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nugge t
29th August 2014, 12:23 PM
Not sure why we want to stop these guys leaving the country to fight. Who knows what they may get upto if kept here. They certainly are not going to thank Australia. The real priority would be to make sure they don't get back in and that their benefits are cut off immediately.

Five grounded, 40 questioned in terror blitz


by: CAMERON STEWART and PIA AKERMAN
From: The Australian (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/)
August 29, 2014 12:00AM
AT least five suspected jihadist recruits have been detained at Australian airports and prevented from travelling overseas in recent months, amid suspicion that they intended to travel to fight in Syria and Iraq.

The move is part of a growing government crackdown on Australians going overseas to fight that has involved at least 40 ­coercive hearings being conducted to help agencies detect those who plan to go and fight.

Immigration Minister Scott Morrison said a Sydney man was stopped at Sydney airport on Sunday and another man was stopped at Melbourne airport on Monday as he and his family ­attempted to fly to the Middle East.

Another man and his family were detained at Melbourne airport on Wednesday but the man, who is believed to have been on an ASIO watch list, was later permitted to fly to Malaysia.

Justice Minister Michael Keenan revealed yesterday that the Australian Crime Commission had conducted at least 40 hearings in the past 12 months in connection with Syria and Iraq, where 60 Australians are currently believed to be fighting.

“The ACC has been operating jointly with its national security partners to support the domestic understanding of Middle Eastern conflicts,” Mr Keenan said.

“These examinations have resulted in an enhanced understanding of Australians likely to travel offshore to engage in conflicts and their travel patterns and financing.”

As more details of the crackdown emerged, Tony Abbott set out the moral case for Australian military intervention in Iraq, telling parliament the slaughter of innocents by jihadist extremists was close to “pure evil”.

The Prime Minister stressed that he had so far received no request for military assistance and any such step would require a cabinet decision and consultation with the opposition.

The government has set up new counter-terrorism units at Sydney and Melbourne airports to help detect those Australians who leave to fight overseas.

The family of a man who was pulled off a Malaysia-bound flight at Melbourne airport on Wednesday have demanded answers from authorities, saying little ­explanation was provided for the “humiliating” incident.

The 26-year-old man, his wife, his younger brother and their mother were already seated on the Air Asia flight to Kuala
Lumpur on Wednesday morning when Customs officials boarded the plane and demanded to see their passports. They then escorted the family off the plane and held them for questioning at the airport, inspecting their luggage and examining their phone messages and photos before releasing the man and his family without any charge and handing the luggage back. The group was allowed to travel to Malaysia for their holiday yesterday.

The man’s sister, who asked to be identified only as Hannah, said her brother had been on an ASIO watchlist since 2009, when the family home was raided as authorities swooped on suspects linked to a plot to attack the Holsworthy army barracks. The man is friends with Nayev El Sayed, who is serving an 18-year sentence for his role, which involved seeking a fatwa from a Somali sheik ahead of the planned attack.

“We’re really upset that this is happening, that it’s happening all over again,” Hannah said. “If he’s a suspected terrorist, why do they book a flight for him the next day to leave again? How does that make any sense?”
Hannah said her brother was a “peaceful” man who had expressed no desire to join the jihadist fighters in Iraq or Syria.

“We all watch the news and it’s very distressing what we see, but no one is saying they want to pack their bags and get on the plane and go fight,” she said. “He can’t even kill a spider. He is so quiet and innocent, very calm, peaceful.”

Hannah said her brother had travelled to Malaysia two years ago for a family wedding without any problems, and questioned why her family had not been stopped at check-in or any of the screening points before boarding their flight.

Asked about the family’s case, a spokesman for Mr Morrison declined to answer questions but said the man was not included as one of the five people suspected of terrorist links who have been pulled off flights at Australian airports under the crackdown.

DiscoMick
29th August 2014, 12:31 PM
So, four people are pulled off a flight to Malaysia because one of them knows someone who has been convicted of terrorism, but apparently there is no known evidence the bloke himself is any threat.
What crime has been committed here? The authorities couldn't find any and let them go. No charges were laid.
I know people who have been convicted of crimes. Does that make me a criminal threat?
This could very easily spiral out of control and turn into a witchhunt against people who are 'different'. We already have peaceful Australians afraid this government is targeting them. Why - because that's how people are targeted in other countries.
There's already enough racism in this country as it is without encouraging more.
A nation of coffee drinkers ... and racists? - The Drum (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-08-28/johnson-a-nation-of-coffee-drinkers-and-racists/5702264)

incisor
29th August 2014, 12:36 PM
i'm with nuggett on this one

as worrying as that may sound :p

why stop em leaving...

nismine01
29th August 2014, 12:38 PM
Is this the Australian version of McCarthyism?
Let's just call it Abbotism, can't just follow the Yanks with everything we do.

Arghhh! reds under the beds! :wasntme:

Cheers

Mike

olbod
29th August 2014, 12:54 PM
Let them go, dont let them back.
Read somewhere that fifteen that went to fight had been killed.
Good result.

DiscoMick
29th August 2014, 01:06 PM
I'm not concerned about stopping the ones who have gone off to fight from coming back.
What I'm concerned about is examples of apparently innocent people being targeted simply because they appear 'different', like the family going on holiday to Malaysia referred to in the story Nugget quoted. No crime committed and no reason they shouldn't come back, I reckon.

2stroke
29th August 2014, 01:11 PM
I agree let them go but not come back. Will those who couldn't go just be more inclined to want to fight here? Screen them on the way out, I'm sure they could track their mobile phone while they're away, maybe get some intelligence. I'd imagine they're doing something to track those who've left already.

nugge t
29th August 2014, 01:14 PM
I am a peaceful Australian and I don't have any fear of the Government coming to smash my still. I am actually more worried about the prospect of a nutter setting off a bomb in Australia because he has a grief over something happening in another country.

McCarthyism ? Abbotism ? Blind Naivety Perhaps?

DiscoMick
29th August 2014, 01:16 PM
So, where is the evidence the family in your story going to Malaysia had done anything to warrant blocking them from coming back?

AndyG
29th August 2014, 01:21 PM
Trouble is,
Let them go & they skill up, then they come back skilled up and a chip on their should, keep them out, i don't think so.

For example,
A Muslim, no Visa to go to Indonesia, walk across the boarder to Vanimo, fly to Daru, hire a local boat to Australia, get picked up by your mates 4WD, (not a LR of course) and your in.

nugge t
29th August 2014, 01:22 PM
I'm not concerned about stopping the ones who have gone off to fight from coming back.
What I'm concerned about is examples of apparently innocent people being targeted simply because they appear 'different', like the family going on holiday to Malaysia referred to in the story Nugget quoted. No crime committed and no reason they shouldn't come back, I reckon.

There was no reference to them not being allowed back as far as I can see.

They were detained on the way out because he was on a watch lis tand then allowed to go. If I was mates with someone serving 18 for planning a terror attack I reckon I wouldn't be too surprised if I was being watched.

olbod
29th August 2014, 01:31 PM
Is this the Australian version of McCarthyism?
Let's just call it Abbotism, can't just follow the Yanks with everything we do.

Arghhh! reds under the beds! :wasntme:

Cheers

Mike


I dont think it is just a case of following the yanks.
The people that were close to the last bombings in london and the families of those killed or injured will probably support every means to contain and seek out the mental cases.
It is easy to be complacent.
We were outraged when the bombings took place in bali.
If folk dont think it could happen here they are delusional.
If innocents get pulled over and then go on their way, no harm done.
But we have these mental cases here in Australia, I suspect lots of them.
Also sleepers.
Seek them out and identify them for the good of all, Muslims included.

Bigbjorn
30th August 2014, 01:28 PM
When I saw the title of this thread I thought "What a good idea". Then I read on and found nugge t was not referring to ...i's and ..m's.

blitz
30th August 2014, 02:49 PM
AS nismine01 said, this is another version of Reds under the bed; hysteria of a political kind, Macarthyism at it's worst.


The only reason why Americans or Australians are being killed is because they are over there, this is an Arabic issue which in my opinion we should butt out of it and let them sort it out.


It is a very sordid history created by the British and French it is continued by the Americans, If we leave them alone in a few years they will have sorted it out, yes people will die, but it is their fight which has nothing to do with us.


As to Australians going over there to fight the holy war, let them go but don't come back.

PhilipA
30th August 2014, 03:24 PM
If they went over fought and maybe were killed no problem.

Er but what about the facebook and twitter pages urging Australians to become martyrs and the threats against Australians etc etc.

They are not just going to fight with the most barbaric terror group we have seen for a while, they are proselytizing to others in Australia to come and join and while there to kill anyone who doesn't share their beliefs including Sunnies, Christians, Jews, Buddhists etc.

Do you think after being exposed to that for a couple of years they will come home and "Well glad that is over, now I can get on with my life as a whatever."
Do you think that any country can have 100% guarantees that every Immigration officer will be able to detect a fake passport or that terrorists cannot some means to get back ?

Surely better to stop them in the first place.

Also the reports I saw about the ones stopped said that one at least had illegal amounts of cash ,$30,000 was stated. This in itself is a crime.

As to the family delayed. Sleep with dogs you get fleas. I have been delayed at an airport when a drug dog detected drugs in my luggage, which after quite a long time proved to be a false alarm. I don't get too upset about such things.
Regards Philip A

Pickles2
30th August 2014, 03:43 PM
I'm with Nugget,..1000%.
They ain't gonna make muxh overall difference to their cause, & they might even end up not being of this earth anymore, which would be the ideal result.
Also, make sure their Welfare is cut off, & DON'T let 'em back in, even if they do very quickly realize that the grass is greener in Aus.
Pickles.