au/wcsstore/AU_BOC_Industrial_Store/pdf/product/en_AU/BOC175MULTI_techsheet.pdf

175 Amp
35% duty cycle at 175 amp

Pros - comes with everything (including TIG torch which most don't include), BOC are a national company, repairs are contracted out to a local firm in Kingston.
Cons - warranty is only 18 months (which seems to be the standard time)


Cigweld Transmig 175i - $1,021.00 (Blackwoods - currently on special), $1,100.00 (Tasweld):

Transmig 175i - Plant - Cigweld - Victor Technologies Asia Pacific - South Pacific (http://www.cigweld.com.au/product/mig-welding-equipment/transmig-175i-plant/)

175 Amp
25% at 175 amp for MIG/TIG
20% at 175 amp for stick

Pros: brand sold in multiple locations (Supercheap Auto, Blackwoods, Tasweld, K&D), service and repairs done inhouse at Tasweld's workshop, three year warranty, spare parts listed on the Cigweld website for it
Cons: worst duty cycle of the lot (but then they might actually just be the most honest company in providing accurate numbers were the others might be inflated a bit?), additional cost for TIG components


Kennedy's Welding Supplies - Bossweld MST 180 - $1,199.00

No website for the brand

180 amp
Duty cycle unknown

Pros: Repairs, service conducted inhouse at Kennedy's
Cons: unknown brand, no website or spec sheet available, advice from Kennedy's is that the settings lack sensitivity and recommends the Unimig instead, TIG components additional cost, Warranty period unknown but suspect 18 months


Kennedy's Welding Supplies - Uni-Mig 190 Inverter - $1,199.00:

Uni-Mig - Suppliers of UNIMIG / Razorweld & Razorcut Mig Welders, Tig Welder, Plasma Cutters, Gas Cutting Equipment, supplies and parts for your welding machines (http://www.unimig.com.au/catalogue_product.asp?product=32&category=1&subcategory=2)
Spec sheet - http://www.unimig.com.au/userfiles/file/KUMJR190INFO.pdf

190 amp
35% at 190 amp MIG
35% at 160 stick

Pros: Repairs, service conducted inhouse at Kennedy's, recommended unit by Kennedy's
Cons: 18 month warranty according to Kennedy's (but Uni-Mig website states 3 year warranty), TIG components are an additional $140.00


Token Tools - Synergic Mig MIG210S - $1,149.00 (5 year warranty), $1,034.10 (2 year - 10% discount) or $919.20 (1 year - 20% discount) - includes free shipping:

Synergic Mig Welder Multi-process Digital 3in1 MTS Mig Tig Stick - Tokentools MIG210S (http://weldingstore.tokentools.com.au/mig-welding-equipment/mig-welding-machines/inverter-synergic-mig-welders/synergic-mig-welder-multi-process-mig210s.html)

210 Amp for Mig, 200 Amp for TIG and 175 Amp for MMA (Stick/arc)
35% duty cycle at 200 Amp for MIG/TIG
60% duty cycle at 160 Amp for MIG/TIG
35% duty cycle at 175 for Stick

Pros - biggest amp rating of them all, cheapest when optioned with the 1 year warranty, includes TIG parts
Cons - warranty is probably difficult to claim as have to buy online from the mainland so would involve shipping issues for return, spare parts only available direct through them


I liked the Uni-Mig for some reason
Out of the Cigweld and BOC the BOC is cheaper, includes more and has better specs.
The Bossweld is out.
The Token Tools is still a good contender and it's the most powerful, and depending on warranty choice can be the cheapest.

[justfishing]

Hello,
I have a Token Tools AC-DC tig had a few questions once the machine arrived I live in WA and I had a returned phone call within the hour didn't have to call him, he answered all questions and offered a return item if things didn't go as explained. Followed his instructions and never had a trouble used the machine a lot still going strong nearly 2 years later, done lots of TIG work and plasma cutting. Very good service. I have used many different brands this one does go very well. Been looking at the Synergic one myself.

Ian

[steveG]

The Transmig 175i always gets a good report in everything I've seen over the last couple of years.

I've got a bigger 250A Unimig and very happy with it. I recall something about a split warranty with Unimig - something like 12M on circuit boards and 3 years on hardware which might help explain the differing warranty periods you're being told.
Mine hasn't done a lot of work, but is now my preferred welder whereas I tended to pick up the stick welder for quick jobs when I only had a cheap&nasty MIG.

Be aware that you need to run straight Argon for TIG, so unless you're seriously going hire another bottle and use it, IMO you'd be better to swap the TIG torch out for something you're actually going to use if you get the chance (an initial gas fill, or auto welding mask etc).

Steve

[davidsonsm]

I bought a Unimig 180 MIG welder as a novice a couple of years back. Its done a heap of things now. So glad I bought it. Its more than paid for itself. So handy, being able to lay a bead of weld.

It was from Total Tools from memory and under $500. I've only ever run gasless. Perfect for what I use it for. But there again. I've nothing to compare it to.

[Toxic_Avenger]

To be honest, comparing on duty cycle should not be a concern for a home hobbyist. Duty cycle is usually calculated on a 10 minute period at a given temperature. Unless you are welding a trans-siberian pipeline, you will never need a 100% duty cycle machine. Realistically, you are measuring out the job, tacking it up etc.

I've had first hand experience with the BOC multiprocess unit, would be my pick for a decent quality multiprocess unit for a home workshop.
Keep in mind the smaller 175 machines are not going to do a very flash job on aluminium mig. It's DC tig also, so no aluminium there either. Otherwise very capable.

[twr7cx]

To be honest, comparing on duty cycle should not be a concern for a home hobbyist. Duty cycle is usually calculated on a 10 minute period at a given temperature. Unless you are welding a trans-siberian pipeline, you will never need a 100% duty cycle machine. Realistically, you are measuring out the job, tacking it up etc.

I have had issues with my current SIP Group 140 amp arc cutting out due to heat quiet easily. But that is possibly due to the welder being almost 10 years old and having never really been used and being a small cheapie unit.


I've had first hand experience with the BOC multiprocess unit, would be my pick for a decent quality multiprocess unit for a home workshop.

The BOC just became a front contender after I found that BOC Australia are undercutting their stores by selling them on eBay for $762.85 < Smootharc Multiprocess 175 Welder | eBay > - that's $160.00 cheaper than my local BOC offered it for and $180.00 cheaper than BOC advertise on their own website < BOC Smootharc 175 Multi-Process Welder | BOC Australia (http://www.boc.com.au/shop/en/au-boc-industrial-store/boc-smootharc-multiprocess-175) >.

Still has the 18 month warranty and BOC have a store locally and contracted repairer locally.

Also of note is the Lincoln PowerCRAFT 180i < Lincoln Electric (http://www.lincolnelectric.com.au/products/page350/category1/category73/powercraft-180i-mig) > at $895.00 plus delivery costs - extra for the TIG torch < Lincoln Electric Powercraft 180i MIG TIG Stick Inverter | eBay >.

The Uni-Mig KUMJR190 is also available at $1,025.00 plus freight costs < UNI MIG MIG MMA TIG 190 Inverter Unimig in Nowra, NSW | eBay >.

[dero]

I have had a WIA mig for 10 years now , has done a lot of work & given no trouble at all. I think they have a special on at the moment too .

[Phil B]

I will get howls of protest for saying this but I am a novice welder and bought a Weldcorp 100amp gasless mig from Bunnings for $300 and taught myself to weld.
It will do anything I or any the hobyist needs and has been great.
Why spend $1000's of dollars on a fancy machine that you will never use to it's capacity? My advise would be stick to gasless mig as well because of the cost and hassle of buying gas for a "normal" mig. Welding thick metals will be beyond your ability initially so 100amp has proved to be more than enough for me.
Phil.

[dero]

I hear you Phil . My experience with most things has been that the cost over the long run is much the same , the cheaper ones do not generally last as long as the trade ones but they are cheaper . the way I look at it these days is that if you are going to need a tool for the long term, you can pay less and replace it when it breaks , or pay the money up front . The advantage of the trade quality tool is that they are usually nicer to use , & I like that .

[steveG]

My experience with cheap MIGs had been the opposite to Phil's. Crap machines and horrible to use. If I was only going to spend $300 on a welder I would get an inverter stick welder and definitely not a mig. Nice to use a much more versatile than a mig.

Steve

[twr7cx]

I asked about the warranty procedure for the BOC eBay store and they provided the following:


We use the same authorised dealers and repair agents across our network so in the event of a warranty assessment, we will authorise you to send your machine to the nearest (or your preferred) agent on our BOC list. The machines don't normally come back to us.

I intend to give the local BOC store an opportunity to price match before purchasing though.

[twr7cx]

I thought a final post would be appropriate to finish this thread off and let you know of my decision. I ended up purchasing the BOC Smootharc 175 this afternoon. I went into my local BOC store (Derwent Park) with my iPad and the BOC eBay listing. I asked them if they would price match it for me and they did. Further to that, they were extremely pleasant about it, very helpful in still running me through the features and settings on the machine and some other advice. I then purchased some 0.8 gasless wire and they did that for half price because I had just bought the machine with them. All up very happy with my purchase and they've certainly won me over as a future customer!

[dero]

Happy welding .

[Phil B]

What did it eventually cost you?
Is it gasless?

Enjoy.

Phil

[Toxic_Avenger]

What did it eventually cost you?
Is it gasless?

Enjoy.

Phil

Welding myth.
Making ANY MIG run 'gasless' filler material (Flux Cored Arc Welding, or FCAW) wire requires a few key things:
1) Ability to change the polarity of the torch (generally gasless wire is DC electrode Negative - 'normal' MIG/MAG welding is DC Electrode Positive).
2) Knurled feed rollers in the wire feed for pushing the fluxcored wire
3) Ideally a torch liner which is replaceable- use a smooth PTFE liner which won't 'snag' the wire
4) a torch which is capable of the duty cycles of gasless welding. In MIG/MAG, shielding gas plays a part in cooling the torch at the gas diffuser / nozzle. Some people run without the nozzle to get more airflow around the contact tip, but if this touches the job, you've just killed your torch.

[twr7cx]

What did it eventually cost you?

As per my above post, they matched the eBay price - $762.85.


Is it gasless?

Yes, as per the spec sheet and my experience now in having used it.


I have just completed my second welding job - the first was a minor spacer for the dirt bike forks when strapping down - a set of rock sliders/tree huggers/side steps for my D2a.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/10/788.jpg (http://s1185.photobucket.com/user/twr7cx/media/DFF1949C-51BF-4E94-A4A6-B4308305FC48_zpsrv7sstbp.jpg.html)
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/10/789.jpg (http://s1185.photobucket.com/user/twr7cx/media/26B69CC4-E579-4698-B198-12F8C0A479FF_zpshgx9inud.jpg.html)
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/10/790.jpg (http://s1185.photobucket.com/user/twr7cx/media/CB768A93-6622-431B-B709-64E14645F8E3_zpsddq6fdpj.jpg.html)
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/10/791.jpg (http://s1185.photobucket.com/user/twr7cx/media/84FF1B34-4A53-4C7D-88B6-E3CC99D8E486_zpsydtbwlz4.jpg.html)

My welding skills continually improved as I made them. I would love to redo them now as I would do a much better and neater job, but they'll do the job and I learnt a lot doing it.

I am super impressed with the BOC unit. Now that I know how to actually work/use the thing it has been brilliant. I have been doing some very very long welds and the duty cycle has more than kept up!