I'm almost Anzaced out, to be honest. But this is a Poms version

[bob10]

Well by now we are probably up to the teeth with Anzac. Check this out, Bob


https://youtu.be/wEUzcDMaxQU

[bob10]

We in Australia should never forget. Take the NZ out of Anzac , you get Aac. Brothers in arms , now & forever. Bob

[ramblingboy42]

Bob, I'm with you.

I, too, am a returned soldier.

I, too , am Anzaced out.

[Discofever]

G'day Bob,

Thanks for serving - appreciate it. Sick of turning on the telly and seeing people who know nothing what it means to serve talking gibberish. They know they should feel something but they don't feel it deep enough to actually sell it. It all looks fake. No idea what it means to serve myself to be honest, spent 13 weeks at Pucka and bailed out, Grandfather was at Tobruk and got shelled by Rommel for 200+ days. Me, I'm just some blow behind a computer who respects what happened, rather than pretending to know anything about it, unlike many. The media are the worst, one of their best ratings broadcast for the year.

Best,

John.

[Eevo]

anzac day used to be a somber event, and unfortunately its not anymore.
now its too much like Australia day; celebration & nationalism. the pilgrimage to anzac cove is a commercial circus.


as much as i love the anzac day clash between collingwood & essendon, its not what the day should be about imho.

[clubagreenie]

I'm another of the many.

Not ANZAC'ed out, quite the opposite there's a lot more detailed and correct documentaries on this year in addition to finally some recognition of the indigenous servicemen who took part in the same campaigns, yet on their return were denied by the RSL entry, even on ANZAC day for a drink with their mates. Received no land grants as others were entitled to, in fact The Lovetts from western Vic had their land taken while they were away in WW1 and used for grants for other servicemen. They are the longest serving indigenous family we have, from WW1 to the modern PNG peacekeeping missions.

[Homestar]

anzac day used to be a somber event, and unfortunately its not anymore.
now its too much like Australia day; celebration & nationalism. the pilgrimage to anzac cove is a commercial circus.


as much as i love the anzac day clash between collingwood & essendon, its not what the day should be about imho.

Yeah, I've noticed a lot this year been using the term 'celebration' rather that 'commemoration' as it used to be. It's been commercialised way too much. :(

[Disco Muppet]

Lets stick to the topic, thread is open again.
Stick to the topic at hand or you'll get a holiday.

[carjunkieanon]

Heard an interesting radio interview during the week with an Australian war historian. He said a lot of young people today turn up at ANZAC cove and are surprised to learn Gallipoli was a defeat. His opinion too was that the real nation that was built from Gallipoli was modern day Turkey.

I was a a local Dawn service, the young Lieutenant who spoke sounded like he knew his stuff, but everyone was calling him the American Lootenant rather than 'Leftenant.'

Four local school kids had the opportunity to say stuff, they did well too.

[Eevo]

although a defeat, it did help the war effort by tying down enemy resources.
Lootenant is very common here.

[jimr1]

The British people owe an eternal debt of gratitude , for the support , of both the New Zealand , and Australians . That is WW1 , and WW2 . Being a Pom , I know many British people hold yous in the highest regard !!.. Jim..

[CraigE]

I am certainly not ANZACed out. We should always remember and respect this day. It is only 1 day a year. I agree the dawn service should be a sombre event to remember the fallen, but it should also be a celebration of life remembering all that served and why as well as our appreciation for our freedoms, the country we live in and the celebration of the lives of fallen, living and serving armed forces members.
What also bugs me is the focus on Gallipoli only, it should be about the whole war and the losses and commitment. Remember many more lives were lost on the Western Front.
Yes often there is way too much superfluous media attention, but better to be too much rather than none.
What irks me is people treating it like a joke, I agree with the WA public holiday, but annoys me when people don't take the time to show the respect the reason we have ANZAC day. Every single Australian, New Zealander and those that live here but are not citizens should take a bit of time over the day to remember what was given up by these people and now what we have to be thankful for as a result.
Annoys me slightly that people use this as an excuse just to have a break or party.

[1nando]

Anzac day is one of the most important days in our yearly calender.
My biggest problem is what people use this day as an excuse for, getting ****ed off their faces. Just yesterday I was going home past randwick race course and there was nothing but ****ed idiots everywhere.
My cousin is currently in Afghanistan for his second time. I know him and his mates don't get smashed off their faces on Anzac day. It is not a day for celebration but a day of reflection, a day of gratefulness and an opportunity to thank those who have and continue to serve our country.
My 2 cents.

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[clubagreenie]

Another thing to note, that's unique to Australian war memorials is that we do not just list those fallen in war but, and particularly in smaller towns, list all those who served. In other countries it's only those who fell.

[bob10]

I'm another of the many.

Not ANZAC'ed out, quite the opposite there's a lot more detailed and correct documentaries on this year in addition to finally some recognition of the indigenous servicemen who took part in the same campaigns, yet on their return were denied by the RSL entry, even on ANZAC day for a drink with their mates. Received no land grants as others were entitled to, in fact The Lovetts from western Vic had their land taken while they were away in WW1 and used for grants for other servicemen. They are the longest serving indigenous family we have, from WW1 to the modern PNG peacekeeping missions.


Good for you. If you followed my posts on this subject, you would be even further educated on the first Australians contribution. My only regret on posting this post, is I left the door open, for those who just want to ..... can't say it without being negative. So I won't. It would be interesting to see how many actually opened the link, & read it. Bob

[bob10]

I am certainly not ANZACed out. We should always remember and respect this day. It is only 1 day a year. I agree the dawn service should be a sombre event to remember the fallen, but it should also be a celebration of life remembering all that served and why as well as our appreciation for our freedoms, the country we live in and the celebration of the lives of fallen, living and serving armed forces members.
What also bugs me is the focus on Gallipoli only, it should be about the whole war and the losses and commitment. Remember many more lives were lost on the Western Front.
Yes often there is way too much superfluous media attention, but better to be too much rather than none.
What irks me is people treating it like a joke, I agree with the WA public holiday, but annoys me when people don't take the time to show the respect the reason we have ANZAC day. Every single Australian, New Zealander and those that live here but are not citizens should take a bit of time over the day to remember what was given up by these people and now what we have to be thankful for as a result.
Annoys me slightly that people use this as an excuse just to have a break or party.


Well said. I could not have said it better. Bob

[bob10]

The British people owe an eternal debt of gratitude , for the support , of both the New Zealand , and Australians . That is WW1 , and WW2 . Being a Pom , I know many British people hold yous in the highest regard !!.. Jim..


We should never forget the other members of the Commonwealth, who sacrificed so much. My point is, we should not be focused on the wonderful things our men did, but on the utter waste of life achieving that. How would this country be now, if those men had lived, and achieved in their different fields. You younger blokes would not have lived thru the times of shattered men, of shattered families, that War set our nation back by heaps. And another thing. Great Britain sacrificed much, much more then we. Their men were in it at the beginning in France, and were cannon fodder, before us. We Australians should never forget that. Bob


First World War Casualties (http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/FWWcasualties.htm)

[landy]

I wouldn't so much say that I'm ANZACed out but more that im I bit over the people that attend the dawn service. I'm a serving returned soldier. I feel extreamly proud of the men and women I served with. But, I have noticed that a lot of our young people see it as a bind to have to attend the dawn service and I will stress that it seems to be the guests that accompany the serving members or ex members themselves . I noticed this year more than others that a lot of people hit the club at work for a beer at 6ish o'clock. And just continued to drink. I found this rather sad. The way we go to war now is obviously so different to even 10 years ago and of course 100 years ago and unfortunately (maybe?) this is reflected in our newer members. It's not to say they are less brave. They certainly are not. And I think sometimes I need to cut them some slack.
One thing I would like to add though. Someone mentioned that Britain lost a lot more men. This is so true. But Britain was fighting for its survival. the risk of invasion as well as its place in a new post war Europe. Not one single Australian needed to be there. Every last man and indeed women volunteered to leave there mothers, fathers, brothers and sisters to fight overseas. There was no conscription they did what they thought was right. That is true bravery.
Lest we forget.

[DieselDan]

That link was in interesting watch, thanks Bob.
Good to hear of the high regard for the ANZACs.

I've found there to be lots of many interesting, insightful and eye-opening articles published in the newspapers in the lead up to ANZAC day. Most of the ones I've seen and read have been well written and very respectful.
Can't say the same for lots of the stuff I've seen on the telly, telling us how sombre the occasion is, how we should feel, babbling on incessantly, the TV stations trying to out-do each other with how much they are 'honouring' the occasion. Commercial circus is right!
I turned it off in disgust in the end when some vapid reporter was going through the crowds and ended up asking some poor old fella who was in a wheelchair 'how he was feeling and how emotional was he?' The poor bloke was clearly very upset and was crying, but she shoved a microphone under his nose and asked away....FFS allow the bloke some dignity and leave him in peace!

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[Redback]

I must say I enjoyed the Video, I love these docos, I learnt a few things I didn't know about as well, which is a bonus.

Baz.

[CraigE]

Do you honestly think that if Britain or Europe had fallen that Australia would not have been on the agenda at some point? It would have, so to say it was not our war is probably not quite correct. Also rememeber most of the soldiers enlisted of their own free will for WW1. You are a current serving member and I respect that, but do the current conflicts in the Middle East have anything to do with us either? I would say they actually have less.
I totally disagree with you stance about people attending services, most of these soldiers are now gone, so it is up to us that are left to show our respect and ensure they are remembered. I know I will as my Great Grandfather was 1st AIF. You cannot seriously just think it should be reserved for ex servicemen or current servicemen? There would be no one to actually watch and appreciate the parades etc. Most of the older diggers are great full to see the support coming from everyday Aussies.
I absolutely agree with people just using it as an excuse to get plastered, too many of them both attending and not attending. Nothing wrong with a couple of beers or sips of whiskey with the old diggers though.



I wouldn't so much say that I'm ANZACed out but more that im I bit over the people that attend the dawn service. I'm a serving returned soldier. I feel extreamly proud of the men and women I served with. But, I have noticed that a lot of our young people see it as a bind to have to attend the dawn service and I will stress that it seems to be the guests that accompany the serving members or ex members themselves . I noticed this year more than others that a lot of people hit the club at work for a beer at 6ish o'clock. And just continued to drink. I found this rather sad. The way we go to war now is obviously so different to even 10 years ago and of course 100 years ago and unfortunately (maybe?) this is reflected in our newer members. It's not to say they are less brave. They certainly are not. And I think sometimes I need to cut them some slack.
One thing I would like to add though. Someone mentioned that Britain lost a lot more men. This is so true. But Britain was fighting for its survival. the risk of invasion as well as its place in a new post war Europe. Not one single Australian needed to be there. Every last man and indeed women volunteered to leave there mothers, fathers, brothers and sisters to fight overseas. There was no conscription they did what they thought was right. That is true bravery.
Lest we forget.

[landy]

Do you honestly think that if Britain or Europe had fallen that Australia would not have been on the agenda at some point? It would have, so to say it was not our war is probably not quite correct. Also rememeber most of the soldiers enlisted of their own free will for WW1. You are a current serving member and I respect that, but do the current conflicts in the Middle East have anything to do with us either? I would say they actually have less.
I totally disagree with you stance about people attending services, most of these soldiers are now gone, so it is up to us that are left to show our respect and ensure they are remembered. I know I will as my Great Grandfather was 1st AIF. You cannot seriously just think it should be reserved for ex servicemen or current servicemen? There would be no one to actually watch and appreciate the parades etc. Most of the older diggers are great full to see the support coming from everyday Aussies.
I absolutely agree with people just using it as an excuse to get plastered, too many of them both attending and not attending. Nothing wrong with a couple of beers or sips of whiskey with the old diggers though.

Hi CraigE,
I'm a bit confused. Maybe I didn't articulate my thoughts very well. I think it's a very real possibility that if Europe had fallen Australia might have become the goal. However the fact is, it didn't. However that is not what I am saying. You mentioned that MOST enlisted of there own free will. I'm saying they ALL enlisted of there own free will. There was no conscription. And that is very brave in its self. I'm not saying don't have a drink. Just don't drink to get ****ed and then tell me it's ok because it's ANZAC day.
Nowhere did I say that ANZAC day be reserved for only the current serving. I find it rather offensive that you suggested that I did. It is a national day of rememberence. And rightly is for everybody.
Lastly in response to our involvement in the Middle East. As a professional soldier I am no longer Mr P. Smith. I am 8212345 Rank P Smith of whatever Corp/Regt. I do not have a political view, neither labor or liberal. I except that I could be deployed in Australia's national interests and that I might not know, or understand what that is. I am not paid for what I did today, or what I did yesterday but for what I might be asked to do tomorrow. And I except that unreservedly. When I can not except that I am free to discharge at any time.

[CraigE]

Hey mate,
was not intended to offend, but it did read a little like you did not like people being at the service and leaned a little towards we should not have been in WW1. But that is the problem with any text. If that is not the case I certainly humbly apologise. There is always going to be debate which conflicts we should be involved in and which we should not. The problem is often while not a direct attack or threat there maybe subsequent ramifications of not.
And yes the clowns over ANZAC day getting smashed really annoys me as well as it is a sign of disrespect. Also people using as a long weekend with no thought of what it means. Not begrudging people the right to get away when it is a long weekend like here in WA, but we need to remember what it is.
I ended up working this weekend, but we still had a service in the mine muster room.
Cheers
Craig



Hi CraigE,
I'm a bit confused. Maybe I didn't articulate my thoughts very well. I think it's a very real possibility that if Europe had fallen Australia might have become the goal. However the fact is, it didn't. However that is not what I am saying. You mentioned that MOST enlisted of there own free will. I'm saying they ALL enlisted of there own free will. There was no conscription. And that is very brave in its self. I'm not saying don't have a drink. Just don't drink to get ****ed and then tell me it's ok because it's ANZAC day.
Nowhere did I say that ANZAC day be reserved for only the current serving. I find it rather offensive that you suggested that I did. It is a national day of rememberence. And rightly is for everybody.
Lastly in response to our involvement in the Middle East. As a professional soldier I am no longer Mr P. Smith. I am 8212345 Rank P Smith of whatever Corp/Regt. I do not have a political view, neither labor or liberal. I except that I could be deployed in Australia's national interests and that I might not know, or understand what that is. I am not paid for what I did today, or what I did yesterday but for what I might be asked to do tomorrow. And I except that unreservedly. When I can not except that I am free to discharge at any time.

[landy]

Hey mate,
was not intended to offend, but it did read a little like you did not like people being at the service and leaned a little towards we should not have been in WW1. But that is the problem with any text. If that is not the case I certainly humbly apologise. There is always going to be debate which conflicts we should be involved in and which we should not. The problem is often while not a direct attack or threat there maybe subsequent ramifications of not.
And yes the clowns over ANZAC day getting smashed really annoys me as well as it is a sign of disrespect. Also people using as a long weekend with no thought of what it means. Not begrudging people the right to get away when it is a long weekend like here in WA, but we need to remember what it is.
I ended up working this weekend, but we still had a service in the mine muster room.
Cheers
Craig

Hi Craig,
No it's all good. I'm sorry I didn't get my point across clearly. And I probably went off half cocked so I apologise to you for that.
I'm in awe of what they did before us, and extreamly proud of what we have done recently. ANZAC day is a good day, if that is the right expression.

[DefenderSte]

I found most of it quite interesting.But yes i agree with alot said above regarding the media hype and each TV station wanting to go one better than the other.

Being a pom my partner and I only moved to NZ 18 months ago.After she retired having completed her 22yrs service in the Brittish Army, and I was a public servant back in the UK.I always went to a service for rememberance day 11th hour on the 11th day of the 11th month.Showing the respect that i have for those men and women who gave their all.

Its just think its so sad that these days a large portion of the youth of today dont have any respect anybody or anything well in parts of the UK anyway,dont know about NZ just yet.

Im cathcing up on the history and i didnt realise that ANZAC troops had such a big loss of life. Very sad indeed.

But i am looking forward to seeing the WW1 exhibition at Te Papa in Wellington next week ive heard nothing but great reviews.

Sorry end of rant and i'll put my soap box away now.....:D

[Discofever]

The ANZAC day media and commercialisation is what I am concerned about (and I think the OP is as well). The media (and the proponents) lost me on it when they were advertising camp Gallipoli experiences at the Melbourne showgrounds. You can camp and dress up etc. for large sums of money of course. You could even but camp Gallipoli sleeping bags, tents, swags, hats, belt buckets you name it. So wrong in many ways...

[460cixy]

The ANZAC day media and commercialisation is what I am concerned about (and I think the OP is as well). The media (and the proponents) lost me on it when they were advertising camp Gallipoli experiences at the Melbourne showgrounds. You can camp and dress up etc. for large sums of money of course. You could even but camp Gallipoli sleeping bags, tents, swags, hats, belt buckets you name it. So wrong in many ways...


That's a very sad state of affairs the old boys would be very disappointed on so many levels

[Cliffy]

Never fear, there's only one "100th" anniversary and I'm sure most of the hype will die down next year.
The media saturation will not be repeated as most people aren't interested in the nuts and bolts of the campaign and are only swept up in the general fervour.
I think the TV broadcasters were down on ratings due to the inordinate amount of shows on TV (damn good for me tho!).
May ramp up again in 3 years but nothing like the past few weeks.

[Disco Muppet]

Having been to Gallipoli, I'd never go on Anzac day. Crowded buy people who just want the Gallipoli ticket punched on their tourist card. Go some other time, explore things at your leisure and go pretty much wherever you like, instead of your allocated half a metre square.
That said, plenty of holier than thou Australians. One guy had a go at us for having a group photo taken on the wall with the Anzac lettering, demanding to know if we were Australian as we were being disrespectful.
Nah mate, we are ze Germans and pass the coke please :rolleyes:

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