Modifying a Perentie...

[Dauntless]

First off; sorry for the long winded post, but it seems like I'm looking to put together something fairly unusual.

I'm looking for a solid, simple, reliable and torquey 4WD which is good off-road, can also carry a decent payload and tow a car trailer. I've done a lot of research on other vehicles and nothing seems to be ideal for what I'm looking for.

I want to be able to drive it every day, go on interstate and outback trips, do some fairly serious 4WDing, and have the ability to get a load of wood, dirt, steel or whatever else I might need.

What I like about the Perentie:
Engine, driveline, chassis are simple, strong and effective. Spare tyre is underneath.
Better clearance and articulation than a LandCruiser 75/79 or Patrol with leaf rear
More performance potential and much higher towing capacity than a leaf sprung Hilux
Should have better articulation than all of the above while being capable of carrying heavy loads without spring/chassis issues unlike a Patrol with coil rear

And now what I'd want to change:
The body: A dropside tray is a must. Is it just a matter of cutting the Perentie body and fitting a Defender ute cab back and roof? Would this still allow the seat to travel all the way back? I'm 6'3 so this is important. I'm assuming a tray built for a Defender 110 ute won't line up with the chassis rails?

Air conditioning: I intend to take this to QLD and northern NSW in summer and sit in traffic, so I'll need A/C. Has anyone done this? Am I right in thinking a combination of Isuzu truck and Defender parts with maybe some custom hoses could make this happen?

Constant 4WD: I'd be doing a lot of miles in this thing, so fuel economy and reliability are important. Is there a part time conversion kit available for the LT95?

Fuel capacity: I've read it's 80L? That isn't adequate for my needs. Given their unique chassis, is a larger tank available, or would I have to get a custom aux tank under the tray?

And finally a few questions.
Steering: How heavy is it? I'm used to a diesel Hilux on 33s with a steel bar and winch without P/S, but I wouldn't want any worse than that. Would a Perentie with winch on 35s be bearable around town and frequently parallel parking?

It looks like the AC compressor would mount on the exhaust side, would OEM and common aftermarket turbos clear this?

I've read that parts like springs, shocks and diff locks are commonly available, is that correct? Would I need 4" lift springs to gain a 2" lift?

I look forward to your replies.

[Ashleylipus]

As far ad i know, tank capacity is 65 litres on your standard perentie. As for your part time 4x4 if say you would need a free wheeling hub kit to give you part time 4x4. I don't own a perentie but ive driven a couple and the steering is already quite heavy with the standard tyres. I think you would have issues if you fit 35 inch tyres not just with steering but also with power. Its only 4 gears and although it works well as it is, i think you would be sorry for fitting those big tyres.

[Homestar]

Steering is heavy on the 4x4 but power steering is an easy fit. The 6x6 has power steering from the factory. The rest of your plan sounds all doable - but the towing capacity of the vehicle isn't what you'd expect and certainly can't legally tow a car trailer as it sits. You'll need to chat to an Engineer about that as the Military towing spec on these vehicles is very low.

The constant 4 wheel drive won't effect your fuel economy at all - the Isuzu engine is quite good on fuel anyway. You'll also loose the advantages of having full time 4 wheel drive - why would you want it to handle in the dirt like a Hilux? ;). I've never heard of a kit to do a part time conversion on the LT95 anyway, but I could be wrong.

All the best, it will be a great vehicle. :)

[JDNSW]

Body: Parts from a 110 or Defender or even Series 3 pretty much bolt on. Seat movement should not be affected, unlike the swb Landrovers. Perhaps find someone with a cab Defender to try your fit. Tray mount will need modification. Engineering will probably be required for this and can also almost certainly increase towing limit to the civilian load. Will also be required for 35" tyres I believe as it is more than 50mm increase. (And why would you want this for your use - other things apart it will give issues with the spare)

Airconditionsing. Certainly can be done, but probably a custom job.

Constant four wheel drive. All Landrovers have been constant four wheel drive for over thirty years and still give better fuel economy than their competitors, so there is little reason to change this - the cost will be more than the fuel you will save over the vehicle's lifetime, so why would you do it? The difference in fuel consumption between full time four wheel drive and two wheel drive would be almost negligible.

Fuel capacity. Custom tank under the tray.

Steering - power steering kits are readily available and probably the most common modification by perentie owners.

Hope this helps.

John

[Dervish]

And now what I'd want to change:
The body: A dropside tray is a must. Is it just a matter of cutting the Perentie body and fitting a Defender ute cab back and roof? Would this still allow the seat to travel all the way back? I'm 6'3 so this is important. I'm assuming a tray built for a Defender 110 ute won't line up with the chassis rails?


Have a look at this one:

Perentie trayback expressions of interest (http://remlr.com/forum/index.php'topic=4033.0)

Rather than cutting the tub like that one, I would recommend finding a proper tray back single cab rear wall and selling the Perentie tub complete.

The cab roof will cut a 20-50mm off the seat travel, depending on how tilted you like the seat back to be.

A Defender/110 tray should work, depending on how it mounts.




Air conditioning: I intend to take this to QLD and northern NSW in summer and sit in traffic, so I'll need A/C. Has anyone done this? Am I right in thinking a combination of Isuzu truck and Defender parts with maybe some custom hoses could make this happen?


I have A/C on one of mine. No need for truck stuff. There are two options, find a County 4bd1 A/C bracket - which is almost impossible - or speak to KLR Automotive who fabricate a bracket to fit a generic Sanden unit. From there you could either find an under dash A/C unit from a Defender or go with a generic hot rod unit between/behind the seats.



Constant 4WD: I'd be doing a lot of miles in this thing, so fuel economy and reliability are important. Is there a part time conversion kit available for the LT95?


As others have mentioned, don't bother.



Fuel capacity: I've read it's 80L? That isn't adequate for my needs. Given their unique chassis, is a larger tank available, or would I have to get a custom aux tank under the tray?


Whatever you need, you'll need to have made.



And finally a few questions.
Steering: How heavy is it? I'm used to a diesel Hilux on 33s with a steel bar and winch without P/S, but I wouldn't want any worse than that. Would a Perentie with winch on 35s be bearable around town and frequently parallel parking?


Power steering is available, again through KLR Automotive. If you want to be reversing with trailers and heading off road with 35s, I would say it would be almost a necessity.



It looks like the AC compressor would mount on the exhaust side, would OEM and common aftermarket turbos clear this?


Here's a photo of my engine bay; the A/C compressor is tucked away under the alternator - plenty of room.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/05/690.jpg



I've read that parts like springs, shocks and diff locks are commonly available, is that correct? Would I need 4" lift springs to gain a 2" lift?


Yes, everything is commonly available. Perenties are already lifted 2", so be absolutely certain you want so much lift before you go down that road. Land Rovers aren't like the rest, they don't need to be miles off the ground to perform off road.

[BadCo.]

...
Land Rovers aren't like the rest, they don't need to be miles off the ground to perform off road.

Or to fit big tires. From what I have read, 35's seem to fit on stock Defenders with 2" lift and the correct offset rims and maybe steering lock adjustment.

[Chris078]

The body: A dropside tray is a must. Is it just a matter of cutting the Perentie body and fitting a Defender ute cab back and roof? Would this still allow the seat to travel all the way back? I'm 6'3 so this is important. I'm assuming a tray built for a Defender 110 ute won't line up with the chassis rails?
You won't need to cut the body, just unbolt and drill out rivets.
a tray off a 130/110 won't bolt straight on due to the rear chassis, but it would not be too hard to mod.

Air conditioning: I intend to take this to QLD and northern NSW in summer and sit in traffic, so I'll need A/C. Has anyone done this? Am I right in thinking a combination of Isuzu truck and Defender parts with maybe some custom hoses could make this happen?
Yup. air con can be fitted


Constant 4WD: I'd be doing a lot of miles in this thing, so fuel economy and reliability are important. Is there a part time conversion kit available for the LT95?

Constant 4WD does not effect fuel economy worth a damn, especially with the 4BD1, leave it.
plus, the Perentie is quite nose heavy and understears like a pig in adverse conditions, you want that 4WD!


Fuel capacity: I've read it's 80L? That isn't adequate for my needs. Given their unique chassis, is a larger tank available, or would I have to get a custom aux tank under the tray?

Fuel capacity is 65L on a standard Perentie. you can fairly easily get another tank fabbed up for under the tray.


And finally a few questions.
Steering: How heavy is it? I'm used to a diesel Hilux on 33s with a steel bar and winch without P/S, but I wouldn't want any worse than that. Would a Perentie with winch on 35s be bearable around town and frequently parallel parking?

The steering is not that bad IMHO. a couple of qualifiers though.
This is on AT, not mudders, and not super wide tyres. I have Hankook Dynapro RF10 ATMs on mine (235/85/r16 - same diameter, 40mm wider) and have no problem with the steering: That is after I replaced the pitman arm and tie rod ends. If you have dry, flogged out ball joints, you're going to have a bad time.
In terms of parking, I find the lack of visibility is more of a problem than the steering - reverse camera and blind spot mirrors are a must.

That said, a full brand new p/s it can be purchased for and installed for $2500. you can go much cheaper using second hand parts.


do you need 35's? In fact, you'd have to double check, but I'm pretty sure that size is not legal in QLD. The standard size for the Perentie is 7.5R16 which is a 31" tyre. [found info here in the minor modifications pdf download] (http://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/Safety/Vehicle-standards-and-modifications/Vehicle-modifications/Frequently-asked-questions-vehicle-standards-and-modifications#gauges)
as follows:
The following information provides some general guidance about raising a vehicle's height
A vehicle lift up to and including 75mm combining both suspension lift and tyre diameter increase (maximum suspension lift 50mm, maximum tyre diameter increase 50mm) is acceptable under self-certification.
A vehicle lift between 76mm and 125mm (inclusive) combining a suspension lift, a tyre diameter increase and a body lift (maximum suspension lift 50mm, maximum tyre diameter increase 50mm, maximum body lift 50mm) requires certification and testing by the department's Approved Person.
Please Note: The above mentioned maximum tyre diameter tyre increase is for 4WD off-road vehicles. A passenger car or passenger car derivatives must not increase their tyre diameter by more than 15mm.
For further information please refer to the LS section of the Queensland Code of Practice ? Vehicle Modifications

As the Perentie is already lifted 2" fitting any more than 32" tyres will require certification (if I understand that correctly)

A higher suspension lift will require double carden driveshafts (pricey, very pricey)


It looks like the AC compressor would mount on the exhaust side, would OEM and common aftermarket turbos clear this?
Other member has answered better than me, but yes, you can fit air con.

I've read that parts like springs, shocks and diff locks are commonly available, is that correct? Would I need 4" lift springs to gain a 2" lift?

springs/shocks/diff locks are all common, easily obtainable parts.
The Perentie is already lifted 2". Going higher will require a lot of expensive work. There are a few threads on the net about it, but the basics are you need to change to double carden driveshafts, cranked drag links and other aftermarket suspension components to keep the geometry correct.
done properly, a 4" lift is not going to leave you much change out of $10k
once it's fitted and certified.



Honestly, I think you'd be better buying a 130 tray back rather than a Perentie and modding it. It would certainly be lighter on your wallet!

[rathgar]

...As the Perentie is already lifted 2" fitting any more than 32" tyres will require certification (if I understand that correctly)....

Personally I cant see why anyone would want to lift a perentie at all or fit significantly larger tyres BUT A perentie is not lifted 2" already - It may be higher that a civilian 110 of the same era but it came from the factory as it is. Therefore going on what you quoted for Queensland you could lift it if you wanted and stay within the minor modification guideline (not requiring certification) by Maximum +50mm suspension and +50mm Diameter Tyre size (giving +25mm lift) = Total +75mm lift

[Chris078]

Personally I cant see why anyone would want to lift a perentie at all or fit significantly larger tyres BUT A perentie is not lifted 2" already - It may be higher that a civilian 110 of the same era but it came from the factory as it is. Therefore going on what you quoted for Queensland you could lift it if you wanted and stay within the minor modification guideline (not requiring certification) by Maximum +50mm suspension and +50mm Diameter Tyre size (giving +25mm lift) = Total +75mm lift


That's semantics. That the army ordered them with a 50mm lift from the factory, does not make that a 'factory standard'. but, if someone wanted to take a punt with the Transport department or their insurance company rejecting a claim, that's their choice.

That also does not change the fact that to lift it any higher is going to require a huge financial investment. You have to replace every single suspension component with either custom or after market parts (drag links etc) along with new adjustable panard rod and new driveshafts. Easily 10 grand there alone.
add in power steering (2500) Turbo 3500, air con 2500, cab, tray etc and you're up to $20-25k in mods.

Additional thoughts for people better at math than me: just how badly would 33-35" tyres affect the gearing? Might be nice on the highway, but I suspect doing a hill start (especially loaded or towing) would become very difficult.

[Homestar]

That's semantics. That the army ordered them with a 50mm lift from the factory, does not make that a 'factory standard'. but, if someone wanted to take a punt with the Transport department or their insurance company rejecting a claim, that's their choice.


Not really - the Perentie isn't a 'special order' 110, it's recognised as a separate vehicle in every respect - just look at the towing capacity. The Army had them built to a spec yes, but it is standard specification for that model of vehicle. Easy to prove - the rego authorities can't have it both ways.

[Blknight.aus]

That's semantics. That the army ordered them with a 50mm lift from the factory, does not make that a 'factory standard'. but, if someone wanted to take a punt with the Transport department or their insurance company rejecting a claim, that's their choice.



given they are not "ordered with 50mm lift" they were built to a specification...

More than happy to go Toe to Toe with both the DOT and an insurance company...

again, in fact... :)

its a pretty simple fight really... see the fording depth marker on the fuel tank.. just measure to the bottom of that... or you could just qoute emei Veh G 101 or even the UHB probrably right around say section 2 page 11 para 28 under the heading of

overall height
laden 1953mm
unladen 2040mm

height of cargo tray from ground
laden
710mm
unladen
825mm

towing pintle height
laden 520 mm <-- changed this on edit.. I miss read the look up table
unladen 640mm

[DeeJay]

Having recently had a Defender certified, whilst there are plenty of vehicles running 35's , no engineer will plate the vehicle above the allowable specs.
It will get knocked back, so submit the vehicle on allowable tyres..

[Chris078]

Not really - the Perentie isn't a 'special order' 110, it's recognised as a separate vehicle in every respect - just look at the towing capacity. The Army had them built to a spec yes, but it is standard specification for that model of vehicle. Easy to prove - the rego authorities can't have it both ways.

That's fair enough. Don't bring that tow rating up again, we'll end up having that argument again too! :p

I guess the thing to remember is that if you want to add any more lift to a Perentie - suspension wise - you'd better have deep pockets!

I reckon for what Dauntless is after, he's probably better getting a single cab 130 and putting a 4bd1 in it. It would work out a bit cheaper and less engineering/certification hassle than modding a Perentie.

Of course he could get a tray back 6x6. That would fill most of his needs except for ease of parking!

[Chris078]

Thanks for these:

overall height
laden 1953mm
unladen 2040mm

height of cargo tray from ground
laden
710mm
unladen
825mm

towing pintle height
laden 710 mm
unladen 640mm __________________

I might go out and measure mine tomorrow, I think mines come out a bit higher than it should be with the new suspension fitted. Hopefully the springs settle down a bit in the next few months.

[Dervish]

I reckon for what Dauntless is after, he's probably better getting a single cab 130 and putting a 4bd1 in it. It would work out a bit cheaper and less engineering/certification hassle than modding a Perentie.


I'm not sure you've thought a great deal about this. Putting a 4bd1 into anything costs a huge amount, after which you end up with basically stock Perentie.

[rfurzer]

Unless you want to do the mod project because you enjoy projects, I'd recommend just buying something that already will do the job.

As for me - I'm halfway through my project so I cant talk!. I do have an engineer working on a certified tow bar tho

[Blknight.aus]

I guess the thing to remember is that if you want to add any more lift to a Perentie - suspension wise - you'd better have deep pockets!



Umm why? you can add 2 inches of lift without any re-engineering.

in fact clever people just go and grab the suspension and spec list for the rsv or rfsv and use that as the stock heght measurements or grab the RFSV springs and shocks.

because while para 28 of its UHB says Tray body load area

para 29 has this..

height of cargo tray from ground.
laden 770mm
unladen 870mm

towing pintle height
laden 610mm
unladen 710mm

and last time I checked the RPS's the springs and shocks have different part numbers...

Hrmmm...

something about

"so long as it was available in the model range at thetime of production" might ring a bell...

someone very cleverer could put forth the argument that as its in the same family that you could, in fact put suspension in that gave you say 110-120mm of lift over the stock GS/FFR and have it be legal...

and my appologies for the edit on the previous post of mine to correct the pintle hook height, landies are good and all but generally the loaded pintle height is going to be lower than the unloaded one.

[Chris078]

Umm why? you can add 2 inches of lift without any re-engineering.

I meant adding 2" to a Perentie from where it is now, which would mean 4" from a stock 110/Defender.

As far as I can tell from what I gleaned when I was looking at the suspension, due to it's design, the perentie is pretty much about as high as you can go before you start having to replace the drive shafts with double carden jointed ones ($1500-2k ea)
you also need to replace the drag links and radius arms as the stock onees will be too short/the wrong angle, the steering linkages will need to be replaced with longer/adjustable ones as well (panhard rod?).

Everything I read said that going higher that a 2" lift on a defender would require those additional changes; which i take to mean adding any further suspension height to a Perentie would require them.


I could be (and quite possibly am) wrong though.
RE: getting part nos from the RFSV etc. It is higher than the the GS? I thought it might have a heavier spring rating, but from the 2 I've seen in the flesh, they seems the same height as my GS.

[rathgar]

I'd be careful relying on user generated documents emei xxxx or uhb xxxx ;) but base your decisions on the land rover part numbers.

[mark2]

Unless you want to do the mod project because you enjoy projects, I'd recommend just buying something that already will do the job.

As for me - I'm halfway through my project so I cant talk!. I do have an engineer working on a certified tow bar tho

Agree - you'll be much happier with a coil cab GU patrol ute and a readily available rear coil brace. Ticks all your boxes and then some.

Yes, I currently own a Perentie and a Patrol. Love my Perentie but it is what it is...

[Blknight.aus]

I'd be careful relying on user generated documents emei xxxx or uhb xxxx ;) but base your decisions on the land rover part numbers.

why, they have liability numbers on them and they match the spec documents.

[isuzutoo-eh]

Where did this double carden jointed info come from? I thought it was only 2007 onwards that needed them for a lift, I haven't measured angles on One Tens for years but pretty sure 4" on a civvy special One Ten was okay with standard uni joints.

[rathgar]

why, they have liability numbers on them and they match the spec documents.

I'm always looking for more documents. What spec documents? Whats a liability number?

[Blknight.aus]

What spec documents?
The ones that have the same info as the 100 and the UHB but have landrover instead of Australian Army written on the cover.


Whats a liability number?
Its a series of digits and seperators that follow the words LIABILITY CODE no.

[rathgar]

The ones that have the same info as the 100 and the UHB but have landrover instead of Australian Army written on the cover....

I've never seen one can you post a copy or link please.

[rathgar]

.....Its a series of digits and seperators that follow the words LIABILITY CODE no.

Which l assume relates to military procedure and has nothing to do with civilian use.

[Chris078]

Where did this double carden jointed info come from? I thought it was only 2007 onwards that needed them for a lift, I haven't measured angles on One Tens for years but pretty sure 4" on a civvy special One Ten was okay with standard uni joints.


quick post, I'll have to dig up the links later, but when I was researching suspension for early Defender/110s, most referenced a need for double cardens when lifting more than 2/3", along with new drag links, steering linkages, rear A frame and Radius arms to keep the geometry correct.

[Blknight.aus]

Which l assume relates to military procedure and has nothing to do with civilian use.

nope its more about insurancy type stuff..

I've only ever seen one complete copy of the civvy docs and contracts and that was in the posession of a guy who was involved in the writing of them. Ive seen the odd bits and pieces of them in various museums.

you might try archives from LRA.

or do you mean the 100 or UHB?

[rathgar]

nope its more about insurancy type stuff..

Tried talking to Mr & Mrs Google but that hasnt helped. Still have no idea what this is about


you might try archives from LRA.....

Have tried that (some time ago) they where not forthcoming.