Series 2a - My First Restoration

[JimM]

I've recently gone out and purchased a Series 2a LWB for couple of hundred dollars. After helping a family friend work on his, I got addicted and thought that I should get one for myself! Only trouble is I'm not mechanically minded at all, so it's been a bit of adventure.. but learning as I go. Hopefully you enjoy this a much as I am. No name as of yet, but here it is. As you can see a bit of rust in the usual places, but I guess that's all a part of the fun.

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[JDNSW]

Looks like you will have your work cut out, but the bodywork, except for the bulkhead, looks fairly good.

[JohnboyLandy]

Hi Jim, it looks like a good buy, it must be a very late 2A, say 1970/71. Is that a six cylinder engine ? You've got a brake booster, which is nice to have.

What I don't understand is what happened to your windscreen wipers, as a late 2a would be a single wiper motor in the dash on left side.

I'd say first step is remove body from chassis and get the chassis rust repaired properly, then the firewall.

Cheers,
John

[JDNSW]

Complete wiper system is missing. It is a six, and I suspect all sixes, at least those sold in Australia, were fitted with a booster.

John

[JimM]

Thanks guys. Yeah it will be a bit of work!

JDNSW is correct, 2.6L 6cyl. The complete wiper system has been taken out. hopefully can find a replacement along the way.

Maybe I can find someone on here who is wrecking or has a spare and can buy it off them?

[JimM]

I originally purchased the 2a to tinker and to drive it around the farm, but after a week of so of driving it I wanted to be able to get it on the road. One of the cylinders seemed to be skipping so after scraping the contact point and removing the built up corrosion in the distributor cap, it seemed to work perfectly. Mechanically it's pretty good, drives well, engine purrs along and the brakes work well. The only other thing needing adjusting was the handbrake. With a bit of rust in the usual places, I figured the next step was to take it apart to start assessing the chassis in it's full glory. So off with its head. Handy having the tractor around. After degreasing and washing the engine bay, I didn't think it looked too bad. I don't mind it with the top 'down'.

I also removed the oil air filter to clean and polish up. I managed to get a coat of primer on it as well, looks like it came out ok.

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[mick88]

The motor came up nice and clean.
What is the purpose of the piece of rhs on the rear left?

Cheers, Mick.

[JimM]

The motor came up nice and clean.
What is the purpose of the piece of rhs on the rear left?

Cheers, Mick.

Hi Mick,

It's what's left of the rear tyre swing. I don't have the swing arm for it so its pretty much useless at the moment. I'm pretty keen to use the bonnet to store my extra tyre as I love that look. Im concerned though as this is not a deluxe bonnet (with no tyre recess) that it might take up a fair bit of vision when driving?
I actually don't have the bonnet mounts for it either... so thats another item for purchase.. adds up quick!

[JDNSW]

The motor came up nice and clean.
What is the purpose of the piece of rhs on the rear left?

Cheers, Mick.

Support for a spare wheel carrier I would guess.

[JimM]

Hi Mick,
Sorry, I thought I replied last night. JDNSW is right it's the mount for the spare wheel carrier.
I don't have the swing arm though so it's pretty much useless. I want to use the bonnet spare wheel carrier anyway. I have concerns though, mounting a wheel on the bonnet (given that it doesn't have the wheel recess), does that reduce visibility at all when driving? I imagine a standard size wheel would be OK but any wider, could start causing problems?

Jim.

[mick88]

Thanks.
As for the spare on the bonnet, it does inhibit you view of the front left corner of the vehicle a bit, but no big deal, especially if only a stock wheel.
However it makes the bonnet a lot heavier to lift up, but still manageable.
Even just having the garden tools on a Perentie bonnet makes a big difference to the bonnet weight.

Cheers, Mick.

[JDNSW]

Tyres up to 7.50 are not bad, only an issue if you are short or driving over steep crests. I would not go over that size though.

Weight is reasonable, but easier to lift if you don't have a bullbar or winch.

John

[ezyrama]

As Mick and John said, the bonnets not too bad to lift with the wheel on Jim, it's a lot easier to get off than crawling into the back and rolling it out. Great looking truck you have there, There is one similar to yours at Cleveland near a mate's place in Brisvegas with a 3.5ltr V8 in it with no roof, sounds gorgeous when he takes off. Will watch this one with a lot of interest.
Cheers Ian

[JimM]

Thanks Mick, John and Ian.
I love the look of the wheel on the bonnet, so I will go down that path. Shouldn't be too much of an issue. I've go the mount, just need to get some fixings for the wheel. I imagine the mount is BSF threaded?

Having a nice V8 in it would make it move! Very jealous. I'll be sticking to the original 2.6L probably due to both capability and price...Maybe for my next one!

Jim

[JDNSW]

The thread is BSF, 1/2" from memory, with a head to match the wheel nuts (two different sizes). The clamps come in two different types, one for 6.00 tyres and one for 7.50s.

While some have fitted V8s to this gearbox, the box will not stand it unless a light foot is used.

[JimM]

Next step was to remove the wiring loom.. not the neatest behind the gauges. Such an interesting task. I went through and labelled all the ends and documented it well, so hopefully when it comes to putting it back in its rather straight forward (is there a better way to do this?). My original intention was to reuse it, but with a few lights not working and with the end goal of putting it back on the road, I thought a new wiring harness would be a better option. Gathering from previous advice on the forum these two are the places to check out?

Autosparks - Home of the world leading supplier of classic car wiring looms (http://www.autosparks.co.uk/) and Vintage Wiring Harness - High Quality Replacement Automotive Wiring Harnesses (http://www.vinwire.com.au/) both seem to come around that $500.00 mark. Not cheap, but probably worth it.

I removed the seat box, rear tub and petrol tank. Transmission case looks alright.. but the fuel pump looks a bit crusty. Still seemed to work well though.

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This was on the front right outrigger where the petrol tank was mounted.. It seems that a non structural bit of RHS has been used to help mount the petrol tank.. has anyone seen this before? It's on both front outriggers, seems unnecessary.

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[chazza]

There should not usually be a need to replace a wiring harness with a new one, if the original had PVC insulation.

All the correct wire colours can be bought from Autosparks and the original bullet-connectors, can be unsoldered from old wires and re-used if repairs are needed. Wires near hot engine components can often have hardened insulation and should be replaced.

If you want bright headlights, increase the cable-gauge and use two relays; Autosparks have a useful gauge descriptor on their site,

Cheers Charlie

[JimM]

Thanks Chazza,

I can't say that i'm very familiar with auto electrics so thats why I thought buying a 'plug and play' harness would be the way to go.
I was hoping to get brighter head lights. Looks like I'll have to look into it further. I didn't take notes of what was and what wasn't working either... I'll probably have to wait until I'm installing the wiring again to figure out exactly what I need. Hopefully that wont be too much an issue.

[Johnno1969]

Tyres up to 7.50 are not bad, only an issue if you are short or driving over steep crests. I would not go over that size though.

Weight is reasonable, but easier to lift if you don't have a bullbar or winch.

John

I've developed a bonnet-lifting technique where I jump up onto the bullbar, grab the bonnet and tyre and go "Heeeeeeeuuuuuup!!!!". Keep the back straight and it works a treat.

[AJF]

Jim

Did you buy the wiring harness? If so, who from? Also did you put in an alternator and convert to positive earth? Is this the done thing?

Regards
Angus

[1950landy]

Jim

Did you buy the wiring harness? If so, who from? Also did you put in an alternator and convert to positive earth? Is this the done thing?

Regards
Angus
With an alternator you would have neg to earth. Only with generator you can have either.[bighmmm]

[Homestar]

Looks like a good project but that rust will keep you busy for a while.

Sounds like the engine runs ok - I'd adjust the exhaust valve clearances if you haven't already. They're behind the cover under the exhaust manifold. They can be done with the manifold in position but it's a lot easier to remove it. They get out of tune quite quickly and lack of maintenance in this area will lead to burnt exhaust valves quite quickly which was one of their biggest failings.

There are ways of coaxing a few more HP from this engine if you have some dollars to spare (it gets expensive quickly). They are great when running well, but not as robust as the 4 cylinder and needs more attention and maintenance. I like them myself, but a lot will say how bad they are - those are mostly people that have never owned them. Lovely smooth engines when running properly. Be aware parts are becoming hard to find for them and I would clasify them as an enthusiasts engine, but please don't let that put you off. :). There's not that many out there now so it's a nice point of difference to all the Holden 6 powered versions kicking around.

[mick88]

I agree with Gav,
the six is a very sweet running motor and well worth preserving if it's possible.
They sound brilliant running, like a symphony of moving mechanical parts.

Cheers, Mick.

[JimM]

Hi Angus - I haven't purchased a harness just yet, still figuring out if I need one at all.

Homestar, you're right. The rust is keeping me busy. If this car has one thing other than character, it's rust.
The engine is running well. I would have no idea on how to adjust the exhaust valve clearances! looks like I have my research cut out for me. I read that you should do this whilst the engine is warm? I don't think it'll be warm for quite some time now....

Mick - Hopefully I can get it sounding similar to that! I love the sound of the 6 Cyl. My friend has one (ex mil), sounds fantastic driving it around (the rust in his muffler might add to it!).

The next step was to remove the steering and take the bulk head off the chassis. After taking the centre cap off the steering wheel and loosening the nut, I gave the back of the steering wheel a couple of taps with a rubber mallet to loosen it off the spline.
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After that I tried to take the drop arm off the steering box. I used a gearing puller, which made the job a dream after a couple of light taps with a rubber mallet. Once that happened I could withdraw the steering column through the bulkhead.

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I went through and the disconnected the throttle linkage, clutch, brake lines (pedals as well), fuel line and anything else connecting the bulk head to the car / engine. This is what I found after dismantling the clutch assembly... crusty. I might replace it first up, then try to refurbish it one day.

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Once that was done, the next step was to remove the bulk head. I've tried to loosen the two bolts at the base for quite some time, and have soaked them with WD40 any time I could. They were frozen the first few times I tried but after a week or two of soaking every now and then, I managed to get them to turn. I used the tractor again to take the weight of the bulkhead whilst I removed the two bolts. The outriggers, which they went through definitely need replacing. They held a good litre or so of QLD sand in them. The bulk head looks like its seen better days.

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Silly question.... Is the discolouration of the bulk head due to the heat burning the bulk head paint? Or is it something else?

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And there it is at the end of the day (back out side again... but at least it's on a concrete pad and not in a muddy paddock).

Jim.

[JimM]

I managed to take the engine out and mount it. I plan to strip it back, put in new gaskets and paint. Looks like it has seen better days. But we will see how I go. It looks like someone has painted it blue, it wouldn't have come out from the factory with this colour would it?
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I then removed the springs, axels and chassis bushes. This was a frustrating job. I used the forums here to find the best way forward. I found drilling out the rubber then cutting into the outer metal sleeve carefully with a hack saw was the most effective way (although slow). Chassis is looking a little tired. Getting this sandblasted, primed and painted. I will get the axles done at the same time. Hopefully comes up a treat.
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The leaf springs have had it (it was pretty obvious from just looking at them though). They are pinched badly and whilst removing them a couple of the bottoms leafs broke off! I'm going to go down the parabolic path, so I'm not too worried about that. I think I'll couple it with SuperPro poly bushes, hoping to get a better ride out of it. I know there are differing opinions on parabolics so I will find out soon enough.

Inside the gearbox and behind the flywheel it's rather dirty. Is there meant to be a gasket between the fly wheel housing and the gear box? I think there is grime getting in through there or is the grime getting in some other way? When I removed them it was just bare metal mating surfaces - would adding a liquid gasket stop this from happening? I also made sure I made a mark on both the housing and wheel, so I can align them up when I put it back in.
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I then took the gear box out, rather simple. I will have to replace the mounts though. This entire process was fairly straight forward, I had to grind these off though (probably a good thing they don't come off easy!) Nyloc nuts would be an appropriate replacement?
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[bemm52]

Wow your powering ahead I'm still trying to remove wiring in a logical way ...........my bulkhead is at least as bad as yours or worse will be watching how you deal with it


Will be following this thread with much interest..........would love to stop the honey does and spend more time on the 2a but it a balancing act [bigwhistle]

Cheers Paul

[Homestar]

Homestar, you're right. The rust is keeping me busy. If this car has one thing other than character, it's rust.
The engine is running well. I would have no idea on how to adjust the exhaust valve clearances! looks like I have my research cut out for me. I read that you should do this whilst the engine is warm? I don't think it'll be warm for quite some time now....


Maybe when you're closer to getting it running again, I can pop over and give you a lesson on valve clearance adjustment - it's not hard once you know how and it'so something you'll need to know how to do. :)

[mick88]

The manual I have here specifies Tappet clearance for the 2.6 engine as:
inlet. 006" hot
exhaust .010" hot or cold

However for the four cylinder both inlet and exhaust are .010" hot or cold.

Cheers, Mick.

[gromit]

Inside the gearbox and behind the flywheel it's rather dirty. Is there meant to be a gasket between the fly wheel housing and the gear box? I think there is grime getting in through there or is the grime getting in some other way? When I removed them it was just bare metal mating surfaces - would adding a liquid gasket stop this from happening? I also made sure I made a mark on both the housing and wheel, so I can align them up when I put it back in.
Many years of clutch dust, oil leakage from the rear main seal and maybe dirt from river crossings. No gasket fitted, usually no sealant either as there should be nothing inside to leak out. Adding sealant may make it harder to separate the engine & gearbox in the car in the future.

Nyloc nuts would be an appropriate replacement?
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The nuts fitted are an early locking type (before Nylocs). Similar principal to a Nyloc, there would have been a fibre washer in the folded over end which was smaller than the thread so created friction to stop it coming undone. When you remove the nut the fibre will crumble away to dust or may already be missing.....



Some parts for the 6-cylinder are getting scarce (read expensive). I needed piston rings and was quoted some crazy prices FFR Refurb (https://www.aulro.com/afvb/leaf-sprung-military-land-rovers/118730-ffr-refurb.html)

The motor in my FFR has been painted blue. Probably a particular engine re-builder painted them blue after they were reconditioned.

The exhaust tappets can be adjusted in situ but you have to remove the dipstick assembly or some people remove the exhaust manifold. Have done them in situ and you have to get on top of the motor & hang upside down virtually.

6-cylinder water pumps can be expensive (if you can source one) but I understand that the bearing/shaft assembly from the 4-cylinder pump can be modified to fit.


Best of luck with the rebuild.


Colin

[Homestar]

The manual I have here specifies Tappet clearance for the 2.6 engine as:
inlet. 006" hot
exhaust .010" hot or cold

However for the four cylinder both inlet and exhaust are .010" hot or cold.

Cheers, Mick.

Yep, but if you're not going to do them every 10,000km a bit looser is better - around 12, but it starts to get a bit rattly going much more, but will make the valves live longer.

[Homestar]

Some parts for the 6-cylinder are getting scarce (read expensive). I needed piston rings and was quoted some crazy prices FFR Refurb (https://www.aulro.com/afvb/leaf-sprung-military-land-rovers/118730-ffr-refurb.html)

The motor in my FFR has been painted blue. Probably a particular engine re-builder painted them blue after they were reconditioned.

The exhaust tappets can be adjusted in situ but you have to remove the dipstick assembly or some people remove the exhaust manifold. Have done them in situ and you have to get on top of the motor & hang upside down virtually.

6-cylinder water pumps can be expensive (if you can source one) but I understand that the bearing/shaft assembly from the 4-cylinder pump can be modified to fit.


Best of luck with the rebuild.


Colin

If it's only rings you need, I recall finding some from something else that would fit but for the life of me I can't remember what. I ended up getting a set of OS pistons and rings for mine.

I'll see if I can find where I wrote it down.

[gromit]

If it's only rings you need, I recall finding some from something else that would fit but for the life of me I can't remember what. I ended up getting a set of OS pistons and rings for mine.

I'll see if I can find where I wrote it down.

I found some that would fit but the piston ring grooves needed widening. Then got a set from Canada via ebay for about $99 landed.


Colin

[mick88]

If it's only rings you need, I recall finding some from something else that would fit but for the life of me I can't remember what. I ended up getting a set of OS pistons and rings for mine.

I'll see if I can find where I wrote it down.


Standard bore size is 3.062" (3 1/16th"), common with a few other makes of engines, so you may find a set of rings that will do the job.
Holden grey motor, so possibly some Chev engines too.

Cheers, Mick.

[Homestar]

I found some that would fit but the piston ring grooves needed widening. Then got a set from Canada via ebay for about $99 landed.


Colin

You've got a lathe.... [bigwhistle]

[JimM]

Thanks Homestar, I might have to take you up on that one! Always keen to learn a new skill.

Gromit - Champ thanks for the advice mate. What FFR mean? I thought my water pump was OK, does it not look right?

Paul - I'm a week or so behind in posting of where I am (I decided to start posting late). So It looks like i'm steaming ahead, but in reality it's a little different.
In regards to removing the harness, I used a simple letter and number system. Mark each end with a letter and number eg A1 to A1, A2 to A2 and took photos of which end connected where. There is probably a better system out there though. With the bulk head, I plan to get it blasted. I've ordered some foot wells from the UK and hope to get them welded on. hopefully once they are replaced, it'll look much more respectable.

I've started to strip the engine now and mask up for priming.
Under the breather, I found these two holes, looks like they are slowly rusting out. Is this a problem? How would you stop it?
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I've gone and masked up all the welsh plugs, gasket areas and holes in the engine. I found aluminium foil to be fantastic to cover the head and rocker cover.
I applied paint stripper to remove the paint. There was a bit of rust on the block, so I took to that with a wire wheel. Seems to work well.
I made sure I did that a couple of times, removing all surface rust. I then applied degreaser, to clean it. following with a couple of washes with metho. I wipe the block down with a white rag and once It didn't come up dirty I decided to paint.
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I applied a primer (I think the jury is out on this one. Plenty of people saying not to bother with the paint I am using).

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After a couple of light coats with the primer I then started with the final colour. It's technically called 'Alpine Diesel Green' - closest I could find to the duck egg blue - this forum came in handy for that one! It came out nice though! photos, play tricks on the colour and doesn't represent it accurately.

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Does anyone know how to remove the stains from the head and rocker cover?
I've used the plastic steel 'wire' wheel to try and remove but I don't want to go too aggressive first. I've tried an Aluminum polish but that doesn't really work. I think the next step might be hydrocloric acid.
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[TimNZ]

Hi Jim, for cleaning alloy parts, and parts I don't want to get too aggressive with, I use one of these with baking soda:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2017/04/766.jpg

Cheers,

[gromit]

Gromit - Champ thanks for the advice mate. What FFR mean? I thought my water pump was OK, does it not look right?



FFR is Fitted For Radio (mine is ex military). No idea if anything is wrong with your water pump....just giving you the 'heads up' that some parts are difficult/expensive to replace.


Colin

[JimM]

FFR is Fitted For Radio (mine is ex military). No idea if anything is wrong with your water pump....just giving you the 'heads up' that some parts are difficult/expensive to replace.


Colin

Cheers, Thanks Colin! I've noticed that the parts are usually hard to come by, so doesn't surprise me that they are expensive! Hopefully I only need to replace common stuff when rebuilding.

TimNZ - Thanks mate, i'll try to find one of those! looks like it'll do the job well.

[Homestar]

Those holes behind the breather are supposed to be there - they lead straight into the crankcase - they look like that as they never cleaned them up after casting - nothing to worry about, they look the same on all the engines I've got and have oil running over them so they won't rust. :)

Cleaning the alloy - Maybe Tim NZ's Idea is a good one if you're not pulling the engine apart. I've taken some bits into a water blaster in Dandenong but they need to be completely stripped so the abrasive can be washed out properly afterwards. They come up all shiny and better than new but it's not a budget excersize either that way.

If the water pump is spinning freely and holding water, then nothing to worry about yet. If you need to ever replace it they are very hard to come by but old ones that aren't just a lump of rust can be rebuilt with new seals - a lathe is required but once it's done, you can then use off the shelf seals for the rest of its life. :)

[JimM]

Those holes behind the breather are supposed to be there - they lead straight into the crankcase - they look like that as they never cleaned them up after casting - nothing to worry about, they look the same on all the engines I've got and have oil running over them so they won't rust. :)

Cleaning the alloy - Maybe Tim NZ's Idea is a good one if you're not pulling the engine apart. I've taken some bits into a water blaster in Dandenong but they need to be completely stripped so the abrasive can be washed out properly afterwards. They come up all shiny and better than new but it's not a budget excersize either that way.

If the water pump is spinning freely and holding water, then nothing to worry about yet. If you need to ever replace it they are very hard to come by but old ones that aren't just a lump of rust can be rebuilt with new seals - a lathe is required but once it's done, you can then use off the shelf seals for the rest of its life. :)

Thanks mate. I thought those holes looked strange, but that explains a lot. Pump was spinning freely and holding water prior to puling the engine out. I'm more than happy to take the rocker cover off, need to replace the gasket, but don't really want to take the head off. I have a feeling that a few of the gaskets on this engine have been replaced, there is gasket cement clearly visible - as gromit said the blue paint hints to an engine re builder. I will try to blast the cover and head this weekend. I'll let you know how I go.

[JimM]

Its been a productive week or so on this build as I now have a rolling chassis!
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I picked up the chassis, axels and freshly painted wheels from the sandblaster prior to the long weekend. They came out absolutely fantastic. I was really happy with the quality of work and finish.
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The long weekend was great to get a solid couple of days to work on it. I've been able to install superpro bushes and parabolic springs along with the axles, so hopefully the ride is greatly improved. I've found that since installing the parabolics, the chassis is sitting about 2 inches higher than an ex military S3 my friend has. It'll be interesting to see how it settles after dropping in the engine, gearbox, bulkhead and the panels. Ive heard overall I'll get an inch or so extra from standard height.

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Next time I should put the rod inside the springs. I have to replace that tie rod end so had to disassemble that section anyway. Looks quite nice with new u-bolts, nuts, shackles and fresh paint. I took all the brakes apart and to my surprise there was a huge amount of meat left on the pads. no real noticeable difference in thickness to the brand new pads I have to replace them. No cylinders were leaking either. Looks like I'll be keeping the overhaul kit for later down the track (I had new pads, cylinders and springs to replace everything with). I gave the brakes a clean and put the drums back on. The challenge for me will be doing the brake lines by myself.


Whilst building up the chassis, I was able to make some progress on the engine as well. I managed to strip and paint the engine breather, side cover, breather cap, external oil assembly and a few more bits and pieces. For these pieces I used a combination of paint stripper and wire wheeling to get clean.
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I've also found molasses to work fantastic for some other rusted parts. Letting the items sit in a tub (ratio of 9:1 water to molasses), coming out great after a few weeks. I've been soaking the exhaust manifold and it has come up fantastic. I've gone a bit off from the traditional restoration, painting it a matt black. The molasses ate all the rust, showing nice crisp detailing of the numbers on the manifold. Even though the molasses ate the rust, the manifold wasn't very pretty. I didn't want to paint it silver, so I thought black would be a good option. Before molasses and after painting below.
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I'm glad I replaced the gaskets on the engine too. Have a look at one of the gaps on the rocker cover. There were 3 in total. What kind of effect would this have on engine performance?

Would applying a high-temp copper sealant (permatex) to the rocker cover side of the cork gasket hurt? I'm thinking that it might help prevent it slipping and creating these gaps in the future?

Also what is the appropriate torque settings for the bolts on the rocker cover and side cover?
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And this is how the engine currently stands. Colour is a bit off in the photo below. I'll try and find an accurate representation one day. looks too blue.

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Slowly getting there.

[67hardtop]

Im really liking this build.

Cheers Rod

[Pickles2]

Just read this thread in full.
UNREAL amount of work in around a month,....well done.
Pickles.

[Johnno1969]

Im really liking this build. Cheers Rod

Ditto.

John

[JimM]

Just read this thread in full.
UNREAL amount of work in around a month,....well done.
Pickles.

Thanks Pickles. It may look like month, but I only started the thread once I stripped the vehicle so the month of this thread isn't an entirely accurate representation. I only decided to start writing just before the 'rebuild part' as I thought some people might find it interesting and it's a good way to document my progress. Hopefully it helps a few people along the way too.

Rod and John, thanks for the kind comments. I'm glad some other people are enjoying it too! It's been such a great experience so far.

I've come across a metal polish that works really well for the welsh plugs. Mine were previously looking rather dirty and dull, however weren't rotted out.
I used a clean rag and polished them by hand. The below picture shows the welsh plugs from left to right, before, during and after. Really makes it shine.

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[AJF]

Jim
Great work.
Quick question, did you rebuild the axel housings and wheel assemblies? Mine look ok other than long term oil leaks. I am thinking of stripping them down and hopefully just replacing the gaskets and seals.
Cheers
Angus

[JimM]

Jim
Great work.
Quick question, did you rebuild the axel housings and wheel assemblies? Mine look ok other than long term oil leaks. I am thinking of stripping them down and hopefully just replacing the gaskets and seals.
Cheers
Angus


Thanks Angus. I haven't yet.
I have swivel hub seals ready to replace but thats really about it. I discovered that I might have a leak in in the rear diff housing. Not too sure though, just monitoring it at the moment. It could just be from my messy replacement of diff fluid! I could have spilled some when replacing. Either that or is the Diff Final Drive Pinion Seal leaking (?). I'll find out when I see it again this weekend, hopefully there is no oil on the ground.
If there is, I will probably do the same as you and rebuild them, whilst replacing the seals and gaskets.

[mick88]

Looking good!
Nice to see a six cylinder exhaust manifold that is not cracked.
Keep up the good work and the posts.


Cheers, Mick.

[JimM]

Looking good!
Nice to see a six cylinder exhaust manifold that is not cracked.
Keep up the good work and the posts.


Cheers, Mick.


Thanks Mick!

I'm now looking into getting my brakes done and weighing up if it's worthwhile to do myself or pay someone to do it for me. I've never done anything like break lines before, so I will need to go out and buy the equipment and tools etc, plus it's a job I'd probably want done properly.

What could I expect to pay for new brake lines throughout/ Whats a reasonable price? I'd also have to get extended (2"?) flexible brake lines to allow for the parabolic suspension correct? I had a quick look on this forum, but couldn't find an indicative price.

Thanks,

Jim

[Homestar]

2" Flexible brake lines are around $100 a set from OS or your local brake place can do them for about $150 set. The solid lines are a different story - the lines aren't expensive but you'll need a good double flaring tool and know how to use it. If you're unsure of this part, it may be better to have them done for you. Not sure what the job would cost all up though.

[1950landy]

Also if you bring a brake pipe kit in from O/S you need to make sure they don't supply copper pipes . You are best to have them made here.

[JimM]

2" Flexible brake lines are around $100 a set from OS or your local brake place can do them for about $150 set. The solid lines are a different story - the lines aren't expensive but you'll need a good double flaring tool and know how to use it. If you're unsure of this part, it may be better to have them done for you. Not sure what the job would cost all up though.

Thanks Homestar,


Yeah I saw those on paddocks.
The braided 2" extended lines are approx. $100. I read these are ADR compliant too. Would they be overkill for the old girl?

Yeah that's what I was thinking. I wouldn't mind the brakes actually working. Might leave this one for the experts!

[JimM]

Also if you bring a brake pipe kit in from O/S you need to make sure they don't supply copper pipes . You are best to have them made here.

Thanks Landy,

I’ve read that the copper lines are not legal? I’ll probably get the flexible lines from OS, but get the solid lines made here.
That way I know they are all good.

Cheers.

Jim

[LRT]

Thanks Landy,

I’ve read that the copper lines are not legal? I’ll probably get the flexible lines from OS, but get the solid lines made here.
That way I know they are all good.

Cheers.

Jim

Some info on copper brake lines:

Australian Moke Forum Copper brakes lines used in Australia (https://www.mokeforum.com.au/index.php'topic=8315.0)

[Homestar]

The steel Bundy tube is easy to work with and cheap so no real reason not to use it. It will rust out in 30 to 40 years of daily use but I think most people can live with that. :)

[LRT]

The steel tube we had made up for our Dodge AT4 truck only lasted 5 years. [bigsad]

However, it may have been on the cheap side of cheap, and combined with our coastal weather doesn't help.

[Homestar]

Geez, that's pretty bad, it sounds like it had no coating on it at all - decent stuff should last as long as the factory stuff does.

[JimM]

I hope mine would last longer than that!

I've been quoted $600-800 for brake lines. That's a lot more expensive than I thought it would be.

[gromit]

I hope mine would last longer than that!

I've been quoted $600-800 for brake lines. That's a lot more expensive than I thought it would be.

You could buy a decent double flaring tool for that.
I only have a fairly simple double flaring tool, it is Snap On though and does the job OK.

Was the $600 to $800 for making & fitting the lines ? Fitting can be time consuming.


Colin

[JimM]

You could buy a decent double flaring tool for that.
I only have a fairly simple double flaring tool, it is Snap On though and does the job OK.

Was the $600 to $800 for making & fitting the lines ? Fitting can be time consuming.


Colin

Yeah, that was for making and fitting. So that is a reasonable price? For some reason I had it in my mind that it wouldn't be that much.

[Homestar]

There's a bit of work in it, for making and fitting, that seems about right to be honest. Parts would only be $100 for the Bundy tube, but add a days labour and your there.

If you do it yourself you need a decent - not cheap EBay jobby - double flaring tool, which will run you a few hundred alone, so if you look at it that way, it's not too bad.

[LRT]

Geez, that's pretty bad, it sounds like it had no coating on it at all - decent stuff should last as long as the factory stuff does.

Yes it rusted from the outside in. I don't know what brand they used, but it certainly wasn't cheap after they put their markup on the parts + labour!

[Dinty]

If you lived closer to me I would come along and do it for you, I have all the gear LOL, cheers Dennis

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2017/04/356.jpg

[JohnboyLandy]

Just my 2 cents worth...

I looked at the copper brake lines from UK company Automec, specifically the nickel coated ones, as they would look like steel lines anyway. Despite convincing myself that these are a great product and comply with a lot of national and international standards, I could never find a definitive cross reference for the standards the Automec lines comply with, to prove equivalence to the SAE J1047 standard quoted as required for brake lines in Australia. As per the information in the Moke forum reference brakes lines complying with the ADR documentation must be made of steel bundy tube.

That and the fact that the copper lines would be more expensive convinced me to get the lines made locally out of steel tube. I haven't yet got the lines made, but Better Brakes on the Gold Coast quoted me $7 per metre for tube, and $2 per flare and $2 per connector, so I figured the total would be about $130 to have the lines made up compared to about $240 plus postage foe copper / nickel lines from Automec.

Copper lines may or may not pass roadworthy, as that will depend on how vigilant the inspector is, I just wasn't willing to spend $240 on copper lines only to fail roadworthy.

$600-$800 sounds quite expensive given the quote I got for making the lines. I don't know how long the bending and fitting would take, but I can't imagine it's $470-$670 worth of labour.

Cheers,
John

[67hardtop]

Just paint the lines. What they dont see they dont need to know about, unless ur gonna polish em and make em all shiny[emoji15]

Cheers Rod.

Ps. I made all my own lines up including the flares. Repco have a decent double flare tool in their latest catalogue.

[Homestar]

Just paint the lines. What they dont see they dont need to know about, unless ur gonna polish em and make em all shiny[emoji15]



I did that once on my old 2a - painted the whole engine bay and chassis including all the old (copper) lines. The guy doing the RWC scratched the paint off then failed it - he said painting everything was an old trick and rings alarm bells and it wouldn't get past him. :D

Not sure if some younger blokes would bother though.

[JohnboyLandy]

Painted or not, copper lines will fail a "magnet test" [biggrin]

Cheers,
John

[JimM]

Thanks all for your help!

Unfortunately, no work on the Landy last weekend.

Looks like the best option for me would be to get the brake lines pre-made here, then have a go at bending and fitting them myself. I'll measure the lines on my mates S3 lwb with a string, then can know exactly how long each line is.
I'll have to ensure the ends are BSF threaded so they can go into the original cylinders. Need to find a place who can do that.

Jim.

[TimNZ]

I think it cost around $400 to get all new hard lines made for the S3, including 4 braided lines, (3 for the brakes and 1 clutch).

Cheers,

[Homestar]

Thanks all for your help!

Unfortunately, no work on the Landy last weekend.

Looks like the best option for me would be to get the brake lines pre-made here, then have a go at bending and fitting them myself. I'll measure the lines on my mates S3 lwb with a string, then can know exactly how long each line is.
I'll have to ensure the ends are BSF threaded so they can go into the original cylinders. Need to find a place who can do that.

Jim.

Can you remove the old lines with fittings and take them to a brake place? The fittings are expensive compared to the line itself - I reused all of mine, a quick buff on a wire wheel and they were as good as new again.

[JimM]

Can you remove the old lines with fittings and take them to a brake place? The fittings are expensive compared to the line itself - I reused all of mine, a quick buff on a wire wheel and they were as good as new again.

Yeah I would be able to do that. Great idea, I wasn't even thinking of re-using them.
Thanks mate!

[Homestar]

No probs, and if you get the lines out in one piece, they have the exact length so no need to measure them, you'll just get back new versions of what you removed. :)

[JimM]

No probs, and if you get the lines out in one piece, they have the exact length so no need to measure them, you'll just get back new versions of what you removed. :)


Thanks Homestar, I took your advice. Luckily I had the lines out in one piece a while ago. I took everything into a local brake manufacture this sat. Great service too, they are only opened to 9-5 mon to fri, however after mentioning on the phone that I have to work in the city and wouldn't be able to drop the brakes off during those times, they arranged for me to be able to drop them off on saturday afternoon. I got a call today and they are done. Quick turn around time frame. Just have to pick them up this weekend and try to install them.

Other than that I only got little bits done. I put the water pump (had to replace gasket) and engine back on, as well as the exhaust manifold.
122736122737122738
I would like to say the engine and gearbox should be ready to go back in next weekend. I just have to wait for the carb gasket to come, they sent me one with scollops taken out of it. Strange.

There is a little job to do with the rear axels. The eyelets where the rear suspension pin goes through to mount the shocks are severely worn so I am planning to try and fix it. I will have to weld an extra plate over the worn holes and re-drill it. This job was meant to be done prior to sandblasting, unfortunately it was forgotten about. This is a little prototype I cut out. Would a plate this size and approx 3mm thick be fine to the job?
122740122741

[JimM]

A few things ticked off this week.

With the help of a friend we managed to fix the worn shock pin holes in the rear axle. Using the template I made, we made two plates out of 3mm steel to cover the worn area.
123123
We created the hole large enough to accommodate the lip from the shock washers, so it sits inside perfectly. Hopefully to avoid wearing in the future.
123124123125

From there we had to strip back the paint to create a clean surface to weld with. We welded it up, then painted over it black. Turned out pretty well. Hopefully it wont be wearing anytime soon!
123126123127123128

I also managed to fit and bend up the Rear brake line. Looks pretty good. I didn't have small enough bolts to the "p" clips to fix them down, but when they are in place the piping looks nice and straight, unlike in this photo - but you get the idea.

123129

Super keen to get the engine and gearbox back in. I just have to find the time!

[Cap]

This thread is great... I have the same issue with the rear shock eyelet, in my case its broken through the end and bent up so in theory I should be able to bend back straight and weld. If not ill take on your method :)

[JimM]

This thread is great... I have the same issue with the rear shock eyelet, in my case its broken through the end and bent up so in theory I should be able to bend back straight and weld. If not ill take on your method :)

Thanks Cap.
Yeah I thought considering everything was back together and we had forgotten about the worn holes, this was the easiest way to fix the problem.
Would have been nice to have done it before the painting so the eyelets could be fixed and you wouldn't even notice. But I don't think you'll see it anyway once the shock is in.

Sounds like yours will be a little easier to fix! Just out of curiosity, would bending the steel back into place create residual stress and weaken it? or given that you're only doing it once and then welding it up it will be fine?

[Cap]

Good point about bending it back... I am very light on tools at the moment and buying what I need as I go... so I dont have a propane torch to pre-heat and bend back which is what I will do. I think because its a thick piece of metal this should be fine. My brother used to be a metal fabricator/welder, so I always ask him first!

Secondly, my chassis and bulkhead is in VERY poor shape... huge amounts of rust at front *dumb irons" and the rear cross member, and both bulkhead outriggers are rusted through. So in terms of welding fab work ahead of me, I got loads and possibly have to junk the chassis and replace with another if I can find one. Also, the bulkhead is badly rusted, both door pillars and around the vents, also foot wells etc.

So this will be a challenge for me, hence threads like yours assist me greatly with what to expect.

[JimM]

Good point about bending it back... I am very light on tools at the moment and buying what I need as I go... so I dont have a propane torch to pre-heat and bend back which is what I will do. I think because its a thick piece of metal this should be fine. My brother used to be a metal fabricator/welder, so I always ask him first!

Secondly, my chassis and bulkhead is in VERY poor shape... huge amounts of rust at front *dumb irons" and the rear cross member, and both bulkhead outriggers are rusted through. So in terms of welding fab work ahead of me, I got loads and possibly have to junk the chassis and replace with another if I can find one. Also, the bulkhead is badly rusted, both door pillars and around the vents, also foot wells etc.

So this will be a challenge for me, hence threads like yours assist me greatly with what to expect.


Well your brother would know more than me being a fabricator, so I'd listen to him [bigrolf]

I'm glad my thread can help out. My chassis wasn't in very good condition either, but you can see how much they can improve.
I wish I knew how to weld, would be very handy and would help keep the costs of the rebuild down!

I am expecting my bulkhead back soon. Hopefully it turns out a treat! Mine was only really rusted out in the footwells. Easy enough to replace.

[Andy130]

I wish I knew how to weld, would be very handy and would help keep the costs of the rebuild down!



Jim, I went to a community centre course to learn basic welding for only $80 before I started my rebuild - it taught me enough to be dangerous lol .You might find something similar in Melbourne.The basics are actually quite easy to learn, then its all about practice.

this is a really helpful site:

Stick Welding, MIG Welding, and TIG Welding Blog (http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/Welding-Tips-blog.html)

[JimM]

Great Idea Andy. There are a few courses around Melbourne, so I'm thinking of biting the bullet and signing up. Should be a bit of fun!

Not much this weekend, I only put the shocks in. The extra width with the added plate on the rear axle, made it a little harder to install as it took away from some of the thread on the shock pin. That being said it was still pretty easy to install.

123361123362

My only concern would be that the shocks are sitting too positive at the moment, with only a small amount of extension travel available. The chassis is obviously unladen and sitting quite high (especially with the new parabolics). Once I put the engine and body back on, I'm hoping they will sit better and allow for greater positive travel.

123364123367

I purchased new split pins for the front shocks, however managed to re-use the old washers as they were in good condition.

Sorry about the angle of the photos, not too sure why it is doing that.
I don't mind the contrast between the black chassis and yellow shocks.

[AJF]

JimM
I like the old man emi shocks.
Cheers
Angus

[JimM]

JimM
I like the old man emi shocks.
Cheers
Angus


Thanks Angus.
Hopefully I can start testing them out soon!

It would be interesting to see the difference between our two projects in ride etc.
I think you're going down the Parabolic and Monroe path? It would be great to see what difference (if any) the shock makes with new Parabolics.

[AJF]

JimM
Yes, getting new parabolics but Paddock Spares could not ship the Monroe shocks as they are gas filled. At this stage I bought the Pro Comp shocks from Paddocks so see how it goes.

Also what tyres did you buy?

Cheers
Angus

[JimM]

JimM
Yes, getting new parabolics but Paddock Spares could not ship the Monroe shocks as they are gas filled. At this stage I bought the Pro Comp shocks from Paddocks so see how it goes.

Also what tyres did you buy?

Cheers
Angus

Nice, I've heard they are good!
I've got Dunlop Road Grippers 7.5R16.
123399123400

[JimM]

Not too much this weekend I'm afraid, but I did hit a nice little milestone for my build. I was able to drop the engine in late Sunday, using the tractor. I managed to install the flywheel housing and flywheel however, I ran out of light so I couldn't do anything further - the down side of not enough shed space.

123627 123628 123629 123630

I also received this in the mail today. New wiring harness from Auto Sparks. Looks very neat.

123631

Now to figure out how to connect it properly! I've got the green bible which covers the diagrams, so hopefully with the help of a mate (who is great with auto electrics), we can get it sorted pretty quickly. I'll try and sort it out after the gearbox and Bulkhead go in.

[Cap]

Impressive build, very well done.

[TimNZ]

Looks great Jim!

Did you get the loom from Autosparks? I found the wrapping insulation really easy to damage, and ended up spending quite a bit of time deburing any of the holes in the chassis where you have to pull the loom through. (The grommets will protect it once it's in place, but when you're fitting it it's easy to damage).

Cheers,

[reachjatt]

Not too much this weekend I'm afraid, but I did hit a nice little milestone for my build. I was able to drop the engine in late Sunday, using the tractor. I managed to install the flywheel housing and flywheel however, I ran out of light so I couldn't do anything further - the down side of not enough shed space.

123627 123628 123629 123630

I also received this in the mail today. New wiring harness from Auto Sparks. Looks very neat.

123631

Now to figure out how to connect it properly! I've got the green bible which covers the diagrams, so hopefully with the help of a mate (who is great with auto electrics), we can get it sorted pretty quickly. I'll try and sort it out after the gearbox and Bulkhead go in.

Hi Mate,
Where did you buy those old man emu shocks for landy. Are you able to provide part number.
Regards,
Nav

[JimM]

Looks great Jim!

Did you get the loom from Autosparks? I found the wrapping insulation really easy to damage, and ended up spending quite a bit of time deburing any of the holes in the chassis where you have to pull the loom through. (The grommets will protect it once it's in place, but when you're fitting it it's easy to damage).

Cheers,

Thanks Cap and Tim, appreciate the kind words, but I’ve still got a lot to go. Hopefully I do the rest of the build justice!

Yep, I ordered it through Autosparks. Luckily for me they had it in stock (with required changes), so it took less than a week from clicking the order button to arriving at my door. Thanks for the tip! I was looking at buying the grommets, but on closer inspection of the package this morning there are grommets already on the loom? When you ordered, were all the grommets there, or did you have to order more?


Hi Mate,
Where did you buy those old man emu shocks for landy. Are you able to provide part number.
Regards,
Nav

Hi Nav, I just got them locally through a friend. I imagine any stockist should be able to supply them. They may be special order though, as I doubt most stores will have them in stock.

Part numbers are N78 for the front and N69 for the rear. I’m pretty keen to test them out along with the parabolic springs.

[TimNZ]

Hi Jim,

I needed an extra grommet for the loom that goes to the rear of the chassis, it only had one. I've not done more than that so far with the loom, (apart from the engine), so I'm not sure what else I will need. There doesn't appear to be a lot of wiring for the binnacle, but until I get the firewall in I won't know for sure.

The engine loom and it looks correct so far, however I will have to make up new battery cables as they were not included.

Regarding the dampers, are they standard length, or longer to suit the para's? I have the stock dampers on my SIII and they are too short for the para's.

Cheers,

Tim

[JimM]

Hi Jim,

I needed an extra grommet for the loom that goes to the rear of the chassis, it only had one. I've not done more than that so far with the loom, (apart from the engine), so I'm not sure what else I will need. There doesn't appear to be a lot of wiring for the binnacle, but until I get the firewall in I won't know for sure.

The engine loom and it looks correct so far, however I will have to make up new battery cables as they were not included.

Regarding the dampers, are they standard length, or longer to suit the para's? I have the stock dampers on my SIII and they are too short for the para's.

Cheers,

Tim

Oh ok, I've got 1 usable chassis grommet left, so that might work out well. I'll have to do new battery cables as well. My battery is located under the passenger seat.

In regards to the shocks, they are "extra long travel". They are sitting rather positive (high) at the moment. I think once everything is in it will sort them out so they sit lower. I took some crude measurements and compared the chassis height to my friends ex mil 109 and I was sitting a good 2" inches above his chassis height - my chassis was unladen then. So I'm expecting it to lower a fair bit, once everything is back on. Notwithstanding, I am a little nervous as I'm not to sure if I need different shocks or not. I believe these are very similar to the Pro Comp Extra Long Travel ones and they are recommended for parabolics, so there shouldn't be an issue. I've seen similar builds with paras with these OME's on them and I'm yet to see a complaint. I'll find out soon enough if this is not the case!

Your shock absorbers - stock as in the original ones? or have you got a like for like replacement thats too short?

[TimNZ]

Your shock absorbers - stock as in the original ones? or have you got a like for like replacement thats too short?

They are stock as in "OEM" Armstrong brand oil shocks ordered with the LR part number. I'll have to look into the Old Man Emus, I was eyeing up the Procomps, but not too many companies want to ship them internationally due to the gas charge.

Cheers,

[JimM]

They are stock as in "OEM" Armstrong brand oil shocks ordered with the LR part number. I'll have to look into the Old Man Emus, I was eyeing up the Procomps, but not too many companies want to ship them internationally due to the gas charge.

Cheers,


Hi Tim,

I found a little more information on the pro comp and Old Man Emu's. They are the same with extra travel and are both recommend for vehicles with parabolic suspension. if you can't get pro comps, OME would be a very nice alternative.

123770

Jim.

[JimM]

I struggled this weekend. I tried to get the gearbox back in and couldn't. It was late in the day so I started to run out of light, then it started pouring! Everything got wet. I wouldn't recommend doing that again.

I'm still trying to figure out why it didn't fit. So, here are the steps I took to fit it. Hopefully someone can see where I went wrong.

1) When fitting the clutch plate, I didn't have the correct tool so I used a makeshift tool which was shown to me in a tutorial. I used a socket and taped the outside so it didn't do any damage and fit snugly, helping (hopefully) to ensure the correct alignment. I stuck it on the end of an extension bar and inserted in into the hole in the flywheel.

123890 123891

2) I then placed the pressure plate on making sure I aligned the mark, that I previously made on the flywheel and plate. I tightened the pressure plate bolts to 25pound as per the instruction manual. I used my breaker bar to stop it spinning from the front.

123894

I withdrew the socket and extension bar. I eyed it up and it looked ok.

123892 123893

I've taken a photo, however the more I look at it, the more I think it is off centre (could just be the angle of the photo?).

3) I used the block and tackle on the forks of the tractor to lower the gearbox in. I selected 4th gear before trying to put it in.
We lowered it in a rotated the the spline slowly to try and match it up. No amount of wiggling or pushing could get it in.
I tried jacking up the engine to change the angles and tired different angles of the gearbox.

I'm just not too sure how to get it to fit. Does anyone have any tips, or have I missed a very obvious step?


Thanks,

Jim

[Phil B]

Is your clutch plate in the right way round?

[JimM]

Is your clutch plate in the right way round?


Don't tell me it's something as silly as that! how embarrassing! [bigsad]
In the tutorial I was watching I copied the way they installed it. Well, at least I thought I did.

[rangieman]

You say the hole in the fly wheel ?
It should really be the spigot bush which is inside the hole in the crank that your alignment tool centres the plate off[wink11]

[JimM]

You say the hole in the fly wheel ?
It should really be the spigot bush which is inside the hole in the crank that your alignment tool centres the plate off[wink11]

By hole, I do mean spigot bush! haha I've got a fair way to go in terms of learning the correct terminology. But thats why I'm doing this!

[Homestar]

Couple of things - as Rangieman says - is the spigot bush still in the back of the crank? Also, the clutch plate does look backwards in that's photo - the back of the clutch plate where the gearbox input shaft goes looks like it's sticking out too far - which could be the cause of your issue.

While you need to get the alignment close, the way you've done it is fine - that's all I've ever done. You can also double check it by seeing where the clutch plate sits around the edge compared to the pressure plate. Looking and feeling will tell you pretty quick if you're a long way out.

[rangieman]

By hole, I do mean spigot bush! haha I've got a fair way to go in terms of learning the correct terminology. But thats why I'm doing this!
If that`s the case then i would recheck c/plate alignment [wink11] i have done similar to what you have used but i put tape around the socket extension so it helps align the c/plate which is what it is all about ,
By the way after you have done it with the tool it always pays to eye it up through the c/plate hole for alignment to the spigot[wink11].
What side of town are you because if you were not too far from me i could swing around and help you if needed[thumbsupbig]

[JimM]

Couple of things - as Rangieman says - is the spigot bush still in the back of the crank? Also, the clutch plate does look backwards in that's photo - the back of the clutch plate where the gearbox input shaft goes looks like it's sticking out too far - which could be the cause of your issue.

While you need to get the alignment close, the way you've done it is fine - that's all I've ever done. You can also double check it by seeing where the clutch plate sits around the edge compared to the pressure plate. Looking and feeling will tell you pretty quick if you're a long way out.

Cheers, thanks mate. Yep, spigot bush is still there. Good to know I was on the right track with some things! [bigsmile]


If that`s the case then i would recheck c/plate alignment [wink11] i have done similar to what you have used but i put tape around the socket extension so it helps align the c/plate which is what it is all about ,
By the way after you have done it with the tool it always pays to eye it up through the c/plate hole for alignment to the spigot[wink11].
What side of town are you because if you were not too far from me i could swing around and help you if needed[thumbsupbig]

I'm just east of Pakenham. I'll have another crack at it this weekend. I'll remove everything and start again, making sure I put the clutch plate the right way around! If I cant get it right, I might have to call in the cavalry. Would've have been good to get it done last weekend, as I'm picking of the Bbulkhead this weekend. I should be able to get both done though.

Thanks for all your help guys!

[67hardtop]

I'll remove everything and start again, making sure I put the clutch plate the right way around!


Remember..." When in doubt...fat side out" with the clutch plate...

Cheers Rod

[rangieman]

Cheers, thanks mate. Yep, spigot bush is still there. Good to know I was on the right track with some things! [bigsmile]



I'm just east of Pakenham. I'll have another crack at it this weekend. I'll remove everything and start again, making sure I put the clutch plate the right way around! If I cant get it right, I might have to call in the cavalry. Would've have been good to get it done last weekend, as I'm picking of the Bbulkhead this weekend. I should be able to get both done though.

Thanks for all your help guys!
Im in Nazza Wozza not too far away and happy to come help and looksy if you want[wink11]

[JimM]

Im in Nazza Wozza not too far away and happy to come help and looksy if you want[wink11]


Not too far away at all. Thanks for the offer, but I might need your help next time! I finally got the gearbox in.

I removed the pressure plate and clutch plate as we all thought it was the wrong way around. Turns out it was the right way around to begin with. Here are the photos of it front and back. last time we tried getting the gearbox in it was getting dark, so we were probably trying to rush - making a meal of it.

Correct way ("fat side out"):

124279

Wrong way:
124280

As you can see in the above photo, it's not possible to put the clutch plate in the wrong way as it would not sit flush with the flywheel surface. I cleaned the spline thoroughly in the gear box then attempted to put it all back in.

I did it all back up (like described in my previous post) and it just slid in first try! [bigsmile] very happy with that result.

124282

I forgot to mention last time, that the replacement gearbox mount had a thread that was slightly larger hitting the chassis so it wouldn't sit flush with the chassis side of the mount. I had to tighten the mount in a vice, then slightly grind the thread down so it would sit flush.

124281


There was also a delay with the bulkhead, so I'm picking it up this weekend. I'll maybe try and make a start on the electrics after that.

[JimM]

I picked up the bulk head and a few other pieces this weekend. Came out well.

124630 124631

I didn't have too much difficulty fitting it.

When I put one bulkhead bolt through, I found out it was slightly off.
124632

As you can see the bolt holes in the bulk head and outrigger didn't quite align. I used a crow bar on the left of the bolt hole and placed it against the front tire to slightly push it out. The bolt went straight through after that.

I fitted a few different pieces I picked up, just to see what it looked like.

124633

Next stop - electrics. I have no Idea what I'm doing in that area!

[Cap]

Next stop - electrics. I have no Idea what I'm doing in that area!

lol - I feel exactly the same way, glad I am not the only one! Damn electrics.

[JimM]

I've now had a crack at putting the harness in. With a help of a friend and a few beers one night, we have most of the wiring done. The Autospark harness has been great and when read with the wiring diagram is rather straight forward. The new harness makes a huge difference and looks nice and neat. I've also finally got the old bus undercover for the first time. It's quite nice being able to work on it past dark and out of the cold!

First thing we did was get out the old harness, so we could reference which end was what on the new harness and set it up quite basically.

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From there we worked our way back using the diagram on one branch of the harness at a time.

I had to remove one bulk head pin and pivot the bulkhead to allow us to feed through the wiring loom to the rear crossmember.
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After this we connected up the engine components. The next job was the gauges. I haven't painted the gauge panel yet, so we removed it and we connected each gauge and switch up ready to insert once the panel has been painted.

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Obviously there are differences between the British built land rover S2a and the Aus built, so there are some discrepancies in the wiring loom (I may have gotten these wrong and misread the diagram so any feed back or corrections on these are welcome!).
Things to note are:


I found that the fuel gauge sender is in the loom which goes to the rear crossmember / lights. I will need to bring this back towards the front along the chassis rail to connect up to fuel tank under my drivers seat.
The cold start connection on the wiring loom is an eyelet connection, when on the motor its a spade. I will need to change the fitting here to work
The alternator modification I got will need to be changed just slightly. I have to change 2 of the cable ends to eyelet connections.
I've got a small separate loom of (3 wires from memory) blue wires with white and red markings, which I don't know what its for. I have a feeling this might be for the wiper motor).


We also has a crack at the front brake lines, once the majority of the wiring was done. One brake line was too long, so had to twist it a couple of times around a duct tape roll to lose the extra length. Worked very well and looks quite neat.

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Next steps for me now are to start putting some body panels back on. That way I can start connecting up the lights and start trouble shooting from there. Slowly getting there.

[JimM]

I recently received a new order from overseas, so I was able to pick up the tools again and continue chipping away at the project.
First job was to finish off the brake lines. I received the new braided brakes lines. These were standard length plus 2 inches to allow for the parabolic suspension. I've heard that these are better than the rubber hoses however, I think the jury is out. I'll soon find out.

Just a shot of how the brakes lines matched up. I was pretty apprehensive before taking on the brake line job, but was surprised about how straight forward it was - even only bending them by hand.

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I remember reading on this forum that it is critical you purchase the right tie rod ends for your car. On closer inspection my car was fitted with the wrong ones. As you can see in the photo below the rods in the linkage are only partly treaded, with the tie rod ends fully threaded. I made sure I got the tie rod ends to match.

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I then installed the steering linkage. I read somewhere that the bottom arm and top arm of the steering relay have to be offset by 81 degrees from each other (as opposed to 90 degrees). Is this correct? This is how I set mine up.

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I adjusted the rod lengths so the wheels were aligned with a slight toe-in and then put the steering wheel on.

I think I've found the centre of the steering box, with the wheel turning evenly both ways. I was rather pedantic about not adjusting the steering column / box to ensure I didn't much it up. Although I think there is some fine tuning required.

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[JDNSW]

......
I then installed the steering linkage. I read somewhere that the bottom arm and top arm of the steering relay have to be offset by 81 degrees from each other (as opposed to 90 degrees). Is this correct? This is how I set mine up. ....

According to my books, Series 1 is 81 degrees, but Series 2a is 90 degrees. I doubt it is significant though - may change the lock slightly.

One point I dis note when checking this - make sure that the steering link between the steering box and the relay does not come closer than an inch to the brake line, bending the brake line if necessary.

[JimM]

According to my books, Series 1 is 81 degrees, but Series 2a is 90 degrees. I doubt it is significant though - may change the lock slightly.

One point I dis note when checking this - make sure that the steering link between the steering box and the relay does not come closer than an inch to the brake line, bending the brake line if necessary.


Oh Awesome! Thanks mate. I'm obviously reading rebuild threads on all the series and mixing them up. This information might come in handy for a series 1 rebuild - If i ever manage to find one!

I might have to check the distance between those two now you mention it. Did it mention why one inch? I run my brake lines on top of that chassis rail, then down and behind the front crossmember for the front left wheel. If I have clips securing the brake line in place, would that eliminate the perceived risk?

[JDNSW]

....... Did it mention why one inch? I run my brake lines on top of that chassis rail, then down and behind the front crossmember for the front left wheel. If I have clips securing the brake line in place, would that eliminate the perceived risk?

No mention of why this clearance is specified, but I would guess that it is because the clearance will vary both as the pitman arm on the steering box swings and as the link pivots on the ball joints, plus that you really don't want anything that moves rubbing against a brake pipe. And there needs to be a safety margin to allow for things to move that really shouldn't (such as the arm on the relay becoming loose allowing the whole setup to droop a bit) without disastrous results. I suspect that there is nothing magic about the actual figure, and something close to the inch mark would be adequate, especially if you made sure it was measured at the closest approach, checking with the rod twisted down and at the lowest swing of the pitman.

I don't think that movement of the brake line is the issue, so the clips on it are not going to affect the situation.

[Chops]

Starting to look like a work of art really. So nice 👍

Just wondering if your trip meter reset button on the speedo works (?) Unfortunately mine doesn't, I'll have to look into trying to fix it.

[JimM]

No mention of why this clearance is specified, but I would guess that it is because the clearance will vary both as the pitman arm on the steering box swings and as the link pivots on the ball joints, plus that you really don't want anything that moves rubbing against a brake pipe. And there needs to be a safety margin to allow for things to move that really shouldn't (such as the arm on the relay becoming loose allowing the whole setup to droop a bit) without disastrous results. I suspect that there is nothing magic about the actual figure, and something close to the inch mark would be adequate, especially if you made sure it was measured at the closest approach, checking with the rod twisted down and at the lowest swing of the pitman.

I don't think that movement of the brake line is the issue, so the clips on it are not going to affect the situation.

Thanks for the help. Your knowledge is always appreciated here! I'll double check all the dimensions when I get back there. The double loop I put in my brake lines might come close to the drop arm.


Starting to look like a work of art really. So nice 👍

Just wondering if your trip meter reset button on the speedo works (?) Unfortunately mine doesn't, I'll have to look into trying to fix it.

Thanks Chops! Very kind words. My trip metre reset button does work thankfully. I wouldn't know the first thing about pulling it apart.
I've got to find a good way of 'sealing' the gauges back in the panel. I'm thinking I'll just use the left over black gasket silicone. Would this do the same job?

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Above is the gauge panel, which I used paint stripper to bring back to bare metal. I then used wet/dry sand paper to remove the scoring marks. Then put a self etching primer on top. I didn't get a photo of the colour after the final layers, but it matched perfectly with the bulk head.

[JDNSW]

Series trip meter reset is not a button - you have to twist it!

[Chops]

Series trip meter reset is not a button - you have to twist it!


Thanks John, I never even gave a thought to twisting it [bighmmm]

[Cap]

I pulled my dash apart, including the speedo unit, although I didnt touch the mechanism as it is working. Not hard at all really and I used RTV to seal the glass ring back in so would minimise dust getting into the unit.

Of course, got vids on these if you want to see what I did (not saying I am the expert tho, but perhaps some ideas)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PyuLby_2Myw&t=3s&index=19&list=PL6LiK5ZbKVXEo2M6AykTbYU0fIjA2c69z

[JimM]

It's been a while since I've been able to tinker away, but I was able to get a few things done this weekend.

I corrected the streering so that the relay arms are 90 degrees of each other. Previously I had the relay arms offset 81 degrees - a series 1 requirement.

I also did some paint prep for the seat box and other bits a pieces ready to go back in. The bottom of the seat box had a sealant all around. I believe that this is to stop any water getting in, however it was a very messy application looking very untidy, so I thought I would strip it and then paint over it.

127931

I took my radiator in for a quote this morning. Here is a photo of it in it's current condition. Looks like it has had a hard life.

127930

I was quoted $800 for a re-core. I can't say I want to pay that much. Looks like i'll have to try and find a decent second hand one? No one here is selling one are they?

I know you can buy 4cyl radiators from the major land rover websites, but does any one know who is selling replacement ones for the 6cyl?

Once I find a replacement radiator, I'll be able to fire the engine up! (hopefully it starts!)

[67hardtop]

The 4 cyl rads were a 3 core and the 6 cyl rads were a 4 core. Good luck getting a second hand 4 core. I couldnt find one anywhere after a fan shattered and destroyed my good 4 core rad on my s3. Hope u find one.

Cheers Rod

[Chops]

$800 for a recore, that's not bad,,, I got quoted over $1000, and he said it would be closer to $1200. He did look though as if he was unsure and it could be more. [bighmmm]
But that's basically a total replacement rebuild using my tanks only pretty much.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

The 4 cyl rads were a 3 core and the 6 cyl rads were a 4 core. Good luck getting a second hand 4 core. I couldnt find one anywhere after a fan shattered and destroyed my good 4 core rad on my s3. Hope u find one.

Cheers Rod
Not quite true in Oz. From the early days in Australia the engines had problems dealing with the higher ambient temperatures so the four cylinders in Oz were specified with the diesel 4 core radiators. You're unwise to use the 3 core particularly if you use the vehicle a lot or do hard off highway use.
Aluminium replacement cores are cheaper than the copper cores. If you use green coolant make sure you replace it every 12 months as the glycol becomes corrosive to the alloy.

[JimM]

Not quite true in Oz. From the early days in Australia the engines had problems dealing with the higher ambient temperatures so the four cylinders in Oz were specified with the diesel 4 core radiators. You're unwise to use the 3 core particularly if you use the vehicle a lot or do hard off highway use.
Aluminium replacement cores are cheaper than the copper cores. If you use green coolant make sure you replace it every 12 months as the glycol becomes corrosive to the alloy.

Thank you Chops, Rod and Lotz-A for the help.

Are the aluminium ones you refer to the e-bay special ones?
I'm not going to be doing hard off road work on this Land Rover - It'll be more of a Sunday Driver, with the potential to cruise around the farm if it's good conditions. Given this - is there a relatively cheaper option you'd recommend? or it it worth getting the original re-cored?

[Rextheute]

Dunno where you are in Melbourne - I've had rads built by Campbellfield Radiators - for older cars , beaut work and priced right - 3 core HD for a Valiant was just under $700.
3 years on it still a ripper .
No connection ,just did a good job .

[Chops]

My quote was friom a guy in Clayton, and it is to match what i currently have.
I'm sure that mine is a 4 core, which can be replaced by an alloy core, quite cheaply if i remember correctly, at about $500 (?), but I'd prefer to have it as an original.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Most of the cheap ones you find about the traps are sourced out of the UK, are 3 row core and have a round top tank of the Series 3 design. Judges at display days may mark down this top tank as not original.

If you're pedantic about things like these you may want to re-core rather than replace.

[JimM]

Dunno where you are in Melbourne - I've had rads built by Campbellfield Radiators - for older cars , beaut work and priced right - 3 core HD for a Valiant was just under $700.
3 years on it still a ripper .
No connection ,just did a good job .


My quote was friom a guy in Clayton, and it is to match what i currently have.
I'm sure that mine is a 4 core, which can be replaced by an alloy core, quite cheaply if i remember correctly, at about $500 (?), but I'd prefer to have it as an original.

Thanks Rex and Chops, judging by the sounds of that $800 doesn't seem too bad. Although... its worth more than what I paid for the car in the first place!


Most of the cheap ones you find about the traps are sourced out of the UK, are 3 row core and have a round top tank of the Series 3 design. Judges at display days [B]may mark down this top tank as not original.

If you're pedantic about things like these you may want to re-core rather than replace.

Not too sure I'm pedantic about those things. I wasn't even thinking I'd ever enter this car into a comp. I doubt I'd go well at all. This is my first attempt at this so the workmanship wouldn't be up there. Plus I have metric bolts, parabolic springs, braided brake lines. Wouldn't I get penalised for all those things?

[JimM]

The weather was surprisingly good this weekend, so I managed to get a bit of painting done.
I stripped the internal sides of the wings as they were discoloured and stained. I first stripped them with a wire wheel, then went over it with wet dry sand paper. I then primed the sides and painted over it with a pressure pack paint. Once the colour coats dried, I applied a clear coat with a hardner to protect it. I have heard stories of clear coats discolouring when exposed to heat, so I will see how this goes. Once again I found tape and aluminium foil the best way to mask off surfaces.

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I have purposely left the external panels untouched. It is my intention to have everything under the hood to look 'near-new' along the with cockpit, whilst leaving the chipped paint externally to keep its character.

I also managed to do the seat box too. Same methodology as above. There is some aluminium corrosion present, however I have treated it and it will be situated under the floor panels.
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I also started polishing the headlight chrome rim. I just used a metal polish and it came up looking nice. The picture below is showing treated area vs worn condition.

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Once the headlight assemblies were put in the wings and the panels were dry, I was able to put in the front right wing! Starting to look like something you can drive.

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Thats all I could get done on the weekend.

Next, I will have to get the manifold studs out as they have corroded threads and with the new exhaust I can't tighten the nuts enough. Best option I've seen on the internet is an Oxy torch (which I don't have). Heat them up and then apply cold water straight away, then they can twist out. I have tried vice grips to twist and soaked the manifold studs in WD40 for weeks, but they aren't coming out. Is there another effective method that can be used here?

[Cap]

I was shown that tightening the nuts a tad first before trying to loosen works. Dont think wd40 is strong enough... have you tried diesel? I use diesel as my no1 lube and for many nut/bolts i have successfully removed them.

[JimM]

It's been a long time between posts as I've been away on holiday and had a break from working on the car. I've recently been getting back into it with a little more progress. I ended up biting the bullet and getting the radiator recored.It ended up costing $700, which was less than the original quote. They did a great job on it. I also had to take the manifold into the local mechanics, so they could use an oxy torch on the studs and install the new ones.
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When it came to installing the front grille panel and radiator the rubber spacers I had were very worn. In searching for an alternative, I came across these anti-vibration pads. I found them to be the correct height and all I had to do was drill a hole in them to allow the bolt to go through. It will be interesting to see how these wear over time - but at the moment they seem to be fit for purpose.
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Here is a quick before and after of how the engine bay is looking. It's come along way (further than I thought I could take it) hopefully its not too long before I can start driving it again!

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Next steps will be tub, doors, finalisation of the electrics and a new battery. Hopefully then I can try and turn it over.

[Dgd69]

Great work looking nice

[JimM]

Some more work over the weekend, with a nice little milestone! - but I'll get to that later.

If I was to do this process again, I'd start by putting the tub on first, so then I can square up the bulkhead to the tub. Once I got the tub on, I realised the bulkhead wasn't exactly square - causing door fitting issues. The parabolic springs at the back (as they were unladen) were sitting really high, giving a false impression that the bulkhead was square.

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The dog was pretty happy with the outcome. Now she can sit comfortably on top and project manage everything from here on in.
I had to shim the bulkhead forward, to allow for enough spacing for the doors - however I think my hinges are a little worn complicating the fitting process.

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I also received a few goodies this week - which I am yet to fit.
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part no. 541522. I also realised that my Lucas wiper motor came with no gearing! So I also had to order that as well.
What is the correct part number for the wiper rack on a SIIA? I've ordered a wiper rack however it seems too thick?

With the help of a friend we finalised most of the electrics, got a new battery and tried to start it. My girlfriend was in town and picked up a N70ZZ battery with 900CCA for me. I think that is enough CCA to turn it over [tonguewink]

We came across a few issues like a bad earth etc, but the the biggest problems was with the starter motor. I withdrew the starter motor and it seemed a bit sticky so I loosened it up with some lubricant, but it would only turn intermittently when put on current. I then took it apart to realise one of the brushes was recessed back inside the casing and wouldn't return. I wiggled it and it popped out, creating contact. I hope this part makes sense as I forgot to take photos! Once the brush was fixed, it worked like a charm!

After that I was able to start it for the first time! It's a great feeling being able to hear it run again. Took it for a little test ride as well, was good fun - although the brakes need some more bleeding. I would upload a video of the engine running - if I knew how.

I installed the seatbox and the seat bases.
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Next steps for me are to:
- bleed the brakes again
- learn how to refurbish the steering wheel
- connect the lights up
- get a truck cab (anyone here have one for sale?)
- get some lights for the dash. I've ordered a set of LED ones.
- I also want to find some floor mats, but all the floor mats I can find say they don't fit a 6cyl.

[AJF]

Great progress - must have been an amazing moment to get the engine going again.

all the best

Angus

[JimM]

Great progress - must have been an amazing moment to get the engine going again.

all the best

Angus

Thanks Angus. It was a great feeling. This whole process has been a rather rewarding learning experience.
I think the real joy will come when I can finally drive it on the road.

Jim.

[landrovermick]

Watching with interest !