I know they are thirsty BUT GEEZ

[FisherX]

Guy Guys,


Look I know they are a thirsty beast and wasn't expecting much but 24L per 100km is it bit much I think. My 93 RRC Vogue was no where near that, although it had a Unichip piggy back on it.


So I've got the soft dash on the road now and have run 2 tanks of fuel through it. I drive from the Northern Beach's in Cairns into the city, about 25km each way 2/3 of the trip is 80 and 100km limits so I'm not in bumper to bumper traffic.


She running rich as you can really smell it. I've had the Rover Gauge on it and it says all is good. No fault code and all sensors reading as they should. I've been scanning the forums but by what I can see there is lots of talk about rich running Rangies no one seems to have THE answer.


My Disco 2 4.0 V8 used about 16L per 100 on the same trip and I was hoping for the fuel economy to be in that region, especially as the Classic is a bit lighter than the Disco.


Any thoughts, ideas or comments are most welcome.

[Baggy]

Have you checked for fuel leaks .....24L per 100kms there's definitely something wrong.

No leaks around fuel rail....Maybe check for split in fuel tank (they are plastic) or from the main rear fuel filter located on the chassis ....any place along the fuel line that has a join.

My 92 classic would have similar fuel consumption to my old 96 Disco ....15L per 100 Klms ....

Most post on fuel consumption relates to new owners understanding that pushing a vehicle weighing over two tonnes and as aerodynamic as a brick was never going to be good ....But your is just bad :eek:

Interested to see what others have to say .... Hope you get it sorted soon.


Baggy

[drover81]

All I can offer is empathy. I've got similar figures (25l/100) on my 92 RRC, and it appears as though everything seems to be running just fine.

I don't know how to check for fuel leaks, so I guess I'm going to probably need to strap a camera on the underside to see if there's any fuel leaking out through the the fuel lines.

[donh54]

All I can offer is empathy. I've got similar figures (25l/100) on my 92 RRC, and it appears as though everything seems to be running just fine.

I don't know how to check for fuel leaks, so I guess I'm going to probably need to strap a camera on the underside to see if there's any fuel leaking out through the the fuel lines.

You could try a lighted match :wasntme:

[PLR]

All I can offer is empathy. I've got similar figures (25l/100) on my 92 RRC, and it appears as though everything seems to be running just fine.

I don't know how to check for fuel leaks, so I guess I'm going to probably need to strap a camera on the underside to see if there's any fuel leaking out through the the fuel lines.

G`day ,

checking mechanical condition should be your starting point , it is often forgotten about underestimated or overlooked don`t know the reason but often no mentioned of it on this site . Tends to be buy this or that , replace this or that .

If the compression is low the cam is worn the timing chain is stretched ETC won`t matter how the sensors , ignition , fuel ETC is the economy will be bad .

Basic tests using a Compression Gauge and Vacuum Gauge would be a pretty simple place to start .

If you not familiar with them Google how to use and how they work and also " " economy and mechanical condition "

Cheers

[Homestar]

If your temp sensor for the ECU (not the gauge) is stuffed and reading low, you won't get a fault code, just heaps more fuel being poured into the engine. Worth checking each sensor to see if it is functioning properly.

PLR's comments are also very pertinent.

[350RRC]

Guy Guys,


Look I know they are a thirsty beast and wasn't expecting much but 24L per 100km is it bit much I think. My 93 RRC Vogue was no where near that, although it had a Unichip piggy back on it..............

.

My 74 2 door gets a little less than that sort of consumption, albeit with a 350 that's done close to 700,000 and the consumption is LPG. :)

You'll figure it out with all the erudite assistance on this site.

DL

[superquag]

The Big Clue is the smell of unburnt petrol.

First impression is your cold start protocol is 'ON' - the fuel injection ECU is getting the wrong advice from temperature sensors (already mentioned by Homestar,and totally worth a look)

Changed the air filter ?

All your spark plugs hot and happy ?

Rest of your Ignition system up to scratch? Got a maximum Static Advance (around 12 degrees, not '6' )

Possible, - but less likely.... fuel pressure regulator is letting through way too much.

Now for the Techy Stuff, this is great background / educational info.
Owning a Land Rover means you need to know heaps of mechanical / electrical stuff, even if you don't personally swing the Sidchromes. The ability to make Intelligent fault-descriptions to your LR Technician will save you time & money. And frustration :wasntme:

Rover 14CUX Hot Wire Mass Flow EFI: Service and Troubleshooting (http://www.britishv8.org/articles/rover-14cux-efi.htm)

Yes, you have my Sympathies as well...

The Lady Sarah, 3.9 insatiable V8 Vogue SE Driveway Sculpture

EDIT: around 20 to 21 litres/100km, or when I last did the math, $26 to $30 per 100km Depending on co$t of fuel...

[FisherX]

Thanks Guys, All good advice.


My first thought was it was staying on cold start enrichment. The RoverGauge indicates the temp sensor is reading normal but I'll get the multimeter out and check the resistance.


I'll also get the compression and vacuum gauges out on the weekend and see what kind of condition my 270K engine is.


I'm also doing all my bushes, rear ball joint and working out why one of my A/C condenser fans isn't working.


So a few days of beers and playing with the Rangie. Can't think of a better way to spend the weekend :).


I'll get back to you all with result.

[superquag]

Plastic tank rings a bell... There is/was a current recall on the last of the plastic tanks, leaking up on top.

Take your VIN number and run it past a Land Rover Dealer, and ask...

- Mine was leaking like a sieve if I filled it up more than 1/2.. LR-Australia replaced it about 2 years ago, under recall-warranty. FREE. :p

IF yours is one of those, pay a little bit and get the breather hose etc replaced at the same time... - Dealer didn't do mine, nor did they ring me and suggest it was past it's Best Before Date. Pity, as the soft rubber breather hose leaks if I fill it FULL,. and I still get the smell of petrol.......:(:(:o:(:(


EDIT:- "...So a few days of beers and playing with the Rangie. Can't think of a better way to spend the weekend..."

- Tried learning to fly Light Sports Aircraft ? - cheaper than fixing Rovers... :p

[Pedro_The_Swift]

yea, but if you have a few beers and stuff up on a landy you dont die :p

[Homestar]

yea, but if you have a few beers and stuff up on a landy you dont die :p

I'm doing the front brakes on the 101 at the moment - if I get that wrong, there's no 5 start crash rating to save me. :D. I wouldn't even want to hit a lamp post at 20kph in it. I don't think the 101 would rate 1/2 star... :angel:

[Pedro_The_Swift]

Dont be so hard on yourself,
I'd give it at least 3 stars,,
4 with the trailer on :cool:

[harry]

In a 101, it's the height of what you hit that matters.

As for fuel consumption, what size tyres is this jigger running?
Oversize tyres will kill fuel consumption

[Baggy]

Came across a crash test on Youtube ...a Disco 1 (97 I think) against a later model Japaneese sedan.
I thought the Disco would win hands down ......but not the case ... Disco did not fair well for the driver ....

There's also one showing a sharp swerve test with a Classic resulting in a roll ... the end result was'nt pretty either ....I suppose if you had to go least you were in a vehicle of choice :D


Baggy

[350RRC]

I've got a 2000 ish Ford Courier ute that I don't feel safe in anywhere.

Just a jam tin.

I always feel safe in my 74 2 door........... 'the other car is your crumple zone' etc, but I drive with care towards others because I'm not into paperwork.

I do remember an RACV report from the early 90's about the two safest cars to be in if you have a major prang.

No. 1 was a Volvo (any year from 1980 on), very closely followed by any RRC.

Moose tests didn't apply then.

cheers, DL

[aRRon]

Thanks Guys, All good advice.


My first thought was it was staying on cold start enrichment. The RoverGauge indicates the temp sensor is reading normal but I'll get the multimeter out and check the resistance.


I'll also get the compression and vacuum gauges out on the weekend and see what kind of condition my 270K engine is.


I'm also doing all my bushes, rear ball joint and working out why one of my A/C condenser fans isn't working.


So a few days of beers and playing with the Rangie. Can't think of a better way to spend the weekend :).


I'll get back to you all with result.

Hi FisherX,
Wondering how things turned out with all your checks?

One further easy thing to check that doesn't seem to have been mentioned yet is the adjustable resistance in the MAF hotwire. With ignition OFF, withdraw multipin plug on side of MAF. Place probes of an ohmeter ($20 digital type will do) one on each of the outermost pins. Resistance from factory setting is around 280 ohms which gives a rich mixture across the range - 4% CO (apparently to help with cold starts in the UK I was once told). The resistance can be adjusted by the Allen head screw on the side of the MAF. Clockwise increases resistance and enriches mixture. Anticlockwise the opposite. In practice 80 ohms gives a good lean mixture, or go a bit more if performance suffers. I've found this settles a lot of tuning/idling issues when all the other checks are ok.

I've found on my '90 3.9 litre that over time (couple of years) the resistance tends to drift off higher again resulting in black soot in exhaust pipe, fumey exhaust smell and heavier consumption. Obviously this setting is independent of all other ECU inputs etc.

While you're at the MAF remove air cleaner and duct forward of the MAF and check out the hotwire. It can get coated with contaminants. Give it a spray with electrical circuit board cleaner to clean it up - helps ensure accurate and quick reading of temp of airflow. Do not touch it with anything solid or brush it.

Good luck.

[Pedro_The_Swift]

Talk about suspense,, 5 days,, :angel::p:D

[DoubleChevron]

Came across a crash test on Youtube ...a Disco 1 (97 I think) against a later model Japaneese sedan.
I thought the Disco would win hands down ......but not the case ... Disco did not fair well for the driver ....

There's also one showing a sharp swerve test with a Classic resulting in a roll ... the end result was'nt pretty either ....I suppose if you had to go least you were in a vehicle of choice :D


Baggy

fifth gear .... little renault people mover and disco.... the little renault cuts a path of destruction through it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mLLanPwRgio

seeya,
shane L.

[FisherX]

G'day Guys,


Sorry to keep you in suspense, but remember I did say I was have'n a few beers so I'm progressing at slow but steady pace :)


I've nearly got all the bushes done, just the front radius arms to go. I've fitted the new alloy upper tailgate, seal and latches. Had to space out the upper hinges to get it to shut, what a PITA. Now I'm waiting on my new set of Bilsteins to arrive before I take her back out on the road.


Ron I sound like you're on to something. I havn't read that before so thank you very much I'll give it a check tonight. I'll do the vacuum gauge checks tonight as well.


So the compression test came up pretty well. I was expecting much worse. So the left bank cylinders are pretty evenly spread between 140 and 150, and the right bank between 145 and 155 dry. All cylinders came up an even 10psi wet. The plugs are new Champions and were mostly covered in black soot with the exception of about 1/4 of each plug white.


Anyway so a long weekend a coming. I've got to break in a new BBQ/smoker tomorrow, drink some beers soaking in the spa and enjoy Australia Day :) (and play with the Rangie)


Hope everyone has a delightful, safe and fun Australia Day.

[DoubleChevron]

G'day Guys,


Sorry to keep you in suspense, but remember I did say I was have'n a few beers so I'm progressing at slow but steady pace :)


I've nearly got all the bushes done, just the front radius arms to go. I've fitted the new alloy upper tailgate, seal and latches. Had to space out the upper hinges to get it to shut, what a PITA. Now I'm waiting on my new set of Bilsteins to arrive before I take her back out on the road.


Ron I sound like you're on to something. I havn't read that before so thank you very much I'll give it a check tonight. I'll do the vacuum gauge checks tonight as well.


So the compression test came up pretty well. I was expecting much worse. So the left bank cylinders are pretty evenly spread between 140 and 150, and the right bank between 145 and 155 dry. All cylinders came up an even 10psi wet. The plugs are new Champions and were mostly covered in black soot with the exception of about 1/4 of each plug white.


Anyway so a long weekend a coming. I've got to break in a new BBQ/smoker tomorrow, drink some beers soaking in the spa and enjoy Australia Day :) (and play with the Rangie)


Hope everyone has a delightful, safe and fun Australia Day.

If you want to know why it takes so long to throw a bush kit in ..... count them. I chucked a new bush kit in my rangie last week.... It took me 3 days ( working a few hours a day ) to do them. I counted forty old bushes on the floor when I was done.

The front radius bushes were the hardest as all the others I managed to find a socket close enough to use as a press tool. I ended up destroying my top ball joint socket to use as a press tool.

Peugeot/Citroen Lower Ball joint Socket J7215 T&E Tools (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Peugeot-Citroen-Lower-Ball-joint-Socket-J7215-T-E-Tools-/262370504837?hash=item3d16803085:g:6Z8AAOSwo4pYhMD B)

one of these sockets was the perfect (to the micro-meter) size to change those bushes. I just ground the prongs off it :( ... Lets hope I never have to change a poogoe ball joint again.

I wasn't expecting any difference in the way the car drives as none of the bushes in mine were collapsed when I removed them.... But I'll be damned if it doesn't steer and track noticeably better. It's also lost the slight shimmy that can sometimes appear as you accelerate past 85km/h (usually when going down hill and around a corner at the same time).

If your still suffering from having a borg warner transfer in there .... I swapped that out last week to.... The L230 has a little gear whine ... but it's fixed 95% of the drivetrain lash. It's way nicer to drive now (and I now won't be bogged with one wheel spinning).

seeya,
Shane L.

[350RRC]

G'day Guys,.................

Anyway so a long weekend a coming. I've got to break in a new BBQ/smoker tomorrow, drink some beers soaking in the spa and enjoy Australia Day :) (and play with the Rangie)...................

And get hold of some NGK or Bosch plugs on Friday and put them in.

Enjoy Aus day!

DL

[FisherX]

Ok I can't find my vacuum gauge. But checked the MAF resistance and it was 1116 ohms. Could that have been the problem? Probably. Anyway adjusted it down to 80. When my new shocks come on Monday I'll take it out for a spin and see how it goes. Thanks guys I'll come back with results.

[Grumbles]

Look I know they are a thirsty beast and wasn't expecting much but 24L per 100km is it bit much I think. My 93 RRC Vogue was no where near that, although it had a Unichip piggy back on it.

Any thoughts, ideas or comments are most welcome.

Over Christmas I spent a bit of time in my soft dash LSE just quietly burbling along some forest tracks in N/E Vic. I had two passengers of which one was a frailish but adventurous 98 year old so everything was done at a very sedate and gentle pace. It was very hot as well so the A/C remained on the whole time.

Fuel consumption worked out to be 14 L per 100 km [20 mpg]. I was expecting heavier consumption but not so. Incidentally the temp gauge never moved from its customary "16 minute to" mark either.

[Pedro_The_Swift]

Thanks guys I'll come back with results.

Is there anything more Aussie than having a beer in the spa? :)

and yes,, how did the new smoker perform?

JC would love pics,,, ;):D