TORQUE KEY SET!

[Andyc626]

G'day Everyone,

I've got a problem with my freelander again!
This time I need a torque key set for a 98 Freelander,I've been told I can get my hands on one overseas but I don't know what size to get.

I've called up a few Landrover places and they seem to think I don't know what I'm talking about(Is that because I'm female?) So I got my dad to call for me and none of them want disclose this information.

Does anyone know why?
If anyone knows what size I need,It would be great if you could help! style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif

[Rosco]

Depending on the quality you want, go to Repco or Supacrap and buy a set of bits in the various sizes.

You should get change from $20.

Cheers

[PhilipA]

The name of the tools are "TORX" . They are like ALAN Keys but have a star shape. ie the tool is a male and goes in a socket that looks like a star.

You buy them in sets of small to large and usually one in the set will fit the desired socket. As stated the sets are available at stores that sell tools like Repco and maybe Supa Cheap. I would buy a good quality set if you are trying to undo head studs. A good but relatively cheap brand is "Kinchrome"
Regards Philip A

[Leo109]

What job are you trying to do on the Freeloader? A few more details and the mob on here may be able to suggest alternatives...

[Andyc626]

Hey,
Sorry guys with a bit more research I now realise it is a TOEX key I need.

I need a new head and don't have the money to pay for someone to put it in so my dads gunna put it in for me (when I get it & the tools).

I've been told replacing the head in a freeloader 98 petrol model is hopeless because it will stuff up in a few months.
Is this true?

Thanks Erin.

[landrovermick]

Erin, More power to ya i recon, !! In relation to replacemnets heads on Freelanders stuffing up - its the first I have heard of it.

Mate I would suggest give someone a call who knows landrovers and that isnt stuck up themselves..... Try the service department of somewhere like graeme coopers, or possibly Karcraft in Silverwater - there is also a landrover wreckers out Warragamba - Greendale way that may be able to help.

Good luck to ya mate - i recon anyone who wants to do the work themselves and has the pump to have a go deserves all the supportthey can get. Petrol engines are very basic, just make sure your dad has a workshop manual.

other option is to try and find a mechanic that will do the work for labour only - there are a few around. - but your warranty will be limited to labour.

ALso while im not an advocate of clubs have you tried or joined the Landrover Owners club, often there are people there who may know who to turn to for help. and of course this site....

good luck

Mick

[Andyc626]

Thanks Mick for your reply, The guy who told me about replacement heads actually works as a mechanic for land rover,so I don't know what to think, thats why I needed to ask if anyone knew about it.
I also had a machanic rip me off,he replaced the timing belt then charged me for it, just to turn around and tell me the head needs replacing! :x
So I got the car towed home and been wondering what to do!

[langy]

Howdy Miss Erin - First, so your Pop has a fighting chance, buy a set of RAVE CD workshop manuals ( In the emporium on this forum or elsewhere on the net). The paper versions will cost you heaps ( $100+). 2nd, Invest some $ and get a second opinion ( A professional one). Paying a mechanic to come out to your place for a half hour inspection and test and written report is well worth it. Even if you don't take the quote, your Pop will know more about what is wrong. After that, plan for your car to be off the road for a while. There's nothing worse than trying to hurry a big job on an unfamilar car. There is an excellent 4wd wreckers at Kotara- but don't be surprised if they haven't wrecked a Freelander- you don't see dead ones around. Last, as for an alternate supplier of LR parts, Karcraft at Silverwater ( Like Mick said) and TR spares Padstow (Sydney) are the front runners. Both will know what is what, and give you reasonable prices for gaskets and bits.

And of course, there are a whole bunch of us here just itching to help

Langy

[101RRS]

The freelander does have a lot of male and female Torx studs and bolts on the car - any decent tool shop has them in sets for about $30 for each set - make sure you get the correct range as some sets have a lot of small tools that are not needed.

As far as the K series engine is concerned it has a design problem that results in marginal cooling to the head. Hot spots develop and if the engine overheats the head is a casualty and sometimes the cylinder liners slip (the block and liners heat at different rates and the liners can become loose).

Unfortunately some mechanics just want to replace engines or heads without trying to repair. Also many Landrover Specialists don't know much about Freelanders. If you don't have access to a trustworthy mechanic, my best bet would be a mechanically minded dad, a Haynes Manual (easy to follow), a RAVE CD, a good Head Shop, and a good non dealer parts supplier. I know some people suggest the 4wd place at Kotara but I have never had much luck with them and I have used them since the the late 70s when they were at the five ways in Broadmeadow. I would suggest checking the parts suppliers mentioned in Sydney, British 4wd who advertise here and if you need a second hand head try TR Spares in Lonsdale in SA.

When you have either repaired or replaced the head there is always a chance it will happen again but if you understand the problem you can minimise the chances. The head has a design problem and where other engines could cope with some reduced cooling capacity the K series cannot. You must ensure the thermostat is always in top condition and that may mean replacing on a regular basis. The coolant must never be allowed to drop down at all, and must be regularly replaced. Air pockets will cause the spot heating in the head that causes the problem. The coolant system as a whole must be serviced regulaly and any suspect parts replaced - in other words simply maintain the cooling system as it is meant to be maintained and if the system gets hot stop don't push on.

For more information have a look at these websites - you might get further advice and help from them.

For those with 1.8 Freelanders this may be of interest - picked it up on another forum

"Those affected by the Freelander Head Gasket problem should visit http://freelander.webhop.net/ and http://home.austarnet.com.au/edwardsonline...anderheadgasket (http://home.austarnet.com.au/edwardsonline/freelanderheadgasket) "

Best of luck

Gazzz

[CraigE]

Erin,
If you have access to a digital camera and can take a pic of the offending bolt and post it on the forum it may help to identify it. It does sound like it is a torx type bolt head. Why they used this type of bolt on a head is beyond me. My advice is buy a cheap set for general use from super cheap, repco or similar. Find the correct size and then go and by a good quality socket bit from a good tool store that will fit a 1/2 inch drive for your socket set. If you have the spare cash a good set that should have the size you need should be available for about $120-200 depending on the range you want. A cheap set would be hard pressed to remove and torque up a head. The rave CD should show all the required tools and special tools. Petrol heads are generally not hard to replace or complex. Just make sure everything as it is removed if unsure of its location is layed out as it has to go back in. Old pieces of packing foam are good for pushing things in in sequence and hold them in place. Above all make sure the head is tightened down in sequence and gradually a bit aty a time.

[PhilipA]

Speaking to a fellow member of my club a few years ago, he told me that he had a BIG problem arise when he tried to fit a new head gasket to an MGF, which is the same engine as a Freelander.

The head bolts are very long and tie the main bearing carrier to the head.
His bearing carrier apparently slipped while he was doing the job and resulted in an engine out job. He was considering selling the car "as is" because it was such a problem.
Has anyone actually removed the head on a Freelander? Is there a way you can hold the bearing carrier in place?
Is my memory failing and this is a load of Bull?
regards Philip A

[51jay]

Having checked out the site posted by GarryCol, I would be seriously looking at the possibile alternative engines to replace the stock one.
Obviously it would cost a fair bit more than a simple head repair or replacement,but, it seems that job on a freelander is not simple,and if it only lasts 80Kklm not worth the effort.

[Andyc626]

G'day All,
I love that soi many have replyed! U all have given me so much stuff to think about.
I'm thinkin it might be worth while to just replace the engine.If I do,with all experience ya's have how much ya reckon I could pick up a new engine, compared to a second hand engine.(what do ya's think of second hand engines?)

Thanks Erin style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif

[LandyAndy]

Hi Erin
We have had 2 engine failures in our Mitsi Trytoo diesel,each time I got a secondhand import motor,the first it turned out was a con,they had built it from peoples "hand in exchanges" but this later one is pretty good.
Look into getting a motor from a low K wreck,or even check out damage vehicle auctions,you may find a written off freelander at a reasonable price,wreck it and the parts you sell may help pay for the replacement of the motor.
Goodluck
Andrew

[101RRS]

Originally posted by Andyc626
G'day All,
I'm thinkin it might be worth while to just replace the engine.If I do,with all experience ya's have how much ya reckon I could pick up a new engine, compared to a second hand engine.(what do ya's think of second hand engines?)Thanks Erin :D :D

Erin

I believe 'new engines' from Landrover are about $5000 but I have heard of them being up to $8,000. HOWEVER, I don't believe these are actually new and are 'remanufactured' from warranty claim engines. These 'new' engines still have the problem though and have as much chance failing as you fixing your head will.

TR spares in Lonsdale SA have second hand engines at about $3,500.

I think I would be absolutely sure you want to go the engine replacement route as it will not necessarily be a better solution. I have had a look at the w/s manual and it seems relatively straight forward to remove the head as long as precautions are taken to ensure the cylinder liners don't move. It will not cost anything to get the engine to this stage (if you have someone to do it) - then you can make decisions on whether to proceed with repair or replace the head or ditch the engine completely and put another one in. If you are intent on changing the engine, you have nothing to loose in having a go at the head anyway.

There are just as many MGTFs and Lotus Elises (has the same engine) in Newcastle as there are 1.8 Freelanders so the local MG car Club might be able to point you in the direction of a mechanic who is familar with the 1.8 K engine.

Also while a number of cars have had this problem, there are heaps on the road that haven't and are still running. If it were me I would have a go at repairing the head - unless you have been advised otherwise the odds are it has just done a head gasket. Though there could be a warped head. If it works and and you maintain the cooling system properly you may not have any further problems. If when the head is off and all looks bad then by all means consider another engine - what have you got to loose.

Good luck

Garry

[Leo109]

Hi Erin,

Have you managed to get a copy of the RAVE CD workshop manuals for your Freeleander yet? If not, PM me and I'll see what I can arrange - no charge.

Reading about what's involved in a head replacement from the proper manuals might help in your decision making.

[Andyc626]

style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif Thanks, I havn't been able to pick up RAVE CD yet!
I really HOPE to just replace the head,but after reading other's coments I'm a bit worryed! :?

Erin.

[Andyc626]

G'day All,
I Finally got the head off my freelander!
The problem has been valve 1 & 2 are bent,the pistons are fine.
I guess I'm glad with that because i was expecting a lot more!!
There were no problems with getting the head off(other than getting the right sized torx socket set). I have my Dad and a friend who is a mechanic who are confident they can replace them.

Wish me luck!
Thanks to all who replyed.

Erin :wink: 8)

[Leo109]

Great news Erin. Hope the rest of the job goes well and you're back on the road (or even better, the dirt!) soon.