Holden to close 30 outlets at the end of this year!

[Pickles2]

Heard on the news this morning that Holden will withdraw the license to sell its product at 30 outlets at the end of this year. It will be interesting to see which Dealerships are involved, but the word is that Melbourne, with the greatest concentration of Dealerships, will be the most affected.
Pickles.

[101 Ron]

I personally don't have much time for Holden anymore since they decided to stop local manufacturing.
To me now they are just like any other car brand retailer.
I am currently playing with a thing called a Holden Viva......made by Daewoo.........complete garbage......should have never been sold with a Holden badge on it........but they did...........and doing things like that is may be why they are loosing market share.
The only thing Holden seem to be doing to respect the Aussie buyer and owner is making a lot of computer information available to the general community and I understand they are the only ones doing it.
Closing dealerships/outlets will repeat the mistakes that Landrover did when they closed dealers to save a short term dollar for bean counters.
People especially in country townships tend to buy a brand where the back up for it is local instead of a 100km away.

[Rextheute]

Heard on the news this morning that Holden will withdraw the license to sell its product at 30 outlets at the end of this year. It will be interesting to see which Dealerships are involved, but the word is that Melbourne, with the greatest concentration of Dealerships, will be the most affected.
Pickles.

Pretty much all regional /rural dealerships will no longer have the backing of GMH - it was not a negotiation , more of a demand .

All special tools , equipment, service lit and signage will be recalled from Nov 2017 - no contracts expiring will be renewed .

- its public knowledge . The local papers are reporting it as many of the dealerships have been running for 50yrs plus and are a large employer , many have apprentices and staff tied to the local region . pretty much all are single or dual franchise dealers , so not big players like a Mantello for example .

[Rextheute]

Holden culls dealers as Commodore sales slide ahead of plant closure (http://www.news.com.au/technology/innovation/motoring/holden-terminates-30-dealers-as-sales-slide-bites/news-story/91e74e5dcb68b6ec20c21c61864fe38a)

Holden to shed 30 dealers as shutdown looms (https://www.wheelsmag.com.au/news/1706/holden-to-shed-30-dealers-as-shutdown-looms)

[Tins]

Seems like a cynical move by Holden. Falcon sales were sliding long before the cessation of manufacturing, and yet the company threw everything at supporting and promoting their other vehicles. The dealer near me is thriving, with Everests, Rangers, Mondeos etc doing well. They also moved into multi brands, but the blue oval is still the mainstay.
I may be wrong, but I understood that Holden has an obligation to maintain servicing and spare parts support. Forcing people to drive further and further for this support seems unlikely to move their business forward.
I really did not expect Holden to just give up. Toyota is closing their factory too, but I bet they don't close dealerships.

[rangieman]

To Bad So Sad :Rolling:
But honestly the writing has been on the wall since early 2000`s[wink11]

[Tins]

T
But honestly the writing has been on the wall since early 2000`s[wink11]

It has, but Holden still are in the business of selling cars, or at least I thought they were. They still have a range of about seven cars after Commodore, and are replacing the Commodore with another import, designed by Opel. Seems a little strange to be burning customers and dealers when the are due to release the Commodore replacement in the near future.

2018 Holden Commodore revealed, officially: Wraps come off fully-imported family hauler (http://www.caradvice.com.au/504474/2018-holden-commodore-revealed-officially-wraps-come-off-fully-imported-family-hauler/)

[Hall]

In the Friday Sun motoring section they had a article on the Astra. They noted how sales across the board have slumped. Said that they will need to some thing special with the next model Astra if it is going to sell. People have such a choice now that a brand name alone does not sell cars, especially if that brand is only re badging other brands. Give it a couple or years and Holden will be mostly gone. Why buy a re branded car when you can get the original and most likely with a better price, warranty etc.
Cheers Hall

[Pickles2]

In the Friday Sun motoring section they had a article on the Astra. They noted how sales across the board have slumped. Said that they will need to some thing special with the next model Astra if it is going to sell. People have such a choice now that a brand name alone does not sell cars, especially if that brand is only re badging other brands. Give it a couple or years and Holden will be mostly gone. Why buy a re branded car when you can get the original and most likely with a better price, warranty etc.
Cheers Hall
A terrible post.
But guess what,....a most truthful one,...."Give it a couple of years & Holden will mostly be gone"?.....So true.
Pickles.

[Homestar]

They are their own worst enemy. All they sell now is the crap that comes out of the Daewoo factory and most (all?) of those cars are diabolical. With very little loyalty left and little repeat business from owners now, they are becoming irrelevant pretty quickly.

The new Commodore will be a stillborn disaster...

[Tins]

The new Commodore will be a stillborn disaster...

I agree, but I'm surprised that Holden is going out of it's way to make it so.

[rangieman]

I agree, but I'm surprised that Holden is going out of it's way to make it so.
Surprised why [bigrolf]It`s GM that is calling the shots holden is just a name that they killed.
How long before we have GM dealers instead ! More yanky **** with lots of Chinese affluent [wink11]

[Tins]

Surprised why [bigrolf]It`s GM that is calling the shots holden is just a name that they killed.
How long before we have GM dealers instead ! More yanky **** with lots of Chinese affluent [wink11]

But that's the point, Chris. The Holden name is staying. The Commodore replacement is still going to be called a Commodore, and yet Holden has gone out of their way do disenfranchise potential customers.

Car manufacturing was always going to die, ever since John Button got involved. But Ford and Toyota are still working to build their brands.

[bob10]

For Holden, substitute GMH. Or , GM. When you are eating your contaminated blueberries, or cladding your building with flammable Chinese cladding, don't forget to give thanks for our free trade agreement , and say a prayer for our remaining manufacturing industry.

[scarry]

Maybe LR could look at taking a couple of the dealerships over.

Yer i know,that would be the day......

They don't seem to realise that not having any dealerships in regional areas knocks their sales around.

But then these days all they seem to be making are around town soccer mums chariots[bigsad]

[p38arover]

More yanky **** with lots of Chinese affluent [wink11]

Rich Chinese money?

Or Chinese effluent?

[bigwhistle]

[101 Ron]

Holden could still be manufacturing in Australia if they made what the public wanted.
Way back they stopped supporting the Overlander conversions of the HQ and HZ.
They tried some dual cab...Ute versions of the commodore wagons with slight lift, but it was not robust enough......And too soft roader..........Cannot remember the name.(adventura?)(crewman X8?)
Ford went soft roader with the Territory and sold a few.
Imagine the current model Commodore station wagon with all the fruit, sub frame proper Dana transfer case and diffs.
Double cell air bag suspension for extra height range adjustment and diagonal cross linking on the air bags for flex.
The comfort of a normal Commodore with real tuff off road ability.
The farmers,miners and 4wd enthusiast wouldn't be able to get enough and the price could be high as the only competition would be 200 series Landcruiser or other expensive options.
Opetunity missed.

[PAT303]

Holden lost all it's credibility when it focused on profits over quality.Holden had a strong loyal following but that loyalty was lost the moment Holden started rebadging Daewoo's,a brand that already had flopped here. Pat

[Tins]

Holden could still be manufacturing in Australia if they made what the public wanted.
Way back they stopped supporting the Overlander conversions of the HQ and HZ.
They tried some dual cab...Ute versions of the commodore discussion with slight lift, but it was not robust enough......And too soft roader..........Cannot remember the name.(adventura?)
Ford went soft roader with the Territory and sold a few.
Imagine the current model Commodore station with all the fruit, sub frame proper Dana transfer case and diffs.
Double cell air bag suspension for extra height range adjustment and diagonal cross linking on the air bags for flex.
The comfort of a normal Commodore with real tuff off road ability.
The farmers,miners and 4wd enthusiast wouldn't be able to get enough and the price could be high as the only competition would be 200 series Landcruiser or other expensive options.
Opetunity missed.

It's a nice dream, but in reality there is no way to justify building unique, stand alone cars in a market of this size. The R&D costs alone are prohibitive (you need to understand how much all this safety and "environmental" stuff really costs. It is $BILLIONS, plural. Hard to get that sort of return in a market that just manages to sell 1,000,000 cars of ALL types.). This is why Holden tried to get cars into the Middle East and US markets, to get to a level of volume that would justify the expense of the R&D. If Holden could have convinced GM that their rear wheel drive platform was the best in the GM world ( it is ), it may have worked. But GM baulked at that, and have no real interest in RWD anyway, as it costs more to manufacture. Remember, GM world wide ( not Holden ) were within a cat's whisker of folding not so very long ago. Their medical plan for employees and former employees (that is where most healthcare comes from in the US; employers ) was costing them far more than they were earning; never mind all the other outgoings. Chrysler were in the same boat, bailed out first by Mercedes and now by Fiat. Ford were nearly as bad.
The Falcon could have survived if Dearborn had taken it's RWD platform for the Mustang, the Taurus and whatever they replace the Crown Vic with, but no, not to be.
Toyota don't give a stuff where their cars are made, as long as the labour is cheap, so that also rules us out in Oz.
Toyota doesn't matter in this debate, though. Holden, and to an even greater extent, Ford, have been a part of all of our histories, and I, for one, am sorry to see them go.



At least the Everest, the Pacific version of the Focus, and the Ranger are designed here, so there is still some activity at Broadmeadows. I 'believe' that Holden may keep some design functions here.

[The Aventura was a poor response to the Territory, but was surprisingly capable as a country car, just at a time when people were turning off that sort of thing. The Crewman was a definite miss, as it was too long, and yet had very poor rear leg room for a crew cab work ute, in a segment absolutely dominated by HiLux in those days. Holden kept trying to resurrect their "Australia's Own" myth with things like the 3rd Gen VT Monaro. Imagine what that cost to design and get into production. And yet apparently they built less than 50,000 of them, in all variants, including export. Hardly good business, and that, lets face it, is what car companies are. Excluding Morgan, of course.]

Sorry for the rant.

[d2dave]

Maybe LR could look at taking a couple of the dealerships over.

Yer i know,that would be the day......

They don't seem to realise that not having any dealerships in regional areas knocks their sales around.



Maybe LR are learning from their mistake. We have just got back our LR dealer(Shepparton)

[Pickles2]

Good summation johntins.
Pickles.

[mox]

Maybe LR are learning from their mistake. We have just got back our LR dealer(Shepparton)

To me it would appear better in the Shepparton Land Rover dealership was returned to McPherson Motors, who had it for many years until LRA had their fit of stupidity and got rid of most of their dealers. New dealer is just another division of the local Darryl Twitt car dealership conglomerate.

[BMKal]

[The Aventura was a poor response to the Territory................................

Hardly a response - the Crewman Cross 8 (ute) and the Adventra (wagon) were both first introduced to the market in 2003. The Ford Territory was first introduced a year later in 2004. [wink11]

[Tins]

Hardly a response - the Crewman Cross 8 (ute) and the Adventra (wagon) were both first introduced to the market in 2003. The Ford Territory was first introduced a year later in 2004. [wink11]

The Territory was well known of, long before it launched. It was cliniced as the R7 at the 2002 Melbourne Motor Show in almost exactly the form it debuted in. Industry insiders were well aware of it before that. Holden was very well aware of how little they had to combat it. Just because you didn't see one before '04 does not mean Holden didn't. Holden simply did not have the time to develop one of their own, so they chucked the X8 stuff under a Commodore, gave it a plastic tailgate and sent it out to take attention away from Ford's looming COTY.

[BMKal]

Both the Ford and the Holden products were known about well before their respective release dates. I remember seeing articles about the coming Holden 4WD range, particularly about the "Cross 8" ute (which Holden believed was going to be their big seller) long before I ever saw anything about a Ford "offroader" - and I was a regular buyer and reader of both the major Australian motoring wheels back in the day.

And "chucking a bit of CX8 running gear" under a Commodore wagon was really no different to Ford chucking a bit of all wheel drive running gear under an updated Falcon station wagon (yes - it was new body panels but not much else changed). I agree with you that Ford did the better job of the two (by a long shot) - but for anyone seriously looking for an off road capable vehicle - neither option was in the running. [wink11]

[Tins]

Both the Ford and the Holden products were known about well before their respective release dates. I remember seeing articles about the coming Holden 4WD range, particularly about the "Cross 8" ute (which Holden believed was going to be their big seller) long before I ever saw anything about a Ford "offroader" - and I was a regular buyer and reader of both the major Australian motoring wheels back in the day.

And "chucking a bit of CX8 running gear" under a Commodore wagon was really no different to Ford chucking a bit of all wheel drive running gear under an updated Falcon station wagon (yes - it was new body panels but not much else changed). I agree with you that Ford did the better job of the two (by a long shot) - but for anyone seriously looking for an off road capable vehicle - neither option was in the running. [wink11]

Totally agree that neither car was in the running. It's a shame really, because a 4WD Territory would have been something, especially the diesel.
Can't agree that the Territory was an upgraded wagon. They have virtually nothing in common, bar the basic platform, which is common practice, to reduce development costs. If they were the same, where are all the AWD Falcons that the modifiers would have built? However, it takes an eye for detail to pick the Adventra from any other Commodore wagon. They even put a version of X8 under the Monaro. From an engineering standpoint there is no comparison.
I saw the R7 at Melbourne that year. It is still viewable at the Ford Discovery Centre at Geelong, well, if that is still there I guess. It was very nearly identical to the production car. Territory was a completely new car, not an ad hoc thing thrown together.

I. too, was very interested in the industry in those days. I stand by my comment re 'response'. But, I'm happy to agree to differ.

[V8Ian]

Totally agree that neither car was in the running. It's a shame really, because a 4WD Territory would have been something, especially the diesel.
Can't agree that the Territory was an upgraded wagon. They have virtually nothing in common, bar the basic platform, which is common practice, to reduce development costs. If they were the same, where are all the AWD Falcons that the modifiers would have built? However, it takes an eye for detail to pick the Adventra from any other Commodore wagon. They even put a version of X8 under the Monaro. From an engineering standpoint there is no comparison.
I saw the R7 at Melbourne that year. It is still viewable at the Ford Discovery Centre at Geelong, well, if that is still there I guess. It was very nearly identical to the production car. Territory was a completely new car, not an ad hoc thing thrown together.

I. too, was very interested in the industry in those days. I stand by my comment re 'response'. But, I'm happy to agree to differ.
I disagree John, the dash, ergo electrickery, are identical to my Fairlane. The interior, with a few dimensional tweaks, was lifted straight from the Falcon/Fairlane range. Isn't the rear diff/suspension the same independent unit as fitted to the sedans?

[Tins]

I disagree John, the dash, ergo electrickery, are identical to my Fairlane. The interior, with a few dimensional tweaks, was lifted straight from the Falcon/Fairlane range. Isn't the rear diff/suspension the same independent unit as fitted to the sedans?

Yes. And the interior, engines, suspension are the same on a Golf and a Skoda Yeti. The Bentley Continental and the VW Phaeton share many suspension and driveline components. Are they they same cars? The Territory was a new car. It was not a Falcon Wagon. It has about as much in common with your Fairlane as a RRS ( old model ) has with a D4. Which, I'd agree, is a fair bit, but nobody calls a RRS a Discovery wagon.

[Homestar]

Fairlane as a RRS ( old model ) has with a D4. Which, I'd agree, is a fair bit, but nobody calls a RRS a Discovery wagon.

I would - and have called a RRS a D4 in a dinner suit. ;)

[pop058]

I would - and have called a RRS a D4 in a dinner suit. ;)

A D4 owner I met once refereed to the RSS as a D4 in tight leather pants, gold chains and it's hat on backwards.

[Tins]

I would - and have called a RRS a D4 in a dinner suit. ;)

I have called a Lexus a Camry in a dinner jacket, and an FJ Cruiser a Prado in clown make up, but I think you are being a little harsh on the RRS. The D4 is almost in a dinner suit as it is.

[Ausfree]

I have called a Lexus a Camry in a dinner jacket, and an FJ Cruiser a Prado in clown make up, but I think you are being a little harsh on the RRS. The D4 is almost in a dinner suit as it is.
Yep, no matter how hard Toyota try a Lexus will always be a flash Camry and the FJ Cruiser will always be a Prado with its cap turned backwards.

[Davehoos]

Just purchased 2006 territory AWD ghia to replace my 2006 BF wagon.
just so different and for me that is a disappointment.

The wagon is a long range tourer the territory is a shopping center sprinter with more inside people space-just need a trailer to bring home the shopping.
fuel economy is the same.

Grown up with badge engineering. Some brands don't do it well. It a shame that international models aren't sold here in small numbers for niche buyers. I read a report of factory imported used cars soon lets hope.

[DiscoMick]

Holden and Ford made the wrong segment vehicles for local manufacturing. Large cars are premium vehicles now. The volume is 1.5-2.0 litres in runabouts and SUVs in larger vehicles.
Look how well Mazda has done. Also Hyundai with a seven year warranty.

[gromit]

Just purchased 2006 territory AWD ghia to replace my 2006 BF wagon.
just so different and for me that is a disappointment.

The wagon is a long range tourer the territory is a shopping center sprinter with more inside people space-just need a trailer to bring home the shopping.
fuel economy is the same.


Interesting comment, took delivery of my 3rd Territory late last year.
The petrol has a thirst problem, my wife took it over and got 18/100 on the school run. Not too bad on a long run but still thirsty.
The last two have been diesels, great long distance tourer but, if you use all 7 seats, there isn't much luggage space. So either people or luggage....you have to make up your mind but at least you have the choice.
Great tow car, have towed over its limit for long distances (getting Series Land Rovers home). Towed a Series I on a heavy trailer from NSW with the petrol Terri years ago and the servos were almost too far apart to make it home !

I still like the look of the Adventra, looks like much more ground clearance than the Terri. When it was launched there were comments about its fuel consumption and the 'harshness' of the engine ?? The MD of the company I worked for knocked back me getting one based on those comments.

The Australian public have voted with their dollars and are buying imported vehicles. RIP the Australian car manufacturing industry.


Colin

[Vern]

The Australian public have voted with their dollars and are buying imported vehicles. RIP the Australian car manufacturing industry.


Colin
Like land rovers?😉

[Tote]

Holden and Ford made the wrong segment vehicles for local manufacturing. Large cars are premium vehicles now. The volume is 1.5-2.0 litres in runabouts and SUVs in larger vehicles.
Look how well Mazda has done. Also Hyundai with a seven year warranty.

Yep, that explains the miserable selection of vehicles at rental car agencies. Just because they list a Rav4/Holden Trax/corolla/lancer as a full size car doesn't mean that they are, particularly if you have to drive the stinking things a few hundred k's on country roads.

Regards,
Tote

[DiscoMick]

Yep, that explains the miserable selection of vehicles at rental car agencies. Just because they list a Rav4/Holden Trax/corolla/lancer as a full size car doesn't mean that they are, particularly if you have to drive the stinking things a few hundred k's on country roads.

Regards,
Tote

Yeah, those you mention are certainly not full size.
If Holden had switched investment to improving the locally-made Cruze it could have done well I think, but they didn't get the quality up to standard to compete with the likes of Hondas and Mazdas. Our Mazda 2 runabout is certainly a quality class above our previous Yaris, and better than any of the smaller Holdens I have driven.
The other problem was the foreign-owned companies wouldn't commit to investing in building cars here to export, because it was cheaper to build them in Thailand or China. Nationalism means nothing to those companies, it's all about maximizing profits, and that's understandable from their point of view. Australian-built cars could have been exported to Europe and the USA, but that would have upset those who want to protect American and European jobs from foreign competition.

[JDNSW]

.......... it's all about maximizing profits, and that's understandable from their point of view. Australian-built cars could have been exported to Europe and the USA, but that would have upset those who want to protect American and European jobs from foreign competition.

A slight bit of bias about maximising profits - if you look at the car industry worldwide, almost all companies operate in the red most of the time. It is mostly not so much about maximising profits as getting out of the red. In the last few decades, probably the only company that has consistently operated profitably is Toyota. Most of the others that have reported profits have almost certainly needed some creative accounting to manage it, except for a few good years - and even then, the profits look insignificant compared to the losses in other years!

And the reason that the companies want to protect jobs from competition from their foreign subsidiaries is that not to do so would jeopardise the explicit or hidden subsidies that they all operate on in their home territories - things like tariff protection and bail outs, as well as government buying policies etc.

[Eevo]

HOL DEN... Together(Holdin Together)


HOLDEN = Hop Out Lads Damn Engines Nakered

Q:Whats the difference between a holden and a trolley
A:A trolley is far easier too push

What’s the difference between a Holden and a wife after 10 years ?
The Holden still sucks


What’s the difference between an elephant and a Holden?
One’s big, slow and damn ugly, the other is an elephant


"Holden" - Australia's Most Widely Used Warning Label


Walkinshaw= Walking-for-sure


Holden, Push on


What's the difference between a golf ball and and a Holden?
You can drive a golf ball a 100 yards

[gromit]

Like land rovers?😉



No 4 Wheel Drives manufactured in Australia so if you wanted one you had to buy an import, most of the ones I own were at least assembled here with some local content......

The market here is too small but when you look back at the manufacturers that used to build/assemble here it was worthwhile at some point in the past. Was this due to import duties ?
In Japan cars are off the road within about 6/8 years unless you want to spend big dollars. This alone must drive the Japanese car industry and depress markets elsewhere in the World where their cars are sold secondhand with low Kms.

The big manufacturers are consolidating their production facilities, not profitable to have manufacturing in every market they sell in. I believe Ford UK don't build cars any longer, the last was the Transit which is now built in Turkey. I think they still build engines in the UK.
Years ago I was dealing with Ford at Dagenham, Basildon & Brentwood (never got to Southampton) and they were scruffy, dirty, tired looking facilities. I visited Mercedes about the same time and it was light years ahead, everything clean & modern.
I read somewhere years ago that Ford NZ stopped making cars and were set up to make alloy wheels for Ford Globally.

Nissan Castings in Dandenong cast parts for most car manufacturers, it's a business and couldn't support just making castings for Nissan.

Toyota want a vehicle for a particular market and they get all their plants to tender. Toyota here were producing cars for the Middle East, I was told that if they lost the contract one whole production shift would be lost.

I'm still running a locally built Ford for business, in 3/4 years time I have to find an alternative. The Asian car manufacturers have improved significantly so I guess if I'm still working it may be a Kia..........

Colin

[JDNSW]

.......

The market here is too small but when you look back at the manufacturers that used to build/assemble here it was worthwhile at some point in the past. Was this due to import duties ?
.....
Colin

Combination of a number of things. Cars were built here initially because of import restrictions during WW1, which flat out banned the import of complete cars. This led notably to a Ford production facility in Geelong, which used engines and most other mechanical parts imported from Canada (Empire Preference), and the building up of Holden to manufacture car bodies for a variety of manufacturers in Adelaide, sourcing capital from GM in the twenties, leading to a majority GM ownership after 1929, but by 1939 they were making pressed steel bodies for a number of companies.

After WW2, massive tariff protection and a cash subsidy from the Commonwealth enabled mass production of the Holden 48-215, a small Chevrolet intended for release in the USA in 1943 or thereabouts but cancelled because of the war. The subsidy was conditional on close to 100% local content. The success of this venture led other manufacturers to negotiate a deal with the Commonwealth where they could bring in parts to assemble cars here with tariffs reduced according to how large a percentage of the final value was imported. Since the labour component of a completed car is very high, you can get the percentage up to around 80% just assembling, painting, and upholstering it. Ford, Chrysler, and later Toyota, Mitsubishi, and Nissan also got close to 100%.

This led to, as you suggest, a lot of manufacturers taking advantage of it. (VW, Peugot, Citroen, Austin, Morris, Renault etc) By the 1970s, however, as imports began to appear in spite of the tariffs, taking advantage of low wage countries (particularly Japan) and were better equipped, and in some cases at least, much more modern design than local cars, and better communications led to Australians questioning why they were paying so much more than most other countries for cars. After several other tries, this eventually led to the Button Plan, which attempted to get the local manufacturers to limit their production to one model per manufacturer and to phase out protection over a number of years. Which has now had the inevitable result of ending local manufacture.

Other factors running against local manufacture include the continuing pile of red tape around car design and manufacture, making the design of a completely new car beyond the resources of almost all single manufacturers, leading to takeovers, mergers and joint ventures, often across different countries. Continuing automation of manufacture means that increasingly cars can only be made on a very large scale, effectively ruling out manufacture in countries with small markets, unless they have something that makes them able to export readily and cheaply - Australia doesn't.