roof racks

[crump]

So the Defender owners book states a load rating of 150kg inc. rack on road and 30kg inc. rack off road. I know its all to prevent litigation and such, but what sort of loads are people in the real world carrying on their racks on trips?

[Rosco]

Roof rack + all the light bulky gear you have. Spare wheels and fuel/water .. :roll: .. Not really clever IMHO... :wink:

Cheers

[seqfisho]

Hi Crump,

Try to avoid any real weight on the roof 8O

My first fender had an ARB full length steel rack, good solid unit and it weighed a ton, you really noticed the difference in handling with it on 8O so much so that it was removed (quite a job requiring 3-4 people 8O ) when not needed.

The second fender I used rhino bars x 3 and one of their alloy trays 3/4 length and for a short time had the 2nd spare up there but you did notice the weight although not as bad as the ARB rack on its own, without the spare was not a problem, could even remove the tray on my own :wink: and it was a very robust system.

Given the fact that a defenders roof aint the strongest part of the car you really dont want to put too much weight up there let alone what it does to the COG.


How the camel trophy trucks didn't fall over all the time beats me 8O

[seqfisho]

Sorry didnt really answer your question :roll:

All I would really carry is the tent, fold up table, chairs, swags etc just the bulky light stuff that is likely to only be needed once a day. :wink:

If you were going somewhere remote then maybe a tire carcass, but not a full wheel and tire unlees it cant be avoided, same goes for jerries (water or fuel) plenty do do it but eventually you strike trouble and why risk ruining your trip when you can avoid it :wink:

Anyway have you ever tried to lift a full jerry can or wheel and tire onto the roof of a fender 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O sphincter popping material style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif :oops:

[crump]

Thanks for the advice, I was aware of the rollover risk, but didnt phrase the question that well. I was more refering to structural integrity of the gutter mount. I just removed the Rhino bars from the defender to fit a new rack and I noticed that the mounts had distorted the inner gutter to a small degree. They have only ever carried a canoe(50 kg) short distances and it may have been the tightness that I did the clamps up that caused the distortion, it wasn't ridiculously tight. So having just fitted a new rack that I can walk around on and is designed to carry 8 jerry cans and a spare wheel, I was somewhat concerned as to the guttering bending under such a high weight, even though it is supported by 12 mounts.Has anyone ever had dramas with the strenghth of their gutters when carrying loads.

[seqfisho]

Wow 8 jerries @25kg a piece 200kg

and a spare @ 35kg plus the rack @ 20-30kg 8O
8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O


The rhino bars on mine never distorted the gutters, they did dig into the compound in the gutter style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif but the gutter is actually quite solid :wink: its the cab walls that aren't that strong :roll:

If you were going to be brave and carry some big weights up there then I would look at some internal bracing to the chassis or like the NAS defenders and mount the rack to the externat roll cage :wink:

[Greylandy]

Hi Crump,

I'd limit the weight to 150kg including the rack. It also depends where you take the vehicle with such loads on the roof .. obviously if doing lots of bitumen driving it's not a big issue. Having said that, I once owned a very similar rack :wink: :wink: style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif and loaded it to the rafters. It had 5 Jerry Cans, 1 spare wheel, tent, tent poles and a milk crate with oils for the vehicle. The defender handled like a drunk camel but there was no real damage to the gutter or pillars. Like Seqfisho said .. those Camel Trophy Defenders carried huge loads on the roof .. I'm sure if you stick to the 150kg rule in general .. it will be ok.

Henry.

[crump]

Thanks Henry, I wasnt questioning the integrity of the rack(similar to the one you used to own), just the gutters themselves. Have no intention of loading to those limits, although with diesel at $1.37 per litre I may have to reconsider that.I'll stick to a couple of jerries for fuel if required, a spare and my swag, and you drive to the conditions anyway.

[disco200tdi]

Not on defender but a disco,

I have just come back from a Simpson Desert trip during which I carried a second tyre casing on some roof bars.
It weighted 20kgs.
I now have cracks in the rain gutters at all the pillars. This was the first and only time I have carried soming on the roof, and I will never do it again.

[Greylandy]

Originally posted by disco200tdi
Not on defender but a disco,

I have just come back from a Simpson Desert trip during which I carried a second tyre casing on some roof bars.
It weighted 20kgs.
I now have cracks in the rain gutters at all the pillars. This was the first and only time I have carried soming on the roof, and I will never do it again.

That doesn't sound right John .. have you owned the Disco from new? It might have been overloaded by a previous owner.

[seqfisho]

Originally posted by disco200tdi
Not on defender but a disco,

I have just come back from a Simpson Desert trip during which I carried a second tyre casing on some roof bars.
It weighted 20kgs.
I now have cracks in the rain gutters at all the pillars. This was the first and only time I have carried soming on the roof, and I will never do it again.

Are they cracks in the metal or just the filler compound between the two parts 8O , most likely it is superficial and not structural, the disco's have a more solid roof and side panel construction than defenders :wink:

[disco200tdi]

I have owned the disco from new.
From underneath the rail gutter you can see cracks in the paint adjacent to the welds at the pillars. There is now slight rust stains starting to come thru. Maybe just the paint is broken but I doubt it. You cannot see any damage from above.
I reckon the flex of the roof bars have been bending the gutters back and forth.
Maybe on bitumen its alright, but on corrugated roads I won't put anything on the roof again.

A friend of mine has developed a carrier for a second tyre carcass hung of the original spare, so as I have a kaymar rear carrier I will make one of these too.

[crump]

Originally posted by disco200tdi
Not on defender but a disco,

I have just come back from a Simpson Desert trip during which I carried a second tyre casing on some roof bars.
It weighted 20kgs.
I now have cracks in the rain gutters at all the pillars. This was the first and only time I have carried soming on the roof, and I will never do it again.
Bugger it, I knew I should have bought a troopy!!
But seriously, if LR states 150kg on road and 30kg off road, is a dirt road off road or only a corrugated dirt road, or do they mean rock climbing and bush bashing.No offence, but I wouldnt classify the Simpson as seriously off road. Ohhh, my head hurts.

[matbor]

Originally posted by disco200tdi
A friend of mine has developed a carrier for a second tyre carcass hung of the original spare, so as I have a kaymar rear carrier I will make one of these too.

Sounds interesting, any pics ??

[cols110]

Originally posted by Greylandy
Hi Crump,

The defender handled like a drunk camel but there was no real damage to the gutter or pillars. Like Seqfisho said .. those Camel Trophy Defenders carried huge loads on the roof .. I'm sure if you stick to the 150kg rule in general .. it will be ok.

Henry.

Yes but Camel Trophy was only a 2 week event, and the racks also have extra front and rear bracing which helps transmit some of the weight onto the body, not just the gutters.

[Greylandy]

Originally posted by cols110+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(cols110)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-Greylandy
Hi Crump,

The defender handled like a drunk camel but there was no real damage to the gutter or pillars. Like Seqfisho said .. those Camel Trophy Defenders carried huge loads on the roof .. I'm sure if you stick to the 150kg rule in general .. it will be ok.

Henry.

Yes but Camel Trophy was only a 2 week event, and the racks also have extra front and rear bracing which helps transmit some of the weight onto the body, not just the gutters.[/b][/quote]

Agree ... but they used a similar design to the rack Crump is currently using. It's got 5 legs on either side as well as 2 at the back but more importantly .. the front legs sit over the B-Pillar, not all the way to the front. Crump's rack came from the same manufacturer as the Camel Trophy racks and is supposed to be an expedition rack. Pic below:

http://www.greylandy.com/images/rr1.jpg

[cols110]

It certainly looks like a pretty good set up, especially with the rear supports. The big difference in the Camel racks is that there are 2 fwd and rear support stuts as shown that help transfer weight directly onto the body, and releave a bit of weight from the gutters.

Here is a pic of a brownchurch rack similar to a CT spec on.

http://www.brownchurch.co.uk/images/LR-11-95-110.jpg

I&#96;ve seen a couple of different racks that dont use seperate mounting feet, but long runners which run the lenght of the gutter, so as to give the maximium amount of support avaiable. Sorry cant seem to find any pics of em on the net.

[seqfisho]

The old style ARB racks used to run a full length gutter support and 4 clamps down each side, not so sure about the newer style though.

[DEFENDERZOOK]

<span style="color:indigo">the ones land rover fit run the length of the gutters.....


this type apparently is too rigid and will eventually rip the roof off as it doesn't allow enough flexing when over uneven terrain.....

mine is starting to sound like it is coming apart in the roof department.....
all i carry up there is my spare tyre (as i like to see what goes on behind me while driving)</span>