My D3 hates Towing

[DonDownunder]

After investing in a new engine last year and getting 10k on the clock before towing then a round trip from West Sydney to Melb with 3.3 ton 27ft caravan in tow without a hick-up we now find ourselves half way to QLD with 2 separate episodes of limp mode. 1st one after 150k then it went away overnight then the next day after 250k. wrecked our holiday as heading home. too dangerous on busy highways, I have posted the exact fault codes and please excuse any bad spelling.
Hopefully the dealer workshop at Tamworth has a magic wand otherwise it will get sold. Fed up....

FAULT 1 OF 12
ECU: Instrument Pack
CODE:U0132
Lost communication with ride level ctrl module / Lost communication with suspension ctrl module A

(INTERMITTENT)FAULT 2 OF 12
ECU: Instrument Pack
CODE:U0184
Lost communication with audio unit
(PERMANENT)

FAULT 3 OF 12
ECU: Engine Management
CODE:P2299
Brake pedal position/accelerator pedal position incompatible
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 4 OF 12
ECU: Engine Management
CODE:P000E
Fuel volume regulator control exceeded learning limit
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 5 OF 12
ECU: Engine Management
CODE:P0087
Fuel rail/system pressure - too low
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 6 OF 12
ECU: Automatic Gearbox
CODE:U2023
Control module network signal calibration data
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 7 OF 12
ECU: Parking Brake
CODE:U0100
Lost communication with engine control module/powertrain control module 'A'
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 8 OF 12
ECU: Ride Level
CODE:U0416
Invalid data received from vehicle dynamics control module
(PENDING)

FAULT 9 OF 12
ECU: ABS system
CODE:U0401
Invalid data received from engine control module/powertrain control module
(HISTORIC)

FAULT 10 OF 12
ECU: All Terrain Control
CODE:U0401
Invalid data received from engine control module/powertrain control module
(PENDING)

FAULT 11 OF 12
ECU: All Terrain Control
CODE:U0402
Invalid data received from transmission control module
(PENDING)

FAULT 12 OF 12
ECU: All Terrain Control
CODE:U0416
Invalid data received from vehicle dynamics control module
(PENDING)

[Tombie]

Heck your battery post is tight - the Negative one...

Also check you have the latest software revisions.

[SBD4]

Also check that there are no CAN bus connection issues or shorts. Brake switch also might be worth looking too at based on one of those messages (the standard go to solution for cascading errors). Also check your tail lights etc for any dodgy globes, they have been known to cause these sorts of issues when a filament fails and causes intermittent connections (go to LED globes if you can, ~Rich~ has done this I think).

[Tombie]

I'm just rereading the list and brake switch/globe look like a potential contender..

[Blue C]

Don do you have a chip on the engine? (not a remap).
If so then the following might be of interest. I had some similar fault codes with limp mode triggered by towing ~1600kg hybrid camper with the engine chipped on my previous D3 (2.7L TDV6)

P000E-22:FUEL VOLUME REGULATOR CONTROL EXCEEDED LEARNING LIMIT : SIGNAL AMPLITUDE>MAXIMUM
P00087-00: FUEL RAIL/SYSTEM PRESSURE- TOO LOW
P2299-68:BRAKE PEDAL POSITION/ACCELERATOR PEDAL POSITION INCOMPATIBLE: EVENT INFORMATION

It happened 2-3 times whilst towing under load (up long steep freeway climbs) Removing the chip (or turning it off) whilst towing solved the problem for me. I sold my D3 to a mate and advised him against putting the chip back on if towing. He decided to give it a go anyway and the same thing (Limp mode triggered) happened to him 4 times driving back from Alice Springs to Adelaide! He's since taken it off with no further issues. Regards, David

[Tombie]

Chips belong with Fish and Vinegar..

Only remapping should be done on these engines... And then only by very reputable tuners.

[Blue C]

Yes agreed Tombie! This happened in 2011 and I learned the hard way! I would never use one again. David

[DonDownunder]

Don do you have a chip on the engine? (not a remap).
If so then the following might be of interest. I had some similar fault codes with limp mode triggered by towing ~1600kg hybrid camper with the engine chipped on my previous D3 (2.7L TDV6)

P000E-22:FUEL VOLUME REGULATOR CONTROL EXCEEDED LEARNING LIMIT : SIGNAL AMPLITUDE>MAXIMUM
P00087-00: FUEL RAIL/SYSTEM PRESSURE- TOO LOW
P2299-68:BRAKE PEDAL POSITION/ACCELERATOR PEDAL POSITION INCOMPATIBLE: EVENT INFORMATION

It happened 2-3 times whilst towing under load (up long steep freeway climbs) Removing the chip (or turning it off) whilst towing solved the problem for me. I sold my D3 to a mate and advised him against putting the chip back on if towing. He decided to give it a go anyway and the same thing (Limp mode triggered) happened to him 4 times driving back from Alice Springs to Adelaide! He's since taken it off with no further issues. Regards, David
David I bought the D3 2nd hand and it has lots of a/market extras. It goes like a rocket and no problems towing the cvan up hills. If it is chipped where would I find it and what does it look like. Is it in a "Plug & Play" harness?? cheers Don :wasntme:

[Blue C]

Yes it is "plug and play"! Depending on the model it will consist of a wiring harness attached to a small plastic module likely to be mounted near the starting battery (mine was actually inside the battery compartment wedged between the battery and front edge of the plastic box so check in there or just in front of it). The wiring harness will lead to a "T" junction that consists of the original engine plug joined to one end of the harness and the other side of the 'T' goes to the plug on the side of the engine near the common fuel rail - either towards the front left side if a late model D3 or at the back if early model D3.You need to take the plastic engine cover off first though to see this area. I can send more detailed instructions and photos as a pdf file if you PM me. Also if you take close up photos of the passenger side of engine with plastic cover off I could probably tell you if you have a chip fitted. Hope that helps.

[DonDownunder]

Yes it is "plug and play"! Depending on the model it will consist of a wiring harness attached to a small plastic module likely to be mounted near the starting battery (mine was actually inside the battery compartment wedged between the battery and front edge of the plastic box so check in there or just in front of it). The wiring harness will lead to a "T" junction that consists of the original engine plug joined to one end of the harness and the other side of the 'T' goes to the plug on the side of the engine near the common fuel rail - either towards the front left side if a late model D3 or at the back if early model D3.You need to take the plastic engine cover off first though to see this area. I can send more detailed instructions and photos as a pdf file if you PM me. Also if you take close up photos of the passenger side of engine with plastic cover off I could probably tell you if you have a chip fitted. Hope that helps.
some pics

[gghaggis]

some pics

If you replaced the engine then you surely would know whether it is remapped or not? As for a chip, it's unlikely the fitters would re-establish a chip without asking you?

Cheers

Gordon

[LRD414]

Don, out of curiosity I had a sift in Disco3 for your fault codes, particularly P0087 and P2299.

P0087 could be related to a fuel pump or fuel filter issue but if so, is usually associated with P2290, which seems the more common code and you don't have that one.

However, P0087 has also been associated with the brake pedal switch issue and this cause would line up with your P2299 code.

So if it's not related to a chip, then the suggestion of changing the brake pedal switch and checking all brake bulbs is worth doing.

Scott

[DonDownunder]

Don, out of curiosity I had a sift in Disco3 for your fault codes, particularly P0087 and P2299.

P0087 could be related to a fuel pump or fuel filter issue but if so, is usually associated with P2290, which seems the more common code and you don't have that one.

However, P0087 has also been associated with the brake pedal switch issue and this cause would line up with your P2299 code.

So if it's not related to a chip, then the suggestion of changing the brake pedal switch and checking all brake bulbs is worth doing.

Scott Thanks Scott. There is no performance Chip and I found 2 blackened brake bulbs . Brake switch working ok as it signals the Brake Controller for the Caravan.I am not sure of the lineup of the signal to the brake controller as it was fitted by previous owner. I always double relay the brake switch signal with polarized diode within the relay to protect computer circuits. cheers Don

[LRD414]

Thanks Scott. There is no performance Chip and I found 2 blackened brake bulbs . Brake switch working ok as it signals the Brake Controller for the Caravan.

Well that's the first thing to rectify Don. Regarding the switch, it seems that when faulty it is intermittent so may not affect your brake controller in an obvious way. Also the recommended way to wire the brake controller signal is spliced to the stop light wire rather than brake switch. Not sure if that's relevant to your problem though. Hopefully it's the bulbs.

Scott

[DonDownunder]

Thanks for help guys. When we were on the road last week was afterdark and 2 separate cars dooted the horn and flashed headlights behind us and we took no notice, Well today after suggestions I found 2 partially blackened tail and brake bulbs in rear lights which could be the culprit to the Limp Mode (hoping it is) as the tail lights may of been flickering off and on, Bulbs replaced so this Tuesday head off with caravan again.
The other contributing item could be the logic in the brake controller signal wiring. If it is sourced from the tow connection at the back should be ok but was in the D3 when I bought it.:)

[LRD414]

Bulbs replaced so this Tuesday head off with caravan again.
The other contributing item could be the logic in the brake controller signal wiring. If it is sourced from the tow connection at the back should be ok but was in the D3 when I bought it.
Don, also worth looking at fitting LED bulbs as per this thread. Then you are unlikely to face this issue again.
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/d3-d4-rrs/145750-d3-led-rear-lights-brake-tail-blinker.html
Given you're leaving Tuesday have a look at Jaycar for them. Or at least take spare standard bulbs with you.
I would be sourcing a spare new brake light switch to carry as well. They are pretty cheap insurance.

Scott

[Tombie]

Brake light switch is MUCH cheaper from Ford Dealers.

[LandyAndy]

Brake light switch is MUCH cheaper from Ford Dealers.
Which do you ask for oh wise one???
Andrew

[Grentarc]

Which do you ask for oh wise one???
Andrew

AFAIK they have the same part number

[LandyAndy]

It wont be listed as a Discovery brake switch,I would be surprised if every Ford used the same switch.
Andrew

[Grentarc]

All I do when ordering from anywhere is quote a part number, as there is no confusion - I do it with dealers and wreckers etc. Much easier that way

[Tombie]

Drop cover under dash, snap photo with phone :) then you have part number

[LRD414]

Land Rover Part Number: XKB500110
Seems to be Ford Part Number: SW6572

Everything you'd ever want to know and more about the switch <here> (http://www.lrrforums.com/showthread.php?18350-HDC-Trans-Suspension-Fault-w-NO-BRAKE-LIGHTS!/page5&) !!

Switch changing procedure I found written up on Disco3 attached to this post too.

Cheers,
Scott

EDIT: looks like it was used on a lot more vehicles than just Ford according to this site:
FORD 1 820 183 (1820183) Brake Light Switch (http://infopart.org/ford-1820183-part)

[DonDownunder]

Land Rover Part Number: XKB500110
Seems to be Ford Part Number: SW6572

Everything you'd ever want to know and more about the switch <here> (http://www.lrrforums.com/showthread.php?18350-HDC-Trans-Suspension-Fault-w-NO-BRAKE-LIGHTS!/page5&) !!

Switch changing procedure I found written up on Disco3 attached to this post too.

Cheers,
Scott

EDIT: looks like it was used on a lot more vehicles than just Ford according to this site:
FORD 1 820 183 (1820183) Brake Light Switch (http://infopart.org/ford-1820183-part)

Hi Scott. Landrover price $54 Identical part from Ford $33, Interesting thing it was a multiple franchise dealer at Tamworth. Same salesperson. Got one today and fitted. Noticed the old one a bit loose in bracket . cheers Don

[DonDownunder]

Left Tamworth after replacing Bulbs and Brake switch. Thought I had it beaten. 20K short of Toowoomba Ding Ding Limp mode.
Off to the Landrover dealer workshop.
Now fixed hopefully. Fuel Rail pressure barely making 160MPA and only under tow load.
So New lift Pump, Filter , Injection Pump & Belt, Several sensors, and replaced some corroded elect plug terminals to sensors and engine ECU and FPCUnit A lot of hard work. Took 3 weeks to trouble shoot and fix.
Just about a new vehicle now so will have to last till we are too old to caravan around:cool:

[LRD414]

Geez you've had a bad run Don!

Don, out of curiosity I had a sift in Disco3 for your fault codes, particularly P0087 and P2299.
P0087 could be related to a fuel pump or fuel filter issue but if so, is usually associated with P2290, which seems the more common code and you don't have that one.
.... I guess the codes were trying to point towards fuel system.

Cheers,
Scott

[DonDownunder]

Sorry to say this but I got rid of my Disco3 and no more.... It was affecting my mental health considerably, was doing my head in. We spent a fortune on it but could not get rid of limp mode. EXTREMELY dangerous with caravan in tow. Ruined our years travels for winter. struggled home and sat by the fire,
I want to say thanks far and wide and to all who helped with advice for the support. Keep an eye out for my leftovers. cheers Don :(

[LandyAndy]

Sad to hear Don.
I hope you have a better run out of whatever you replace it with.
I can understand it leaving a bitter taste in your mouth:(:(:(:(:(
GOODLUCK
Andrew

[Ean Austral]

Best wishes for whatever you choose to replace it with Don.




Cheers Ean

[DonDownunder]

Sad to hear Don.
I hope you have a better run out of whatever you replace it with.
I can understand it leaving a bitter taste in your mouth:(:(:(:(:(
GOODLUCK
Andrew

Thanks Andrew, where do I go on Forum for private sales?

[LandyAndy]

Here you go Don.
There is a cut and paste form for most of the areas to make life easy.
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/aulro-marketplace-forums/
Andrew