Mud Tyres 18"

[~Rich~]

Hi Guys,
Just had a set of 275/65 R18 Atturo Trail Blade Mud Terrains fitted:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/09/1369.jpg (http://s193.photobucket.com/user/VSK5/media/20140905_061925042_iOS_zps8efce47f.jpg.html)

They are LT and 10 ply construction.
That is a 255/55 R19 GG next to it.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2015/08/777.jpg (http://s193.photobucket.com/user/VSK5/media/AtturoMT_zps03c31465.jpg.html)

So you may ask are they legal?
Well yes they are - even in NSW.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/09/1370.jpg (http://s193.photobucket.com/user/VSK5/media/Legal4_zps8660f99a.jpg.html)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/09/1371.jpg (http://s193.photobucket.com/user/VSK5/media/Legal3_zps3c45725a.jpg.html)

So they are 6.32% larger in diameter, less than the 7% to be legal.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/09/1372.jpg (http://s193.photobucket.com/user/VSK5/media/Legal1_zps48a1e3af.jpg.html)

And less than 26mm wider.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/09/1373.jpg (http://s193.photobucket.com/user/VSK5/media/Legal2_zps25821824.jpg.html)

Yes I have had to modify the seam that is in the front of the rear wheel arch and also move the coolant lines to the rear A/C unit too.

These are not my day to day tyres they are only for 4wd trips.
Can't wait to test them out ;)

[ADMIRAL]

Bet they howl like a banshee

[gossamer]

Looking forward to seeing a pic of them them on then hearing how they go

[simoncs]

great work Rich!!!

[Redback]

They look pretty good Rich, when you testing them out:)

I like the painted rims too, did you do those yourself??

Baz.

[gghaggis]

Legal for a D4, but not an RRS. I've been trying the Achilles Desert Hawk Extreme MT in 265/60R18 (112Q) - used them for our Simpson/Birdsville trek. So far I've done around 9,000 km on them. A little noisy, but not overly noticeable, and fairly good road manners up to around 145kph (unlike my Maxxis Bighorns, that wander all over the road). They're wearing quickly, as you'd expect from a mud tyre used daily.

Curiously, for a mud tyre, they're not rated LT - 7 belt tread and 3 belt sidewall - but have certainly copped a beating without any cuts or punctures.

Even in Perth, they're pretty cheap - under $280 each.

Cheers,

Gordon

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2015/08/765.jpg

[~Rich~]

Yeah I looked at the Achillies MT too Gordon, they didn't have the 275/65 R18 so that counted them out. I also considered the Cooper STT but at $550ea they ruled themselves out! Also on the shortlist was Summit Mudhogs and the Bighorns.

Yes Baz I painted the road 19's with plastidip, the 18's are painted with epoxy to be tougher.

[~Rich~]

I researched them all, Gordon had mentioned the Bighorns tram tracking. The Summits I couldn't really find any reviews on. The Atturo's have been available in the states and have had some decent reviews. No tram tracking, reasonable noise levels.

[gghaggis]

Yeah I looked at the Achillies MT too Gordon, they didn't have the 275/65 R18 so that counted them out.

Apparently they're releasing the same X-MT mud tyre in 285/60R18 as well - should be available in the next month or so.

Cheers,

Gordon

[Geedublya]

Yes I have had to modify the seam that is in the front of the rear wheel arch and also move the coolant lines to the rear A/C unit too.

How hard is it to move the A/C lines? I'm thinking of going up to a similar diameter.

[~Rich~]

How hard is it to move the A/C lines? I'm thinking of going up to a similar diameter.

It's only if you have rear A/C but it's not for the faint hearted moving those coolant lines like this:
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2015/02/650.jpg (http://s193.photobucket.com/user/VSK5/media/D3/normal_heater-lines_zps344fd924.jpg.html)

Trimming or bending over of the seam is not hard, it's the extra trimming out the very bottom of that seam for the pipework and then bending them around or using heater hose and keeping it tight which is the challenge. The original pipes are alloy with a rubber lagging over.

[~Rich~]

Bet they howl like a banshee
I won't be fitting them until the end of the month as I am doing quite a few kms for work & play on the tarmac, once fitted I'll let you know how they are.

[gossamer]

Still waiting for the photo of them fitted :D

[~Rich~]

Still waiting for the photo of them fitted :D


Not on just yet, I have another work trip on before I swap them over.
It's a job for the long weekend. ;)

[scarry]

It's only if you have rear A/C but it's not for the faint hearted moving those coolant lines like this:
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2015/02/650.jpg (http://s193.photobucket.com/user/VSK5/media/D3/normal_heater-lines_zps344fd924.jpg.html)

Trimming or bending over of the seam is not hard, it's the extra trimming out the very bottom of that seam for the pipework and then bending them around or using heater hose and keeping it tight which is the challenge. The original pipes are alloy with a rubber lagging over.

Are the pipes coolant for heating,or refrigerant for the A/C.If they are coolant,and you don't mind having no heating in the rear,you could probably loop them together under the vehicle and do without them if you wanted?

[AnD3rew]

Legal for a D4, but not an RRS. I've been trying the Achilles Desert Hawk Extreme MT in 265/60R18 (112Q) - used them for our Simpson/Birdsville trek. So far I've done around 9,000 km on them. A little noisy, but not overly noticeable, and fairly good road manners up to around 145kph (unlike my Maxxis Bighorns, that wander all over the road). They're wearing quickly, as you'd expect from a mud tyre used daily.

Curiously, for a mud tyre, they're not rated LT - 7 belt tread and 3 belt sidewall - but have certainly copped a beating without any cuts or punctures.

Even in Perth, they're pretty cheap - under $280 each.

Cheers,

Gordon

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2015/08/765.jpg

Hi Gordon have you experienced them on the Tarmac in the wet? If so how did they go? That's my main worry about MTs for everyday use

[gghaggis]

Hi Gordon have you experienced them on the Tarmac in the wet? If so how did they go? That's my main worry about MTs for everyday use

They're siped, and so far handle wet bitumen reasonably well for an MT - better than the Goodyear MTR's I used to run.

Cheers,

Gordon

[~Rich~]

Are the pipes coolant for heating,or refrigerant for the A/C.If they are coolant,and you don't mind having no heating in the rear,you could probably loop them together under the vehicle and do without them if you wanted?


Yes they are for rear heating. So yes you could just loop them to each other at both ends of the cuts. But why would you do that rather than keep it working?

[~Rich~]

ON!

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/05/291.jpg (http://s193.photobucket.com/user/VSK5/media/D3/87C4E3A3-4652-4AFB-877B-382A68B44ED1_zpsicwir9z1.jpg.html)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/10/1266.jpg (http://s193.photobucket.com/user/VSK5/media/D3/7512B7A9-ACE2-4CBC-93F1-36628972C2A0_zpsufspvhiu.jpg.html)

With tyres this size you need to remould the rear inner wheel arch linings as well as those seams, many of the existing bumps need to be remodelled flat!
Go for a drive over bad / large speed bumps, it will rub and show you where to adjust the liner.

This can easily be done with a hot air gun, heating the plastic until it becomes soft and pushing it as required. It can even be folded over itself and melted to join back together. Be careful not to overdo it and make a hole though.

Are they noisy - well compared to any street tyre yes they are.
Do they howl - yes, turn the stereo up!
Can I still talk to the passenger at highway speeds - yes.
Do they handle well? - in the dry yes - wet still waiting.

[~Rich~]

Well 2 trips under their belt and I'm loving the offroad grip and height I get from these approx 50mm diameter larger tyres. Gearing change is unnoticeable too.
On rocky terrain they work a treat, gravel excellent and yet to test them in the mud.
On the freeway I'm not finding extra noise uncomfortable and was still able to talk without raising my voice to my passengers.
There is a bit of understeer on winding roads but as my passenger mentioned that this can disappear after the tyres had worn in a bit.
I have driven in wet road conditions and found them to be fine.
I've swapped back to my road tyres now and they look so small!

Oh yes I've found a couple more spots to modify in the inner guards, one at 10 o'clock on the passenger front, and another at about 9.30 o'clock on the drivers rear.

[TerryO]

I to took the KM2's off of the D3 on Friday and put the smaller Cooper AT3's on and your correct Rich man they look small after having big MUDs on almost to the stage the D3 nearly looks sooky.

[Icemanx10]

Hi Rich,

Any feedback on how the Atturo's go on sand?

With the wheel well mods do you drive them on normal height on road, or do you run rods/LLMAS with some lift (i.e. normal mode but suspension actually in offroad height)?

I'm agonizing between the Atturo's and Cooper ST-maxx, so any advice would help!

There's a definite price argument for the Atturo's.

Cheers,
Mark

[~Rich~]

Hi Rich,

Any feedback on how the Atturo's go on sand?

With the wheel well mods do you drive them on normal height on road, or do you run rods/LLMAS with some lift (i.e. normal mode but suspension actually in offroad height)?

I'm agonizing between the Atturo's and Cooper ST-maxx, so any advice would help!

There's a definite price argument for the Atturo's.

Cheers,
Mark

They go great on sand, not an issue.

Well - height wise I have to drop down to Access height as well as use -20 on LLAMS to get in my garage with my roof rack on.
Most of the time I forget to switch it back to LLAMS off and I still have no problems driving around at that height!
I only sometimes get a slight rub when going over a big speed bump a bit quick at that -20.

Cooper ST-Max - what a rip off in price!

I'd actually recommend Summit / Kanati Mud Hogs though myself see this thread for even more choices:
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/d3-d4-rrs/223570-federal-couragia-10ply-mts.html

Shop around, price will be a big factor in Perth.

[Icemanx10]

Thanks for the prompt reply Rich.
The mud hogs didn't have as much feedback available when I considered them a year ago. They look like exactly what I want.
I think buying the tyres over east and shipping them to Perth is the go. Unfortunately, Perth has some supply challenges in addition to getting about 50 cents on the Aussie dollar on the cost of everything.
Regards
Mark

[~Rich~]

I've got these tyres going cheap in the for sale section:

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/wheels-tyres-suspension-sale/230786-4-x-275-65-r18-mud-tyres-cromer-sydney-northern-beaches.html#post2479160

[Aaron40]

What price per tyre for the Achilles Desert Hawk in 266/60/18 please?

[Drizzle]

A quick google...

Full service price
https://www.jaxtyres.com.au/tyres/brands/achilles/desert-hawk-x-mt

Tyres only price
http://m.ebay.com.au/itm/221959153536

Gordon also has a secondhand set available
http://www.greenovalexperience.com/#!2nd-hand/cai3

[Owen]

Thanks for the great post, something to save for before my Cape York trip in '17 !!

[~Rich~]

Well Atturo MT's sold.
Replaced with Hankook MT (RT03) 275/65 R18
http://screenshot.net/l1py5ap.jpg
Did quite a bit of searching for reviews of tyres and found that this tyre was recommended by many as the best tyre they ever had.
Time will tell how good they are.
Got to say they are quiet on the road compared to any other MT I'd had before incl BFG's.

[LandyAndy]

They look pretty good Rich.
Got a pic from a bit futher away,like a side view????
Cheers
Andrew

[Disco4SE]

They are great Rich. Had them on one of my 4WD's. Quiet on road for an MT and preformed well off road apart from thick gluggy mud, but then again any MT will.

I am running Procomp Extreme MT'2's at the moment. Only done a couple of thousands all on road. Haven't had them off road as yet. The Procomp's are definitely louder on road than the Hankooks and about $100.00 a corner dearer.

Let us know how they go.

Cheers, Craig

[Piddler]

The Hankooks are OK Rich, I have had lots of mt. I have these at moment approx 50,000 km. Be lucky get 65,000 where my BFG would get 80-90k

The Hankooks were much cheaper though for pretty good performance.
Cheers

[~Rich~]

I have these at moment approx 50,000 km. Be lucky get 65,000 where my bag would get 80-90k

The Hankooks were much cheaper though for pretty good performance.
Cheers

My BFG's? not my bag?
They don't make the BFG in 275/65 R18 in a MT, only in AT which of course you should get better milage out of.
These are my Off Road set so they should last quite a while if they perform. ;)

Cheers Rich

[LRD414]

So the Atturos didn't meet expectations Rich?

Scott

[~Rich~]

So the Atturos didn't meet expectations Rich?

Scott



I found the compound not to be to my liking, on dry clean rock they worked fine, but any sort of dirt or moisture on the rock they simply didn't have to grip unfortunately.
This was with tyre pressures at 18psi as well.

For gravel, sand and mud they were great.

I was torn between 3 Tyres this time:
Hankook MT
Kanati Trail Hog
Kanati Mud Hog

In the end I went for the tyre with the best reviews.

[Aaron40]

Rich do you think 275/65/18 is too large for everyday driving as your one and only set of tyres?

[~Rich~]

Rich do you think 275/65/18 is too large for everyday driving as your one and only set of tyres?

I'm going to answer you with some questions back:
What sort of 4wding are you doing? Normal run of the mill 4wding you won't need them this big.
If clearance is the issue first step is to either get LLAMS or Gordons Rods, if you still want/need more clearance then this size tyre may suit you.

Have you checked if this size is legal where you live?

Remember body modifications will most likely be necessary as well.

Your speedo will be out as well, easily checked if you use a GPS to check it on a flat constant section of road.

[Aaron40]

Cheers Rich, I have Llams, I like bigger rubber for clearance and footprint however don't want to throw gearing out too much and not real keen on cutting any bodywork, massaging seams is ok...

[~Rich~]

Hi Aaron,
Everything you have to modify is in this thread, rear A/C pipework, rear wheel arch seams and wheel arch linings front & rear. Also the wiring loom on the passenger side front chassis rail directly beside the tyre where it will rub on it on full lock turning left.

Note these MT tyres while they are 275 they only look to be about the same width as the standard 255 tyres, this is because of the profile is more rounded than a AT tyre and the width is at the widest point not at the tread face.
A 285/60 R18 AT tyre looks much wider!

I don't notice any performance loss to tell you the truth but I do have a BAS Remap.

[~Rich~]

They look pretty good Rich.
Got a pic from a bit futher away,like a side view????
Cheers
Andrew

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

LLAMS set at +30 in this photo

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

[Aaron40]

They look great Rich, do you think the offset of Gordon's rims would make the rubbing of the wheel arch lining seams any less?:)

[LandyAndy]

That looks really good Rich.
Andrew

[TerryO]

http://screenshot.net/2v7n8tw.jpg

LLAMS set at +30 in this photo

http://screenshot.net/wlg8eiq.jpg

Looks good Rich, can't wait to hear how they are going in a few thousand kilometres, my AT3's are all but worn out and I have been considering the Hankooks.

[Disco4SE]

Looks good Rich, can't wait to hear how they are going in a few thousand kilometres, my AT3's are all but worn out and I have been considering the Hankooks.
I ran AT3's as my every day tyres on the vehicle that I had the second set of wheels with the Hankook RTO3's.
Chalk & cheese off road but closer in comparison on road.
The AT3's were better on road in the wet, but failed compared to the Hankook's off road.


Cheers, Craig

[~Rich~]

No problem I'll let you know how they perform, I'm heading bush the Anzac long weekend and also to Channel country in July.

Now the sun is back out here is a better shot of the tyres:
http://screenshot.net/rgv7xsz.jpg

[~Rich~]

They look great Rich, do you think the offset of Gordon's rims would make the rubbing of the wheel arch lining seams any less?:)

Gordon should be able to confirm / deny differences.

[~Rich~]

TuffRR has exactly that setup, read here:
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/d3-d4-rrs/234711-cooper-mickey-thompson-tyres-18-d4-rims-4.html#post2524775

Update on Hankook MT RT03

Open road - they do not get any noisier compared to the Atturos.
Handling tar - great but they will never be as sure footed as a high terrain.
Handling dirt - fantastic.
Rocky steps - no contest compared to the Atturos. One particular step I had to had 4 attempts getting up with the Atturos I went straight up with the Hankooks. The grip level is that much better.

[Lukeis]

Hi Rich

I can see you have a D3 with 275/65/18, I wanted the same tyre on my D4 but does anyone know if it will rub on my car?

I don't have the skill to be moving AC lines etc so if that is the case, what is the absolute biggest tyre I can fit?

side note: what is epoxy paint? you mentioned you did this to the 18" wheels, I have plasti dip but agree this would be pulled off the first sign of rocks.

thanks mate, Luke

[LandyAndy]

Hi Rich

I can see you have a D3 with 275/65/18, I wanted the same tyre on my D4 but does anyone know if it will rub on my car?

I don't have the skill to be moving AC lines etc so if that is the case, what is the absolute biggest tyre I can fit?

side note: what is epoxy paint? you mentioned you did this to the 18" wheels, I have plasti dip but agree this would be pulled off the first sign of rocks.

thanks mate, Luke

Luke.
Have a look for Gordons website,he is GGhaggis on here.His website is Green Oval Experience.The man to see for all things D3/D4/RRS.He has a spreadsheet on his website on what tyres fit and what mods are needed.
Andrew

[~Rich~]

Epoxy paint comes in spray cans at Bunnings etc. Its tougher than normal spray cans but takes 18hrs to dry!

Some have that size tyre on D4s, an alternative is 285/60 R18 which is 799mm OA rather than 815mm for the 275/65.
You can get by without moving the AC lines with for the 285's but not the 275's.

[Lukeis]

Hey Rich

I had a read of Gordon's green-oval-experience write ups, it sounds like its the other way around?

with 285/60/18 he mentions the need to move the AC lines, but not a mention on the 275/65/18 spec sheet.

I noticed Pro-speed-uk made a pretty amazing looking D4, if anyone hasn't seen this car its definitely worth a look: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3X8S4iebTc

It has the 275/65/18 tyres on it but i have no doubt they would have done any necessary changes to make them fit.

I particularly like this cars rock sliders, they seem fairly indestructible too if you watch this test video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c94XC79KqQU

[TuffRR]

Hey Rich

I had a read of Gordon's green-oval-experience write ups, it sounds like its the other way around?

with 285/60/18 he mentions the need to move the AC lines, but not a mention on the 275/65/18 spec sheet.



Definitely need to move with 275/65/18. And re-model the inner guards with a heat gun to ensure you don't rub holes through them.

[~Rich~]

Definitely need to move with 275/65/18. And re-model the inner guards with a heat gun to ensure you don't rub holes through them.

Exactly!
I've run both sizes on a D3 not a D4 and I got away without having to move the A/C lines or trim the seam within the rear wheel arches with the 285's. Yes the 285/60 R18's did occasionally rub on the seam and did end up rubbing a hole though the inner guard but the 275/65 R18's are 16mm OA bigger so there is your answer.

[Lukeis]

ah makes sense.

Just to clarify, is moving the AC lines only for cars with the rear (3rd) zone air-conditioning? or for all cars?

I'm happy with moulding the wheel arches but not crazy about changing the seam/AC lines.

FYI I wrote to prospeedUK who did the car in the video above and they just used lift rods to fit the 275/65/18 but recommended lock stops too. I don't want to be driveng around full time on the 'off road' height via rods so I will have to change my tyre choice

[~Rich~]

If you do not have rear A/C then it's a quite easy job, remove inner wheel arch linings and bend that seam over with a hammer!
Re mould the linings with a heat gun and refit.

I drive around at standard height and occasionally get a rub when going a bit quick over a speed bump, not enough to worry about though.
On dirt roads I'm normally at +30 with LLAMS.

[Lukeis]

275/65/18 it is then!

[~Rich~]

275/65/18 it is then!



Just noticed you live in Mona Vale, I'm in Cromer!

BTW - buy a LLAMS kit!!!

[Lukeis]

Hey rich, oh so close, should tee up a 4wd sometime!

Yeah I literally just bought the 3 way rods from GOE, I didn't want any switches visible in the car, by the sounds of it the rods shouldn't take long to change either way and a lot cheaper!

Given our chat above, any tips on where to get this size tyres cheaply nearby?

[~Rich~]

I found Bob Jane at Brookvale the best, followed by Jax.

There maybe another 4wd W/E planned latter this year for D3,D4 & RRS.

I'm in a club and also a private group to get away with.

[onesilop]

I'm going to get a second set of wheels/tyres for my d4 with Llams . I am not really want to mod the rear ac lines.

If I get 275 65 r18s and run Llams at off road height when they're fitted, will I have to make the mods?

[~Rich~]

Well it depends, are you going to use the vehicle off road? If yes then definitely. If it's just a show pony you could get away with it. Remember you won't be able to drive in car parks at Access height.

[Lukeis]

Hey Rich

I have found some near new AT3 (cooper) tyres, any thoughts on these?

I realise they aren't muds and they aren't the 275/65/18 size i was hoping for but they are going cheap however I'm not sure if they will really be much better than the road tyres i already have? the tread doesn't look very aggressive..

I have 255/60/18 already, these are 265/65/18

[onesilop]

Well it depends, are you going to use the vehicle off road? If yes then definitely. If it's just a show pony you could get away with it. Remember you won't be able to drive in car parks at Access height.

Thanks for that,

They are definitely for use not just show [emoji3] think I'll stick with the 265/65/r18

[~Rich~]

Hey Rich

I have found some near new AT3 (cooper) tyres, any thoughts on these?

I realise they aren't muds and they aren't the 275/65/18 size i was hoping for but they are going cheap however I'm not sure if they will really be much better than the road tyres i already have? the tread doesn't look very aggressive..

I have 255/60/18 already, these are 265/65/18

Mixed reviews on the AT3, they are a Cooper which can be a love / hate brand!
From what I've read check to see if it's a LT construction. If not I'd pass on them.
The tread pattern is better than O/E. ;)

[Lukeis]

yep, definitely LT strength and some it says.

Part of me says they are good value for the price, the other side of me says they are my spare wheels so they should be more aggressive!

I don't care for mud, but i do want to be able to climb in rocky conditions and definitely beach driving.

decisions decisions..

[Disco4SE]

I have found some near new AT3 (cooper) tyres, any thoughts on these?

Have had two sets of these and travelled quite a few Klm's on them.
Great on road wet or dry, good off road apart from thick mud as they gunk up very quickly. Good choice in the AT range.
Mud tyres are a different topic all together.


Cheers, Craig

[Dfourfun]

Yeah I literally just bought the 3 way rods from GOE, I didn't want any switches visible in the car, by the sounds of it the rods shouldn't take long to change either way and a lot cheaper!




Lukeis (and others) - note, if you have GOE rods (like I do) and you go a bigger diameter than 265/65/18, then it gets very difficult to reach over the tyres to get to the rods to swap over height, particularly the rears. A mate of mine has the 275's and whilst they look great you have to be a contorsionist to get to the rods (which is even less fun if the tyres are already grubby). Not an issue of course if you are a LLAMS user, only with rods (which I happen to think are fantastic, particularly Gordon's new versions without the rubber grommets). I too have the 3rd row air and have no interest in tinkering with it at all.

I am also looking for something more aggressive in that 265/65/18 size than my current OEM tyres (which I am trying to use up as quickly as I can!), but the choices are pretty uninspiring. I had the D697s on my prior D4 and they were terrific - until you got into clay soils or mud when they just turned to slicks... The D697s remain my default tyre unless something better comes along.

I have a few thousand Kms left on my current tyres before decision time, so any other bright ideas or suggestions welcome.

[gghaggis]

In 265/60R18, there is the Achilles X-MT (also now in 285/60R18). Good muddie, got me 1st place in the W4 Land Rover Challenge :cool:

Average on-road manners, but nothing uncommon for a muddie.

Cheers,

Gordon

[Dfourfun]

thanx for the suggestion Gordon, I will have a look at these Achillies and make sure they are LT as well (not clear from their website). The various 4WD forums have not been complimentary however about their performance on wet bitumen (which we get a lot of in Melbourne!). Some muddies behave better than others around town/highway, so as always it is a compromise. My fear is the way SWMBO drives around she will end up in trouble - and me in tears! - if the grip of these new tyres is substantially reduced from what is currently 'normal' for us. I was hoping to avoid it but perhaps 2 sets of tyres/rims is going to have to be my solution, a city set and a holiday set.

[Lukeis]

Hey Dfourfun

I ran some quotes today which might be of interest to you:

265/60/18

1) Achilles Desert Hawke MT = $230ex (JAX)
2) Maxxis AT MF980 = $295ex (JAX)

The Maxxis tread looks identical to the BFG tyres but without the $400 price tag. All other AT tyres I saw didn't have tread that seemed much better than good road tyres.

The Achilles really are a stand out if you want the most aggressive you can for the price but I personally have chosen to go for the Maxis, they should last a lot lot longer and if I'm honest I'm probably not as hardcore as I like to think.

over to you..

[Dfourfun]

Thanx Lukeis, I am also considering the BFG KO2 tyre - my local Jax guy only had the D697s in stock so he is getting a sample of all 3 in for me (Maxxis, Achilles & KO2) so I can look and touch them and compare the 4 of them against each other (so much better than just photos or brochures!). Meanwhile I will keep researching. Good luck with your Maxxis.

[Lukeis]

Now I want to wait and see what you pick.. Haha

[Russrobe]

Ah stoked I finally sorted a 2nd set of 18s and for free!!! Now the muddy choice dilemma begins. .. Thinking the 275 65 18 Achilles...https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/05/204.jpg

[LandyAndy]

Look good too.
Interesting to see how your tyre size choice goes.
Ive just fitted a set of 265/60x18 Cooper ATRs with little or no difference to driveability or fuel consumption.
I had 235/85x16 on my D2,they were awesome off road but hurt the fuel economy and driveability.
I think I would take alot of convincing to go much bigger than I have on the D4,perhaps out of warranty with an ecu upgrade:twisted::twisted::twisted:
Andrew

[Russrobe]

Look good too.
Interesting to see how your tyre size choice goes.
Ive just fitted a set of 265/60x18 Cooper ATRs with little or no difference to driveability or fuel consumption.
I had 235/85x16 on my D2,they were awesome off road but hurt the fuel economy and driveability.
I think I would take alot of convincing to go much bigger than I have on the D4,perhaps out of warranty with an ecu upgrade:twisted::twisted::twisted:
Andrew

Agreed Andy, and if I didn't have a tyre shop 2 kms away which gives me access to a belly lift i'd be too lazy to swap between sets.

No rear air con is another big factor, I don't have it and probably would be in the too hard basket for me to modify. Whereas a hairdryer and a few taps of a hammer I can justify...

Plus the car come with 15k km old cooper ht's so don't want to waste them!

[LandyAndy]

I have a hoist at work,I doubt I will be putting the OEM wheels back on.I do like them,the GOE wheels however are simply nice to look at.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/10/529.jpg (http://s113.photobucket.com/user/LandyAndy_2006/media/20160515_133332_zpstvnmlmgk.jpg.html)
Andrew

[Russrobe]

Anyone have experience with Dick Cepek FC2's?? They have some great reviews.

$220 per tyre, fitted=O

Dick Cepak FC2 275/65R18 | Wheels, Tyres & Rims | Gumtree Australia Kalamunda Area - Forrestfield | 1113966310 (http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/forrestfield/wheels-tyres-rims/dick-cepak-fc2-275-65r18/1113966310)

[LandyAndy]

You cant go wrong at that price,especially if you are only using them as play tyres.
Andrew

[Disco-tastic]

Ive read a number of good reviews on them. The people ive met who have them love them. Most of these guys were running 32inch tyres on a 16 or 17" rim though. Might be different in a lower profile.

Cheers

Dan

[~Rich~]

Good price!
More of an all terrain than a mud though, good all round tyre though.
All depends on what you want to do with them. ;)

[Russrobe]

Good price!
More of an all terrain than a mud though, good all round tyre though.
All depends on what you want to do with them. ;)
Mostly sand Rich, just want to make it as easy for the car as possible as you know there's some soft stuff here in W.A... Would put 33's on if they would fit!

Bit of mud too would be nice for winter.

[Russrobe]

Getting a bit mixed up with the MT vs AT in sand argument.

Some say MT are best, others say get AT for sand as much better..

MT's i was set on as it would be nice to have confidence in mud too but if majority of driving is on sand....

Stuck.

[LandyAndy]

In general,MTs are not good in sand,AT is better,and belive it or not HT are the best.The idea being the less digging the tyre does the more traction you have.
PS,incase you dont know,make sure you turn the DSC off every time on the sand,it re-sets all the time between special programs and re-starts.
If you dont turn it off its a self bogging feature;);););)
If you havent yet,get onto Gordon and grab a GOE handbook,you will learn LOTZ about your D4.
ENJOY
Andrew

[ozscott]

Ht are hopeless at pulling up out of ruts in sand though. I have found agreessive ATs are the best all round tyre in sand especially when towing where you need to be able to change direction and pull up and out of wheel ruts at speed...HT in these conditions just dont have the grip to do so and you have to bleed off a lot of speed give heaps of lock and mash the throttle to force the issue. Interestingly a tyre mag shootout some years ago showed Pirelli Scorpions (the older more aggressive ones) and Maxxis Bighorns (close to a full mud tyre) performed tops in sand v HT.

Cheers

Cheers

[Russrobe]

Well just went to trial fit those wheels and who would think evoque have different stud paterns so now I'm thinking just go 285 60 18s so i can stick to one set. Local shop has B/Stone 697s or General Grabbers in stock. Ggs are about 100 a tyre cheaper.... I need 5.

[Tombie]

I'd be going the D697s. A much more robust tyre.

[~Rich~]

I'd be going the D697s. A much more robust tyre.



X 2

[Tombie]

In general,MTs are not good in sand,AT is better,and belive it or not HT are the best.The idea being the less digging the tyre does the more traction you have.

<snip>

ENJOY

Andrew



Apologies my friend but that is absolutely not true.

The correct phrasing would be:

With incorrect throttle application:
HTs dig in
ATs dig in a bit fast
MTs dig in a lot faster

Driven correctly the more paddle like a tyre is the better it works on sand...

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/05/116.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/05/117.jpg

[Russrobe]

Trial fitted a 285 60 18 this morning, noticed there's only about 10mm clearance off the chassis and roughly the same up top. Anyone had inner sidewall rubbing with pressures down offroad?

[sheerluck]

I'm running 285/60-18 Cooper Zeon, and yes, there's not even a finger's width of space between the tyre and upper control arm. Never had any rubbing on the CA, regardless of tyre pressure.

[Tombie]

Good luck if you ever want to fit chains :)

[Tombie]

You guys must drive very slowly at lower pressures - tyre roll will close that gap quickly.

[sheerluck]

Good luck if you ever want to fit chains :)

Chains would involve being somewhere cold. Zero chance of that happening. SWMBO complains when it gets below 20.

[Piddler]

Apologies my friend but that is absolutely not true.

The correct phrasing would be:

With incorrect throttle application:
HTs dig in
ATs dig in a bit fast
MTs dig in a lot faster

Driven correctly the more paddle like a tyre is the better it works on sand...

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/05/116.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/05/117.jpg

Couldn't agree more Tombie.

Cheers

[~Rich~]

x3 Tombie,
Tyre pressures and driving technique are paramount.

[Russrobe]

Sweet thanks sheerluck. I know most of the bulge is obviously going to be at the bottom just thought there might be some rubbing with a bit of bounce. Nice one. The sidewall on the General Grabbers seems much thicker than the 697s, also the G/Gs have a higher load rating...

[Russrobe]

Hmmm i see why people have mixed opinions then, if your throttle control is perfect you're better off with muddies. I might be better off without them with the bugger all 4x4 exp i have.... Tombie i will never need to fit chains not in the near future atleast being from Perth, but tyre roll did have myself and the fitters questioning the size....

[Tombie]

Chains would involve being somewhere cold. Zero chance of that happening. SWMBO complains when it gets below 20.



Chains are also excellent when you can not get traction in slippery conditions [emoji41]

I do understand what you're saying though!!!

[Russrobe]

x3 Tombie,
Tyre pressures and driving technique are paramount.
275 65s might be a better option.... slightly skinnier although the overall diameter increase closes the gap on chassis clearance... Your's must get close on full lock Rich? How's the wear?

[Tombie]

Keep in mind that mods tend to have a flow on effect...

If the tyre size means it will foul on the body if the suspension goes into limp mode; then allow for a SLS bypass kit. Otherwise you will be going nowhere at all, not even limping it to the roadway.

You'll also need to allow for a wheel carrier as it won't fit the spare underneath.

[~Rich~]

275 65s might be a better option.... slightly skinnier although the overall diameter increase closes the gap on chassis clearance... Your's must get close on full lock Rich? How's the wear?

The wear is fine so far, I'll let you know after my July trip to Channel country.

I don't have any rubbing issues at standard height, at access I get a rub on reverse full lock.

Mind you mine is a early D3, for some reason latter models get more rubbing particularly on the front end on full lock.

[TuffRR]

Mind you mine is a early D3, for some reason latter models get more rubbing particularly on the front end on full lock.


I think that is because the D4's have an added 'horn' to the end of the chassis rail which is not present on the D3 chassis. This is the main point of rubbing on mine which I have not yet resolved.

[Russrobe]

I think that is because the D4's have an added 'horn' to the end of the chassis rail which is not present on the D3 chassis. This is the main point of rubbing on mine which I have not yet resolved.
Yep that's the spot. I'll probably take a file to the upper control arm too. It's nice and sharp at the moment looks like it would slice a sidewall in one tap.

[Lukeis]

dforfun - i finally bought a set of spare tyres..

i got the 265/60/18 archiles desert hawke muddies today - a guy was selling 5 of them for $100 on gumtree (one brand new, 4 at 50% tread - bargain!)

I'll be hitting the trails/beaches next weekend so I will report back and let you all know if i get bogged on the beach with MT's.

[Dfourfun]

well, and why not when they are such a bargain!?

Yes Lukeis, I would be quite interested in your feedback on these Achilles. Gordon (from GOE) reckons they're pretty good, so that is an opinion well worth taking note of.

Ultimately it comes down to whether I can be bothered with swapping over rims (query how often?) from day-to-day 19s with ordinary ATs and the second set of 18s with much more aggressive holiday tyres on (and the joys of stuffing about with the LR winch for the 5th one each time!), or to just have a compromise set of semi-aggressive ATs on my 18s all the time and sell the 19s to someone...

Decisions, decisions.

[Lukeis]

Dfourfun..

I have the tyres fitted to my 18" and took them away for the weekend for some initial off roading..

First thoughts - they look amazing, I blacked out the rims so with my fuji white D4 and aggressive tread pattern i was in love at first sight and was quickly contemplating making this my everyday look.

This love affair ended pretty fast after I started driving the car, they are loud and when i say loud I mean LOUD!!! Horrible, to the point where any thoughts of permeant fitment to the car are a distant memory. Its embarrassing to drive around in, not to mention the radio and phone calls need to be turned up even with the windows closed.

Finally, after listening to them howl up the freeway I pulled offroad - again I was in love, they give me so much confidence in the bush, no longer trying desperately to avoid rocks instead you can plow over them, and with the hill climbs i did it killed it - i put a couple of short videos here if you want to see them in action


https://youtu.be/SDG06g0V_xw

All up? Get these tyres only if you find yourself committed to the idea of having a city set and an off road set of tyres like I do. If that is not you, then I wouldn't buy them.

[Dfourfun]

Thanx for the report and the vid Lukeis (apols for slow reply). Great look but noise seems to be a real issue. To get to the dirt anywhere to really use muddies invariably means manymany k's on the black top so sounds like this would not be a long term proposition (for me anyway). Unless I got a fantasti bargain like you did. The D697s I had before were certainly not noisy but they did become slicks in clay, hence my desire for something a bit more aggressive (but the Achilles sound like a bridge too far). Will let you know what I end up getting, still procrastinating.... Thanx again. Love the white D4 (biased!).

[Lukeis]

Smart choice.

They are actually on my car again atm as I was off-road over the weekend, I know for a fact I would never buy the Achilles if I had only one set of tyres due to the noise.

Let me know what you end up with, i still think if I had to spend real
Money I'd get the maxxis 980 at 295ea

[~Rich~]

I'm loving the Hankooks, I'll post some post trip photos after my long trip.

[Lukeis]

How's the tyre noise rich?

[~Rich~]

For a true mud tyre they are great, less than 1/2 the sound as from the Atturo's