Buyer beware

[tassiespirit]

Ignorance is bliss, and you can't trust some Range Rover/ Disco owner . This is my brief and tainted love affair with this breed of vehicle.

Well I am very new to the game and still trust people (my major fault). I just bought my first Range Rover a 2000 P38a 4.6 Gems with Auto, from a self employed guy here in Tasmania. He drives a Disco and this was his wife's car, which she used to pull a horse float for the kids horses.

I tested the car and it was tops for all except two things, and I did not do enough "study" to understand what these things meant, so I do take responsibility, ok, but only to a point.

But, as a new-by, I sort of trusted the guy , when a message came up saying "Sunroof not set" he said you just have to reset it, when we find the key no.1 as he only had No.2 key. That was the second issue. ( His wife lost the key , in the horse stables somewhere).

Of cause the car was a couple hours away from where I lived and I paid a deposit . He promise to "find" the key, which he hasn't yet found it; now he is refusing to answer or return my calls.

The sunroof, I found out has no cables or motor in it, he took them out I assume to put into his disco, not sure, just my thoughts. :mad: I never thought to pull off the interior light to check.

And the No.2 key he/she jammed in two 2032 batteries instead of two 2025's which cracked the PCB inside. So the FOB does not work just the key; got the FOB tested and there is no signal at all from it.

So now I am a lot wiser and going to be a lot more out of pocket , as I now have to source a No.1 from the UK or Germany ( I have been told) is where it will come from???!!! Had to submit rego papers and a DNA test to boot. Oh , and about $450.00 to purchase the one (1) key no both 1 and 2 keys.

Currently using the null EKA number to get the car to run, as the EKA for the car locks up the ignition. Key does fit drivers door and ignition with no issue.

Moral of the story - learn, learn, learn about these cars before you go to buy one. Any thoughts people?

[DoubleChevron]

If that is the only problems with the car I'd say you bought a bloody rippa. Keys... that is the standard issue with all modern cars. See if you can get a new key cut by VIN from ebay uK (that's what I did with my wifes peugeot 407 .... they are $500 a key new ....). I'm sure you'll find a way around the key issue if you hit google up.

Your angry the sunroof doesn't work, when he said the sunroof doesn't work :wasntme: My guess is the cables were remove to guarantee it would stay closed a leak free. A good fix for any sunroof IMO :)

I never get worked up about issues with cars I buy. Anything 16years old for example is sure to have issues. The previous owners can be so used to the "issues" it doesn't even occur to them to mention them. If the interior is tidy, the body straight, clean and rust free. And everything works ... you have purchased a winner from my perspective.

seeya,
Shane L.

[daf11e]

104864The only thing I'd add mate is a 2000 model would not have come with a Gems engine, it would be a Bosch from factory so I'd be checking it hasn't got an older model engine.

[daf11e]

And..

[Keithy P38]

I don't mean to be rude, but anyone who purchases a 16yr old vehicle from a long distance away is a fool for not having it inspected prior to laying down the cash. No offense, but you are responsible.

And a 2000 is definitely a Bosch or "Thor" motor. If you have a gems, something is already suspicious.

I've bought 3 P38's. Two from Sydney and one from Melbourne. All have been inspected by professionals. I have paid over $1,000 in inspections over 5yrs for inspections, but it sorted the duds from the good ones.

It could happen to a commodore or falcon too, not just P38's. You happened to be lucky!

Cheers
Keithy

[mtb_gary]

Just like the previous comments, if it is only a key and a sunroof motor, nice and easy to rectify. Also concerned re the GEMS vs Bosch? BTW roughly how much did you pay for the car? Aside from sunroof and key does everything else work especially HEVAC (no cheque book symbol) and EAS fully functioning?

They are still a really nice car to drive, 6 months down the track when the initial disappointment and frustration is behind I'm sure you'll be as addicted to the p38 as the rest of us :angel:

[deano2469]

That's a bargain if engine is correct and you are confused in your frustration. I have an extensive tool box and much wider knowledge of cars in general since I bought a p38. It cost me 4 grand, bought on eBay from Melbourne, drove home on trip permit, lpg installed but not well, have spent heaps on air boxes. Bought another from Sydney on gumtree, 1900 bucks, to get the motor when mine overheated, sold the rest for 900, motor now done 330000; car 350000 ks . Still get intermittent issues but no more than any other old car I've had. If you were that concerned you would have done some homework.. get over it or sell it to me cheap.

Sent from my HTC_0PJA10 using AULRO mobile app

[Dark61]

Its all about learning I suppose and some lessons come more expensive than others. How about putting stuff like that down on the receipt for the deposit? " Balance of $x payable on understanding that second key is found/sun roof works etc" . If that's not forthcoming you could renegotiate the price. Otherwise doesn't sound like a bad motor for its age- get in it and enjoy it.
cheers,
D

[tassiespirit]

If that is the only problems with the car I'd say you bought a bloody rippa. Keys... that is the standard issue with all modern cars. See if you can get a new key cut by VIN from ebay uK (that's what I did with my wifes peugeot 407 .... they are $500 a key new ....). I'm sure you'll find a way around the key issue if you hit google up.

Your angry the sunroof doesn't work, when he said the sunroof doesn't work :wasntme: My guess is the cables were remove to guarantee it would stay closed a leak free. A good fix for any sunroof IMO :)

I never get worked up about issues with cars I buy. Anything 16years old for example is sure to have issues. The previous owners can be so used to the "issues" it doesn't even occur to them to mention them. If the interior is tidy, the body straight, clean and rust free. And everything works ... you have purchased a winner from my perspective.

seeya,
Shane L.
Shane, You are right of course, it is small price to pay for a car. Car is straight and starts first time every time. It is 16 yrs old and has a few small bits missing or need tidying up. But it does have the bottle jack and handle and a spare 18" mag and good tyre. It's just my first Landie of any description. But I am finding it's a steep learning curve, but I am open to learn.


104864The only thing I'd add mate is a 2000 model would not have come with a Gems engine, it would be a Bosch from factory so I'd be checking it hasn't got an older model engine.
Daf11e,
Thanks for the reply, yep, its a Gems motor 4.6 in it, what can I say, as per the picture.


I don't mean to be rude, but anyone who purchases a 16yr old vehicle from a long distance away is a fool for not having it inspected prior to laying down the cash. No offense, but you are responsible.

And a 2000 is definitely a Bosch or "Thor" motor. If you have a gems, something is already suspicious.

Keithy, None taken, you are right , I am mad with myself for being so rash, but, looking back I am not so bad off really. But I am kicking myself publicly, hoping other will be smarter and wiser than me that's all. And as I already said I am responsible for my own actions, so I don't really blame the guy I bought it off, I should have done more homework. Maybe even ripped off the interior light too!!??

Don't know if it is a replaced motor or not but the car is a very early 2000 model. Like February I think from memory.

Paid a total of $4000 for the beast so, not too bad, I thought at the time.

I do appreciate the comments guys......
Allan

[TheTree]

Hi Allan

The P38 can be, and usually is, a steep learning curve !

They were bleeding edge at the time they came out so now they are showing their age a little and they are fairly complex beasts. That said, this forum is one of the best places to get help, don't be afraid to ask questions

There are also a lot of pages on rangerovers.net which are worth reading.

It seems there is a bit of a mystery about your engine. What is your VIN and date of manufacture on the compliance plate (under the bonnet on the sill at the passenger side front) ?

Perhaps a shot of your engine bay as well.. curious minds are now wondering :p

Oh and welcome to the madness the P38 is an awesome vehicle on and off road !

Steve

[tassiespirit]

Here are a couple pics I took tonight, I was keen myself to show you guys. It all looks like it should be there with nothing missing. Now I am intrigued to see why it is the way it is.
The Vin plate did not show up very well in the rain , so there it is from the rego papers- manufactured 02/2000
Vin no: SALLPAMD3WA398044
Engine no: 48D08134A
I will get some better pictures tomorrow.


Allan

[TheTree]

Mate

That is definitely a GEMS, I can't see the 02/2000 in the pic, but the THOR started in 1999 with VIN WA410482

So yours looks like a late GEMS, 98 maybe

Steve

[DoubleChevron]

Mate

That is definitely a GEMS, I can't see the 02/2000 in the pic, but the THOR started in 1999 with VIN WA410482

So yours looks like a late GEMS, 98 maybe

Steve

How to Identify Land Rovers: Defender, Discovery, Range Rover And Series (http://www.roverparts.com/How-to-identify-your-Rover.cfm)

Says here "WA" year in 1998 build. So yes, it certainly could be complianced in australia in 2000. Often cars aren't complianced in Australia to several years after manufacture. Eg: my 1992 model range rover was complianced 1994 .... they kept it in stock for nearly 2years before complying and selling it. Imagine buying spending $100,000 on a "new" 2year old car.

seeya,
Shane L.

[TheTree]

So it may have been built in late 98 or even early 99 and not have been compliance plated in OZ until 02/2000 ... makes perfect sense :angel:

[daf11e]

Very interesting......what year did the clear indicator lenses begin replacing the Orange?

[Keithy P38]

I agree Tassie. It's sad you had to go through it! Hopefully someone else will do some research off the back of this post and come out better for it! As you say, you've not done too bad! Once these issues are sorted you'll be enjoying the P38 much much more! Good luck!

Mid 2000 the clear lenses came in Daf!

Cheers
Keithy

[tassiespirit]

Very interesting......what year did the clear indicator lenses begin replacing the Orange?

Hey guys here is a couple of pics that will explain somethings, It's a FEB 1999 on the VIN plate on the B pillar but FEB 2000 on the REGO papers!?

Also, it has the ranga indicators not clear ones.

Allan

[daf11e]

Allen I'd say early 1999 sounds pretty right as it was later that year they introduced the Bosch motor.....also probably changed the indicator lights to clear from Orange...also around the headlights and high beam the surround was black in colour.....I think the other difference was front side seat airbags which you probably won't have......anyways a good buy and wish you well!

Jim

[tassiespirit]

Thanks everyone, just wanting on the reply from the dealers on the key replacement and the damage($$).

Then the fun begins, with a manual on CD on the way and some head scratching to do. Need to do the maintenance to find out what is what here, as I already have pulled the Pollen filters and they where putrid and choked.

Same with the air filter on it, but just need a blow out with the compressor. There is a receipt for new injectors and a starter motor about 100000 k's ago and new rear air bags 12 months ago too. nice! More pluses.

Cheers for now guys
Allan

[Keithy P38]

Allen I'd say early 1999 sounds pretty right as it was later that year they introduced the Bosch motor.....also probably changed the indicator lights to clear from Orange...also around the headlights and high beam the surround was black in colour.....I think the other difference was front side seat airbags which you probably won't have......anyways a good buy and wish you well!

Jim

My blue P38 was Feb '99 on the build plate, was a Thor with orange indicators. It was a very early Thor - 3XA412211!

The black headlight surrounds were a 2001-on fit.

[daf11e]

Mines a 2000 and has the black surrounds as standard ...my RR book also shows 2000MY.......but then again Keith who would know if some were sitting around so long prior to rego.


Jim

[Scouse]

XA = 1999MY = orange indicators.
YA = 2000MY = clear indicators, blacked out headlights & new fog lights.

Normally the next year model starts appearing late in the year, usually October or so but for some reason the Australian XA & YA P38s didn't appear here until early that particular year.
Trivetts received their first YA on 2-2-00.


It's very unusual that it sat around for over a year though - it's a very popular colour so I wonder why it didn't move?

[Rob Hse]

I would do as much research as you can to better understand the p38...like Steve pointed out they were and still are a very high tech vehicle with lots of sensors and electronic modules.. I would also strongly recommend purchasing a nanocom evolution ,I just purchased one and have already reset the eas on my parts car ( I thought I would use my SE as the guinea pig rather than my HSE !) with 100 % success !.....one of these nanocom units will save you money in the long run, they are a great diagnostic tool !...also download a copy of rave while you are at it ...perceive with the p38 they are a great machine!

[tassiespirit]

I would do as much research as you can to better understand the p38...like Steve pointed out they were and still are a very high tech vehicle with lots of sensors and electronic modules.. I would also strongly recommend purchasing a nanocom evolution ,I just purchased one and have already reset the eas on my parts car ( I thought I would use my SE as the guinea pig rather than my HSE !) with 100 % success !.....one of these nanocom units will save you money in the long run, they are a great diagnostic tool !...also download a copy of rave while you are at it ...perceive with the p38 they are a great machine!

That's great thanks for that, Imay have to get one, but still learning. Just when through and cleaned all the fuses terminals and reseated all the relays. My air con, is working again after stopping for a couple of weeks, after the clean. But the ECM or HEVAC for the air con is dead - display not working. So I need to open that up and check it next.

Then I will check the EAS - it is slowly going down over a few days, so a slow leak somewhere. Time to get out the old soapy water in the spray bottle trick.

Allan

[parasnoop67]

Hi tassiespirit,

If you need sunroof parts I may be able to help.
I have a complete sunroof, still in a vehicle, and am in Hobart.