Perentie window felt - how to replace it.

[dranoweb]

So I attempted to replace the window felt on my perentie driver's side window today - after discovering new felt stashed in the map pockets.

I learnt alot and wanted to pass it on, as there was no clear tutorial that I could find here, and some of this process was not exactly obvious to a newbie such as myself.

I'll come back and add photos when I do the passenger's side (hopefully tomorrow).

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So you're going to replace the felt...
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1 - remove the four posidrive screws from the window runner.
(they are NOT phillips - this is important, as you can and will strip the head out otherwise.), place screws in safe place.
This will require some shuffling of windows to access them all. The last one you will get stuck on, can be made easier by partially removing the rubber stop at the top front inner track. you only need to remove a half inch or so.
I suggest pliers and a medium flat blade screwdriver - if you aren't worried about the paintwork inside the track.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/771.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/772.jpg

2 - remove the door top

It's done by removing the two nuts on the interior side of the door, under the ledge above the map pocket.
Firm and constant pressure here as the seal may be stuck and will take a bit to let go.
an extra pair of hands may assist to prevent window breakage.
If like me - it has been a while since this was checked, your bolts may be screwed (metaphorically)
fish oil and wd40 on hand will help, but consider new bolts if they look like my inner bolts.
Tip: there is no head on these bolts, rather they are threaded into a stud that's welded into the door top frame - this makes them replaceable.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/742.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/743.jpg


3 - get a drill, and drill bit to suit the size of the rivets

The rivets are smaller than most on the rest of the vehicle - and aluminium.
You need to drill out the 4 rivets holding in the window lock (leave the screws alone)
You also need to drill out the two rivets holding in the lower window frame ledge.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/773.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/774.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/775.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/776.jpg



4 - lay the door top outside facing down on a soft, possibly grassy or soft area.

Gently lift the window ledge upwards, and the windows should drop out of the top of the frame.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/777.jpg

5 - remove old felt (if present) , install new.

I added a very small amount of neutral cure roof and gutter silicone to each end of the felt (outer side) in an uneducated attempt to combat the felt sliding with the window - as this was the cause of the old stuff falling out. I'm yet to see how well this worked.

5 - this is the tricky part. orient the window frame, up-side down.
I tried various methods here, but the best seemed to be the following:
carefully maneuver both windows into the felt slots, while still situated on the runner.
again, extra pair of hands may make this easier.
a bit of a wriggle to ensure they fit all the way in.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/778.jpg

6 - apply firm, but not excessive downward force on the windows, and swing it sideways back into the window frame. there will be a positive "clunk" when they are in.

It should look like this:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/779.jpg

7 - Insert new pop rivets and "pop" them as designed.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/780.jpg

8 - Inspect, repair (if needed) and re-install window lock mech - will need more aluminium rivets.

9 - lube felt and track with appropriate product, I used easyglide spray.

10 - clean fingerprints off glass.

I found that the drainage holes in the door were plugged with silicone and I had a small reserve water tank in the door. zinc bolts had turned black - and so when replaced and cleaned, I treated the area with fish oil... it's not the most pleasant of things to use.... especially when trying to keep the windows clean.


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How to increase window lock force - The poor man's method:
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1 - Drill out rivets and remove window lock as shown above:

2 - Inspect lock for damaged parts - and lubricate with a plastic safe or PTFE dry lube. (spray packs available from jaycar dealers.)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/781.jpg

3 - Insert small screwdriver as shown, with careful force separate the plastic.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/782.jpg

4 - insert small piece of 3, 4 or 5mm rubber according to the desired increase. I used 4mm (shown above also)

5 - remove screwdriver, and trim flush.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/783.jpg

6 - re-install window lock.

[Themadmob]

Brilliant Instructions ... Love to see the photos ... Where did you get the new tracks from

[dranoweb]

The new felts were stashed in the passenger side map pocket, along with wrinkled old ones.
I'll be removing the passenger door top today. I'll add the first few photos after that.

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[Themadmob]

Thanks

[dranoweb]

So a little unfortunate news, the inner door top bolt for the passenger's side is so rusted that the bolt is rotating inside the door top frame.

I'll need to do some disassembly and surgery.

this appears to have been full of water for a long time, presumably due to the excessive amount if silicone used around the bolt and it blocking the drainage galleries in the rubber seal.

this also means pictures will be delayed.

[Themadmob]

Hmmm that's frustrating for sure ... Good luck mate, let us know how you go

[dranoweb]

Brilliant Instructions ... Love to see the photos ... Where did you get the new tracks from

Photos have been added for your interest...

[Blknight.aus]

couple of pro tips.

its easier on your back to do it on the tailgate of the GS or a workbench....

you dont have to remove the window from the door, if you decide to do it this way because some butcher has hacked and rounded the nuts close the door prior to doing the drilling


there is also a way of doing it without taking the glass out or drilling by undoing the screws then prying and turning the tracks up and out then slowly pulling them out replacement is the reverse of removal but if you,re not both careful and lucky the tracking will kink. You can straighten the kinks out but not if you force it too much and break metal backing.

[dranoweb]

I had looked up several of those "tips" and found them more time consuming and frustrating - leading to my final resolve.
But I am aware that they work for some people, for me however I had to look up a few new profanities to describe my mood at the time.

I had originally attempted this with the door tops attached - but learnt quickly, it's much easier with the door tops removed.

Two nuts takes a few seconds to undo - saved me a great deal of time and frustration, and was also a good chance to inspect possible corrosion/rust ingress.

I don't particularly have back problems, and the tailgate of my GS has insanely long pop rivets sticking out of it - seemed like a great way to scratch things up, even through a thick wool blanket - however you will note, I did allow some variability here.

I will be drilling and replacing those tailgate rivets, they seem to have been for the number plates, and they have nearly cost me a kneecap ligament a few times already.

Lastly - note that I did not profess to be an expert here - just someone attempting to fill in the information I could not find elsewhere.

I'm happy if someone else know better - we all learn that way.

[Blknight.aus]

I did not profess to be an expert here - just someone attempting to fill in the information I could not find elsewhere.


given that what you've just presented is essentially a neater easier to follow presentation of whats in the manual, youve paid significcant attention to detail (do you know how many people cant spot the diference between phillips and posidrive) and extending to include considerations that go beyond the basic core task of "heres how to change the strips" with workmanship that puts some dealerships "profesional" standard to shame.....

you go right on ahead, keep posting your work and call yourself an expert. I'll back the claim.

[Themadmob]

Anyone know what the part numbers are

[dranoweb]

I appreciate the compliment.

Can't help with part numbers, but I'm looking myself. Will report back when I find a source

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[Aussie Jeepster]

I have the same problem with BOTH door tops - tried to take the tops off, but the nut/bolt just keeps turning inside the door top..
How did you manage to get yours undone?

[dranoweb]

The bolt is threaded at the top. The door top has a threaded stud welded into it. Just keep turning it and it will come out.

My search for spares continues.

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[Lotz-A-Landies]

Anyone know what the part numbers areIf you do a little surfing in this section you will find a sticky thread full of useful Perentie parts info. (Including the answers for this question.)

aulro.com/~/coil-sprung-military-land-rovers/~perentie-milspec-110-isuzu-parts-accessories-thread.~ (http://www.aulro.com/afvb/coil-sprung-military-land-rovers/226018-perentie-milspec-110-isuzu-parts-accessories-thread.html#post2441649)

Also do you know you can prolong the life of your felts by removing them giving them a little/light stretch to return them to the needed length and return them to the door top by folding them in reverse (fold from opposite side). New ones come as a flat strip of felt that you need to fold to insert into the door top.

[dranoweb]

Thanks for the link.

New felt is cheap enough. Landybitzau on ebay sells it for something like $14.

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[Lotz-A-Landies]

Thanks for the link.

New felt is cheap enough. Landybitzau on ebay sells it for something like $14.

Sent from my E6653 using AULRO mobile appYes it is cheap and you can also get it direct through the Land Rover Genuine parts chain.

However for no money and no waiting for the post to arrive with as little as an hours work you can recondition your current felts by reversing them.

Diana

[dranoweb]

I personally like to do the whole new for old wherever possible - especially on a vehicle I've only had a couple of months.

Felt is probably one of those things that doesn't matter, but the mentality has stuck from working with.modern cars where it's usually a bad idea to recycle anything.


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[Lotz-A-Landies]

That is probably a valid attitude to apply to manufactured parts but with a flat strip of felt I like the notion of the first of the three Rs (Reuse, Recycle, Reduce).

Having installed new top strips on my previous Perentie but reused some strips for the verticals I found no noticeable difference in the sealing qualities so on my current Perentie have reused all the strips and am very happy with the results.

I will admit that they probably wont last as long as new ones but who cares, I did it on a Sunday at the spur of the moment while I was re-sealing a bottom runner which had come adrift from the glass?

[dranoweb]

I have a habit of replacing new for old, and putting the old in my emergency box for long trips.

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[Chris078]

I will be drilling and replacing those tailgate rivets, they seem to have been for the number plates, and they have nearly cost me a kneecap ligament a few times already.

I bought some hard rubber to glue over the various bolts/rivets that poke through the tailgate.
About to pull it all apart as it needs repainting and many of the rivets holding it together have broken off inside and rattle around over every bump.

That tutorial looks great. I actually ordered some new window felt a few weeks ago and have been looking for how to replace it.

Now I just need to work out how to stop the tops of windows rattling.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

[I]I will be ... <snip>
...
That tutorial looks great. I actually ordered some new window felt a few weeks ago and have been looking for how to replace it.

Now I just need to work out how to stop the tops of windows rattling.You fix the rattles by fitting new (or rejuvenating old) top felts.

The whole job replacing felts takes less than an hour per window.

one tip is to have a hooked tool to get the felts out, I used a pair of circlip pliers to get under the felt and then a pair of fine point pliers to grab it and pull it out.

Other than that its an easy job.

While you've got the top disassembled its worthwhile modifying the window lock mechanism.

The window lock works by using the tongue at the top to wedge into a gap in the runners of the two panes. It wears and no longer works. A temporary fix is to cut (or file) down the shoulders of the mechanism, being careful not to cut out the base of the pyramid. (the red line at the top)
Then wedge a piece about 2mm-3mm of hard plastic or metal into the gap in the cam device. (The black bordered red trapezoid shape)
Diana :)

[p38arover]

Is this what you need, Bailey channel?

I saw it being sold for Perenties at KLR Automotive so I took a pic.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/602.jpg

[Dervish]

Is this what you need, Bailey channel?

I saw it being sold for Perenties at KLR Automotive so I took a pic.


I should've asked for a finder's fee :D It's great stuff, I haven't had rattles from the windows since I installed it

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/607.jpg

[Chris078]

Is this what you need, Bailey channel?

I saw it being sold for Perenties at KLR Automotive so I took a pic.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/03/602.jpg

Probably. it's just the tops of the windows that rattle together. I have a small rubber wedge that I jam between them at the moment that keeps them quiet,but it's an ugly solution.
Thanks.

[Aussie Jeepster]

available from Clark Rubber - it's called Bailley Channel!!!!!!

[dranoweb]

Think I might get me some of that stuff.
doortops might get disassembled again soon as I still have some leaks in the wrong places.

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[Lotz-A-Landies]

If you have leaks in the wrong places, take a look at the rubber insert between the door top and the door bottom. There should be a couple of cut-outs in the rubber that run to the outside to allow the water inside the door top to run outside the vehicle.

Quite often you find that the rubber is fitted with the cut-outs to the inside which directs the water onto the driver's Right leg or passenger's Left leg. :mad:

[dranoweb]

I had worked out the drainage system there.

It appears to be weeping in between the seal.

What I was really getting at was that I may modify this system and avoid having water in the door altogether.

Weather that be by addibg drain pipes or by drilling side facing drain holes in the channel and blocking the old.

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[Lotz-A-Landies]

I have been thinking of some thick "O" rings around the big fixing bolts top and bottom of the rubber insert. The hope is that if the size is correct it will both protect the bolt from corrosion and stop the water running around under the door top.

Some of the old series Landy door tops, had a hole drilled in the outside bottom corner at each end of the door. The problem is that it both let water out and more back in, which increased the rusting of the door tops.

What gets me is that in 1957 Land Rover door tops had galvanised frames. Later the same year they changed to Series 2 with the door tops unprotected inside and they have been rusting ever since. Bloody bean counters. :mad:

P.S. Not a problem for Perentie/Wolf door tops.

[dranoweb]

My perentie door tops appear to be aluminium and are painted with heavy black paint inside.

The lower frame however is steel, and showing some water ingress.

I don't plan to be drowning mine, so letting water back is is less of a problem, but I can see how it may happen regardless.

I need to do some thinking/3D printing/laser cutting and come up with something that works.

also need to look up part number for door top bolts.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

My perentie door tops appear to be aluminium and are painted with heavy black paint inside. ...<snip>
...
also need to look up part number for door top bolts.The page from the LR Parts Catalogue is in the Perentie parts sticky http://www.aulro.com/afvb/coil-sprung-military-land-rovers/226018-perentie-milspec-110-isuzu-parts-accessories-thread.html#post2441649

The studs are MTC6223

[dranoweb]

wow....
looking at new ones, I realize just how much I'm missing from mine...

Door Top Fixing Stud MTC6223 (http://www.johnrichardssurplus.co.uk/door-top-fixing-stud-mtc6223.html)

[Chris078]

wow....
looking at new ones, I realize just how much I'm missing from mine...

Door Top Fixing Stud MTC6223 (http://www.johnrichardssurplus.co.uk/door-top-fixing-stud-mtc6223.html)

Looking at the amount of unnecessary metal on that stud, it looks like it might be designed to be sacrificial?

[dranoweb]

That thought had ocurred to me.
found my local land rover dealer and ordered 4 new for $22 each.

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[Chris078]

That thought had ocurred to me.
found my local land rover dealer and ordered 4 new for $22 each.

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$22 ea?!!! ouch. :o

[dranoweb]

Compared to the damage a flying doortop can do to another vehicle, I feel it's worth it.

You could try fixing my xtrail.
parts for that are insanely expensive.

A bumper (plastic) costs $1800
Starter costs $1100
Engine $2600
Plastic body clips are $5 each and I needed 40.

The perentie is a dream on the wallet by comparison.

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[Chris078]

$2600 for an engine is pretty darn good!
The fuel pump for a Perentie costs more than that!
Agree with you about the other parts though; that's why modern cars can get written off with very minor damage (especially if you pop an airbag)

[dranoweb]

Yeah I've been watching fuel pumps on the afm auctions.

Ignore the misplaced photos. Can't seem to remove them

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[Chris078]

Yeah I've been watching fuel pumps on the afm auctions.

Auction one are cheap. I grabbed one for $300. a new injector pumps runs about $2500 or so

[dranoweb]

Picked up door top parts from dealer today.
Appatently the studs are intended to be sacrificial and need regular checking.

Part numbers in repair manuals have been superseeded. See attached image. If too low quality, I'll transcribe.

And I got one stud free as they come in bags of 5.


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[Aussie Jeepster]

My window frames are so rusty I'm buying new ones along with all new felt etc. Currently saving my pennies as it will work out to over $500 per window, but the existing ones are totally stuffed. I'm going to the US again at the end of April and might bring home a set of Garrison fittings to use on them

[Chris078]

Picked up door top parts from dealer today.
Appatently the studs are intended to be sacrificial and need regular checking.

Part numbers in repair manuals have been superseeded. See attached image. If too low quality, I'll transcribe.

And I got one stud free as they come in bags of 5.


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This is a Land Rover dealer you got them from?

[dranoweb]

Yes Gippsland land rover in Morwell.

It also appears on closer inspection that the door top seals are a different style.

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[dranoweb]

So I discovered today that my felt is on the move again...

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[Chris078]

So I discovered today that my felt is on the move again...

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might need to put some contact adhesive down underneath it.

[dranoweb]

I had done so before...
anyway i have door top studs to replace, will look at it tonight

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[dranoweb]

Replaced door top studs and seals today.
new style seals actually look like they may fix some of the leaking issues.



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