History Lesson From Les Hiddins.

[disco man]

I found a 2 DVD set from the library called "Bush Tucker Man 8 Classic Stories Of Survival With Les Hiddins".

As a young bloke i always loved watching Bush Tucker Man,between him and Malcolm Douglas,Alby Mangels,The Leyland Brothers.The idea of adventure was very much implanted by these great Australians.

I thought i knew a little bit about Australian history,but after watching this DVD it seems a lot of what i have told needs a bit of work.Below is a description from the sleeve notes.

Episode 1-The Coffee Royal Affair, Les travels to the Western Australian coast where sir Charles Kingsford Smith's reputation was damaged following one of Australia's earliest aviation disasters.

Episode 2-The Cannibal Convict, In the Wilds of south-west Tasmania Les looks at the story of one of Australia's earliest prison escapees Alexander Pierce.

Episode 3-The Best Of Them All, Follow the footsteps of the determined explorer John McDouall Stuart who became the first European to cross the country from south to north.

Episode 4-The Dutch Settlement, Les follows clues across Australia to investigate a report made last century about a Dutch colony that was established in central Australia following a ship wreck.

Episode 5- Gold Fever, Les travels to central Australia to investigate discoveries that claim to throw new light on the legend of Lasseter's lost reef.

Episode 6- The Passionate Prussian, Les looks at Leichardt's phenomenal journey from Moreton Bay to Port Essington and the mystery of his disappearance.

Episode 7- The Great Misadventure, The tale of Burke and Wills is re-evaluated and Les speculates how a knowledge of bush tucker may have changed the outcome of this ill-fated party.

Episode 8- Into The Vilest Country, Les travels to the Cape York Peninsula in a manner that contrasts strongly with that of the cumbersome Kennedy expedition.

The story that sticks out the most for me is about the Dutch settlement, it states an englishman who was part of a exploration party traveling through Central Australia in the 1800's came across some Aboriginals that had a Masonic sign and referred to his gun as a musket.But as Les points out the English had stopped using the term musket many many years before.

The settlement was on the edge of a swamp or billabong and had over 300 Dutch settlers in a well constructed camp.Les speculates these Dutch people most likely came from a shipwrecked on the Western Australian coast.But what made them leave the coast? And what prompted them to keep walking inland?

And Les and many others have not been able to find any evidence of this settlement or what happened to these people why?. If this is true Dutch settlement predates English by many years.

Any thoughts on this guys?

[Brett1066]

I remember vaguely from school that we were told that the Dutch discovered Australia before Captain Cook. I think the ship they were on was the Duyfken, but don't quote me on this. I do know that some of the Dutch were shipwrecked off the WA coast, Dirk Hartog I think it was, around the Shark Bay area. Thats about the limit of my memory of school taught Oz history.;)

[bsperka]

It was called New Holland on maps of the time for a very good reason.

[disco man]

I remember vaguely from school that we were told that the Dutch discovered Australia before Captain Cook. I think the ship they were on was the Duyfken, but don't quote me on this. I do know that some of the Dutch were shipwrecked off the WA coast, Dirk Hartog I think it was, around the Shark Bay area. Thats about the limit of my memory of school taught Oz history.;)

I think the Dutch, French, and maybe the Spanish? found Australia well before the English. But i am not sure about the Dutch living here many years before the English then vanishing without a trace or solid record of them being here.

But thanks for replying mate.

[Mick_Marsh]

I found a 2 DVD set from the library called "Bush Tucker Man 8 Classic Stories Of Survival With Les Hiddins".

As a young bloke i always loved watching Bush Tucker Man,between him and Malcolm Douglas,Alby Mangels,The Leyland Brothers.The idea of adventure was very much implanted by these great Australians.

I thought i knew a little bit about Australian history,but after watching this DVD it seems a lot of what i have told needs a bit of work.Below is a description from the sleeve notes.

Episode 1-The Coffee Royal Affair, Les travels to the Western Australian coast where sir Charles Kingsford Smith's reputation was damaged following one of Australia's earliest aviation disasters.

Episode 2-The Cannibal Convict, In the Wilds of south-west Tasmania Les looks at the story of one of Australia's earliest prison escapees Alexander Pierce.

Episode 3-The Best Of Them All, Follow the footsteps of the determined explorer John McDouall Stuart who became the first European to cross the country from south to north.

Episode 4-The Dutch Settlement, Les follows clues across Australia to investigate a report made last century about a Dutch colony that was established in central Australia following a ship wreck.

Episode 5- Gold Fever, Les travels to central Australia to investigate discoveries that claim to throw new light on the legend of Lasseter's lost reef.

Episode 6- The Passionate Prussian, Les looks at Leichardt's phenomenal journey from Moreton Bay to Port Essington and the mystery of his disappearance.

Episode 7- The Great Misadventure, The tale of Burke and Wills is re-evaluated and Les speculates how a knowledge of bush tucker may have changed the outcome of this ill-fated party.

Episode 8- Into The Vilest Country, Les travels to the Cape York Peninsula in a manner that contrasts strongly with that of the cumbersome Kennedy expedition.

The story that sticks out the most for me is about the Dutch settlement, it states an englishman who was part of a exploration party traveling through Central Australia in the 1800's came across some Aboriginals that had a Masonic sign and referred to his gun as a musket.But as Les points out the English had stopped using the term musket many many years before.

The settlement was on the edge of a swamp or billabong and had over 300 Dutch settlers in a well constructed camp.Les speculates these Dutch people most likely came from a shipwrecked on the Western Australian coast.But what made them leave the coast? And what prompted them to keep walking inland?

And Les and many others have not been able to find any evidence of this settlement or what happened to these people why?. If this is true Dutch settlement predates English by many years.

Any thoughts on this guys?
Yep. The Dutch had been here long before the English claimed it.Dutch traders had been tradingwith the Aboriginals hundreds of years before Cook arrived.
I know a fellow who found a coin from the Dutch East India company in his back yard. Thinking it was rare, his subsequent investigations proved it was more common than he thought.
You know the dingo is not native to Australia. It was introduced by traders a very long time before Cook. The dingo originally came from Thailand I think.

[korg20000bc]

I love mysteries and I recall the stories from watching Les' shows on the telly.
A possibility for a group of Europeans leaving the coast could be that they went with a group of nomadic aborigines to a different seasonal camp... possibly.

Anyway, I love his work and I uploaded an old, now unavailable, VHS of Bush Tucker Man that was produced by Defence Public Relations. I'll link them below:
Original Bush Tucker Man Part1(of4) - YouTube
Original Bush Tucker Man Part2(of4) - YouTube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytqH3cLPHTQ
Original Bush Tucker Man Part4(of4) - YouTube

[Brett1066]

Yeah I don't remember ever being told that any settlements were established before the English settled. But then again, doesn't mean there weren't any. History is normally written by the winners, and the English may well have suppressed any information of any other settlements to strengthen their claim on Australia - after all, it was the age of colonialism with the European powers competing for new lands and claims.
Interesting all the same.

[101RRS]

Also don't forget the English were exploring the NW Coast at least 100 years before Cook "discovered" Australia. Likewise the Dutch, Portuguese and Spanish were here at least 80 years before that - so up to 200 years before Cook.

Torres
Tasman
Dampier
Hartog

are the well known ones but there are more.

Garry

[Mick_Marsh]

I remember vaguely from school that we were told that the Dutch discovered Australia before Captain Cook. I think the ship they were on was the Duyfken, but don't quote me on this. I do know that some of the Dutch were shipwrecked off the WA coast, Dirk Hartog I think it was, around the Shark Bay area. Thats about the limit of my memory of school taught Oz history.;)
You're thinking of the Batavia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batavia_%28ship%29).
The Duyfken (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duyfken) was another Dutch ship. I saw the replica at Goolwa some years ago. It is known to be the first ship to land on Australian shores in the very early 1600's, before the Batavia.

[Brett1066]

You're thinking of the Batavia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batavia_%28ship%29).
The Duyfken (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duyfken) was another Dutch ship. I saw the replica at Goolwa some years ago. It is known to be the first ship to land on Australian shores in the very early 1600's, before the Batavia.


Knew I should have paid more attention at school dammit! :D

[cummo]

Yep - I have the book (I think I got it signed by Les at a local promo event years ago. A fascinating read.


You can still buy the DVD from the ABC Shop - $30; plus the complete collection of the Bushtucker Man DVD series - $40 (on special till 8 September).


I think I'll be dropping some hints at home for my upcoming birthday........


Cheers, Dave

[disco man]

Also don't forget the English were exploring the NW Coast at least 100 years before Cook "discovered" Australia. Likewise the Dutch, Portuguese and Spanish were here at least 80 years before that - so up to 200 years before Cook.

Torres
Tasman
Dampier
Hartog

are the well known ones but there are more.

Garry

G'day mate it sounds very likely that Dutch settlement Les is talking about was indeed there,any thoughts on why no trace or evidence has not been found? From what i know there is no records from the Dutch about this.

[Grappler]

Anthropologists think Dutch survivors from Zuytdorp wrecked in 1712 at Shark Bay WA have descendents in the local indigenous community (Carpets of Silver- Playford)

The Dutch vessel Duyfken explored and charted the Gulf of Carpentaria in 1606. It was not wrecked on the Australia coast

[101RRS]

There are quite a few historic records of ships wrecked on the west coast and there were known survivors (from other survivors) that were never seen again - bit later rumours of light skinned and blond aborigines just inland from the west coast.

So it would seem there may have been whites living with aborigines and over time as the "black" gene is more dominant than the "white" gene these white features would slowly fade. I guess DNA testing was developed too late to test aboriginals in the area as white colonisation years later would disguise and earlier European DNA in the aboriginal population.

I doubt there was a population of 300 Europeans - where did they supposedly exist.

Garry

[JamesB71]

Thanks for sharing the Les Hiddens stuff. :)

[Grappler]

A comment on Q&A or was it Legally Black?, the other night that Muslims discovered Australia, got me googling
Turns out, some coins from the 10th century, have been found on Wessel Is
They were thought to have originated from a former African sultanate in Kilwa, near modern-day Tanzania

Read more: Coins found suggest Australia was discovered SIX CENTURIES before Captain Cook arrived on the island | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2327362/Coins-suggest-Australia-discovered-SIX-CENTURIES-Captain-Cook-arrived-island.html#ixzz3BekE2nIJ)
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

[korg20000bc]

A comment on Q&A or was it Legally Black?, the other night that Muslims discovered Australia, got me googling
Turns out, some coins from the 10th century, have been found on Wessel Is
They were thought to have originated from a former African sultanate in Kilwa, near modern-day Tanzania

Read more: Coins found suggest Australia was discovered SIX CENTURIES before Captain Cook arrived on the island | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2327362/Coins-suggest-Australia-discovered-SIX-CENTURIES-Captain-Cook-arrived-island.html#ixzz3BekE2nIJ)
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

We can keep doing this almost ad infinitum - it was really discovered by whomever the aborigines used to be way back. Perhaps they ousted who was here before them.

I love finds of old coins in place. Unfortunately, they only give us an earliest possible date, not a latest possible date.

[Pickles2]

I just saw & bought the "total" Les Hiddins collection, 5CD set from the ABC shop,...I do remember Les, so I'm very much looking forward to viewing them.
Pickles.

[DiscoMick]

As said above, some people from the Batavia wreck got ashore (Peter Fitzsimmons wrote a book about it I read recently) and there were certainly other Dutch wrecks.
It is said the Chinese first got here in 1421, but that story is disputed, like so many others.
Captain Cook didn't 'discover' Australia - people have been sailing boats to Australia for at least 50,000 years.

[disco man]

I love mysteries and I recall the stories from watching Les' shows on the telly.
A possibility for a group of Europeans leaving the coast could be that they went with a group of nomadic aborigines to a different seasonal camp... possibly.

Anyway, I love his work and I uploaded an old, now unavailable, VHS of Bush Tucker Man that was produced by Defence Public Relations. I'll link them below:
Original Bush Tucker Man Part1(of4) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7A-nqul7w-k)
Original Bush Tucker Man Part2(of4) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyC9czJi1Qg)
Original Bush Tucker Man Part3(of4) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytqH3cLPHTQ)
Original Bush Tucker Man Part4(of4) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0Qlu75yVEk)

The second video raises some very interesting queistions about a possible link between Australia and Madagascar which i think is fascinating.

[justinc]

A fantastic DVD set!!! Will probably watch it again over the weekend now, been at least a year since I saw it :)

JC

[Pickles2]

The second video raises some very interesting queistions about a possible link between Australia and Madagascar which i think is fascinating.
Yes.
One of my very best friend's from school days, was Graeme Walsh, who became not only Australia's, but the World's most knowledgeable expert on Australian Aboriginal Rock Art, in particular, the "Bradshaw Paintings".If you're into this stuff, you'll know about Graeme.
These paintings show boats, seafaring stuff, which Aborigines were not, predate by a VVVEEERRYY long time, some "existing" "theories", suggesting people were here 40/50000 years ago, pre dating some Aboriginal "theories", that they were the "originals".
For sure, not saying what is the truth, BUT, who can say, "WHAT IS THE TRUTH"?
Pickles.

[disco man]

Yes.
One of my very best friend's from school days, was Graeme Walsh, who became not only Australia's, but the World's most knowledgeable expert on Australian Aboriginal Rock Art, in particular, the "Bradshaw Paintings".If you're into this stuff, you'll know about Graeme.
These paintings show boats, seafaring stuff, which Aborigines were not, predate by a VVVEEERRYY long time, some "existing" "theories", suggesting people were here 40/50000 years ago, pre dating some Aboriginal "theories", that they were the "originals".
For sure, not saying what is the truth, BUT, who can say, "WHAT IS THE TRUTH"?
Pickles.

Bloody hell pickles you know some very interesting people,These paintings really change a lot of what i know about Australian history.I am very keen to follow up and try and learn more about this fascinating possible link.

[Bearman]

Even though I have seen all of Les's videos (quite a few time on the idiot box) I am going to drop a few hints that I would like a set for Fathers day. Never know, might get lucky:D