Navy artificers.

[bob10]

I joined in 1964, as an Engine Room Artificer Apprentice. After a number of name changes, ended up a CPOMTP. [ Marine technical propulsion.] However, my mates and I will always be ERA'S. Our apprentice system mirrored the RN's.

https://youtu.be/KM5kzGSWJIY

[carlschmid2002]

Pillow Fights?

[bob10]

Pillow Fights?

They are English. The video is an R.N. video.

[pop058]

Pillow Fights?

Stokers. what else can you say :p

[bob10]

Stokers. what else can you say :p

That part of the video is meant to represent the cross section of Artificers in the RN at the time. The only pillow fight stokers have is with seamans girlfriends. [ place smily face here. for some reason, it's not working.] For the record, Artificers are not, and never have been, stokers.

[pop058]

I joined in 1964, as an Engine Room Artificer Apprentice. After a number of name changes, ended up a CPOMTP. [ Marine technical propulsion.] However, my mates and I will always be ERA'S. Our apprentice system mirrored the RN's.

https://youtu.be/KM5kzGSWJIY


That part of the video is meant to represent the cross section of Artificers in the RN at the time. The only pillow fight stokers have is with seamans girlfriends. [ place smily face here. for some reason, it's not working.] For the record, Artificers are not, and never have been, stokers.

All the MTP's I knew were referred to as stokers

[bob10]

All the MTP's I knew were referred to as stokers

Stokers carry Artificers tool bags. A stoker used to be able to progress to a mechanician , via a fast tracked course at the apprentice school, Quakers hill [ shut down now]. I've known some excellent mechanicians, who gave nothing away to any tiffie. Another avenue was the direct entry tiffie, a qualified tradesman who, if selected, came in at the rank of ERA2.

Stokers came in as general entry sailors, via HMAS Cerberus. Artificers entered via HMAS Nirimba, as apprentices aged 15 to 16. after 4 years apprenticeship, they joined the fleet as ERA3 [ leading seaman] where practical training began in learning the operation of every type of machine on the ship, eg evaporators, turbo generators, boilers , steam turbines. At this point, the training mirrored the stokers training in the operation of the machinery. Also, young Tiffies participated in boiler cleans, bilge cleans, and every other dirty job Stokers did, to keep them grounded. Tiffies had to get every machinery watchkeeping certificate before they could progress in the Artificer stream.

While getting the mwc's, young ERA3's worked with ERA2's, & ERA1's, learning the finer points of maintaining all the machinery they had on board.
I guess the fundamental difference between Stokers & Tiffies was the Stokers operated the machinery, Tiffies operated and maintained it. As mentioned, motivated stokers could enter the Tiffie mainstream by being selected for mechanician training. I've never met a bad mechanician. No sailor in the old navy ever called a Tiffie a stoker.

[pop058]

So as a CPOMTP, you were never referred to as a Chief Stoker ??

[bob10]

Interested members could find out more by reading 'Skilled Hands at Sea ".

SKILLED HANDS AT SEA - HMAS Nirimba Story (http://www.ran-skilledhands.org/library/index_skilledhands_at_sea.htm)

Engineering training

http://www.ran-skilledhands.org/library/index_skilledhands_at_sea.htm

[bob10]

So as a CPOMTP, you were never referred to as a Chief Stoker ??

Never. You were a Tiffie, or Chief Tiffie. There was always only one Chief Tiffie, and one Chief Stoker. Woe betide any ERA1 who allowed himself to be called Chief Stoker, if the real Chief heard.

[bob10]

Just to confuse the issue further, senior sailors in the Tiffie branch had the opportunity to sit for a " Charge ' certificate.Briefly, this certificate is awarded to Senior Marine Technical personnel who have acquired the practical and technical expertise dealing with the construction , operation and maintenance of machinery and equipment fitted in steam powered ships , [ in my case], to enable him to take charge of the Marine Engineering Dept. in the absence of a Marine Engineering Officer. Needless to say, a Tiffie could not become a Chief ERA without the charge certificate.

Having said that, when I joined the Patrol boat stream, on the old Attack class boat, Ardent, I joined as the "Charge" Tiff. and until I left the navy, from the Fremantle boat Woolongong, I answered to nothing else but Charge. I was responsible to the C.O. for the administration and efficient running of the engineering branch on the boat. It was a credit to the high calibre of sailors in the Patrol boat stream, that my job was made easy by the fact the sailors were a cut above the norm, IMO. Best time of my career, working out of Darwin, not so good out of Sydney, in Bass Strait, but we were doing an essential job.

[pop058]

Bob,
Do you have a hard copy of "Skilled Hands at Sea" ?

[bob10]

Bob,
Do you have a hard copy of "Skilled Hands at Sea" ?

When I was the secretary for the Sandgate Naval Association, one of our members was from the first intake at Nirimba, 1956, I think. He gave me a copy. I know I have it here somewhere, but it's like my glasses, damned if I know where. However I have not made a forensic search. I will tomorrow, & get back to you.

[pop058]

When I was the secretary for the Sandgate Naval Association, one of our members was from the first intake at Nirimba, 1956, I think. He gave me a copy. I know I have it here somewhere, but it's like my glasses, damned if I know where. However I have not made a forensic search. I will tomorrow, & get back to you.

I have several, but found (another) one at a flea market awhile ago.

[bob10]

I have several, but found (another) one at a flea market awhile ago.

Definitely a good read. However, a more informative read is a paperback written by L.G. "Sandy" Freeleagus, called MOBI, the original inhabitant of the RAN's training establishment. Larger than life , I can tell you every story is true, Sandy was not far ahead of me at Nirimba, I remember first hand most of the stories. If you read Skilled Hands at sea, and MOBI, you get a good idea of life in the RAN apprentice training establishment. MOBI used to be sold at the Maritime Museum, Brisbane.