Car Hire Company Duty of Care

[Saitch]

A person I know arrived at Brissie airport from Rocky 1 hour before the storm last Thursday. They picked up their pre-arranged hire car & left to drive to Chermside. Not far into the trip they got hit by the rain & hail. On returning the car they were informed that they were liable for a $3000 debit from their card which will be used for hail damage repairs. (The excess was $7000) If the repairs are less than the $3000 then a refund will be forthcoming.
Now this person was not informed of the storm by the rental people even though there were storm warnings issued. Surely the hire company has a duty of care to inform a new arrival that there is a severe storm warning current before letting them drive off!

[Ausfree]

Can't help you there, sounds like a trip to a lawyer might be needed. But that is interesting that through no fault of your friend they are charged for "an act of God". Thanks for the headsup as I occasionally hire vehicles and it might be worthwhile me checking with the hire company next time I take out a rental.

[Eevo]

A person I know arrived at Brissie airport from Rocky 1 hour before the storm last Thursday. They picked up their pre-arranged hire car & left to drive to Chermside. Not far into the trip they got hit by the rain & hail. On returning the car they were informed that they were liable for a $3000 debit from their card which will be used for hail damage repairs. (The excess was $7000) If the repairs are less than the $3000 then a refund will be forthcoming.
Now this person was not informed of the storm by the rental people even though there were storm warnings issued. Surely the hire company has a duty of care to inform a new arrival that there is a severe storm warning current before letting them drive off!


duty of care would be limited to "do you have a license?"


the person signed the form, which says he has to pay the excess. its sucky but i dont think he has a leg to stand on.

[Kev the Fridgy]

I would seek legal advice, duty of care laws are constantly being questioned and found to be misunderstood quite often, for instance, last week i was relocating some AC units from one part of a building to another, our own electrician wired all the interconnecting and control wiring, however the site electrician had to provide the power supply, they were hesitant because in their words, the duty of care laws would require them to take responsibility of there was any problem with any part of the AC units as they were the last ones to work on the electrical side.

So my point is and how I would argue the point is, the hire car company would have/ should have been aware there were storms about, if it can be proven they did and did not warn the driver who was on a plane and most likely not aware of the Severe Storm Warning then they failed in there duty of care to inform the driver of the potential for damage and that he would be held liable.

Maybe I am wrong maybe I am not but for the kind of coin your suggesting I would put up a fight first.

[Bytemrk]

Whether it falls under duty of care or not I have no idea, I am not a lawyer.

But I'd strongly advice your friend to seek legal advice.

I flew out of Brisbane around the same time as your friend arrived. I would be awfully surprised if the hire company was not aware of the storm. Virgin Airlines certainly were - they sent me a text at 8:20 the previous evening warning of " Forecast storms that may impact flights tomorrow". (They don't usually do that - so I knew it was likely to be a major storm.)

As mentioned I would think at the very least it could be argued that the hire company staff contributed significantly to the event by not warning the driver.

Talk to a lawyer without doubt.

[nat_89]

Bloody hell thats rough as steep bloody prices! Thats why i always pay the extra $$ for excess reduction down to $0

[boa]

What would have happened if the hire company had informed the person. I think most would take the chance, I always take the option of least excess.

[gossamer]

Common courtesy to warn of the storm and maybe advise an excess reduction but duty of care i dont think so. The car hire company isnt to know which direction you are going, for all they know the car was heading away from the storm.

[PhilipA]

VISA Platinum travel insurance covers the excess if your friend paid with one.

Regards Philip A

[DiscoMick]

I'm no legal expert, but I doubt if your friend has a leg to stand on. Those agreements are usually watertight because the companies have paid to make sure all possible liability is shifted to the customer.

[Tombie]

Where does it all end :twisted::(

"I didn't pay the extra insurance and now I've got a bill I don't like.."

WTF!!!

Duty of care and all the associated bull**** that comes with it will end up costing us and is costing us in our freedoms, choices and financially.


Personal responsibility people - In this instance - Look Up! Watch the weather for the region you're going to...

Would your mate have grabbed a Taxi instead?

[loanrangie]

I agree to an extent Tombie but what if i was hiring a boat and there were rough seas and a weather warning, should the hirer still let me hire a boat knowing that ?

[Tombie]

I agree to an extent Tombie but what if i was hiring a boat and there were rough seas and a weather warning, should the hirer still let me hire a boat knowing that ?

Should a car hire mob then advise there are silly drivers? Random animals spotted in the local area committing suicide by vehicle? That there is unforeseen oil dropped on the freeway and likely to cause loss of vehicle control?

Of course not...

Land Rover didn't advise me that I should insure my vehicle when I purchased it as it was highly likely to be in a MV incident during my ownership...
Why should they???

Did the girl at Maccas advise you to chew slowly and thoroughly, or you may choke, and to not eat too much as you may gain weight?

[vnx205]

.... .....

Did the girl at Maccas advise you to chew slowly and thoroughly, or you may choke, and to not eat too much as you may gain weight?

Didn't the Macca's coffee cups have a warning on them stating that the contents may be hot? :)

I believe that was their response to being sued by a woman who spilt hot coffee on herself.

EDIT: I was right, but there is a bit more to it than most people realise.
http://www.lectlaw.com/files/cur78.htm

[gazby]

While I was working travelling all over Australia and the rest of the world 10 years back, I hired cars in all sorts of places/countries, there was always that spectre hanging over the hire of the "unfortunate" accident/occurrence, my company always had special insurance for such an event. One of my colleagues "wrote off" a week old Toyota 80 series Landcruiser on his way back to civilisation from a copper project in Central Western Queensland trying to dodge a group of Emu's, the bill was horrendous, thankfully he was not hurt, and neither was the company bank balance.
Once they have your card number and your signature that says you do not accept the offer of "claim excess reduction", at whatever cost per day, no matter what, your money is as good as gone if you damage their vehicle. And I think the companies who do their insurance repairs are not too careful about how they quote. So unless you have, as has been said, a "special" arrangement/deal with your card provider or travel insurer, no matter what, the hirer pays, the hire company will not lose, fair or unfair. It is a business contract, and under the circumstances I can see no other way it could work.
My advice, for what it's worth, if you must hire a car/transport, thoroughly check the vehicle over for damage before even getting behind the wheel and take all the "buffering" cover you can buy from the hire company, you never know when that big number comes up. Gaz:)

[Ausfree]

While I was working travelling all over Australia and the rest of the world 10 years back, I hired cars in all sorts of places/countries, there was always that spectre hanging over the hire of the "unfortunate" accident/occurrence, my company always had special insurance for such an event. One of my colleagues "wrote off" a week old Toyota 80 series Landcruiser on his way back to civilisation from a copper project in Central Western Queensland trying to dodge a group of Emu's, the bill was horrendous, thankfully he was not hurt, and neither was the company bank balance.
Once they have your card number and your signature that says you do not accept the offer of "claim excess reduction", at whatever cost per day, no matter what, your money is as good as gone if you damage their vehicle. And I think the companies who do their insurance repairs are not too careful about how they quote. So unless you have, as has been said, a "special" arrangement/deal with your card provider or travel insurer, no matter what, the hirer pays, the hire company will not lose, fair or unfair. It is a business contract, and under the circumstances I can see no other way it could work.
My advice, for what it's worth, if you must hire a car/transport, thoroughly check the vehicle over for damage before even getting behind the wheel and take all the "buffering" cover you can buy from the hire company, you never know when that big number comes up. Gaz:)

I can vouch for that. We (my wife and I) hired a vehicle once and did not do a thorough pre-inspection (something that I do very carefully now) and we failed to notice a dent in the rear left mudguard. We got the blame and had to pay accordingly.........didn't have a leg to stand on. What hurt the most though was the arrogant attitude of the hire company manager, we never went back until he sold out and the new people are great to deal with.:)

[101RRS]

My advice, for what it's worth, if you must hire a car/transport, thoroughly check the vehicle over for damage before even getting behind the wheel and take all the "buffering" cover you can buy from the hire company, you never know when that big number comes up. Gaz:)

And - when you return the car make sure you take detailed pics of it and have an independent witness.

All to often the cars are returned to airports and not sighted by rental staff and later they find damage and charge you.

[Ausfree]

And - when you return the car make sure you take detailed pics of it and have an independent witness.

All to often the cars are returned to airports and not sighted by rental staff and later they find damage and charge you.

Good advice!!!!!

[SSmith]

I travel all over for work and hire a lot of vehicles.

Our SOP now is to approach their staff and get the return part of the condition report signed.

Cannot speak for witness reports or how either will pan put in court, but i can say that pics will not deter them from charging you for un noticed damage, or in our case damage their cleaning staff cause when they back into something.

Sent from my GT-S7562L using AULRO mobile app

[sam_d]

I think your mate is going to be a bit disappointed but once you sign for that car, he is liable for any damage, howsoever caused. It's in pretty much any car hire contract and all you can do to insulate yourself from any further expense is to take out their most comprehensive insurance.

I've been burned by car hire places in the past so check every car I hire very carefully. The staff at the last place I hired from (at Cairns Airport) were very surprised that I wouldn't just sign the inspection report and wanted to check it myself first. Even though I had zero excess to pay should there be any damage, I just didn't want them to have any wrigggle room.

On the one occasion where I returned a car with damage, I had reduced my excess to $500 but the damage was definately going to cost much more to fix - I forgot that the car I was in didn't have my Disco's ground clearance and had a much tighter turning circle so when I was at full lock going round a roundabout made using large rocks and boulder the result was never going to be good.:wasntme:

[FeatherWeightDriver]

I'm no legal expert, but I doubt if your friend has a leg to stand on. Those agreements are usually written to appear watertight because the companies have paid to make sure all possible liability is notionally shifted to the customer.

Rule #142 of contract law - just because it is written on the contract, does not mean it is enforceable, even if you have signed the document.

Trouble is, having the other party yield usually needs special lawyering joo-joo magic, which is expensive... :mad:

[DiscoMick]

I hied an eight-seater van recently for a school camp and luckily looked at the roof to discover extensive scraping, not visible from ground level, probably because someone had gone into a parking station that was too low. The damage was NOT noted on the hire diagram, so I made a point of noting and describingit in great detail, and then telling the guy at the desk all about it, so I couldn't get blamed for it. My employer probably would have paid for me, but I didn't want that to happen. You gotta be ultra fussy about this stuff.

Sent from my GT-P5210 using AULRO mobile app

[Bytemrk]

Personal responsibility people - In this instance - Look Up!

Normally I'd be 100% on that band wagon Tombie.... too many people do not take responsibility for their own actions.

But I have to say, having flown out of Brisbane not much more than an hour before the storm.... beautiful blue skys.... no hint of a storm.

[isuzurover]

I hired a car in the US in the middle of a severe snow storm. They didn't tell me I was also heading into severe tornados. At no point did I think they should have.

[rangie ute on 38'']

All I can say is What a joke this world has become

[Basil135]

Is it fair to assume that the hire company was aware of the approaching storm?

Can you prove that they were, and therefor negligent in not advising the person hiring the vehicle?

I would guess that a hire car company has no need to be aware of the current weather conditions, unlike an airline, for instance.

I would speak to a lawyer, but find one that will do the first consult free, as, in my opinion, they do not have any duty of care to ensure you are aware of the current weather.

It could also be argued that the vehicle was fitted with a radio, and the hirer could have tuned in and received the current, and forecast weather conditions.

[Saitch]

All I can say is What a joke this world has become
Normally I would agree with this sentiment & Tombies post, as I hate the "Someone elses fault" thing but, this was a grandmother who hadn't driven in Brissie since the '70s & who had asked directions from the hire car desk, so the person at the desk was fully aware of the direction of travel. I agree that they may not have been aware of the storm but to take $3000 from a card without permission (I know, read the small print) seems pretty ****ty to me. Why hasn't the renter got the choice of getting an independant quote for repairs against the hire company quote which would be pretty well pre-ordained.
Steve

[101RRS]

Did the contract specifically specify that the $3000 would be taken out of the allocated card or did it just say you would have to pay the first $3000??

If the latter then taken the money from the card would be considered to be an unauthorised transaction and should be reported to the bank. However if the contract does say the money will be taken from the credit card then there is not much that can be done.

Unfortunately the car rental industry is one that will try to fleece you if they can.

Garry

[Saitch]

Did the contract specifically specify that the $3000 would be taken out of the allocated card or did it just say you would have to pay the first $3000??

If the latter then taken the money from the card would be considered to be an unauthorised transaction and should be reported to the bank. However if the contract does say the money will be taken from the credit card then there is not much that can be done.

Unfortunately the car rental industry is one that will try to fleece you if they can.

Garry
Garry
The $3000 was an estimate by the people at the vehicle return centre:confused:
The excess was $7000 on an Hyundai!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Bytemrk]

Thinking about it Saitch, is she exposed to that sized bill because that is the excess no matter what..... or did she choose not to pay their additional insurance option.... because that is relevant too.

Personally I'd still take legal advice, not because I think they have a bullet proof case.... more because it is a lot of coin and personally I would want to be SURE I had to pay it before simply handing over the $$ ( Note I am saying take legal advice... not engage a lawyer to fight it necessarily)

While I think their is a very strong likelihood the company did know about the storm, and there is a potential argument as to whether they should share blame or not. If she actively decided not to pay their additional Insurance option....that probably wont help her case, I'd think.

[Saitch]

Thinking about it Saitch, is she exposed to that sized bill because that is the excess no matter what..... or did she choose not to pay their additional insurance option.... because that is relevant too.

Personally I'd still take legal advice, not because I think they have a bullet proof case.... more because it is a lot of coin and personally I would want to be SURE I had to pay it before simply handing over the $$ ( Note I am saying take legal advice... not engage a lawyer to fight it necessarily)

While I think their is a very strong likelihood the company did know about the storm, and there is a potential argument as to whether they should share blame or not. If she actively decided not to pay their additional Insurance option....that probably wont help her case, I'd think.
Sorry Mark
You beat me to the punch. I can't type too fast:angry:

[DiscoMick]

Sorry, but I doubt if the car hire company could be shown to be responsible for anything which happens after the vehicle leaves its premises in the hands of the person who hired it under the stated conditions which were signed for.

[PhilipA]

This thread reminds me of a woman who called in to Ray Hadley last week.

She was incensed that she had bought a mixed alcoholic drink and while passing the money to the barman had dropped 20C into the drink.

She then said to the barman "what are you going to do about it?"
The barman replied "Nothing"

Ray Then said to her that once the drink had left the barman's hands it was her responsibility and if she would have been polite then she may have got a lot further.

To me there are similarities. I don't know how to say this without sounding like a grumpy old fart, but what happened to personal responsibility?

When my little kids used to come to me and say that a toy was broken, with "It Broke", I would say " No you broke it, you have to take responsibility" .

Bit tough on young kids but a sense of responsibility stops people from becoming "victims" and my kids are now unusual X Gens in that they take responsibility for their own actions.
Last night I drove from the Central coast into Mona vale knowing there were storms around and hoping for no hail. I wouldn't have blamed the weather bureau if my car had ben hail damaged, I would have just swallowed it.
Regards Philip A

[3toes]

I hire a few cars each year and have noticed that the excess has been going up to silly levels. Think it is driven by customers shopping around for the best price and the rental companies then seeking to recover their profit by making the insurance something you have to have as the down side is too high.

Same business model as the electronics shops. People research the price of the TV and so there is no margin in it, often they are sold at a loss. The same customer then needs the cable to connect everything up which costs $$$$$ customer has not checked price and pays.

Now I have no connection with the link below and it is give as an illustration of the type of annual cover that I keep. Means if the rental company comes up with an unexpected bill am covered. Generally these policies work on the basis that the rental company charges you and then you claim it back. Check how much the maximum claim is on the policy as the rental companies keep pushing the excess up. If it keeps going like it has excess will soon be more than value of the car. Bonus is that this covers more than the hire car company cover does. If you read the hire car cover policy it is amazing how little it does actually cover.

Car Rental Insurance Excess Reduction (http://www.vroomvroomvroom.com.au/insurance/)