Td5 auto disco power??

[jimbob]

Hi all, I've done a fair bit of reading on here and else where but I can't find the answer. So I'm hopeing people's experience on this great forum might be able to help. So I've got a disco 2a td5 auto. It's had egr and cat deleted I've put a tune in by trs in Adelaide. It has slightly bigger tyres than normal 265/75 16. The disco has done 150,000ks I'm second owner full service history.
I do a bit of towing with it and this is where my problem starts. I'm towing about 2t not too heavy. When I'm in top gear on the hwy at 100ks and hit a small hill I put my foot down a bit, nothing happens, put it down a bit more, nothing happens put it down more. Now it's about 3/4 throttle and the auto just changes Back and the motor revs and I get slight acceleration. Now what I would like to get it to do is, when I put my foot down slightly the first time. It needs to tip in a bit of diesel and boost and accelerate up the incline. So do people think my vehicle has an electrical or mechanical problem or am I asking too much of the car????

Any ideas and thoughts would be greatly appreciated.thanks Jim

[rangieman]

2 ton behind that with bigger tyres i honestly feel you are expecting too much[wink11]

[Pippin]

Try third locked up for those situations.
Nick

[discorevy]

As above , those tyres will give you around 10% reduction in torque as well as a speedo reading of 100 kph when your real speed is around 108 - 109 kph, definatly third lock up for hills with 2tonne on the back

[jimbob]

I forgot to mention that I have a nanacon and there are no faults logged. Also I'm travelling around 85ks when it changes back to 3rd.

[jimbob]

I have taken in account gearing with tires and I'm talking true speed not speedo. I had a defender td5 with 285 tires and I know they have different gearing in transfer but I could put my foot down in 5th and it would haul 3t on the back with no problems with hills. Maybe it's the auto that's the problem??

[jimbob]

I really hope that I'm not asking too much of it. It's such a nice thing to drive otherwise. But if it can't do the job then..... any one want a clean low Ks disco👹

[Pippin]

I forgot to mention that I have a nanacon and there are no faults logged. Also I'm travelling around 85ks when it changes back to 3rd.
You need to change manually to third long enough for it to go into lock up before you come to a hill, gradient or lower speed than 90Ks.
Nick

[Roverlord off road spares]

4.5 tonne with a little 2.5 litre engine pulling it up hill don't expect much, tunes don't add that much power.

[jimbob]

Ok here's a question, in top gear, what rpm should I hit full boost when accelerating?
Because when cruising at 100ks the engine is doing 2200rpm and when I put my foot down I'm only getting .9bar of boost. Once the rpm comes up to 2500rpm boost comes up and then I can feel it accelerate.

[jimbob]

Thanks roverlord. I just can't stop comparing it to the defender that used to do what I'm asking of this one with ease.

[gazk]

2 ton behind that with bigger tyres i honestly feel you are expecting too much[wink11]

Agree with Rangieman. Do you have an EGT guage? Need to be watching that with 2 tonne behind and an ECU remap.

[jimbob]

No egt yet. Agree needs one though.
I have been using 3rd lock up and it's better but still seems to struggle.

[jimbob]

Is there any problems that occurs with air flow sensor or tps that could cause this?

[AllTerr]

I'd be more worried about your gearbox oil heating up... Like others have said. Drop it in to third lock up and be patient up hills.

[SPROVER]

What sort of tune is it? Did you have it done by trs? I would highly recommend an egt gauge and a stage 2 tune from José.

[SPROVER]

Also tow it in sports mode. Makes a big difference.

[jimbob]

It will be getting an egt gauge. I understand the issues with heating up oil and slipping converter etc.
I'm driving around with full trailer and empty trailer today and I believe after doing this that it defiantly has some sort of problem. Because with an empty trailer it behaves much the same as full. It is gutless in top gear. Bearly accelerates with an empty trailer at 90ks. Any slight hill and the speed drops off. And I mean slight hill. I live in mildura, we don't have mountains or even big hills here. Is any one aware or issues that might cause this?? Eg sensors, turbo, air flow meter???

Thanks for every ones replys👍🏻

[jimbob]

Yes yes did the tune. They only have one.

[jimbob]

Sorry trs

[Fluids]

Hi all, I've done a fair bit of reading on here and else where but I can't find the answer. So I'm hopeing people's experience on this great forum might be able to help. So I've got a disco 2a td5 auto. It's had egr and cat deleted I've put a tune in by trs in Adelaide. It has slightly bigger tyres than normal 265/75 16. The disco has done 150,000ks I'm second owner full service history.
I do a bit of towing with it and this is where my problem starts. I'm towing about 2t not too heavy. When I'm in top gear on the hwy at 100ks and hit a small hill I put my foot down a bit, nothing happens, put it down a bit more, nothing happens put it down more. Now it's about 3/4 throttle and the auto just changes Back and the motor revs and I get slight acceleration. Now what I would like to get it to do is, when I put my foot down slightly the first time. It needs to tip in a bit of diesel and boost and accelerate up the incline. So do people think my vehicle has an electrical or mechanical problem or am I asking too much of the car????

Any ideas and thoughts would be greatly appreciated.thanks Jim


I'm towing maybe 1.5t and the D2a kitted is around 2.5t ... so we're touring at approx' 4t. I've got 265/60*16 fitted which gets me about 6% oversize ... and on a std tune, egr & cat gone, and boost around 19psi it's adequate .... 265/75*16 are about 10% oversize and that's your problem (at least one of them).

See this post ==>> Mods for Towing a Caravan (https://www.aulro.com/afvb/discovery-2-a/246609-mods-towing-caravan-post2647343.html#post2647343)

... or the whole thread ==>> Mods for Towing a Caravan (https://www.aulro.com/afvb/discovery-2-a/246609-mods-towing-caravan.html)

You can see for my road speed (actual) vs engine rev's I'll be struggling to get enough boost unless I stay in a lower gear/higher engine revs for longer .... and with the 265/70 it works well, but imho it's at it's limit (on the std tune). 255/70 tyres would work better. 265/75 and towing 2t has stretched your legs too far ... see my post on how I "work" the auto to get results ... 90km/hr at 2000rpm is a very comfy touring speed with good economy.

You should also check your MAF .... 58-60 at idle / 600+ at WOT under load.

... and your boost of 0.90bar is off ... I'm seeing 1.30-1.32bar at WOT uphill under load

What's happening when you apply the throttle at 100 is it's not downshifting, the torque converter is unlocking ... so the engine can rev higher, but your still in 4th. Try, feathering the throttle a little as you downshift to 3rd, wait for the torque converter to lockup, THEN apply the gas .... the torque converter will stay locked for much more throttle applied ....

I don't tow in sport mode, it just lets the revs climb higher before an upshift ... I prefer to shift manually, and get the torque converter to lockup as quickly as possible in 3rd & 4th.
Hey!... it is only a 2.5L motor [biggrin]

[gavinwibrow]

It will be getting an egt gauge. I understand the issues with heating up oil and slipping converter etc.
I'm driving around with full trailer and empty trailer today and I believe after doing this that it defiantly has some sort of problem. Because with an empty trailer it behaves much the same as full. It is gutless in top gear. Bearly accelerates with an empty trailer at 90ks. Any slight hill and the speed drops off. And I mean slight hill. I live in mildura, we don't have mountains or even big hills here. Is any one aware or issues that might cause this?? Eg sensors, turbo, air flow meter???

Thanks for every ones replys👍🏻

My D2 is very similarly kitted to yours, but with trans cooler EGT and Nanocom in instrument mode and I pull a 3 plus tons brick, AND I also have a deadish spot around 80/90. Will eventually get back to Jose to revisit the reMAP, but in the interim, all good advice here, especially 3rd lockup and sports mode. It is amazing how quickly the EGT rises even on a slight slope at anything over 80 (true speed).

[jimbob]

Thanks I have all those threads and do change manually to keep lock up. I'm more interested in if there is a fault problem causing lack of power. As I said it struggles with an empty trailer. I will check my air flow against those figures thanks.

[jimbob]

I defiantly think the gearing with the tyres is part of the problem, I just don't think that's all of the issues.

[jimbob]

Ok just check air flow meter and under full throttle about 3500rpm, the highest reading I could get was 340!!😱😱 that must be the main problem. I assume with out the correct reading the ecu can't fuel correctly. So can this just be that it's dirty or do I need a new one??

[Fluids]

Ok just check air flow meter and under full throttle about 3500rpm, the highest reading I could get was 340!!😱😱 that must be the main problem. I assume with out the correct reading the ecu can't fuel correctly. So can this just be that it's dirty or do I need a new one??

Well, that's not good .... try cleaning it (when it's COLD!!) and if there's no marked improvement get a new MAF (genuine siemans only - cheapies are rubbish and don't last).

I had a similar problem to yours (could only hit 380-400maxed and about 52 at idle) and fitted a new Siemans MAF and a de-cat pipe and no more problems. This is pretty likely part of the problem ... and tyre size.

I have an extra trans' cooler but don't have the EGT guage yet as with a std tune I'm on the safe side (extra boost/not extra fuel) ...

[AllTerr]

Pull your MAF plug and try again

[AllTerr]

Ahhh Fluids beat me to it. Yeah what he said. Either get some contact cleaner and give it a spray or you can pull the plug and see if there's any improvement on the nanocom.

[PhilipA]

My experience with a BAS remap ,decat, deEGR,20PSI, 255.70x16 etc is that your EGTs will be sky high if you let it run down to 2200 in top under load. I could easily reach 750C if I kept my foot in it, and that was with knowing what the EGT is with a gauge.

I tow 1tonne and this happens with mine, although a lot better with a Serck intercooler although I haven't towed with it yet. I still anticipate I will have to back off and change down.

I third the previous comments that you have to change early down to third manually, wait for lockup and then accelerate. Best torque and best boost is around 2800RPM .
Your MAF low reading could be a problem. Also check that your boost sensor in the manifold is clean and your modulator is working and all hoses to and from it are in place and not split.
Regards Philip A

[jimbob]

Great feedback from every one so thank you. I believe it's down on power because of the low air flow readings. Cleaning and unplugging saw no change so a new one is being picked up Monday. I will keep you all posted. 😜👍🏻

[sierrafery]

Ok just check air flow meter and under full throttle about 3500rpm, the highest reading I could get was 340!!😱😱 that must be the main problem. I assume with out the correct reading the ecu can't fuel correctly. So can this just be that it's dirty or do I need a new one??
As long as the EGR is removed you should make sure that the low reading is not actually real and there's not some restriction in the intake or exhaust, if the catalyst is still in situ better undo the downpipe and make a short test this way(somewhere to not disturb with the noise) cos low air flow/boost/power can be theresult of clogged cat too. It's a possibility as long as unplugging the MAF made no difference, only if the MAF was completely failed prior of unplugging it should make no difference otherwise the default is very rare to be the same as a low reading MAF

[jimbob]

I think I've misunderstood unplugging the maf. I plugged it back in after. I think every one is saying to drive with it unplugged. Whoops my bad. I'll try again tomorrow with it unplugged 👍🏻

[jimbob]

I've deleted the cat. I surprose it could be blocked intake??? Or partially blocked.

[whitey56]

To rule out the tyres see if you can borrow a standard size set of wheels from someone and start the process of elimination.

[AllTerr]

I think I've misunderstood unplugging the maf. I plugged it back in after. I think every one is saying to drive with it unplugged. Whoops my bad. I'll try again tomorrow with it unplugged 👍🏻
Yes. Unplug it at take it for a spin and see if there's any difference.

[Jazzman]

I have the same setup but don't tow. I'd say like everyone else to check the air flow through the engine. Intake and exhaust. If you have removed the CAT i'm guessing it is not going to be exhaust. Check the air filter, maybe even replace it they don't cost much. If you truly believe it is not right, perhaps your intercooler hoses are beginning to delaminate, restricting your air flow.

I also believe 0.9 bar is a little low (1.3 is pushing max boost) i'd expect about 1.2 at about 2500 RPM, but i would't adjust your boost on the turbo until you are sure the air flow is correct.

I've been toying with the idea of a 1.4 ratio transfer case for some time, I've bitten the bullet and am now in the process of rebuilding one to put in, effectively making it close to your old Defender but with less throttle response due to the auto, to compensate I've got an Ashcroft TD5 upgrade torque converter coming.

The reason I'm doing all this is because essentially I've experienced what you are speaking of, but while four wheel driving rather than towing. It is the same issue but effects me differently. We are riding on the edge of the vehicles capability, but it is no reason not to check the air flow and perhaps adjust the boost when ready.

[jimbob]

I just took it for a spin with the air flow meter disconnected and there was a great difference in light to medium throttle response. On heavy acceleration it was surging very badly but was still going a lot better. Can't wait to get the new sensor in!! 😎

[jimbob]

Yeah I won't adjust the boost until air flow sorted. I don't think I will got to a low ratio transfer. I'm sure it would fix the gearing issue but I recon if I can't get it to go the way I expect with out major modification then I might just have to upgrade to something that will do the job a little easier. 😞

[jimbob]

Thanks fluids!! The new air flow meter is fitted and it's a different car to drive. I haven't towed with it yet because I'm away at the moment. But I will as soon as I get a chance. Thanks to all that posted. I hope this fixes 90% of the issue.👍🏻