Carrying an LPG bottle on roof rack

[p38arover]

I'm not sure if this should be here or in Camping...

I want to carry a 4.5 kg (even though they are now called a 3.7kg) bottle on my roof rack, restrained in a bottle carrier.

What I'm wondering about is - does it matter if the bottle is on its side? Mounting the carrier like this is easier as I can bolt it down in several places. It would also not be quite as high.

As an aside, I did a swap and go of a 9kg to a 4.5 (3.7) kg bottle. The LPG price on a swap and go is flaming high - $25. Now I have a small bottle, I think it will be going to a gas place for refilling, not going to a servo for swapping.

Conventional mounting:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/11/105.jpg

Horizontal mounting:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/11/106.jpg

[d2dave]

Definitely not. Although it is outside, if it leaks it will be liquid not vapour.

Liquid propane expands 270 times when it vaporizes. Not sure about the legality but I would expect it to be illegal.

Any reason why you don't want it in the car?

[p38arover]

Definitely not. Although it is outside, if it leaks it will be liquid not vapour.

Why would it matter, it'll be on the roof, not in the car?


Any reason why you don't want it in the car?

Nowhere to put it and still have it restrained.

[Mick_Marsh]

Definitely upright.
You want the gas, not the liquid.

[AndyG]

Upright unless you have one of the special marine ones

[Mick_Marsh]

Why would it matter, it'll be on the roof, not in the car?



Nowhere to put it and still have it restrained.
There are many vehicles around that have the gas bottles on the roof rack.

[d2dave]

Why would it matter, it'll be on the roof, not in the car?


If you were parked some where and it leaked a litre of liquid gas you would have 270 litres of gas.

Now propane is heavier than air. Lets say it is a calm day with no wind. I do not want to be around your car with 270 litres of gas at the wheels.

[Mick_Marsh]

If you were parked some where and it leaked a litre of gas you would have 270 litres of gas.

Now propane is heavier than air. Lets say it is a calm day with no wind. I do not want to be around your car with 270 litres of gas at the wheels.
Reading that, 270 litres of gas in the car and dribbling out the orifices I'd want even less.

[Aaron IIA]

If you were parked some where and it leaked a litre of gas you would have 270 litres of gas.

If it leaked a litre of gas, you would still have a litre of gas. If it leaked a litre of liquid propane, you would have 270 litres of gaseous propane.
Aaron

[85 county]

where did you get the mount from???

[p38arover]

where did you get the mount from???

It's an Oztrail item. I got it from Anaconda on the weekend. They had a sale on and I got it for $20 instead of the usual $35.

http://www.oztrail.com.au/product-range/camper-trailers-rvs-caravans/camper-trailer-accessories/camper-trailer-gas-bottle-holder-by-oztrail

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/11/104.jpg

[85 county]

thanks

Anaconda has not long opend shops in SA, have not had a look at them yet.

have only been able to get 9kg ones for caravans

[Collins]

The cylinder must be mounted upright so that the relief valve is in communication with the vapour space. The relief valve flow rate is not adequate to accommodate liquid discharge and maintain the pressure at a safe level.
By having the relief valve attempt to handle liquid discharge you are open to the potential of a BLEVE ( Boiling Liquid Expanding Liquid Explosion) & contrary to popular belief this phenomenon is not restricted to flammable/combustible fluids.

[Collins]

If it leaked a litre of gas, you would still have a litre of gas. If it leaked a litre of liquid propane, you would have 270 litres of gaseous propane.
Aaron

More too the point, if you safely discharged 1 litre of liquid, giving 270 litres of vapour, you potentially have some 14000 litres of flammable vapour. LEL - (Lower Explosive Limit) of LPGas is approx 1,9%

[d2dave]

By having the relief valve attempt to handle liquid discharge you are open to the potential of a BLEVE ( Boiling Liquid Expanding Liquid Explosion) & contrary to popular belief this phenomenon is not restricted to flammable/combustible fluids.

Not correct. Firstly BLEVE stands for "Boiling Liquid Expanding Vapour Explosion"

A BLEVE is caused when a leaky cyl has caught fire. A full bottle on fire is fairly safe as the liquid inside keeps the cyl cool.

However, as the level drops the uncooled steel starts getting hot from the fire and we all know what happens when steel is hot.

Eventually it gets too hot to be able to hold the pressure and it ruptures causing a massive explosion.

Here is a utube of a BLEVE.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UM0jtD_OWLU

[Collins]

Not correct. Firstly BLEVE stands for "Boiling Liquid Expanding Vapour Explosion"

A BLEVE is caused when a leaky cyl has caught fire. A full bottle on fire is fairly safe as the liquid inside keeps the cyl cool.

However, as the level drops the uncooled steel starts getting hot from the fire and we all know what happens when steel is hot.

Eventually it gets too hot to be able to hold the pressure and it ruptures causing a massive explosion.

Here is a utube of a BLEVE.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UM0jtD_OWLU

I admit, I should have written "VAPOUR".

A BLEVE does not have to involve a flammable or combustible material, nor does it have to involve fire. BLEVE's also occur due to mechanical damage.
A BLEVE occurs when the material of the vessel fails and allows the escape of it's contents, which begin to boil and expand explosively.

I have extensive knowledge of the LPGas industry as a Government Dangerous Goods Inspector, conducting a business involved with the installation & maintenance of LPGas storage & handling facilities as well as tankers. I also managed a major LPGas terminal and was the signatory for the Cylinder Test Station.

I have some knowledge & expertise on the matter.

[Collins]

Irrespective of discussions involving BLEVE's, the law does not permit the carriage of cylinders within a vehicle, except for use in trade when it must be carried secured & upright in an enclosure ventilated to the exterior of the vehicle, OR, carriage between the location at which the cylinder is filled or exchanged to your home.

[d2dave]

I used to hold a ticket to transport dangerous goods. This is were I learnt about BLEVE's.

Now my understanding of it is that it is caused by the bottle rupturing due to it being so hot due to the fire. The steel get soft, the container ruptures and then the fire causes the explosion.

If a bottle ruptures with no ignition source there is no BLEVE. And without a fire softening the steel it is highly unlikely for a bottle to rupture in the first place.

How can the liquid boil and expand explosively? When you open the tap and let gas out it is boiling.

[isuzurover]

Irrespective of discussions involving BLEVE's, the law does not permit the carriage of cylinders within a vehicle, except for use in trade when it must be carried secured & upright in an enclosure ventilated to the exterior of the vehicle, OR, carriage between the location at which the cylinder is filled or exchanged to your home.

Do you have a reference for this law?

Kleenheat:
Transporting LPG Cylinders Safely | Kleenheat Gas | Gas Safety (http://www.kleenheat.com.au/gas/about-kleenheat/safety/transporting-lpg-cylinders-safely.aspx)


There is no danger with transporting small volume LPG cylinders that are appropriately restrained and correctly filled.
...

No cylinder larger than 9kg (22 litres water capacity) should be carried inside a passenger vehicle.

Origin:
LPG cylinder safety tips - Origin Energy (http://www.originenergy.com.au/2572/LPG-cylinder-safety-tips)

Safe transportation

Gas cylinders should be secured in an upright position and cylinder valves should be adequately plugged for transportation. In Queensland, cylinders must be fitted with a screwed plastic cylinder plug
Do not carry more than 13.5kg in gas cylinders in a passenger vehicle and only transport cylinders in the boot whenever possible
Transportation of cylinders greater than 250 litres requires cylinder loads to be placarded
Unload cylinders as soon as you reach your destination


NSW Fire dept
LPG Cylinder Safety Check List - Fire and Rescue NSW (http://www.fire.nsw.gov.au/page.php?id=716)

Transport:

When transporting cylinders in the car the total capacity must not exceed 9kg. The cylinders should be transported in an upright position, secured, preferably in the boot. Do not leave LPG bottles in a vehicle unnecessarily.
No more than two cylinders should be carried in a car at any one time.

[d2dave]

For those that don't know I own a caravan park. I am accredited to decant gas bottles and I am allowed to train any staff to be able to also fill them on my behalf.

On my large 90 kg decanting bottle is a big sticker with the rules/instructions.

Have a read of number 10.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/12/879.jpg

Also we now have what is known as chain of responsibility laws. Places like Bunnings would not sell you a swap and go if you could not put it in a car.

If it was illegal and they sold a bottle, you have an accident, people are seriously injured or killed as a result of the gas bottle, responsibility would go back through the chain.

Starting at the top. Bunnings would be in trouble and so would the staff member who sold it and then the customer who buys it.

At my local produce store. They have a big sign which says "Ute It, Don't
Boot It"

Some farm chemicals can't be transported in an enclosed vehicle. If I went in with my Disco and wanted some of these they would not sell it, yet they will sell me a swap and go 9kg gas.

BOC. When I buy mig gas it can go in the back of my disco. When I buy acetylene I have to bring my trailer or they wont supply.

So in this day and age of responsibility and litigation, if it was not legal to transport in a vehicle, there is no way anyone would sell you a swap and and go without first checking how it would be transported.

[Hogarthde]

In reference to original query........read No 11

[DeeJay]

I used to hold a ticket to transport dangerous goods. This is were I learnt about BLEVE's.

Now my understanding of it is that it is caused by the bottle rupturing due to it being so hot due to the fire. The steel get soft, the container ruptures and then the fire causes the explosion.

If a bottle ruptures with no ignition source there is no BLEVE. And without a fire softening the steel it is highly unlikely for a bottle to rupture in the first place.

How can the liquid boil and expand explosively? When you open the tap and let gas out it is boiling.



75% correct, if the relief valve can get the excessive pressure off, then only the gas vented thru the valve will burn off & no BLEVE. If the relief valve cannot vent the gas sufficiently ( usually preceded by a shrill whistle - but only if vapour is escaping-) the pressure builds up to a point that the cylinder ruptures ( helped by being heat weakened) and the rush of boiling liquid expands out into the atmosphere & - being superheated & in flames, - immediately explodes. Having one upright on a roof is a waste of time if the vehicle rolls on to its side & catches fire.
So the clever bit would be to place the cylinder so it is upright after an accident:angel:
Cylinders are unlikely to explode unless "blowtorched" by another. It necessarily need not be on fire, but subject to it, to explode.
In my 25 years in the LPG industry, I have only one photograph of a flattened cylinder & that was in an inferno.


Cheers, David

[Mick_Marsh]

Have a read of number 10.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/12/879.jpg


So a 9kg bbq or caravan bottle can be transported in the car. Given that it is the most popular, and domestically the largest size, I wouldn't think we should be rushing to enroll in accreditation courses and buying utes.

Oh, some interesting viewing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQFphkoiq3g

[d2dave]

So what you are seeing here is gas bottles which were obviously full, getting a bit hot, expanding and then venting gas. After venting the pressure drops and the vent closes.

Providing you are not in the path of the flame this is not dangerous.

This is why when fitting a gas bottle to a caravan the gas bottle vent should be facing away from the caravan, so if a bottle vents and something ignites it it will not burn the van.

In the Utube shown above a BLEVE did not happen.

[85 county]

So what you are seeing here is gas bottles which were obviously full, getting a bit hot, expanding and then venting gas. After venting the pressure drops and the vent closes.

Providing you are not in the path of the flame this is not dangerous.

This is why when fitting a gas bottle to a caravan the gas bottle vent should be facing away from the caravan, so if a bottle vents and something ignites it it will not burn the van.

In the Utube shown above a BLEVE did not happen.

add to that Russian Red 30KG gas bottles have no handle to guarding around the Valve. its not uncommon to see one fall off a truck, or just be knocked over and take the valve clean off. like once a month i saw one go off. not always in fames

[Collins]

These are the links to various rules/regulations pertaining to the transport of small L P Gas cylinders in the various states of Australia.

Queensland

http://mines.industry.qld.gov.au/assets/petroleum-pdf/info_cylindertransport.pdf

New South Wales

http://www.workcover.nsw.gov.au/formspublications/publications/Documents/transporting_of_small_gas_cylinders_fact_sheet_096 6.pdf

Victoria

http://www.vwa.vic.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0006/22983/Alert-Storinggascylindersinvehicles.pdf

Tasmania

WorkSafe Tasmania | Safe transportation of gas cylinders (http://worksafe.tas.gov.au/industry_and_safety/topics/subject/gas_cylinders/safe_transportation_of_gas_cylinders)

Northern Territory

http://www.worksafe.nt.gov.au/NewsRoom/Documents/safe_use_of_liquefied_petroleum_gas_from_cylinders .pdf

South Australia

https://www.sa.gov.au/topics/water-energy-and-environment/electrical-gas-and-plumbing-safety-and-technical-regulation/electricity-and-gas-safety-for-consumers/gas-safety/lpg-cylinders-and-fittings#title3

Western Australia

Private vehicles - Department of Mines and Petroleum (http://www.dmp.wa.gov.au/16411.aspx#16439)

http://www.dmp.wa.gov.au/documents/Pamphlets/DGS_P_SAVPickingUpSomeLPGasForYourBarbeque.pdf

I will not be offering further comment, apart from recommending that any/all cylinders are transported in an upright position in a position & not inside of a vehicle.

[benji]

With the upmost respect to all, a properly secured, in date, upright cylinder that is in a car that isn't left in the hot sun all day is perfectly safe. I'm pretty sure that's how most of us here would carry there's. There's always going to be idjits that plonk a full 9kg on the front seats of a boiling hot car.

Sent from my GT-I9305T using AULRO mobile app

[DeeJay]

With the upmost respect to all, a properly secured, in date, upright cylinder that is in a car that isn't left in the hot sun all day is perfectly safe. I'm pretty sure that's how most of us here would carry there's. There's always going to be idjits that plonk a full 9kg on the front seats of a boiling hot car.

Sent from my GT-I9305T using AULRO mobile app



As long as you accept that your insurance is invalidated by doing so :eek:

[d2dave]

As long as you accept that your insurance is invalidated by doing so :eek:

Unless the insurance company specifies this, how can they refuse a claim if you are not breaking any law?

[DeeJay]

Unless the insurance company specifies this, how can they refuse a claim if you are not breaking any law?



If you read the information sheets posted by Collins, they cover the various states where in a vehicle to carry bottles. I stand corrected for W.A & NT but the dangerous goods transport code for the more populated states covers this pretty well & carrying a LPG bottle - any size- in the passenger compartment of a vehicle is against the code - not sure if this constitutes breaking the law though but I know of instances of household insurance claims being rejected or a considerable sum deducted from the claim where breaches of the code have happened e:g having a caravan bottle in a house that burnt down.
Plus, Benji is in Victoria, but maybe I should have spent more time on my reply. It gets pretty confusing as the Worksafe sheet posted for Vic is for trade vehicles, not private vehicles. Worksafe have no jurisdiction over the everyday motorist.
Personally I think the W.A. guidelines are the most practical & would be the way I would want to transport a full cylinder in my Land Rover, but here, I can't.

[d2dave]

It gets pretty confusing as the Worksafe sheet posted for Vic is for trade vehicles, not private vehicles. Worksafe have no jurisdiction over the everyday motorist.


This is correct and I will still stand by this statement. It is NOT illegal to carry a 9 kg bottle in a private vehicle for private use.

[DeeJay]

This is correct and I will still stand by this statement. It is NOT illegal to carry a 9 kg bottle in a private vehicle for private use.



Page 16 Point 1


Do not transport cylinders containing toxic or flammable gases


in enclosed vehicles.






http://www.psych.usyd.edu.au/whs/COP/BOC_Guidelines_for_Gas_Cylinder_Safety.pdf




Still not sure about legality but I would still bet your insurance company would negate your policy in the case of an accident/fire

[d2dave]

And above that it says 'Guidelines For Gas Cyl Safety". Guidelines and law are totally different.

It is a bit like putting a two metre length of timber on your roof rack. The law says that you need to tie it front and rear.

However, if I am selling the timber I can have my own guidelines suggesting that you tie it in three places.

I will put money on it that if I went to a BOC store and purchased a swap and go LPG, I could put it in my car.

[vnx205]

That same document also says on page 16, immediately above point 1:

If there are no other practical methods of transport, enclosed vehicles may be used subject to the following recommendations: (My emphasis.)

Is a vehicle enclosed if a window is open? The comment in that document about the boot suggests that the vehicle is no longer enclosed if it has an opening to the outside.

[isuzurover]

That same document also says on page 16, immediately above point 1:

If there are no other practical methods of transport, enclosed vehicles may be used subject to the following recommendations: (My emphasis.)

Is a vehicle enclosed if a window is open? The comment in that document about the boot suggests that the vehicle is no longer enclosed if it has an opening to the outside.

The bottom line is it is not illegal to transport a [9 kg or smaller] gas bottle inside a vehicle anywhere in Australia.

I am also yet to see an insurance clause which prohibits it for private purposes.

[DeeJay]

Guys,
Next time you are at a Bunnings or Servo, go read the instructions on the swap cage.
I would not want anyone to end up in court trying to convince the magistrate ( & hopefully not coroner) that a Defender Wagon or commodore type is not an enclosed vehicle.
I stand by my comment that carrying a LPG cylinder in an enclosed vehicle- whilst not taking it to be refilled & straight back home again- will invalidate your insurance. Legalities aside....Your insurance company knows that $50,000 does not buy you much court time & they can- & will- string things out till you crack.
Benji made a comment & I, being in the LPG industry for 25 years, I could not let it pass.
I downloaded the dangerous goods transport code book as the company I work for ( not BOC) Safety Site Manual refers to it with regards BBQ cylinder transport & it is 322 pages with later addendums and it took 15 minutes to read 20 pages, so defer to the BOC Bulletin above.

[isuzurover]

....

Again, you are confusing recommendations/guidelines and the ***law***.

Go and park a van or wagon (i.e. no boot) next to a gas cage at any bunnings and they will happily swap your bottle and watch you load it into your car. They sell them with plastic plugs in for this reason...

EDIT, just found the Elgas/Swap&Go instructions:

Avoid transport inside passenger compartment
DO NOT transport 9kg gas bottles loose or laying down
Keep 9kg gas bottle cool and away from flames, sparks & heat
DO NOT leave 9kg gas bottles in enclose vehicle unnecessarily
Ensure 9kg gas bottle valves are turned off firmly when not in use. Do not over tighten
Maximum two 9kg gas bottles in enclosed vehicles


"Avoid" is not the same as illegal. The fact that the later sentence says you can carry 2 bottles in an enclosed vehicle proves my point.

I suppose you are still going to argue the point???

[DeeJay]

Again, you are confusing recommendations/guidelines and the ***law***.

Go and park a van or wagon (i.e. no boot) next to a gas cage at any bunnings and they will happily swap your bottle and watch you load it into your car. They sell them with plastic plugs in for this reason...

EDIT, just found the Elgas/Swap&Go instructions:

Avoid transport inside passenger compartment
DO NOT transport 9kg gas bottles loose or laying down
Keep 9kg gas bottle cool and away from flames, sparks & heat
DO NOT leave 9kg gas bottles in enclose vehicle unnecessarily
Ensure 9kg gas bottle valves are turned off firmly when not in use. Do not over tighten
Maximum two 9kg gas bottles in enclosed vehicles


"Avoid" is not the same as illegal. The fact that the later sentence says you can carry 2 bottles in an enclosed vehicle proves my point.

I suppose you are still going to argue the point???


Ben,
Please cut & paste where I said it is illegal.

[isuzurover]

Ben,
Please cut & paste where I said it is illegal.

How about you provide some proof that an insurance company has ever invalidated a claim because a (9kg or smaller) gas bottle was being (temporarily) transported inside a private vehicle for domestic purposes? [EDIT: excluding caravans and/or permanent mounting of gas bottles inside]

Or even insurance fine print that says the same.

[DeeJay]

How about you provide some proof that an insurance company has ever invalidated a claim because a (9kg or smaller) gas bottle was being (temporarily) transported inside a private vehicle for domestic purposes? [EDIT: excluding caravans and/or permanent mounting of gas bottles inside]

Or even insurance fine print that says the same.


Ben,
Good dodge :p

[isuzurover]

Ben,
Good dodge :p

OK - you (unlike Collins) have not said it is illegal, however you have said it is against [workplace] codes of practice and said many times your insurance will be invalidated. However you have provided no proof whatsoever.

The fact is that every state legislation (and the info on gas swap cages) says you can temporarily transport at least 1 <9kg gas cylinder in a vehicle provided it is upright.

So everyone needs either a trailer / ute / roof rack to go and pick up a swap and go bottle without invalidating their insurance. please...

[SSmith]

The vic law (and naturally each state has its equivalent) is: dangerous goods (transport by road and rail) regulations 2008, not the ADG Code

Flip to page 34ish. Rule 26 special provisions for tools of trade and private use.
I did not see any stipulation such as straight to filling or swap and go.
Also it does give an allowance for upto 50 (liquid) litres to be transported in the passenger compartment

FWIW i completely agree with the recommendation that you transport LPG outside the passenger compartment wherever possible.

Cheers
Simon
(DG driver licence assessor)

Sent from my GT-S7562L using AULRO mobile app

[d2dave]

Had to go to Bunnings today in Shepparton and BOC is across the road, so I called in.

My question to them was, if I get a swap and go can I put it into my car, pointing to my disco. His answer was no problems, perfectly legal for two 9 kg bottles, can't have three.

He did say however that I could not put one 15 kg bottle in the car.

I did question him about what DeeJay posted, in post number 32 and he said he did not know anything about it and that it was probably company guidelines.

In this day and age of chain of responsibility and litigation, there is now way known that a company like BOC would allow it if it was not legal.

[p38arover]

In this day and age of chain of responsibility and litigation, there is now way known that a company like BOC would allow it if it was not legal.

I can ask a member of the forum who is a manager in BOC. I won't mention his name.

BTW, I mounted the bottle carrier upright.

[DeeJay]

I kinda find it odd how things other posters put up get attributed to some one else involved in the discussions.
No where have I said you cannot take bottles down to get refilled, nor have I said it is illegal to carry bottles in an enclosed vehicle.
I think this web page covers what I am trying to put across.



www.elgas.com.au/blog/393-legality-of-gas-bottles-for-caravans-urban-myths (http://www.elgas.com.au/blog/393-legality-of-gas-bottles-for-caravans-urban-myths)




I think if you were travelling around Aus with a bottle stored in your Defender and you had an accident that Firies attended & wrote it in their report, your insurance company has found an "out" with regard to settlement

[THE BOOGER]

That link refers to an insurance company having an out if you have more than the limit or if you are breaking the law. If we stay inside the law the insurance will not have an out.

[DeeJay]

That link refers to an insurance company having an out if you have more than the limit or if you are breaking the law. If we stay inside the law the insurance will not have an out.


So the question still remains. Can you legally carry a BBQ cylinder inside a 4x4 wagon, apart from taking it away & exchanging it?
I believe not:(

[SSmith]

So the question still remains. Can you legally carry a BBQ cylinder inside a 4x4 wagon, apart from taking it away & exchanging it?
I believe not:(

Yes you can.
Sry i am on the road now so i cannot post a link, google the vic law that i referenced earlier.

Ill copy and paste the contents, if necessary, when i am able.

Sent from my GT-S7562L using AULRO mobile app

[DeeJay]

Yes you can.
Sry i am on the road now so i cannot post a link, google the vic law that i referenced earlier.

Ill copy and paste the contents, if necessary, when i am able.

Sent from my GT-S7562L using AULRO mobile app



Please do because my copy of dangerous goods (transport by road and rail) regulations 2008 - 2014 edition has no reference from pages 0-50 at which point I was going ga ga. All the pages around 34 were only definitions. No Rules.
There are 756 pages in all - 3 files totalling 62 MB & I went thru them all.
AS1596 does have a page on small cylinder transport in passenger vehicles but it says "for information" & says to unload the cyl as soon as practical.

[SSmith]

T756 pages, We are looking at 2 different documents then.
Where did you get it from?
The code for transport?, available from here:
NTC - National Transport Comission (http://www.ntc.gov.au/heavy-vehicles/safety/australian-dangerous-goods-code/)
Does not contain any Regulations, it is the technical reference.

The regulations for Vic is what I am looking at, available here:
DANGEROUS GOODS (TRANSPORT BY ROAD OR RAIL) REGULATIONS 2008 (http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/vic/consol_reg/dgbrorr2008538/)

The copy I had on my laptop was out of date :angel:
but the rule I referenced is correct:

Rule: 26 Special provisions for tools of trade and dangerous goods for private use

For those not in the industry LPG is classed as Division 2.1

(1) This regulation applies to a load (an applicable load) if?

(a) the load includes?


(i) an aggregate quantity of dangerous goods of less than 500 that does not include any dangerous goods of Division 2.1 (that are not aerosols) or Division 2.3 or Packing Group I; or
(ii) an aggregate quantity of dangerous goods of less than 250 that does include dangerous goods of Division 2.1 (that are not aerosols) or Division 2.3 or Packing Group I, provided that dangerous goods of Division 2.3 and Packing Group 1 together constitute less than 100 of that aggregate quantity; and

(b) the goods are not being transported in the course of a business of transporting goods but are being transported?



(i) by a person who intends to use them; or
So the scenario of having it inside a 4x4 for the purpose of touring is acceptable
(ii) so that they can be used for a commercial purpose.

(2) A person transporting an applicable load is exempt from all obligations imposed by these Regulations other than those imposed by this regulation.

(3) A person must not transport an applicable load unless each package in the load?

(a) complies with the packaging requirements appropriate to the quantity of dangerous goods, as specified in Part 4 of these Regulations; and
(b) is appropriately marked (defined in regulation 5); and
(c) is loaded, secured, segregated, unloaded and otherwise transported in such a way as to ensure that?


(i) its packaging remains fit for its purpose; and
(ii) the risk to any person, property or the environment is eliminated, or if it is not possible to eliminate the risk, is minimised to the maximum extent that is practicable.
i.e. window open a fraction or other ventilation, keep out of direct sunlight, cylinder upright etc

(4) Omitted, irrelevant for this discussion

(5) If an applicable load contains an aggregate quantity of dangerous goods of Division 2.1, Division 2.3 or Packing Group I of more than 50, a person must not transport the load?

(a) in the passenger compartment of a vehicle; or
(b) in any other enclosed space in the vehicle.
So as long as you keep the aggregate quantity under that 50L threshold you may transport it in the passenger compartment

The Elgas website gives the fill capacity of a 9kg gas bottle as 16.6L

[DeeJay]

Thanks for that link..:)


I thought I had the right publication, a lot of similarities but not the same.
Sounds like a lot of the rules have been amended over the years.
This was my reference. Also, it appears that Worksafe Vic, being the State Authority,- for this National Code- do have jurisdiction for the motorist
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/12/438.jpg

[101RRS]

Arh the old policy duel at 10 paces - my policy is better than your policy - this is the sort of thread you would find on the the Silly Old Fart Exploreroz forum.

[DeeJay]

Arh the old policy duel at 10 paces - my policy is better than your policy - this is the sort of thread you would find on the the Silly Old Fart Exploreroz forum.



Nah, just two bureaucrats comparing notes:p