Orkney 90's Series 2A Project

[Orkney 90]

Well, after a long search and much umming and uh-ing, I have finally bitten the bullet... For better or worse.

I have been on the look-out for a long wheel base Series hardtop for a long time. I wanted something that was as close to original as possible. Original running gear. Minimum rust. Something solid that I could get back on the road, then restore as time permits.

Have I really found the Holy Grail? Honestly not sure yet, as the Series 2A I have just purchased I have not yet laid eyes upon. Yes, purchased sight-unseen. To be delivered next week when I have some days off from work.

All I know about the car are the few photos I have seen which hopefully I will be able to upload. I am not the most computer savvy person in the whole world.

I am however a Carriage Builder by trade. So the body-work won't worry me too much. It's the rest of the car that will be an adventure. Or a major headache. Probably both. I should probably stock up on those codeine tablets. Wait, is that even legal? Never mind.

Okay, well according to CalVin this is what I have found out so far about the Land Rover I have not yet met in person;

Series 2A
Chassis Number: 34708368G
Basic Body Type
109 Inch
6 Cylinder Engine
Model Years: 1966-1971
CKD - Right Hand Drive
08368 Serial Number
G = 6 significant design modifications
Suffix used from April 1969 - October 1971

Hopefully I can find out more about it as time goes on. Anyway, here are the pictures that I have seen.

[Orkney 90]

And some more photos...

[67hardtop]

Mate, welcome to series ownership. That looks like a fine example of a late 2a. You will have many hours of enjoyment restoring it to whatever level you choose. You will need headache tablets too....lol. but its all good. Looking forwards to seeing another s2a on the road again. Good luck with ur new landy. Dont forget, without pics, it didnt happen...

Cheers Rod

Sent from my GT-P5110 using AULRO mobile app

[Dark61]

Nice looking thing.


What's that under the dash Mate , some kind of heater?


cheers,
D

[Orkney 90]

Nice looking thing.


What's that under the dash Mate , some kind of heater?


cheers,
D

Hi Dark61, not quite sure what that thing is. I only get the car next Wednesday. I was kind of hoping that someone on here may know... Also that strange looking round black thing attached to the steering column?

And is there anything else obviously not original Land Rover just by those few photos?

[67hardtop]

Nice looking thing.


What's that under the dash Mate , some kind of heater?


cheers,
D

Yes that is a heater and the round thing on the steering column looks to be an aftermarket tachometer.

Cheers Rod

Sent from my GT-I9507 using AULRO mobile app

[Orkney 90]

Thank you 67hardtop. That does make sense. Can't wait to see it in person and get stuck into it.

[Thunderbolt]

Nice one! Yours looks to have the syncro box in it going by the straight gearstick. I've got a similar vintage one but mines a four and the non syncro box but same grill and a vdo tacho in the same spot. Looks like freewheeling hubs from the pic
Cheers

[30t of coolness]

Good buying, I was watching that myself but couldn't afford another project at the moment (even if it has a smiths heater) according to the wife!

[Orkney 90]

...(even if it has a smiths heater)...

So I'm presuming that a Smith's Heater is a good thing?

[JDNSW]

It would be interesting if indeed it does have an all synchro gearbox - as far as I am aware this box was only fitted to home market station wagons.

Regardless, from the pictures it does look like a very good specimen. And I agre - the thing on the steering column is an aftermarket tacho, and the black thing on the firewall is a heater.

John

[Orkney 90]

The all-synchro gearbox does sound interesting, so that is something I will check out when I get the car. I am guessing that the original could have been replaced sometime in the life of the car.

Once I get my hands on it, I will take some more detailed photos.

[Homestar]

The pic taken of the chassis number - the opposite side spring hanger doesn't look right - not sure what's going on there. All in all, looks like a nice original unit.:). Good to see it has the original 6 in it, and hasn't been changed for a Holden engine. Don't let anyone talk you into replacing it - while they probably aren't as bulletproof as the Land Rover 4 cylinder, with good maintenance they are a reliable enough engine and are super smooth, free reving and easy to coax a few more ponies out of. :)

[67hardtop]

Looks like freewheeling hubs from the pic
Cheers

They are warn hubs.

They are argueably the toughest free wheeling hubs available at the time for series and other makes. Really strong.

Cheers Rod

Sent from my GT-I9507 using AULRO mobile app

[JDNSW]

Yes, Warn Hubs, same as the ones I have. Having run tests with them in and out, I see no real advantage in them, and they bring the risk of lubrication failure on the top swivel bearing if not regularly engaged (or simply engage four wheel drive while stopped and leave it in for a few kilometres once a week). But no need to remove them - just leave them locked.

As bacicat points out, the RH rear spring seems to have a problem. The shackle is in a strange position. This could be either a broken main leaf allowing the axle to move back or the same effect could probably happen by badly worn bushes, or possibly the front bolt completely missing. Unlikely but possible is chassis damage or even an incorrect spring fitted.

John

[Orkney 90]

Thank you John. I will have to do some reading up on the correct way to use the Warn Hubs. I am presuming that if I leave them "locked" then they are engaged in full-time four-wheel-drive?

As for the spring hanger, I have already taken some of those codeine tablets...

Kidding. I think I need something stronger...

I guess I will find out soon enough.

[JayBee75]

Hi Dark61, not quite sure what that thing is. I only get the car next Wednesday. I was kind of hoping that someone on here may know... Also that strange looking round black thing attached to the steering column?

And is there anything else obviously not original Land Rover just by those few photos?



Yes that is a Smiths square panel heater, opposed to the round ones. I have one in the garage but they only fit if you don't have a hand throttle.

by the way, great find, great base to start from. Enjoy.

Cheers
jonathan

[JDNSW]

Thank you John. I will have to do some reading up on the correct way to use the Warn Hubs. I am presuming that if I leave them "locked" then they are engaged in full-time four-wheel-drive?
.....
Not exactly. As designed, with fixed front drive flanges, the front half axles, differential and propeller shaft are turned by the wheels motion, but there is no connection between the output shaft of the transfer case and the propeller shaft. When you push the yellow knob down, or engage low range, a dog clutch connects the propeller shaft to the transfer case output shaft.

In theory, not turning these parts by disconnecting the from the wheels when you don't want four wheel drive should reduce wear and improve performance and fuel economy.

In practice, the saving is so small as to be imperceptible - the reality is that spinning these parts with no load takes very little power - the major loss is probably aerodynamic from the prop shaft, and at the speeds typical of Series Landrovers, this is negligible.

But there are drawbacks to not having them spinning. The major one is that the lubrication to the upper swivel bush depends on the U-joint throwing oil about, and long periods without this will result in excessive wear on these parts.

In addition, I have seen reports of excessive wear on the slip joint in the prop shaft, and condensation in the diff resulting in rusting of the half of the mechanism that is always above oil level, including the bearings.

John

[Orkney 90]

The pic taken of the chassis number - the opposite side spring hanger doesn't look right - not sure what's going on there. All in all, looks like a nice original unit.:). Good to see it has the original 6 in it, and hasn't been changed for a Holden engine. Don't let anyone talk you into replacing it - while they probably aren't as bulletproof as the Land Rover 4 cylinder, with good maintenance they are a reliable enough engine and are super smooth, free reving and easy to coax a few more ponies out of. :)

There seems to be very little in the way of literature regarding the six cylinder engine compared to the fours. The common theme seems to be that spare parts are relatively hard to find. I hope that this will not be the case as I do indeed intend to keep it as original as possible, including the six.

[Homestar]

There seems to be very little in the way of literature regarding the six cylinder engine compared to the fours. The common theme seems to be that spare parts are relatively hard to find. I hope that this will not be the case as I do indeed intend to keep it as original as possible, including the six.

I like that you want to keep it original, don't listen to the knockers that will tell you about their mates mate who had issues with one, once you've driven it, you'll realise it's a sweet, smooth engine worth hanging onto, and it's rarity is a nice draw card too IMO.

Parts are available if you know where to look, but don't expect your local Repco store to have them. :D. I'm just hunting up some oversize pistons, rings and bearings at the moment as I'm doing a full rebuild on my Sons. Things like water pumps are scarce, but can still be bought new. If you have the room, finding a complete spare engine as parts wouldn't be a bad idea. They are uncommon, not rare, but I've picked up 2 at good prices. I paid $100 for 1 with a brand new clutch in it, but engine condition unknown - but was told it had run, and recently I paid $450 for a very good known runner with brand new water pump and a few other parts. This is the engine I've just stripped to rebuild, and it's in very good condition all in all. The resto we are doing will be a daily driver, so everything is getting replaced or rebuilt on this car.

This is the thread on the resto - http://www.aulro.com/afvb/series-iii/199133-my-series-3-project.html

And here's some good reading on the engine - http://www.aulro.com/afvb/series-iii/198988-2-6-engine-improvements.html

One of the forum members on here - Cookey - is the oracle on these engines and he has been working on them since these engines were being used by the Army, which is where he learnt all about them. He is also very good at coaxing extra ponies out of them too and if you have some dollars spare for a set of his extractors, these would be the biggest bolt on improvement you can make to it - gaining nearly 30% power increase by doing so (confirmed on a dyno - see the engine improvement thread)

[Orkney 90]

Thank you very much bacicat. There certainly is a lot of great info there. I plan to be using this as a daily driver as well, so reliability will be a priority. The extractors sound great, but it may be a while before I actually get that far.

And whilst on the topic of the 6 cylinder, are there any particular weaknesses that I should be looking out for when I get it? Apparently it hasn't been started for a very long time, so apart from fluids, is there anything else that should be checked before attempting to start it? And where would be a good place to buy a replacement oil filter?

[Homestar]

One of the weaknesses of these engines is the exhaust valves can burn resulting in low compression and poor performance. Assuming that it is in good condition at the moment, I would adjust the exhaust valve clearences as soon as you get it. It's not a hard job, but requires the exhaust manifold to be removed to do it properly for access - which is one of the reasons this job didn't get done as regularly as it should in Civilian life. Remove the side plate below the exhaust manifold and you'll see the tappets there - they are as simple to adjust as any other engine then, just a flat blade screwdriver, 1/2" ring spanner and some feeler gauges.

If it hasn't been removed in a while, you may break some of the studs that connect the manifold to the exhaust - fitting new ones from your local exhaust shop will make your life easier in the future anyway. The bolts/studs on the head should be fine. Reassemble with copper coat as you'll have this off a couple of times a year if you're doing things properly.

A new side plate gasket wouldn't go astray as I bet the old one is hard. Things like this and filters can be easily obtained from your local Indy LR specialist parts supplier - not sure who is up your way, I use British Car Components in Melbourne. Maybe someone else can help out here and let you know some people up your way that are good to deal with.

I'd also remove the plugs and crank the engine until you have oil pressure before trying to start it. You may also need a squirt of oil down the dash pot on top of the carby too - unscrew the black know in the middle of the top of the carby and squirt some engine oil or trans fluid on there - a couple of squirts will do the trick. Check to make sure all the throttle linkages are free and give them a good squirt of CRC to make sure everything is operating smoothly. Check you points, dizzy cap and leads to make sure they're still serviceable. To make it easier to start, and to reduce maintenance, maybe think about putting an electronic ignition in (very cheap and easy) or even a whole new dizzy like we're doing - even that's not an expensive excersize. Brand new distributors for these are available from old blighty for about 100 quid IIRC.

Most of all, have fun with it. :). Be sure to let us all know how it runs once you've been over it.

Cheers - Gav.

[Orkney 90]

Would anybody know whether there is a mechanic in the Sydney area (preferably western Sydney, but anywhere else in Sydney is good) who knows and understands Series Land Rovers? This will be for those bits where I am well out of my depth and for the eventual blue-slip and registration process. I would rather give my hard-earned to someone one who knows what they're talking about...

[JDNSW]

Call Land Vehicle Spares in Silverdale - I think they do mechanical work as well as selling spares.

John

[Orkney 90]

Once again, many thanks John.

Just having a look at the Land Vehicle Spares website and indeed they have a workshop for mechanical work including blue-slips. And the bonus is that they are located relatively close. And spare parts. Yay!

[Orkney 90]

Well, finally my new project has arrived!

All I have done so far is clean a lot of the crud off, both inside and out. Now I can better assess what needs doing...

The firewall seems to be in remarkable original condition. there doesn't seem to be any rust anywhere, excepting a bit of surface rust under the brake cylinder.

The chassis also appears to be rust free, the front dumb-irons are excellent! However, as can be seen in the photos, the off-side rear forward spring hanger has broken at the welds, which is what caused that "wrongful-look" on the previous photos. The car has a lean to the off-side because of this, and the rear axle looks out of place as well. The forward cross member has also seen better days.

The clutch doesn't seem to be working as the clutch pedal drops to the floor with virtually no resistance. (But does come back up again).

I have not yet managed to start the engine as I would like to change all the fluids and hoses before I do so. The main radiator hose has an ominous crunching sound from its internals when squeezed, so I would like to do a full coolant flush after replacing the hoses.

Also quite amazingly, the door tops seem to be very rust free as well...

Anyway, here are some photos as it currently stands...

[Orkney 90]

And some more...

[Orkney 90]

And these...

[67hardtop]

Very nice aquisition. Looks very original. Great buy. Im jealous.

Cheers Rod

Sent from my GT-I9507 using AULRO mobile app

[Homestar]

What a great vehicle! That crossmember is in similar condition to how mine was - I think someone may have driven over a log and got a nasty surprise. It's not a hugely difficult job to replace if you're handy with a grinder and welder.

[gromit]

One of the weaknesses of these engines is the exhaust valves can burn resulting in low compression and poor performance. Assuming that it is in good condition at the moment, I would adjust the exhaust valve clearences as soon as you get it. It's not a hard job, but requires the exhaust manifold to be removed to do it properly for access - which is one of the reasons this job didn't get done as regularly as it should in Civilian life. Remove the side plate below the exhaust manifold and you'll see the tappets there - they are as simple to adjust as any other engine then, just a flat blade screwdriver, 1/2" ring spanner and some feeler gauges.



You can do the exhaust valve clearances without removing the manifold.
Instead you have to remove the dipstick tube, then take off the sidecover and get it from under the manifold.
Then get on top of the motor and ....

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/01/245.jpg (http://s1245.photobucket.com/user/cradley/media/Series%203%20FFR/DSCF2511_zps50894090.jpg.html)

A friend who has a Rover 3litre car has a theory about the six cylinder motors. Because they are a bit thirsty people run them lean and that leads to the exhaust valve failures.
My FFR motor had been reconditioned by the army then run on a farm then by a young guy who had done a lot of offroading, exhaust valves were fine.

Nice vehicle you've found, shame about the chassis though. Maybe someone is parting out a vehicle and could supply the crossmember, worth an advert in Markets.


Colin

[Orkney 90]

Yes, that cross member has certainly seen better days! Interesting that so many of them have been bent over the years, must be the design.

It's that spring hanger that has me scratching my head. What on Earth could have caused that kind of damage?

[Orkney 90]

One thing that I have forgotten to mention and take a photo of is behind the seats. Still has what I presume is the original crank handle, an old hydraulic bottle-jack and its handle attached to the bulkhead above the crank handle.

[Homestar]

You can do the exhaust valve clearances without removing the manifold.
Instead you have to remove the dipstick tube, then take off the sidecover and get it from under the manifold.
Then get on top of the motor and ....

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/01/245.jpg (http://s1245.photobucket.com/user/cradley/media/Series%203%20FFR/DSCF2511_zps50894090.jpg.html)

A friend who has a Rover 3litre car has a theory about the six cylinder motors. Because they are a bit thirsty people run them lean and that leads to the exhaust valve failures.
My FFR motor had been reconditioned by the army then run on a farm then by a young guy who had done a lot of offroading, exhaust valves were fine.

Nice vehicle you've found, shame about the chassis though. Maybe someone is parting out a vehicle and could supply the crossmember, worth an advert in Markets.


Colin

You know me Colin - do you think I'd be able to adjust the tappets like in the photo? :D

I think you'd be calling the Fire Brigade in to rescue me...

[JDNSW]

A couple of comments.

You have what looks like a very good specimen, albeit with a few specific problems.

Some minor chassis repairs - these may be easier with the rear body off, not a very big job with the hardtop - and easier with impact damage such as this rather than the more usual rust problems. I wonder if this damage resulted in it being taken out of service fairly early in its life rather than being run into the ground?

I note that you have station wagon rear springs - these are a major improvement in ride if used empty, while retaining load carrying ability.

I suggest you probably have clutch hydraulics problems, and replacing or overhauling the master and slave cylinders is probably needed. From the picture, the hydraulic line from the master cylinder looks non-standard and this may be part of the problem.

However, this may also mean it has had the gearbox replaced by a Series 3 one, probably to get all synchromesh (not something I would do!). If it has the 2a gearbox and clutch (slave cylinder on RH side), then another possible clutch issue is the clutch release shaft coupling. The bell crank operated by the slave cylinder has its shaft coupled to the release shaft inside the bell housing by a sleeve with two pins through holes in the sleeve and each shaft - these pins can break, resulting in the symptoms described. Replace with the correct hardened pin - a mild steel pin or bolt will only last a few kilometres.

John

[SG1 Bones]

That's a great looking SIIa 109. I look forward to seeing what you do with it.

Nathan.

[UncleHo]

G'day Orkney 90


That is a very clean and original vehicle,the flat heater was an expensive extra in those days,good for demisting the w/screen but not much else,the rear spring looks like it might be in back to front,measure the other one,from the front shackle pin to centre bolt,and compare them,I note that this vehicle has not got the brake booster fitted,(optional extra)but you might consider fitting one for use in today's traffic,if so,use a Series 3 booster and brake tower complete 6bolts(captive nuts)1/4turn and lift away after disconnecting the pipework,if using a booster,get the S3 upper r/h front guard as it has the cutout for the booster or one from an EARLY 110.


Hope that is of help.


cheers

[Orkney 90]

Thank you UncleHo. At the moment I am in a state of frustration. It took me over a week to get the car from when I purchased it, and all day yesterday it rained... And it has just started raining very heavily again. I could push it into my garage, but these new modern suburban garages don't leave me any room to get around the car to do any serious work.

So now I am drinking a nice strong black coffee and contemplating all that needs doing.

[UncleHo]

Yeah! a nice cup of Black Coffee (my normal brew) I think I will join you in one,I have a 68 ex-military 2a 109 soft top,had it since 1986,just doing a timing chain and radiator replacement,$xxx for a new core,but I love the old girl,I was a Landrover/Leyland spare parts person in NSW during my working life,that is how I know the animal.


Orkney,is that where you are from? as my wife is a Liverpuddlian. (Scouser)


cheers

[Orkney 90]

No, I am actually Hungarian. A long way from the real Orkney...

I own an Orkney Grey Puma 90, hence the Orkney 90 user-name. Having said that though, I would love to visit the real Orkney one day. I am very much over the 40 Degree and 110% humidity days of summer in Sydney...

I dream of cooler climes...

Mind you, if the rain doesn't let up there is always the One Day International Cricket on the television later... A Hungarian and Cricket, who would have ever thought? (mind you, it took me over 30 years to understand how the game worked...)

[67hardtop]

Mind you, if the rain doesn't let up there is always the One Day International Cricket on the television later... A Hungarian and Cricket, who would have ever thought? (mind you, it took me over 30 years to understand how the game worked...)


Its easy, bowl ball, hit ball with bat, run like hell to other end before someone throws ball back at u...:D:D:D:D....lol

Cheers Rod
Sent from my GT-I9507 using AULRO mobile app

[Orkney 90]

The scary part is that it took me 30 years to work that out!

Just imagine how long it will take me to work out how a Series 2A Landy is put together...

[67hardtop]

The scary part is that it took me 30 years to work that out!

Just imagine how long it will take me to work out how a Series 2A Landy is put together...

Easy, just like a large meccano set. Lots of bolts and nuts and a few screws and panels....lol.
Just put it back where u pulled it off from.

Cheers Rod

Sent from my GT-I9507 using AULRO mobile app

[Orkney 90]

I am currently in the process of draining and flushing the radiator and cooling system, and I am thinking of all new water hoses as some are quite perished. Is it possible to buy a "hose kit" for these 6 cylinder engines, or do I just buy hoses that are a close fit and then make them fit? And are those "flexible" water hoses any good?

Many thanks in advance.

[gromit]

I am currently in the process of draining and flushing the radiator and cooling system, and I am thinking of all new water hoses as some are quite perished. Is it possible to buy a "hose kit" for these 6 cylinder engines, or do I just buy hoses that are a close fit and then make them fit? And are those "flexible" water hoses any good?

Many thanks in advance.

If you can't get them from your local LR supplier then try SuperCheap.
Because their hoses are all on display you can wander in with an old hose, check through them all and get quite a close match.
Autobarn keep them behind the counter and you are relying on the staff to find something.

I'm sure I have a set for my FFR that came from 4 Wheel Drives in Melbourne.


Colin

[Orkney 90]

My goodness it has been a busy time of late. Between work, family and Land Rover time I have barely had time to scratch myself.

But in the short time that I have had my Series 2A I have learned a very important lesson, and that is that no matter how small and easy a job looks, it is more extensive, time consuming and frustrating than originally imagined. But it is all great fun!

I purchased a new battery and installed. Then I added some fresh fuel to the tank. I even flushed and changed fluids, cleaned the spark plugs and checked the little oil reservoir on top of the carburettor. And amazingly, after three short attempts the engine roared to life, and settled into a nice idling purr. The previous owner told me it was last started in 2008.

Now that was a genuine Eureka moment! Even more amazing is that the electrics seem to be working. Both headlights high and low beam, indicators and brake lights all do what they're supposed to.

Yesterday I received two new books in the post. I am sure that both of these will help me immensely. (See attached photos)

Despite the body work having many dents, scrapes and bruises I am astounded that most of the paintwork appears to be original. However, someone at sometime in the past has touched up a few of the scrapes and bruises with a paint brush, but the colour matching is nearly spot-on. I have taken some photos of the paintwork and some places where it has been touched-up. Despite the fact that the paint is quite faded, it comes up amazingly well with a light polish. So good in fact that I am thinking of preserving the body work as it is, with all the dents, scrapes and bruises. I am considering doing this mainly because all the panels seem to be the originals with original paint.

Anyway, little jobs continue. I have removed the vent flaps to change the rubbers which were perished. But still relatively water-tight as I found out in the big rains Sydney experienced last week. I have also ordered a new set of indicator and clearance light lenses. And I am on the look out for an original wheel to use as a spare, as I don't have a spare. I also discovered a set of rubbish air horns attached to the car, but they didn't work. I pulled them out, re-connected the wires to the original horn and it works beautifully!

Okay, enough typing. Time for some updated photos.

[Orkney 90]

Some more photos. Here are what I presume are original stickers for the tyre pressures, and a seat belt compliance. Also the new battery fitted. Interior and exterior panels are also getting progressively cleaned.

[Orkney 90]

Here are the front dumb-irons. They seem solid, as a hammer and cold-chisel proved. No undue rust holes. Also the original horn in-situ. After pulling out the useless air-horns, I re-connected the original wires to the original horn and bingo! It works like a charm!