86", front axle too far forward??

[cjc_td5]

On my 86", the front axle appears to sit too far forward in relation to the wheel arch panel? The springs appear to be correct and the shackle is sitting at an OK angle?? The spring is also centred on the spring leaf. The wheelbase is about 87" which corresponds to the error in the wheel arch. Also, when out doing a 4wd competition last year, I managed to separate the front prop shaft at the spline. The axle appeared to be able to move forward enough for the shaft spline to drop out. Was an easy fix by undoing one end and sliding the spline back in, but not something I want to repeat too often.

Interesting, my series III Stage 1 also has its front axle sitting forward in relation to the wheel arch panel.

I am sure I have noticed other rovers that the front axle is centred in the wheel arch panel. Any ideas what is going on here?

[JDNSW]

Only thing I can think of is if the springs have excessive camber, this would be the effect, as would the fitting of military shackles without the extended dumb irons.

John

[123rover50]

As John says. Spring camber.
I reset my springs a bit over much and the shackle plate is pointing slightly forward. My wheel in the mudguard gap looks just like yours. Your shackle plate is near verticle.
Look at chassis drawings and the plate is pointing well to the rear and springs are near flat.
I am not too worried about mine as its had no use yet so will sag a bit.
You could take a leaf out if you are concerned.

Keith

[Phil B]

Measure from the centre bolt hole to the front and back hanger holes, they may not be the same
The dimensions on the springs on my S3 were different when I redid mine

[cjc_td5]

Measure from the centre bolt hole to the front and back hanger holes, they may not be the same
The dimensions on the springs on my S3 were different when I redid mine

The centre bolt hole is centred on the spring leaf on both the 86" and S111, that is one of the first things I checked.

Thanks
C

[cjc_td5]

Righto, Chris the butcher time here...
What about the possibility of drilling a new centre bolt hole in the top 2 leaves to move the axle position rearwards? The rest of the leaves will slide in the pack to line up with the new hole location. Do you think this would badly weaken the upper leaves with 2 holes?

C

[Homestar]

Only one way to find out... [wink11]

It's definately the sort of thing I would do... [bigwhistle]

[JDNSW]

1. Spring leaves are fairly hard, so drilling a hole may not be that easy.

2. Since the second leaf wraps round, you need to do it too

3. No way would I weaken a spring like that, although if the U-bolts are kept tight and the extra hole is still well within the pad on the axle, you'd probably get away with it.

[gromit]

Just had a quick look and I have 4 Land Rovers with the axle sitting forward in the front wing/fender/mudguard (delete to suit).

SIII bitza so who knows what came from where. Just fitted LWB front springs and I think those I removed were LWB.
SIIa Dormobile. Springs replaced with aftermarket by a previous owner.
SIIa GS. It's a 'cutwing' but seems to sit forward.
SIII FFR. Sits forward and seems all original.


Colin

[cjc_td5]

Mmmmm, thanks Gromit and all the others who have contributed.
I suppose at the end of the day I am not so much concerned about the wheel sitting forward in the wheelarch but mainly the incident I had last year when the front prop shaft pulled out of its spline when scrabbling up a rocky hill. I suppose there was enough axle twist in the springs to extend the prop shaft until the spline fell out. I suppose I should find out if a 88" (or later) front shaft is any longer as that may be an option???

C

[gromit]

Just found a side-on picture of my 86" (from the 60th at Cooma).

Wheel is to the front of the wing.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2017/05/77.jpg (http://s1245.photobucket.com/user/cradley/media/Series%201%20with%20Welder/DSCF3642.jpg.html)


Colin

[cjc_td5]

Righto, can anyone confirm that the front prop shaft is longer on a 88" vs a 86"? I.e. when the chassis was extended 2", did the engine and transmission unit stay with the front axle or did it move back (and therefore need a longer front prop shaft)?
I have been given a front prop shaft supposedly off a 88" but it is the same extended length as the front prop shaft on my 86". Can anyone point me to some specs that may give what the extended lengths for the shafts should be?

Thanks
Chris

[JDNSW]

All the dimension changes from the 86 to 88 were forward of the firewall, and the whole idea was to allow a longer engine, so I assume the gearbox stayed put. This should make the front prop shaft longer.

[cjc_td5]

Next stupid question...
When a prop shaft is mentioned as being 21.813" (554mm) in length, what is this referring to (mid spline, compressed, extended length)?? Is this the length flange-to-flange on the vehicle?

Thanks
Chris

[JDNSW]

Your guess is as good as mine, but I would think it meant flange to flange on the vehicle.

[cjc_td5]

Both of my shafts are abt 530-590mm min-max lengths so I guess they are both 86" shafts...

[B.S.F.]

A neutral shaft length of about 554mm will fit S1 86 and 107" front and 86 and 88" rear..W.

[cjc_td5]

My 86" is 575mm flange to flange front transfer output to the pinion flange. This explains why my front shaft separated as there was only 15mm of spline engagement before any droop.

Very tempted to make up a 25mm spacer to space between the drive and shaft flanges at the transfer end...

[whitehillbilly64]

Just a thought,
Could the rear spring brackets be over centre, so working forward instead of rear ward ????

whitehillbilly