Emirates plane crash at Dubai, panic in the cabin.

[bob10]

Was the landing gear lowered?

Emirates plane crash-lands at Dubai airport; passengers safe (http://thenewdaily.com.au/news/world/2016/08/03/emirates-plane-crash-dubai/?utm_source=Responsys&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=20160804_TND_States)

[bob10]

Getting all those people out was a good job.

Emirates Boeing 777 Explodes on Dubai Runway After Crash Landing - NBC News (http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/emirates-jet-burns-runway-after-dubai-airport-incident-n622046)

[sheerluck]

Seems that there are conflicting reports over whether it was lowered, lowered and collapsed, raised to do a go around....
Accident: Emirates B773 at Dubai on Aug 3rd 2016, touched down during go-around without gear, aircraft on fire (http://avherald.com/h?article=49c12302&opt=0)

[PhilipA]

Getting all those people out was a good job.
But they all completely ignored the direction to leave all personal belongings, which caused the mayhem.
It must have all happened in slow motion for them to get out.
Really a lesson in what not to do.
Regards Philip A

[Hugh Jars]

You will almost always lose height during the initiation of a go-around. Not sure if the Tripler has the same TOGA logic as the 737, but the first push of TOGA gives a reduced thrust for, say, a 1000fpm climb. A second press gives full go-around thrust. There's a marked difference in performance between the two :)

I've used both, depending on the reason for the go-around.

[JDNSW]

Reports say that ambient air temperature was above 50C, with strong gusting wind. Quite possibly the reason for requesting a go-round, and a contributor to the accident as well.

John

[muddymech]

You will almost always lose height during the initiation of a go-around. Not sure if the Tripler has the same TOGA logic as the 737, but the first push of TOGA gives a reduced thrust for, say, a 1000fpm climb. A second press gives full go-around thrust. There's a marked difference in performance between the two :)

I've used both, depending on the reason for the go-around.

looks like it give an input for 2000fpm climb

"On approach, a single push of the TO/GA lever moves the thrust levers to a
thrust value to climb at 2,000 fpm. A second push moves the thrust levers to
full go-around thrust.
An AfT disconnect switch is on the left and right thrust lever. Push an AfT
disconnect switch to disconnect the AfT and show the AUTOTHROTTLE
DISC caution message on the EICAS display. To reset the
AUTOTHROTTLE DISC caution message, push the AfT disconnect switch"

[bob10]

But they all completely ignored the direction to leave all personal belongings, which caused the mayhem.
It must have all happened in slow motion for them to get out.
Really a lesson in what not to do.
Regards Philip A

I agree, it took a while before one of the cabin staff asserted any authority, by that time the panic had set in. Once the cabin staff got over the initial shock, it was sorted reasonably quickly. Hard to say how you would react in that situation. Cool calm assertive leadership required. Easier said than done.

[Hugh Jars]

looks like it give an input for 2000fpm climb



"On approach, a single push of the TO/GA lever moves the thrust levers to a

thrust value to climb at 2,000 fpm. A second push moves the thrust levers to

full go-around thrust.

An AfT disconnect switch is on the left and right thrust lever. Push an AfT

disconnect switch to disconnect the AfT and show the AUTOTHROTTLE

DISC caution message on the EICAS display. To reset the

AUTOTHROTTLE DISC caution message, push the AfT disconnect switch"


Typical sequence of events:

"Go around, flaps 15" (pilot flying)
"Positive rate" (of climb) (pilot not flying)
"Gear up, check thrust" (pilot flying)

A possibility is during the go-around the flaps may have inadvertently been selected to less than 15, and once they pass that in the retract sequence the aircraft would resume a descent which can often end up with this outcome......

[Rolly]

However the Flap handle has to pass through a 'gate' to put it into a non-standard position for a go-round. That is single or all engines operating.

[Narangga]

Was the landing gear lowered?

Emirates plane crash-lands at Dubai airport; passengers safe (http://thenewdaily.com.au/news/world/2016/08/03/emirates-plane-crash-dubai/?utm_source=Responsys&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=20160804_TND_States)

The rank of the flight crew may well be...

[juddy]

If the plane had a issue prior to landing and the tower was notified ( not saying it was ) would the fire appliance not have been at the ready? Looking at the stills and video nothing was on standby.

[BigBlackDog]

Yeah,if the tower was informed they would have had every piece of emergency equipment staged at the runway start ready to pick up the pieces.
Strange accident, would I be right in saying not the first 777 that had landing gear 'issues'?

[JDNSW]

For what it is worth, I don't think it was landing gear issues - I think the gear was retracted because a go round was left too late or badly executed, perhaps because of wind shear. No doubt the answer will be apparent from the flight data recorders.

Conditions for landing were far from perfect - very hot and strong, gusty wind, although I don't think this is unusual there, and it was the pilots' home base, so they should have been familiar with the conditions.

There is always the possibility of technical problems, such as the engines failed to respond properly when the go round was initiated, but again, the data recorders should either rule this out or clearly show it.

John

[Hugh Jars]

However the Flap handle has to pass through a 'gate' to put it into a non-standard position for a go-round. That is single or all engines operating.



Correct, Rolly, but it's quite easy to move the flap lever through the gates and inadvertently select a different setting to what's desired.....
Word from an insider is a significant tailwind on final, late configuration and not stable (which led to the go-around) were contributing factors. No mention of fatigue yet.
Either way, the pilots will be dealt with in the usual Emirates way :(

[superquag]

"... Either way, the pilots will be dealt with in the usual Emirates way..."

- Fired ?
- Firing squad ?

or, flogged with a feather. . . ?:wasntme:

The initial reports I heard suggested a late-ish 'go-around', tail-wind increasing... add "modern Fly-By-Wire computers" interpreting pilot inputs...and things just went pear-shaped from there. :eek:
- Talk about holes in the cheese lining up. :o

B/Box report and analysis will be interesting...

[Hugh Jars]

Hahaha :) Fired, if they aren't sent to gaol first, for 'causing the death of a firey'.

I'm thinking the calling of "positive rate" when it's only 'sort of a positive' rate.

I'm glad it wasn't me. I'm sure we'll all learn something from it....

[PhilipA]

I noticed in the Weekend Australian that an ex emirates pilot on the same model 300 gave the opinion that because the plane is 70 metres long the tail could have struck the ground on the go around.

He said that there were many tail strikes on takeoff on this model until the take off procedures were modified in training.
Regards Philip A

[Hugh Jars]

It's a possibility, PhillipA but depends on the aircraft. Some 777's have tailstrike protection in the FBW, whereas others don't.

I don't think there was a gear malfunction. More like it was in transit when it touched down. Up or down? We'll soon find out....