AdamHunter
31st May 2017, 10:56 PM
I've been running the EMS2 now for a few months and under various conditions, time to start sharing some trends with those who are interested as I'm sure having this info on here is better than floating around inside my head. In time I'll get some data into table form.
My setup - 04 D2a TD5 auto, abt 220km indicated onboard, always at GVM and oversize tyres (8% speedo error at 100), rack , bars all round, a heavy brick basically. Davis ecu remap, 2.75 exhaust, egr removed. Do run a second trans cooler.
Towing - 2 tonne single axle poptop van.
EMS setup - EGT measured from the manifold @#1 (EGR port). Engine Oil pressure, gearbox oil temp (measured inline where the cooler line is flexible between factory cooler and the solid pipe running under the sump. Coolant temp , measured at the head adjacent to the factory senders. Yet to instal the coolant level detect.
EGT - on highway generally ~400C and into the 5s in hilly highway terrain. It does take a decent hill and pushing hard in lockup to get temps into the 6s. In fact I have to let road speed & revs drop to ~80/1900 and be deep in the throttle to spike the EGTs. Dropping back to third lockup will drop the EGTs and bring speed/rpm back up.
Towing - on highway in locked up 4th abt 90-95 indicated, flat terrain no headwind low 500s. Lightly undulating terrain or light headwind still in the 5s provided I press on and keep momentum/rpm in that 90/2050+ rpm zone. Drop below that and EGTs climb into the 6s of holding 4th lock. Decent highway hills if I hit them at 100/2200 and stay in the throttle upto mid 600Cs before backing off and changing down to locked 3rd as speed dips below 85. Temp will drop 50 and then not until speed/rpm has dropped to 60/1800 (in third locked) does EGT start to climb up into the high 6s again.
I don't labour the engine towing into the 700s.
Unlocked torque converter towing or not, temps never seem to get above the 5s, there is simple not enough load on the engine I suppose.
Towing i drive by the EGTs working the box manually in 3/4. To maintain good road speed/rpm it is important i find to be willing to work it reasonably hard from 70-100 in 3/4 lock even on flat ground up into the high 500s to then be able to give it a breather and get the temps down while maintaining the 90-100 in 4 lock. If I don't do that hard work i find I get stuck in the 70-80 zone in 3rd locked and unable to pull 4th lock.
Coolant temp - running solo mid 80s to low 90s irrespective of road speed/terrain. I didn't have the EMS on in the height of summer so yet to see the impacts of high ambient.
I've had 1 really long 2nd gear hill climb that got the coolant upto 94.
Towing - generally high 80s on this current trip up the qld coast in ambient temps of mid 20s and no headwinds. On hills if the EGTs get into the high 5s, coolant will get into the low 90s. EGTs into the 6s mid 90s. Highest coolant has been 96 on a long climb in 3rd locked with an EGT of abt 650 - 75km/2000rpm held with a fair Amt of throttle for a good minute or so to crest a hill. EGT and coolant were stable at that point, not climbing and the fan was in cat 5 hurricane mode, the hardest I've head the viscous spin to date. Boy do they push some air when they need to!
I'm happy enough with my cooling that I won't watch that gauge page now during th winter, I'll just set the alarm point at 95 to alert of a problem - and I need to instal the level detect to catch a leak.
Oil pressure - running upto temp in the morning 5-5.8 bar is common.
Once upto temp if the revs are over 2100, 4.3-4.5bar seems normal. Let the revs drop to below 2000 and the oil pressure drops to 3bar.
Idle is 2.5.
This one has opening my eyes on why you shouldn't load up a engine at low rpm. Less oil flow getting around.
I'm curious as to what the TD5 oil pressure "should" be and what others are getting.
Is it oil dependent? Am I running the right oil grade for the age of mine and temps I run in.
Some more research needed.
Oil temp - mine is plumbed to ATF cooler line and currently i have some leaking issues to get on top of.
Temps however are a real eye opener.
3/4 lockup 40-50C alll day long. Up hill or down , towing or not. At night it sits around high 30s, even with the ATF leak!
Unlocked , it just climbs from the get go. More than 2500rpm for a decent period of time and it just climbs like a clock. BIG hill 2nd and 1st unlocked out of hairpins and you end up at high 90s before long , even with my extra cooler. At that point I back off to 2300 if I can't pull over and give it a break.
That will stabilise the temp in the low 90s. Pulled over idle in neutral for 2-3 minutes and temp will drop back to abt 60.
The auto really does need a 2nd gear lockup , especially for towing or in really hilly country. It just generates so much heat and I presume pressure as It expands as it heats up I believe. Though unsure if that pressure is greater than the "pump" pressure around the system.
Bottom line is keep it locked and don't go too heavy on the right foot unlocked. If towing def get an extra cooler and given the price of a rebuilt tranny I'd say knowing auto temp is a high priority.
I'd hope that a burst atf line would show a temp rise before the box is damaged, though I don't know if that would be the case. Probably erratic gear change or maybe unlock right before the big bang [emoji95].
All the same, alarm is being set for 95 and if climbing in an unlocked situation I change the EMS to show gearbox and coolant as EGT becomes a non issue unlocked.
Keen to know if others experience the same trends and/or have different ideas on my thoughts above.
My setup - 04 D2a TD5 auto, abt 220km indicated onboard, always at GVM and oversize tyres (8% speedo error at 100), rack , bars all round, a heavy brick basically. Davis ecu remap, 2.75 exhaust, egr removed. Do run a second trans cooler.
Towing - 2 tonne single axle poptop van.
EMS setup - EGT measured from the manifold @#1 (EGR port). Engine Oil pressure, gearbox oil temp (measured inline where the cooler line is flexible between factory cooler and the solid pipe running under the sump. Coolant temp , measured at the head adjacent to the factory senders. Yet to instal the coolant level detect.
EGT - on highway generally ~400C and into the 5s in hilly highway terrain. It does take a decent hill and pushing hard in lockup to get temps into the 6s. In fact I have to let road speed & revs drop to ~80/1900 and be deep in the throttle to spike the EGTs. Dropping back to third lockup will drop the EGTs and bring speed/rpm back up.
Towing - on highway in locked up 4th abt 90-95 indicated, flat terrain no headwind low 500s. Lightly undulating terrain or light headwind still in the 5s provided I press on and keep momentum/rpm in that 90/2050+ rpm zone. Drop below that and EGTs climb into the 6s of holding 4th lock. Decent highway hills if I hit them at 100/2200 and stay in the throttle upto mid 600Cs before backing off and changing down to locked 3rd as speed dips below 85. Temp will drop 50 and then not until speed/rpm has dropped to 60/1800 (in third locked) does EGT start to climb up into the high 6s again.
I don't labour the engine towing into the 700s.
Unlocked torque converter towing or not, temps never seem to get above the 5s, there is simple not enough load on the engine I suppose.
Towing i drive by the EGTs working the box manually in 3/4. To maintain good road speed/rpm it is important i find to be willing to work it reasonably hard from 70-100 in 3/4 lock even on flat ground up into the high 500s to then be able to give it a breather and get the temps down while maintaining the 90-100 in 4 lock. If I don't do that hard work i find I get stuck in the 70-80 zone in 3rd locked and unable to pull 4th lock.
Coolant temp - running solo mid 80s to low 90s irrespective of road speed/terrain. I didn't have the EMS on in the height of summer so yet to see the impacts of high ambient.
I've had 1 really long 2nd gear hill climb that got the coolant upto 94.
Towing - generally high 80s on this current trip up the qld coast in ambient temps of mid 20s and no headwinds. On hills if the EGTs get into the high 5s, coolant will get into the low 90s. EGTs into the 6s mid 90s. Highest coolant has been 96 on a long climb in 3rd locked with an EGT of abt 650 - 75km/2000rpm held with a fair Amt of throttle for a good minute or so to crest a hill. EGT and coolant were stable at that point, not climbing and the fan was in cat 5 hurricane mode, the hardest I've head the viscous spin to date. Boy do they push some air when they need to!
I'm happy enough with my cooling that I won't watch that gauge page now during th winter, I'll just set the alarm point at 95 to alert of a problem - and I need to instal the level detect to catch a leak.
Oil pressure - running upto temp in the morning 5-5.8 bar is common.
Once upto temp if the revs are over 2100, 4.3-4.5bar seems normal. Let the revs drop to below 2000 and the oil pressure drops to 3bar.
Idle is 2.5.
This one has opening my eyes on why you shouldn't load up a engine at low rpm. Less oil flow getting around.
I'm curious as to what the TD5 oil pressure "should" be and what others are getting.
Is it oil dependent? Am I running the right oil grade for the age of mine and temps I run in.
Some more research needed.
Oil temp - mine is plumbed to ATF cooler line and currently i have some leaking issues to get on top of.
Temps however are a real eye opener.
3/4 lockup 40-50C alll day long. Up hill or down , towing or not. At night it sits around high 30s, even with the ATF leak!
Unlocked , it just climbs from the get go. More than 2500rpm for a decent period of time and it just climbs like a clock. BIG hill 2nd and 1st unlocked out of hairpins and you end up at high 90s before long , even with my extra cooler. At that point I back off to 2300 if I can't pull over and give it a break.
That will stabilise the temp in the low 90s. Pulled over idle in neutral for 2-3 minutes and temp will drop back to abt 60.
The auto really does need a 2nd gear lockup , especially for towing or in really hilly country. It just generates so much heat and I presume pressure as It expands as it heats up I believe. Though unsure if that pressure is greater than the "pump" pressure around the system.
Bottom line is keep it locked and don't go too heavy on the right foot unlocked. If towing def get an extra cooler and given the price of a rebuilt tranny I'd say knowing auto temp is a high priority.
I'd hope that a burst atf line would show a temp rise before the box is damaged, though I don't know if that would be the case. Probably erratic gear change or maybe unlock right before the big bang [emoji95].
All the same, alarm is being set for 95 and if climbing in an unlocked situation I change the EMS to show gearbox and coolant as EGT becomes a non issue unlocked.
Keen to know if others experience the same trends and/or have different ideas on my thoughts above.