I removed my Tyredog TPMS before doing the Gibb River Road

[BSM]

We just completed a big Melbourne to Kimberly loop via WA coast and Central Oz in the D3 towing a camper trailer. The old girl didn't miss a beat for the whole 17,800km journey, and not even a single puncture despite some pretty horrible gravel roads. I put that down to good trip prep including a set of new Bridgestone 697 as recommended by several folk on this forum.

Having previously experienced a puncture whilst towing near Arkaroola (http://www.aulro.com/afvb/d3-d4-rrs/201318-30km-arkaroola-warnings-lights-mild-heart-infarct.html), I was pretty determined to de-risk that side of things. Hence the set of new D697s, a second spare for the car and a Tyredog TPMS.

I'd bought a Tyredog with 6 sensors off ebay, and installed the relay under the right hand side of the car shortly before setting off. I pretty soon realised that whilst the display would show pressures for six wheels (4 car, 2 trailer), there was something amiss with one of the trailer pressure measurements.

When driving at speed on bitumen, the TPMS would faithfully record the increasing pressure and temperature in the tyres as the tyres flexed with the rotation (quite an eye opener how much the pressure can change), however it didn't show any change for one of the trailer tyres, but continued to display the pressure at the start of the drive.

It became clear pretty quickly that the signal from the left trailer wheel just wasn't being picked up by the relay, except very occasionally, like when taking a left hand turn at an intersection, which seemed to allow a brief period of connectivity. Eventually I just removed both trailer sensors, figuring it was better to be receiving no information than pressure data that was not correct.

Despite no-longer having the trailer pressures displayed, I still had the vehicle pressures displayed. It was good to be able to keep an eye on them as we travelled.

At Cape Range I had to air down for the first somewhat lengthy stretch of dirt, and that was when I saw that the sensors were rubbing against the rim. It seemed that the rubber valve stem was flexing outward with the weight of the sensor and rubbing on the rim, wearing a groove.

I didn't do anything about it at the time, but it played on my mind, until at the beginning of the Gibb River Road, with many hundreds of kilometres of hard corrugations ahead I started to picture in my mind the sensor jerking violently at the end of the rubber valve stem as I drove on the corrugations, and figured that the risk of damaging the valve stems outweighed the benefits of seeing the pressure of the tyres, and so removed all of the sensors.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=98321&d=1441001407

Sensor on Valve stem

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=98322&stc=1&d=1441001407

Groove worn in rim

Ironically I met another Disco owner about half way along the GRR, towing a big off-road van. I saw that he had something odd attached to his rims. He explained that he also had Tyredog sensors, and was told of the problem of valve stem flexing by a guy in SA. The guy had said to fit a few inches of that black cylindrical hot water pipe insulation over the sensor and valve stem., rather like a collar, and that this would cushion the sensor and stop the stem flexing. He duly bought some pipe insulation at the Bunnings in Ceduna and installed it. ( It took a picture - I hope he doesn't mind - see thumbnail below)

Of course there is no Bunnings on the GRR, and so I elected to leave the sensors off rather than fashion some makeshift alternative.

To be fair to Tyredog, they do say in their instructions that the sensors should only be fitted to wheels with steel valve stems. I figured though since several forum members were using them successfully, that they'd be fine.

For mine though, the flexing of the rubber valve stems is too great, and the thought of the effect of corrugations presented too much risk. Maybe I'll try the pipe insulations, but too be honest, It looks a bit ugly.

[letherm]

Maybe I'll try the pipe insulations, but too be honest, It looks a bit ugly.

I think ugly is ok when in those circumstances. :D At least you've still got the data coming in and it could possibly stop a problem.

Martin

[Tombie]

3M film on the rim, or short valve stems...
Also can go the metal stems and have no vibration!

[LRD414]

We just completed a big Melbourne to Kimberly loop via WA coast and Central Oz in the D3 towing a camper trailer. The old girl didn't miss a beat for the whole 17,800km journey, and not even a single puncture despite some pretty horrible gravel roads. I put that down to good trip prep including a set of new Bridgestone 697....


That's great news and a big trip. Hopefully you'll be able to do a trip report? Those are all places we want to take the D4 and camper in coming years, so ideas and inspiration would be welcome.

Cheers,
Scott

[discotwinturbo]

I have been using this brand since 2006 and to date no damage to rims, including two CSR trips. Have saved me from a number of times for potential destroyed tyres.

Have only ever used them on the rubber valves too as far as I recall. Both on factory D4 and GOE rims.

My valve stems do seem quite short though so maybe not enough throw.... I also use them on my camper, previous horse float and newhorse truck.

I won't leave him without them.

Brett....

[joel0407]

I've been looking and considering some for a while now. I prefer a system with in tyre sensors such as either the ones that attach by steel band to the rim or the ones that are part of the valve stem.

Reason is Id like to monitor temp as well as pressure. I don't think the air temp at the valve cap is going to be much reflection on what in the tyre.

Happy Days.

[wbowner]

I have had the same problem with van and car with a different set of tpms

Would you need to cover the sensor as well. Does the cover in the pic also cover the sensor? I thought it did but can't see it when I looked closer.
If you just did the stem of the valve would that not be enough ?

Don't know and am looking for an easy solution, like this.

Seems a common problem

I put a bit of that stick on rubber on the rim of the van tyre and you can see how it has been banged around.

I put tape around car sensors.

Both these solutions are not satisfactory though, what you have shown seems better.

I had asked that question on this else where and dome guy recommended getting some closed cell foam from Clarke rubber and cutting out bits with a hole saw and putting these over the stem.
Similar to above I guess.



Richard

[Fred Nerk]

Tyredog accessories include a silicon cover that protects the sensor and the rim. Easy to fit, they just slide on yet are very secure.

http://www.tyredog.com.au/store/replacement-parts/silicon-cover-to-suit-all-tyredog-external-tpms-sensors.html

As for your relay location; I put mine in the cubby box next to the third row seat, "temporarily". Been there ever since. Picks up trailer signals and is out of harms way. Changing the batteries could not be easier. No need to try to secure it under the car.

[wbowner]

I looked up the sensor covers, as I don't have tyre dog tpms they would not help.

I also thought that perhaps they are not the best option

One of the objevtives, apart from having rims marked, is to stop the valve stem from being bounced around which may damage it. I am not sure these would help, may make it worse.

Putting the cover on it like above would stop a lot of the stem movement I think.

Richard

[BSM]

Tyredog accessories include a silicon cover that protects the sensor and the rim. Easy to fit, they just slide on yet are very secure.

Silicon Cover to suit all TYREDOG External TPMS Sensors (http://www.tyredog.com.au/store/replacement-parts/silicon-cover-to-suit-all-tyredog-external-tpms-sensors.html)

As for your relay location; I put mine in the cubby box next to the third row seat, "temporarily". Been there ever since. Picks up trailer signals and is out of harms way. Changing the batteries could not be easier. No need to try to secure it under the car.

The main thing I was concerned with was that the valve stem itself would fail through excessive flexing. Those silicon covers wouldn't really stop that I think.

[BSM]

That's great news and a big trip. Hopefully you'll be able to do a trip report? Those are all places we want to take the D4 and camper in coming years, so ideas and inspiration would be welcome.

Cheers,
Scott

Thanks Scott. Definitely a good thing to do with your D4.

[wbowner]

Does the cover also go over the sensor,

If so would it stay on

Need it cover it any way?

Sorry asked above as well but was lost in some of my other guff 😀

Richard

[Tombie]

The main thing I was concerned with was that the valve stem itself would fail through excessive flexing. Those silicon covers wouldn't really stop that I think.


Won't happen. Those valve stems will outlast your tyres and will be replaced each time a new tyre is fitted (at least they should be as a default)

[Tombie]

I've been looking and considering some for a while now. I prefer a system with in tyre sensors such as either the ones that attach by steel band to the rim or the ones that are part of the valve stem.

Reason is Id like to monitor temp as well as pressure. I don't think the air temp at the valve cap is going to be much reflection on what in the tyre.

Happy Days.


Actually they're quite accurate!

[Nomad9]

Hi There,
The tyre sensors I bought the sensor was part of the valve stem, the sensor part were actually inside the tyres. This obviously comes with its own set of problems one of which was actually fitting the tyre back on the rim after being installed. They seemed to work ok, however when getting the tyres replaced when they reached the legal limit the tyre house broke the sensor when pushing the old tyre off the rim. They were very sorry of course but didn't replace the broken one. With one broken I just took the rest out and left one in the spare tyre. The motion of the vehicle moving was enough to activate the sensor.You always seem to forget checking the pressure in the spare tyre, or the valve stem is facing the bottom of the vehicle.

Cheers Marty

[Tote]

Mine had gaffer tape to stabilise them across the Simpson......after the rims had been damaged.

Regards,
Tote

[Shortyesquire]

I've got the ABR Sidewinder ones that go on the stem. I haven't given them a thrashing yet, but the guys at the tyre place reckon they're the type a lot of truckies use.

My research indicates that short rubber stems should be fine. The metal stems fatigue and crack apparently.

To protect the sensor I've gotten some 22m round rubber feet for table legs for 80c each from Clark rubber. I've drilled a hole in them to squeeze the stem of the sensor through. They have just enough room for the Allen head grommet which I've used 243 loctite on.
98474

[wbowner]

I've got the ABR Sidewinder ones that go on the stem. I haven't given them a thrashing yet, but the guys at the tyre place reckon they're the type a lot of truckies use.

My research indicates that short rubber stems should be fine. The metal stems fatigue and crack apparently.

To protect the sensor I've gotten some 22m round rubber feet for table legs for 80c each from Clark rubber. I've drilled a hole in them to squeeze the stem of the sensor through. They have just enough room for the Allen head grommet which I've used 243 loctite on.
98474

Hi
These are the ones I have and they did cause damage to my van and car.
I contacted Derek and he said to put a sleeve over them.
What you have done is similar to the tyre dog protection you can get
It will be interesting to see how it goes

Richard

[Oztourer]

My local tyre centre warned that steel valve stems do not flex which can be a problem when off road as you run the risk of snapping one from a rock or other side protrusion. I'm looking at 6 wheel TPMSs at the moment and am still not decided on brand or style yet. They advertise the Tyredog brand on eBay but the model numbers are different to what you can get here. Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

[BSM]

My local tyre centre warned that steel valve stems do not flex which can be a problem when off road as you run the risk of snapping one from a rock or other side protrusion. I'm looking at 6 wheel TPMSs at the moment and am still not decided on brand or style yet. They advertise the Tyredog brand on eBay but the model numbers are different to what you can get here. Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

I believe that the model number difference between those TDs available in Oz and those from Taiwan via eBay are simply to do with the different markets that they sell too. I compared the manual for the Australian one (available on-line), with the one written in Chinglish that I got with my EBay TDs, and the functionality is identical.

[BMKal]

I'm looking at 6 wheel TPMSs at the moment and am still not decided on brand or style yet.

Safety (http://www.landybitz.com.au/safety)

This is the system I've been running for the past three years or so without any problems at all. Available from Landybitz - a member on this site. ;)

No issues with valve stem damage, grooves worn in wheels, or sensor units getting damaged by rocks or nicked by kids, as the sensor units are mounted inside the tyre strapped to the rim. :D

At the time of purchase, I looked at the available options. I would never even consider anything with a sensor that just screws onto the end of the valve stem. I was also working in the mining industry at the time where TPMS is a common feature on both heavy equipment and many site light vehicles. The companies I was involved with at the time also ALL chose TPMS systems using sensors inside the tyres, as these are the least likely to be damaged.

The only risk of damage to this type of sensor would be a tyre fitter who was not being careful during tyre repairs / replacement. However, if you mount all sensors in the same easily identified location in each wheel rim and inform your tyre fitter of the location of the sensors, this should not be a problem. My sensors are all mounted directly behind the valve location.

[Iain_B]

I have a Tyre Dog TPMS with internal sensors ( replaces the air valve) and they have been great, 50,000km with them an no problems and they have given me warning of slow leaks twice.

I had the external tyre sensor on my Discovery, and they only lasted one serious trip (about 10,000km) before one by one the sensor started to fail. Like others have found, corrugations and rubber valve stems allow them to flex, and the sensor wore the paint off the rim. It was during the Birdsville floods 2010 when we went down the Birdsville track just after they opened the roads to let everyone out and they probably spent quite a bit of time under water which could have been part of the problem.

I have this system for my Unimog, Steelmate Australia & NZ- TPMS, Parking Sensor Specialist (http://www.steelmate.com.au/p/8643863/diy-tpms-compatible-with-sat-nav-.html) which works with the monitors in the overhead console. I would love to have internal sensors, but I have internal beadlocks (Staun ones).

[Oztourer]

... I have this system for my Unimog, Steelmate Australia & NZ- TPMS, Parking Sensor Specialist (http://www.steelmate.com.au/p/8643863/diy-tpms-compatible-with-sat-nav-.html) which works with the monitors in the overhead console. I would love to have internal sensors, but I have internal beadlocks (Staun ones).

I like the idea of the Steelmate linking up with the AV input on the in-dash GPS. Pity it doesn't come out in a 6 wheel version for my caravan.

[Fred Nerk]

Well, I must add my 2 cents worth. I have the Tyredog 'screw on the stem' system.

No problems. Have driven to Mt Dare where I reckon some of the worst corrugations can be found. Crossed the Simpson, driven mud, beach rock etc. I have the silicone protective covers. No marks on the rims. Valve stems replaced when tyres wear out but do not show any signs of fatigue.

Main advantages for me. I can swap the sensors to what ever trailer I'm towing. I have a set of 6 OEM 19 inch wheels and a set of 6 GOE 18 in wheels and I can easily swap the sensors around. I don't have to remove a tyre to get to the sensor. Batteries are cheap and easy to replace. The tyre fitters can't break them and neither will I when I use my bead breaker kit.
For me it's an easy choice made a while ago and never regretted.

[RobA]

An interesting discussion and reflects the widely varying experiences of users so always a valuable part of this forum. So let me add our 15 years of outback tours to this. We started using TPMS back in 2000 and have worn out plenty from then to now. We have used internal and external sensors and with the D4 and Ultimate have chosen to use the external sensors from LMS which we have tested over around 6,000km of outback travel with no issues. One issue in this thread has been comments on valves bending and we have seen that with rubber valve stems and so chose short metal ones on our GOE rims. But we have the OE valves on the 19" rims and the camper and no problems on dirt and rock roads either. So go figure that perhaps only time and a killer rock will tell. One of the reasons we chose the LMS setup is it can handle enough tyres for two spares on the car and camper if we need them as well as the fact that the sensors are programmable to a wheel and can be re-programmed. This has not been the case for many others in our experience so a note of caution when choosing. We have seen failures with client vehicles and they are very annoyed to find the LHF must be replaced with a LHF and as their "spare" is a RHR things can get teary.

So in our view both are great but one thing in this space is you pay for quality in our view

Rob

[wbowner]

99254

As mentioned above I have alson had troubleb with the sensor damaging the wheel
At some ones suggestion I got some rubber insulating tube from bunnings a have put some on the van and one tyre of the car to see if any other issues



How do you load more than one pic

[wbowner]

Second pic on van


99260

[Fred Nerk]

I have just returned from a two week trip which included Coongie Lakes and about 2000km of dirt with a lot of corrugations. My GOE rims now show some marks where the sensors have rubbed. The marks are superficial and don't bother me, but I felt I should let you know that my previous post was perhaps premature and after a few years and a lot of travelling on corrugated roads, some paint has rubbed off where the sensors have bounced on the rim.

[rrturboD]

I've had a 4 tyre set of tyredogs for over 10 years now. I use the 4 on my vehicle, and when towing, move the front sensors to the trailer. I hope I'll feel a front tyre deflate. So far the standard sensor and receiver have saved me twice with deflating trailer tyres. I use the short (about 20mm) valve stems and was advised by tyre shop to describe them as 'gocart' valve stems, as they are the shortest rubber available.
Given that I have multiple sets of wheels, the external sensors made sense.