SWB - Petrol tank installation - pattern - plans - method

[damiane]

Does anyone have a pattern or plan/s for cutting passenger side fuel filler hole in body skin and behind seat? I want to install an extra tank on that side. I understand I will need to have a steel piece added to chassis outrigger to mount the tank. I will also need to:

a) cut a hole in the panel crossing behind the LFT passenger seat to allow for the filler pipe and breather.

b) link both outlet fuel pipes to a physical 3 position tap, I.e. ON LFT side, OFF and ON RT side and mount the tap.

c) cut a shaped hole in the outer body skin and pop rivet the skin fitting with spout.

d) re-wire both fuel sender units through a two-position switch so that I can select the tank from which I'm drawing fuel.

Be grateful if those who have done this already to comment. What have I missed? Any tips?

Thanks :D

Damian

[grey_ghost]

Hi,

My 1960 Series II had a petrol tank installed in the passenger side of the vehicle... The previous owner didn't install a second filler - in order to fill the second tank you had to lift up the passenger seat base, unscrew a petrol cap and fill it that way. Much like a Series I petrol tank under the drivers seat.

There was a switch on the firewall that simply selected left or right hand tank. Not an electric switch - more like a tap. I think that military series used something similar.

Personally I didn't like the installation and removed it. I didn't like the idea of kicking the wife out of her seat to fill it - or because there was no sender, you couldn't see how much petrol was left in the tank..

But it's another idea..

Cheers,
GG.

[damiane]

GG thanks. It is another option although I suspect wouldn't pass a RWC inspection. I don't think they are too keen on a fuel filler inside the vehicle cab. Also both of the Landies I owned in the 70s and 80s - a 2A and a 3- had the external fill arrangement installed. Too easy.

[crackers]

If practical, I'd be tempted to get the second tank plumbed in and working, filler under the seat, just to see how it goes THEN worry about an external filler (which I agree would be the best option). The advantages of this move would be that you get to see how much the second tank gets used and you get the plumbing sorted, the thought being it'd be a pity to cut a hole in the body only to find you can't get it to work or don't get any realistic benefit from it. Sort of a 'don't do anything you can't undo' approach.

[damiane]

There is a lot of sense in what you suggest Crackers. I wonder whether there is a problem with petrol vapours smelling up the interior. I suppose I could run a short breather pipe under the seat.

[gromit]

Damian,

There may be a problem with a filler inside the vehicle check out VicRoads VSI8
OK if originally fitted but not if a 'modification'.

How far will you be traveling to need an additional fuel tank ? Is yours currently a 10gallon or a 16 gallon ?

My Series I has a tank under the tub and two Facet pumps are used, one for each tank. A switch selects which Facet and which sender are used.
Picture below shows pumps on LHS and a fuel pressure regulator (the Facets were too high a pressure).


https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2015/08/50.jpg (http://s1245.photobucket.com/user/cradley/media/Series%201%20with%20Welder/DSCF5248_zps7d0c33e8.jpg.html)

Another option is the changeover valve from a Military Series IIa



Colin

[damiane]

Colin,

Had a read of VIS 8. Thanks for that. I don't think there is any doubt that a filler, even under the seat box, but filled by lifting the "tool-box" lid, would be regarded as being "inside the passenger compartment". In any event the filler pipe on the tank surface is, as I understand it, at the rear of the tank and would be behind the passenger seat. By the time you got a rubber pipe and a cap ring and cap on top of that it would almost certainly be inside that compartment. The alternative would, I guess, involve a specially manufactured fitting ($$$$$$) for the tank to bring the fuel cap down closer to the tank's surface to keep it under the seat box lid (Does that make sense?) Putting a skin fitting on would be child's play in contrast.
It is a 10 gallon (Imp) I believe. Given the range it could well be cutting it fine in SW NSW, SA, or even extended travel in High Plains country without the jerry option which I really do want to avoid. These things are slow enough without a roof rack.

Damian

[gromit]

Damian,
First stage might be to fit a 16gallon tank, your tank could then be moved to the passenger side if needed at a later date.
4-Wheel Drives get the tanks made but they are fairly expensive, hopefully you can find someone parting a vehicle out and score a 16 gallon tank.

Colin

[damiane]

Colin,

Do you know which vehicles were fitted with the 16 gal tank? As in which model. I don't expect you to know the particular cars :)

[JDNSW]

The sixteen gallon tank, I believe, came in with the Series 3, but with modification to the front support outrigger, is a bolt in replacement for the 2/2a.

John

[Dinty]

Mate, give me a day or so and I will look in the shed for you, I'm reasonably certain that I have templates to show how to cut out for a 2nd tank in a SWB, I will let you know in a few days if I can find them.
I did this some years ago and kept them as a reference for just this type of situation, I will keep you posted, cheers Dennis

[damiane]

Mate, give me a day or so and I will look in the shed for you, I'm reasonably certain that I have templates to show how to cut out for a 2nd tank in a SWB, I will let you know in a few days if I can find them.
I did this some years ago and kept them as a reference for just this type of situation, I will keep you posted, cheers Dennis

Terrific, thanks Dennis. No rush. Haven't got a tank yet :D

[marting]

Hi damiane
I have just done this to our SWB tub which we currently have stripped and out of the vehicle. We made up templates in cardboard, using the holes and openings etc. on the drivers side.
I am running twin 10 gallon tanks in the SWB. FWD Motors in Fairfield Yeronga sell re-manufactured 10 and 16 gallon tanks for series landrovers. I have the 16 gallon tanks fitted to my ex-army 109. They are about $300 + GST each and are IMHO a much superior product to the original tank being a single skin steel tank, much like a long range tank sold by ARB etc.
APT manufactured and welded the necessary outrigger to the chassis, but it is straightforward. I just can't weld!
In both vehicles we use the in line tap from a military 11a, in conjunction with a switch on the dash to swap the sender from tank to tank.
Cheers, Martin

[damiane]

Hi damiane
I have just done this to our SWB tub which we currently have stripped and out of the vehicle. We made up templates in cardboard, using the holes and openings etc. on the drivers side.
I am running twin 10 gallon tanks in the SWB. FWD Motors in Fairfield Yeronga sell re-manufactured 10 and 16 gallon tanks for series landrovers. I have the 16 gallon tanks fitted to my ex-army 109. They are about $300 + GST each and are IMHO a much superior product to the original tank being a single skin steel tank, much like a long range tank sold by ARB etc.
APT manufactured and welded the necessary outrigger to the chassis, but it is straightforward. I just can't weld!
In both vehicles we use the in line tap from a military 11a, in conjunction with a switch on the dash to swap the sender from tank to tank.
Cheers, Martin

Thanks Martin. Couldn't see anything related on their website but I'll drop them an email. They may have a brochure of some sort or some pics.

Damian

[marting]

When you give them a call ask for Richard. He is the series expert there.
Cheers, Martin

[damiane]

Hi damiane
I have just done this to our SWB tub which we currently have stripped and out of the vehicle. We made up templates in cardboard, using the holes and openings etc. on the drivers side.
I am running twin 10 gallon tanks in the SWB. FWD Motors in Fairfield Yeronga sell re-manufactured 10 and 16 gallon tanks for series landrovers. I have the 16 gallon tanks fitted to my ex-army 109. They are about $300 + GST each and are IMHO a much superior product to the original tank being a single skin steel tank, much like a long range tank sold by ARB etc.
APT manufactured and welded the necessary outrigger to the chassis, but it is straightforward. I just can't weld!
In both vehicles we use the in line tap from a military 11a, in conjunction with a switch on the dash to swap the sender from tank to tank.
Cheers, Martin

:censored::censored::censored:
Well talk about PRICE SHOCK!!!!!

Spoke to FWD Motors in Qld today. Not their fault at all but the manufacturer has put his fuel tank prices waaaaaaaaaaaayyyyy UP. Like $1,200 for the 16 gall and comparable for the 10 gall. FWD agreed with me that at those prices he won't be making many tanks. Certainly not for me. As I am sure everyone would agree, I could buy a whole barn find off fleabay for that money and part it out just for the tank and fittings. So back to the drawing board. The U.K. option is looking - as a friend of mine says - "betterer and betterer" :D Will have to check freight costs.

Well Paddocks [U.K.] have just got back to me. What a cro*k. They can't even give me the "rough" quote I asked for because until the petrol tank, sender and relevant bolts and gaskets are all packaged up they won't know the dimensions (obviously they have never sold one of their tanks before so they won't know the dimensions !!!!!) BUT - and here's the grabber - they will gladly wrap it all up then tell me the freight cost and if I don't want it they will refund my money. Is that "make work" or what! Guys. Come on!!! This is not rocket surgery. Ho hum. S'pose I can try across the ditch and see if the yanks can do better. Has anyone imported a package about the size of a 10 gallon petrol tank from Paddocks in recent times? Some idea of what it cost would be much appreciated. Ta :)

[damiane]

Mate, give me a day or so and I will look in the shed for you, I'm reasonably certain that I have templates to show how to cut out for a 2nd tank in a SWB, I will let you know in a few days if I can find them.
I did this some years ago and kept them as a reference for just this type of situation, I will keep you posted, cheers Dennis

Dennis, it just occurs to me :bangin:that using say the standard 10 gallon tank under the passenger side that the filler pipe fitting on the tank will be further inboard from the outer skin than in its normal position under the driver's seat. It will go from being on the outer edge to being on the inner edge of the top of the tank. Correct?
I understand you would cut the inlet hole further inboard in the floor but what do you do to overcome the added distance from the end of the metal inlet pipe fitting to the top of the tank? Is it just a case of cutting the rubber pipe at the appropriate spot and inserting a length of steel pipe?

regards

Damian

[Dinty]

The Repair parts manual shows only a RHS fuel tank, that's all that was made by Rover, the only difference is the fuel filler hose for the LHS,
the image shows the templates to cut 2 openings, one on the top of the LHS wheel arch (in the tub) and the other through the seat transom panel
http://i659.photobucket.com/albums/uu319/DJM110/113-372/IMG_4242_zpsgya6uvvb.jpg
What you have said about the opening for the fuel filler neck is correct, as there are only RHS tanks that have been adapted to fit the LHS.
I would not pay $1200.00 for a fuel tank either, you could buy a complete Land Rover wreck for less than that, there are a few Series 3 ex mil kicking about that would (should) have the std 16 gallon tank, S3 military only had a tank on the RHS, anyway mate good hunting, cheers Dennis

[damiane]

I'll get back to you Dennis, if I may, when I have said tank in hand. Thanks for your efforts.

Damian

[Dark61]

Well Paddocks [U.K.] have just got back to me. What a cro*k. They can't even give me the "rough" quote I asked for because until the petrol tank, sender and relevant bolts and gaskets are all packaged up they won't know the dimensions (obviously they have never sold one of their tanks before so they won't know the dimensions !!!!!) BUT - and here's the grabber - they will gladly wrap it all up then tell me the freight cost and if I don't want it they will refund my money. Is that "make work" or what! Guys. Come on!!! This is not rocket surgery.


I've had this nonsense before and it irritates the poo out of me. Your'e quite right , its not rocket surgery and all they need to do is weigh the stuff and then say plus packing. It cant be that hard. Jeeeezs...
cheers,
D

[gromit]

Four Wheel Drives used to get them made, now they've changed ownership you'd have to check price & availability. They even got Series I tanks made but you had to supply a good filler neck to fit into it (too hard/expensive to make).

Catalogue shows them at $467.50 (16gal) but I'm sure it's risen since 2006.

Any sheet metal place could quote but you'd need one to copy........

Paddocks have always operated the way you mention, you pay, they pack it and then quote freight. Problem is if they give a rough price someone will complain if the cost is different when they go to send it......can't win.




Colin

[crackers]

They even got Series I tanks made but you had to supply a good filler neck to fit into it (too hard/expensive to make).

What? How hard is it to make a tube with a mesh at the bottom and a cap at the top? If they can't make a filler, you'd have to wonder if they can make a ruddy tank at all.

[gromit]

What? How hard is it to make a tube with a mesh at the bottom and a cap at the top? If they can't make a filler, you'd have to wonder if they can make a ruddy tank at all.

The filler neck, not the extended filler tube that fits into it. You'd either have to make press tooling up or possibly it could be spun but again you'd need tooling. Then there are the 7 pins that need to be cut & brazed into position.
Even the filler tube would need tooling made.

Cutting & welding up flat sheets is simple in comparison......

Colin

[crackers]

The filler neck, not the extended filler tube that fits into it. You'd either have to make press tooling up or possibly it could be spun but again you'd need tooling. Then there are the 7 pins that need to be cut & brazed into position.
Even the filler tube would need tooling made.

Cutting & welding up flat sheets is simple in comparison......

Colin

I'd have to have another look at mine but I still can't see the complexity. Ah well, I'm not having to make the things (just as well by the sound of it)

Just editing to add that my tank doesn't have a complicated neck sticking out of the tank. The cap is more or less flush with the top of the tank and just extends down into the tank proper with a mesh at the bottom.

[Aaron IIA]

I understand you would cut the inlet hole further inboard in the floor but what do you do to overcome the added distance from the end of the metal inlet pipe fitting to the top of the tank? Is it just a case of cutting the rubber pipe at the appropriate spot and inserting a length of steel pipe?

regards

Damian

The rubber flexible hose needs to be cut, rotated and joined anyway, as only right hand hoses are available.

Aaron

[damiane]

Four Wheel Drives used to get them made, now they've changed ownership you'd have to check price & availability. They even got Series I tanks made but you had to supply a good filler neck to fit into it (too hard/expensive to make).

Catalogue shows them at $467.50 (16gal) but I'm sure it's risen since 2006.

Any sheet metal place could quote but you'd need one to copy........

Paddocks have always operated the way you mention, you pay, they pack it and then quote freight. Problem is if they give a rough price someone will complain if the cost is different when they go to send it......can't win.

Colin

Colin,
I figured they might be worried so I especially asked for a "rough" quote just to have some idea and I told them why. Very inflexible approach from a service point of view. Still it's their business not mine.

Cheers

Damian

[Killer]

The filler neck, not the extended filler tube that fits into it. You'd either have to make press tooling up or possibly it could be spun but again you'd need tooling. Then there are the 7 pins that need to be cut & brazed into position.
Even the filler tube would need tooling made.

Cutting & welding up flat sheets is simple in comparison......

Colin

I made one up for Scallops Series I. I turned it from a solid round bar, quite a bit of work and a lot of wasted material, but it looks the part. We used his existing filler tube and cap.

[damiane]

The filler neck, not the extended filler tube that fits into it. You'd either have to make press tooling up or possibly it could be spun but again you'd need tooling. Then there are the 7 pins that need to be cut & brazed into position.
Even the filler tube would need tooling made.

Cutting & welding up flat sheets is simple in comparison......

Colin

Are we talking about PN 330366 "Cowl for fuel filler"?

Damian

[gromit]

Are we talking about PN 330366 "Cowl for fuel filler"?

Damian

No, we're talking about the filler neck soldered into a Series I tank......

Colin

[marting]

:censored::censored::censored:
Well talk about PRICE SHOCK!!!!!

Spoke to FWD Motors in Qld today. Not their fault at all but the manufacturer has put his fuel tank prices waaaaaaaaaaaayyyyy UP. Like $1,200 for the 16 gall and comparable for the 10 gall. FWD agreed with me that at those prices he won't be making many tanks. Certainly not for me. As I am sure everyone would agree, I could buy a whole barn find off fleabay for that money and part it out just for the tank and fittings. So back to the drawing board. The U.K. option is looking - as a friend of mine says - "betterer and betterer" :D Will have to check freight costs.

:)
Damian
That price is ridiculous! I bought their last 2 10 gallon tanks a fortnight ago, (Won't tell you what I paid for them!) and Richard said their tank supplier was going to put the prices up but that is out of all proportion.
Martin

[damiane]

Damian
That price is ridiculous! . . . . that is out of all proportion.
Martin

Couldn't agree more Martin. Perhaps he just doesn't want to do them.

Damian

[gromit]

Damian,
Have you tried 4 Wheel Drives. If they don't do them any longer I could try to find out who made them.


Colin

[damiane]

Damian,
Have you tried 4 Wheel Drives. If they don't do them any longer I could try to find out who made them.


Colin

Thanks Colin but I am going back there next week in any event to pick up some stuff. I'll check with Murray then.

Damian