Died mid flight!

[PeterH]

My 2001 HSE 4.6 died mid flight on the way home from work this arvo. Right on a very busy roundabout at peak time too :(
First thing I did was check all connections, hoses, etc, but found nothing obvious.
Called RACV for a tow, a very nice Disco ownwer came to the rescue and towed me out of the way of all the traffic, thanks Anthony!
I'm not sure where to start with this one, I could not see any spark, but also could not hear the fuel pump working. It is turning over fine, no errors on the dash, faultmate had no faults showing. Was not overheating, actually has been running really well for ages. I had no warning at all, it just died. My first thought is crank position sensor or fuel pump. I've never had to test either of these before, can anyone point me in the right direction?
Any other suggestions?
Cheers, Pete.

[Hoges]

goodness gracious:eek:

Use the garden hose to dribble cold water onto the area around the crank sensor. If the engine starts when the CKPS is "cold" then most likely that's the problem... the permanent magnet in the nose of the sensor eventually becomes too weak (because of heat and vibration... ) to register a pulse. If it does start, it will probably stop shortly thereafter when the engine warms up and the magnet "dies"...

[Keithy P38]

Hoges nailed it!

Perfect weather and year for crank position sensors to die.

Are you at or around 200,000 to 230,000km on the odometer?

Cheers
Keithy

[AndyG]

Well done Hoges, the knowledge here is scary. Maybe there should be a green stamp award once a month for the best advice :)

[PeterH]

Keithy do you have a hidden camera in my car? It is indeed about 230,000km!

[Keithy P38]

That's the magic odometer reading for crank sensors to die! Very few die earlier, none last longer!

Keithy

[Scouse]

That's the magic odometer reading for crank sensors to die! Very few die earlier, none last longer!

KeithyI've just replaced mine at 350000km. As far as I can tell, it hasn't failed but I'm chasing a very intermittent (can go 6+ months without appearing) non-fire when cold problem.

[Keithy P38]

If it's done that many k's and hasn't been replaced by a previous owner, then you've set a record! Some decent k's you've done there!

Cheers
Keithy

[Hoges]

Well done Hoges, the knowledge here is scary. Maybe there should be a green stamp award once a month for the best advice :)

Thanks for the compliment! HOWEVER... this issue has been explained a fair bit on these pages recently... guess that with SWMBO regularly interstate these days, tag-teaming with her sister to care for their invalid nonagenarian mum, I get a bit more time to imbibe the detailed knowledge in this forum... that's the problem with any thought of switching to a different model... have to learn all the little quirks all over...

[Scouse]

If it's done that many k's and hasn't been replaced by a previous owner, then you've set a record! Some decent k's you've done there!

Cheers
KeithyThe dealership I worked at did all the work on the car from day dot. There's no mention of a crank sensor in the history. Fuel pumps on the other hand....

[TheTree]

Certainly sounds like a CPS but then mine turned out to be crap in the fuel pump inlet strainer !

Steve

[PeterH]

Aaaand the $10,000 prize goes to Hoges and Keithy!
CPS it was indeed.
I turned it over first thing in this morning at the coolest part of the day and she fired up straight away. Was looking like the cps was the culprit.
I ordered a genuine LR one and it arrived a couple of hours later.
Put it in this arvo and now running perfectly once again, excellent result!

Many thanks to all for the great help here, I really didn't know where to start looking with this one.
A breakdown that requires towing kind of freaks you out a bit, it's always a huge relief when you post your dilemma and start getting suggestions that point you in the right direction.
As you work through the different issues that arise with your P38, you become more and more knowledgeable in the P38 field. I found the same thing when I had my classic, it was a learning curve the whole time.
I've been eyeing off L322's lately, might go for one in 12 months or so, when the price comes down a bit more! But I know it will be the same process of working through problems as they arise.
It's always very satisfying to fix it yourself, also great to pass your own experiences on for the benifit of others.
So a big thank you goes out to all here.
Cheers, Pete.

[glenhendry]

Mine original CPS lasted 285kkm for posterity.

[PeterH]

My exact odometer reading was 230200 km.
I would advise anyone who has not already replaced this to have a spare with you.
You could fit it on the roadside if you were really stuck.
You need a 7mm spanner and an 8mm spanner to do the job (on 99+ models).
You can pick one up fairly cheaply on ebay if you have a look.
That's my 2 cents anyway!

[mtb_gary]

Thanks Peter, I'm at 225,000K's. I've had a spare sitting in the back of the car for some time now......I think I'll do some preventative maintenance over the weekend and replace it ;)

Gary

[PeterH]

I think that's a wise move Gary, should have done the same myself!
What model year is yours?
If it's a 99+ I have some good tips for you.
I think earlier models are different.
Cheers, Pete.

[mtb_gary]

Peter, mine's a 1996 model

Gary

[mtb_gary]

Mission accomplished. I think the hardest and most frustrating part was getting the metal clip off the connector plug!


Gary

[PeterH]

Nice work Gary! I had a similar experience with the connector on mine, had to get to it from the top of the engine bay, around the back of the motor, very tough spot to get to.
I'd say you have saved yourself a breakdown replacing that item, talk about a show stopper!
At least you can keep the old one as a spare now.

[glenhendry]

Yes, the connector is hard to get to. We did my brothers '97 last night.

Here is a tip for the GEMS engines, unbolt the sensor from the engine block first and bring it up towards the bonnet, that gives you much more slack to work with for the bloody connector. Then, attach the new CPS at the connector first, and then lower it down and bolt it on with the 7mm socket with a double length extender and position yourself in front of the front diff. <always use jack stands>