Rear Diff broken :(

[Captain_Rightfoot]

Hmmmmm Since our trip I have noticed quite a bit of drivetrain noise on overrun. Last night I had a let's work it out session with some very experienced friends.

It would appear that it's rear differential. They believe that most probably it was caused becase they didn't set the pre-load right. Looks like a trip to the dealers style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif

Has anyone had any experience with how LR will handle this. I don't want them to just change the bearing and re-set it, I believe they should replace the diff centre (at least the crown wheel and pinion) as I don't want to be stuck with a noisy diff for the next 15 years :x The car has just 7k on it.

[101RRS]

If they do the work correctly there will not be any noise - if there is take it back. Any dimantling of the diff should result in the mechanics re-lapping the teeth to ensure there is no noise.

Insist the work is being done by diff trained staff.

[seqfisho]

Hi CR,

Will you be able to get it fixed so you can make it on the 21st :?

You could always hit em up for a maxi drive style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif

I know when my first fender had the rear door frame crack because of the spare, if you knew who to ask you could talk LR into fixing by installing an aftermaket swing out carrier :wink: it was great to know someone who worked there in those days style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif :wink:

[Hellspawn]

Originally posted by Captain_Rightfoot

It would appear that it's rear differential. They believe that most probably it was caused becase they didn't set the pre-load right. Looks like a trip to the dealers style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif


In my mind it doesn't matter if they did set the preload and everything else up correctly, just because everything measures perfect on the bench doesn't mean it will forever stay that way when back in the housing being subjected to loads.

The rear diff in HS I rebuilt with new everything, set it up best I could to the manual specs and will spin quietly unless asked to cope with full throttle when it howls a bit. Nothing I can do about it, there's certainly nothing wrong the specs as I paid someone to tell me what I already knew to be sure. Just it doesn't remain perfectly set all the time because of what the motor applies to it I can't adjust or account for in setup.

The other thing to remember is even if they do set it back up to spec, it may still howl, whine, whatever noise it makes because the diff has worn to a certain pattern and getting everything back to that spec where it it doesn't make noise will be chance or very difficult.

Be interested to know how this turns out.

[Captain_Rightfoot]

[quote=Captain_Rightfoot]The other thing to remember is even if they do set it back up to spec, it may still howl, whine, whatever noise it makes because the diff has worn to a certain pattern and getting everything back to that spec where it it doesn't make noise will be chance or very difficult.

Be interested to know how this turns out.
That is exactly why, if my diagnosis is correct, I'll be gunning for a whole new centre diff. The car is only 3 months old... this shouldn't be happening. 8O :cry: :cry:

As long as they come to the party I'll can forgive style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif

[Captain_Rightfoot]

Originally posted by seqfisho
Hi CR,

Will you be able to get it fixed so you can make it on the 21st :?

You could always hit em up for a maxi drive style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif

I know when my first fender had the rear door frame crack because of the spare, if you knew who to ask you could talk LR into fixing by installing an aftermaket swing out carrier :wink: it was great to know someone who worked there in those days style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif :wink:

I have booked it in for the week after the meeting for that reason. The caveat is that I'll take it in and let the service manager have a listen next week and see what he says.

I think he'll be like my mate who just thought it was Steve being picky about little noises. After he drove the car down the street he got out and shook his head... 8O He went on to say it had a noisier diff than his 89 Rangie with 450k on it 8O 8O

[Captain_Rightfoot]

I'm going to be cautious here, but it looks like the dealer have done a very good job. they had the car for 3 whole days, and claim they have fixed a raft of minor niggles (leaks, loose bits etc).

But most importantly, they claim that the noisy read differential was worn bearings. I'm not quite sure what caused a car with 7k on it to have worn bearings, but I'm not so sure I'm going to find out. Anyway, they have replaced the entire diff centre style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif I haven't driven it yet, but the wife says it's all quiet now. style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif

Interestingly I went for a drive with a service tech and within a k of the dealer he had concurred with our diagnosis of the rear diff, and agreed that they would replace the diff centre subject to his confirmation of the problem. style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif

Contrast this with the members of our Simpson party who broke a rear diff in a Prado. At last count the car had been in the stealer for 5 weeks while they argued over who was going to pay for it. I believe that they have a letter from Toyota saying that the car was not being used for it's intended purpose, and therefor they would not honour the warranty. So, if yoiu buy a Prado, and do anything more than shopping and school runs, you're on your own :roll: :roll:

[p38arover]

Originally posted by Captain_Rightfoot
I believe that they have a letter from Toyota saying that the car was not being used for it's intended purpose, and therefor they would not honour the warranty. So, if yoiu buy a Prado, and do anything more than shopping and school runs, you're on your own :roll: :roll:

So if you use a Prado 4WD for 4WDing, that is not the purpose for which the Prado was designed? 8O

Ron

[DEFENDERZOOK]

<span style="color:blue">quick question: did you check the oil level in the diff before you took it back?


they dont always come filled....these should be checked on the pre delivery inspection (if it is done correctly)......

or it may not have been set up correctly in the first place.....</span>

[Captain_Rightfoot]

[quote=DEFENDERZOOK]<span style="color:blue">quick question: did you check the oil level in the diff before you took it back?


they dont always come filled....these should be checked on the pre delivery inspection (if it is done correctly)......

or it may not have been set up correctly in the first place.....</span>
Good question. I didn't check the levels, because my I wasn't sure how it would go, and I thought that playing dumb customer was the go, so I didn't even want to mark the plug.

My experienced LR friends though when they heard it that the pre-load was set up incorrectly. I fear that is as close as we're going to come to knowing style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif

[shaunp]

Preload for sure on a car so new.

[DEFENDERZOOK]

Originally posted by shaunp
Preload for sure on a car so new.


<span style="color:blue">usually is just the pre loads....but.....

we have had one or two come in with a dry diff.....
some places dont do a thorough pre delivery and it may have gone out with no or very little oil in it.....</span>

[JDNSW]

Long time ago, but a cousin of mine had the gearbox fail on a new car at about 5000miles, away from home, so it was not the selling dealer that handled the warranty repair - and the inside of the gearbox was not even oily! I always thought it did very well to go that far. (It was an Austin)

[Captain_Rightfoot]

[quote=shaunp]Preload for sure on a car so new.


<span style="color:blue">usually is just the pre loads....but.....

we have had one or two come in with a dry diff.....
some places dont do a thorough pre delivery and it may have gone out with no or very little oil in it.....</span>
If nothing else, it proves I should be checking the rest of the fluids style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif I will do that today.

I drove the car this morning... the noise is all gone style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif

I also heard this morning that the Toyota is still hostage while they fight over it. 8O I will get the full story tonight. style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif

[George130]

Like JD commented its any brand. Father-in-laws merc destroyed the rear tyres in 15,000 k's. Turns out the suspension pre delivery alignment wasn't done. Initially the dealer claimed he had hit a kerb with force and was also driving to hard. Car hasn't been back to them since. Merc Aust got quite a rocked over it same as when the dealer tried to bill him they were given 5 mins to remove the new tyres they had fitted and and him the keys or he would report the car stolen and the last known location as their place. All this in the show room before prospective customers style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif

[Captain_Rightfoot]

After last night I can confirm the Prado is still a hostage and has been for the 2 months since we returned from our trip. Toyota are refusing to pay, and so are the owners 8O :x 8O

[Hellspawn]

Originally posted by Captain_Rightfoot
After last night I can confirm the Prado is still a hostage and has been for the 2 months since we returned from our trip. Toyota are refusing to pay, and so are the owners 8O :x 8O


Had a similar experience with Deutz Fahr. Reiterates the mentality of most big companies. It's normally the yard manager who breaks just to get the vehicle out of the yard and hopefully see the last of you.

My thinking is if this stand off keeps going, your friends will have to weigh up which is more, lost use of the vehicle or the repair. For us, not having the Deutz was costing us more than the repair. Approached the yard manager and came to and agreement of "halves" in cost.

[shaunp]

I'd bypass the dealer and go direct to Toyota, tell them how would they like poeple to know what crap really they are on a tv program on like Current affair. Landcruiser King off the road yeah right. The dealer is just worried about Toyota paying them for the repair. Your mate just needs to yell loud enough every day and he will right.

[George130]

Originally posted by shaunp
I'd bypass the dealer and go direct to Toyota, tell them how would they like poeple to know what crap really they are on a tv program on like Current affair. Landcruiser King off the road yeah right. The dealer is just worried about Toyota paying them for the repair. Your mate just needs to yell loud enough every day and he will right.

I would agree. E-mail Toyata at least once a day and quote reference of each post so it grows and grows. Contact dealer at least once a day and offer same threat. The best method is an as public a way as possible, That is on their busiest day turn up in show room and demand the manager and in a load voice complain , rant and rave as much as possible. Refuse to go into an office untill they give you an agreement in writting and point out to them that their after sales service and waranties are crap. This attitude works wonders.

Also specify a time fram for repairs to be done. If the time frame passes email every dealler in the country and as many oppositions companmies as possible plus consumer affairs and the media. Show no mersy :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

If you want us to join in the campaing please suppliy their email address. I will happily ask them to please explain what happened as im a prospective customer :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

That will learn them.
My work collegues will attest to my stubborness when my hard earned money is involved with poor customer service.

[abaddonxi]

Hi,

I used to know a fella who's job it was to go around NSW following up all of the disputes between dealers and owners.

He was pretty convincing that Toyota would come to the party if it was clearly a mechanical problem and not a falling out of love with the car problem. This included out of warranty stuff.

So, there is a person out there. Find them and they should work it out.






Well, I'm an optimist.

Cheers

Simon

[Captain_Rightfoot]

I just spoke to my brother who is the head of a japanese manufacturer in Aus, and he says that the best way to get what you want is to check the handbook, and if there are no specific exclusions take them to small claims, and you usually win style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif

[sclarke]

Originally posted by JDNSW
Long time ago, but a cousin of mine had the gearbox fail on a new car at about 5000miles, away from home, so it was not the selling dealer that handled the warranty repair - and the inside of the gearbox was not even oily! I always thought it did very well to go that far. (It was an Austin)

Not a Landcrab???

[p38arover]

Originally posted by Captain_Rightfoot
Contrast this with the members of our Simpson party who broke a rear diff in a Prado. At last count the car had been in the stealer for 5 weeks while they argued over who was going to pay for it. I believe that they have a letter from Toyota saying that the car was not being used for it's intended purpose, and therefor they would not honour the warranty. So, if yoiu buy a Prado, and do anything more than shopping and school runs, you're on your own :roll: :roll:

This question arose on the Overlander forum about this:

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>Do we know what the full story is here? Was the Prado fitted with an 8 inch suspension lift and a 4 " body lift? Was the bottom of the diff covered in big rock scrapes etc? Did it have 800 kg of luggage on its roof rack/luggage rack? Was it towing a 3 tonne load on rough off road territory? Or did it just have 4 passengers, 100kg luggage, no camping gear, no trailer, no modifications and being driven by a couple of grannies in the middle of the Simpson Desert?
Got no idea what the story is but its stupid to just recite one case like that with NO detail at all of the circumstance.[/b][/quote]

Was the Prado modified, etc?

Ron

[shaunp]

Have you seen the 4WD monthly last issue the 100series Cruiser broke a front diff on the 4x4 of the year test. TDV6 Disco won. They seemed a liitle worried about reader back lash on the winner, and spent some time justifying the choice. Eating a little crow.

[Captain_Rightfoot]

Originally posted by p38arover+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(p38arover)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-Captain_Rightfoot
Contrast this with the members of our Simpson party who broke a rear diff in a Prado. At last count the car had been in the stealer for 5 weeks while they argued over who was going to pay for it. I believe that they have a letter from Toyota saying that the car was not being used for it's intended purpose, and therefor they would not honour the warranty. So, if yoiu buy a Prado, and do anything more than shopping and school runs, you're on your own :roll: :roll:

This question arose on the Overlander forum about this:

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>Do we know what the full story is here? Was the Prado fitted with an 8 inch suspension lift and a 4 " body lift? Was the bottom of the diff covered in big rock scrapes etc? Did it have 800 kg of luggage on its roof rack/luggage rack? Was it towing a 3 tonne load on rough off road territory? Or did it just have 4 passengers, 100kg luggage, no camping gear, no trailer, no modifications and being driven by a couple of grannies in the middle of the Simpson Desert?
Got no idea what the story is but its stupid to just recite one case like that with NO detail at all of the circumstance.[/b][/quote]

Was the Prado modified, etc?

Ron[/b][/quote]
Ron,

The prado had 2 people only on board. It had enough fuel and water on board to do the simpson trip we were doing. In my opinion they weren't being extravagent. For the trip I would consider it lightly loaded, like 5 of the other 6 vehicles doing the trip. The other vehicle was a patrol that was loaded to the gunnels and was much heavier than it needed to be.

As far as mechanical mods, the only mods it had was a 2 inch suspension lift, slightly wider tyres (275's as opposed to 235 stock), and a loud exhaust. It was a petrol automatic about 2 years old. It broke a rear differential.

It has now been in the shop for FOUR months at the end of this month. Toyota are saying that "it was not being used for the purpose for which it is intended". :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: In other words, you're covered if you're taking the kids to school or going to the shops. If you're using it off road you are on your own.

The owner has dug his heels in and is taking toyota to small claims. Toyota are asking to see the video of it breaking. That was the last update I had. I can ring them if you like.

For a laugh.. the other prado on the trip broke a front diff in his front yard playing on a couple of rocks... lol

[Captain_Rightfoot]

Let me know what the thread is and I'll help out style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif I love a good forum war as much as the next bloke style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif

[p38arover]

Then I should let you respond. Sorry it was A4WDM, not OL

The forum thread is http://www.4wdmonthly.com.au/forum/index.p...=12989;start=50 (http://www.4wdmonthly.com.au/forum/index.php?board=1;action=display;threadid=12989;st art=50)

Ron

[Captain_Rightfoot]

Originally posted by p38arover
Then I should let you respond. Sorry it was A4WDM, not OL

The forum thread is http://www.4wdmonthly.com.au/forum/index.p...=12989;start=50 (http://www.4wdmonthly.com.au/forum/index.php?board=1;action=display;threadid=12989;st art=50)

Ron
Reply made. I think I was fairly objective about it too.. hope they appreciate it but I guess it wil get lost in the war... LOL.

[Captain_Rightfoot]

I rang them and found out that they actually got the car back last week. I'm not sure whether it was the video or that they just waited them out, but toyota came to the party. style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif