Just joined and hoping to diagnose problem

[grayarea]

Have been a Landrover Discovery owner for 14 years (2000 Discovery TD5). Have done about 195K and have generally been happy owner. Over last few years it has been mostly garaged only taken out to drag stuff to dump or surfboards carting although did trip from Sunshine Coast to Whitsundays a couple of years ago.

Not sure on forums where to post about working out problems.

Discovery has been pressed into more service due to change around of cars etc. We have two intermittent faults the first that has been going for sometime. Sometimes when starting the car the M and S transmissions lights will flash. Switch car off start up again no problem, drive for few days and even 200km and then problem again.
This was diagnosed last year as faulty inhibitor switch and replaced with second hand one. Fixed problem for a while. Then recurred.
Battery died and replaced which improved things.
Second problem which is much more recent which may or may not be related is that the engine will suddenly die with no power (but steering and brakes still powered). First time occurred. Stop and restarted. No lights flashing or anything.
Has occurred 3 more times but these times accompanied by a lot of smoke from exhaust and burning smell. All have occurred with 5 mins from home. Car not overheated and fuel in tank. Car restarts and drives normally afterwards with no smoke and normally acceleration. Have driven nearly 500km between 2nd and 3rd event.
Serviced by local mechanics who have changed fuel filter and oil filter between 2nd and 3rd event. No problem found.

I am guessing electrical problems or fuel pump but this is based on a complete lack of mechanical knowledge (human physiological problems are my area of knowledge)

Many thanks in advance from the learned people here.

Mods please move post or suggest forum to post if this is the wrong area.

Hoping to keep Discovery going for a good few years but rather concerning when car suddenly loses power!!

[Don 130]

Welcome to the forum. Sorry I can't help with your problem, but hopefully someone will come along soon who can.
Don.

[Graeme]

Is the smoke black? If so then the intercooler hose from the turbo at the intercooler may be delaminating on the inside and blocking airflow. This was a common occurrance with especially for earlier TD5s. Stopping the engine allows the delaminated inner layer to resume its normal position at least temporarily.

[grayarea]

Graeme

Smoke is black and smell may almost be rubbery. Sounds like a place to look.

Thanks for the suggestion.

[Rok_Dr]

X2 checking the turbo hose at that number of Kms.

Re the M&S lights another place to look is for oil in the engine ECU loom.

Unplug the red plug on the engine ECU (behind the battery) if there is oil there it's time to replace the loom, which is almost a routine service check now for these cars. In the short term give the plug a good cleaning with contact cleaner and that will resolve things for a bit.

Cheers

Steve

[DeanoH]

M& S lights flashing sounds like the inhibitor switch, AKA XYZ switch, to me.

Very, very common problem with D2 automatic. The inhibitor switch lives on the side of the transmission directly underneath the air con drain hose so gets a pretty tough time. Plenty of info on this site (if you can find it) on this subject. I think we're up to about switch number 5 or so on our 2004 TD5 so I reckon you've done pretty well.

Deano :)

[worane]

The XYZ switch has been very thoughtfully placed under the drip pipes of the air con . Only an engineer at Land Rover would have had the forethought to do that.
You can extend the drip pipes yourself with a bit of suitable clear pipe and tie them away from the XYZ switch. (situated either side in the transmission tunnel high up).
I had the same probs and took the car to an auto shop. The mechanic there put it on a hoist and pulled the plug on the auto harness off. It was full of spilled (leaked) oil. After cleaning the plug pins with contact cleaner all my xyz probs went away including Limp Home which was a part of the deal.
Welcome and best of luck.
Regards Nick. (worane).

[grayarea]

Will be disappointed if it is the inhibitor switch as cost $400+ for a second hand one last year. Has done less than 10K since then.

Re checking oil on engine loom will have a look but as mentioned in original post very unmechanical.

Will get mechanics to look at hose as seems best suggestion so far.

Many thanks for all replies as will have saved a load of time and effort.

Will keep posted as to progress.

[Tombie]

How far / often do you drive?

M&S is also a sign of a poorly charged battery...

[Fiddler]

Will be disappointed if it is the inhibitor switch as cost $400+ for a second hand one last year. Has done less than 10K since then.

Re checking oil on engine loom will have a look but as mentioned in original post very unmechanical.

Will get mechanics to look at hose as seems best suggestion so far.

Many thanks for all replies as will have saved a load of time and effort.

Will keep posted as to progress.
I had the same or similar problem about 12 mths ago, engine would stop, by the time I got out opened the bonnet, kicked the tyres a few times, take the key out and lock the vehicle then open it again get in and it would start and not happen again for a few weeks or so, had a diagnostic done at the Land Rover service centre they installed a new harness, has not happened since. $1,200 ouch!

[heichen]

for a while my M&S lights came on a few times. Eventually I had to replace the battery. Since then it has never happened again.
Heichen

[grayarea]

Wow many thanks for all the responses and thoughts.

I think one of the issues is trying to work whether it is one or two issues.

Took the car to a local auto-electric shop that has the ability to read the computer error codes. I did ask for the print out but they couldn't/wouldn't do so but they told me (if I remember correctly) that there were numerous errors for the injectors (I think 2 and 4), code for engine speed and a code for engine input. They cleaned an area next to the battery which was "full of oil and could be causing shorts" and directed me to take it to British Off Road down the coast for consideration of a new harness. They cleaned it all up and did this rather kindly free of charge! They felt that it could explain both issues.

This am took car out of garage and had M and S flashes within 10 seconds of reversing. Switched engine and started again all disappeared and not seen since again.

Re new battery the car was not used very often but now being driven regularly and when going drives well. Battery was replaced two months ago and did help the M and S issue for a while.

So once again not being mechanical is the engine loom the same as the harness?
Are these error codes consistent with what is being suggested. Just don't wont to go down a $1200 repair bill if it is the wrong problem? Will probably take it British Off Road for expert opinion but is a hassle and v busy at work.
Many thanks once again for everyones input.

[sjane]

Just had the engine stalling issue on my td5 manual. It was the intercooler hoses. Replaced with some silicone ones from ebay. $100.
I did notice they felt very soft when squeezed, especially the passenger side front hose. This may help diagnose but really they didn't look too bad inside or out. Air flow readings were the give away.

[Rok_Dr]

Yep engine loom is exactly the same as the harness. The engine ecu lives just behind the battery so that is the plug they will have cleaned.

I'd definitely replace the engine loom. It's not expensive or time consuming to do. However you should check a couple of months after fitting as there will be a bit of residual oil that seeps through the external harness running to the ecu that the engine loom plugs into.

When I got the M & S lights, a CAN bus time out error was reported, which was traced to oil in the engine loom. Cleaned the plug and no further issues after 18 months. The Auto sparkies suggestion of going to a land rover specialist is a good one and will save you money in the long run. Can't advise as to who to go to in your neck of the woods, but I'm sure that the local members on this forum will be able to assist if the question is asked


Cheers

Steve

[steve_a]

XYZ switch I'd suggest wiring issue, it needs a clean and a check. I've seen the M&S on with testing which has been from the battery getting low.
The ECU in the engine bay won't have any relation to that AFAIK, the ECU under the drivers seat is connected directly to the gearbox, might be via the area under the window switches.

The engine faulting out might be crank angle position sensor, when hot they fail, you get out, it cools down and restarts. I think the TD5 one is easier to get to than the V8.
I'm not sure I know of a way to test the CPS, however you might see the code for it. Being a diesel I'm not sure if those codes are part of standard OBD2 or not, they are on the V8 though.

[grayarea]

Well definitely going to take it to a Landrover specialist.

This am same deal started car M and S lights flashing within a few seconds. Switch off. Restart all clear.

Drive off down road within 1 km power dies. First time I have been able to directly observe as my wife has been driving car each other time. Engine does not stop but just v quiet. Lots of black smoke from exhaust. No electrical fault lights. Press accelerator no power but tachyometer picks up. Stop car. Restart no problems no fault lights.

Drive for another 25 mins (school run) including two stops and restart engine (deliberate) without any other issues.

I guess cleaning oil has not resolved issues but might not be clean enough. Still possible intercooler hose. I am just wondering whether alternator battery issues as faults occur on starting and within 1km of home but otherwise drives fine.

However conclusion is need specialist help.

[sierrafery]

1. Re new battery the car was not used very often but now being driven regularly and when going drives well. Battery was replaced two months ago and did help the M and S issue for a while.

2. So once again not being mechanical is the engine loom the same as the harness?
.

1. what about the charging system then?... measure the voltage on the battery with engine running, eventually the parasitic drain cos a charging problem could cause those troubless too , see this http://www.aulro.com/afvb/2259913-post3.html

2, As about looms and harnesses, for oil at the ECM red plug it's about the injector loom(or harness how ever you like), engine harness is other thing see here http://www.aulro.com/afvb/2259921-post8.html